Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII Read OP For Mod Warnings

emeldc · 26-01-2021 05:55PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Any link for that in bold?

I know your acolytes dont usually look for any factual info, but if you are talking rubbish you may need to back it up.

I actually can tell you that new pubs have been opening in Dublin throughout since 2016. One of the 1s coming to mind, heh, the pipers corner off Abbey st. :pac:

The rural demise is common knowledge TBH. We've lost two out of six since last year but they were both rented and probably struggling anyway. You've some chance in Dublin with the population numbers.

DeanAustin · 26-01-2021 05:56PM

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Where I think you are going wrong here though, and of course this is just my own opinion, is that you are applying the “normal” parameters for political success in the context of what has become an extraordinary situation where the parameters have changed and now boil down to one single rubric — Covid cases.

If you were look at the media narrative right now in Ireland — and as we know, politicians know well the importance of media narratives — what is the success of this country and other countries being ‘assessed’ on primarily? It’s not economic performance, it’s certainly not employment, it’s not education, it’s not how countries are trying to safeguard other important medium to long term interests. The measure of success is quite simply Covid case numbers — countries are either “doing well”, “deteriorating” or are effectively in an ongoing state of all-out apocalypse depending on how their case numbers are.

The government knows this — and I think you also need to boil it down not just to parties as a whole but to individuals. Who wants to be the person who went against the grain? Who wants to be the person who argued that more Covid deaths might be a price worth paying for a sustainable policy? Who wants to be that scapegoat who will be wheeled out and given a media lynching as the man / woman who made the call that sentenced another 1,000 pensioners to death — or the one responsible for an ICU unit being overwhelmed?

You are correct in saying that people are massively pissed off with the situation — but remember the mass sense of civic duty last March? Remember the nation getting behind the ‘flatten the curve’ mantra? People are getting more pissed off now yes, but I still think the government is banking on the idea that people being pissed off in lockdown (with the very helpful narrative that ‘irresponsible people’ are at fault) is something they can stand behind — because they can say it was based on a public health need. As long as cases are low, the country is deemed to be succeeding.

My original post was talking about the conspiracy theory stuff whereby people think governments are using Covid to strip away freedoms with a view to never giving them back. That's nonsense for the reasons I've outlined.

The rest of what you've said is fair enough. But it's still politicians trying to manage the narrative that what they are doing (i.e. minimising deaths/cases) is the right thing so that they find favour with the public and get votes next time we go to the ballot box. That's always the end game for politicians - "how do we get as many votes as possible in the next election" rather than "how can we remove everyone's freedom and rule the country without the inconvenience of an election."

The government has set their stall out clearly on covid. Their stated priority is minimising cases and saving lives above everything else. That's their guiding principle so what you've outlined is them being consistent with that aim. The approach is also logical and is being followed by other governments around the world. You can disagree with it but it's a very logical strategy to pursue.

If there is an alternative way to manage this crisis, it's up to the media and the opposition to put that forward. It's not the government's job to challenge their own strategy once they've decided on it.

I sometimes think people think that there is a solution to this crisis. "If only the government did x, things would be much better and this problem would go away." There isn't. Without a vaccine, we're just moving deckchairs around the Titanic. Personally, I think the government have done a decent job - they're managing an impossible situation.

Ginger n Lemon · 26-01-2021 05:57PM

Boggles wrote: »

Nope. Infection rates dropping like a stone.

Regardless of what is happening in your anecdotal "big bad world" the vast vast majority of the country are complying with restrictions.

Any link for that ?

I dont see much compliance in my area either. Not anecdotal btw, people just dont give a shi*.

Boggles perhaps you could consider leaving your house once in a while to get some real world update, other than what you listen on RTE?

GazzaL · 26-01-2021 05:58PM

Boggles wrote: »

Nope. Infection rates dropping like a stone.

Regardless of what is happening in your anecdotal "big bad world" the vast vast majority of the country are complying with restrictions.

Infection rates dropping like a stone despite all the people breaking restrictions, and yet restrictions are being extended by 5 weeks. No wonder people aren't listening anymore.

Ginger n Lemon · 26-01-2021 05:59PM

emeldc wrote: »

The rural demise is common knowledge TBH. We've lost two out of six since last year but they were both rented and probably struggling anyway. You've some chance in Dublin with the population numbers.

That is great, top notch analysis.

Have you considered that if restrictions werent as ridiculous, especially relating to pubs that have been demonised as if all of covid cases since March 2020 been attributable to them, maybe those 2 would not have shut down?

I remember in July there were 6 new cases on like a Thursday.

I also remember alcohol only pubs not being allowed to reopen until 20th of Sept.

Fkers used schools as an excuse..... ironically to close schools down anyways even though alcohol only pubs that have not actually traded could not have contributed to any cases :rolleyes:

PTH2009 · 26-01-2021 06:00PM

Having a laugh are we lads

Smirking at the Hospitality question

growleaves · 26-01-2021 06:01PM

emeldc wrote: »

The rural demise is common knowledge TBH. We've lost two out of six since last year but they were both rented and probably struggling anyway. You've some chance in Dublin with the population numbers.

In Dublin there were people out in town every night. Friday/Saturday everywhere was packed. Some pubs would be full on Thursdays and Sundays with others relatively empty. Nurses, casino workers etc. out on a Monday night. Brazilians out in Diceys every night.

Kunta Kinte · 26-01-2021 06:03PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Any link for that in bold?

I know your acolytes dont usually look for any factual info, but if you are talking rubbish you may need to back it up.

I actually can tell you that new pubs have been opening in Dublin throughout since 2016. One of the 1s coming to mind, heh, the pipers corner off Abbey st. :pac:

Here is one from 2018.and the situation in rural areas worsened between then and up to the period before March 2020.

https://www.newstalk.com/podcasts/highlights-from-lunchtime-live/decline-pub-rural-ireland

B]"Over 70 rural pubs closed in 2018, according to industry analysis by the Drinks Industry Group of Ireland (DIGI).

The figure is a stark reminder of the pub’s continued decline in rural Ireland. In the period between 2005 and 2018, 1,535 or nearly 20% of rural pubs closed; many were forced to shut up shop during the recession.

DIGI’s analysis of Revenue figures show the rural pub population declined by almost a quarter in Mayo (-21% or 98 pubs), Tipperary (-22.5% or 118 pubs) and Cork (-25.6% or 313 pubs) down from 1221 to 908 in same period 2005-2018".[/B]

BTW speaking about Dublin pubs I`m surprised you actually visited any of them considering you refused to support Irish hospitality last summer and went off on a foreign holiday despite caterwauling for weeks about them not being reopened quickly enough.

Boggles · 26-01-2021 06:03PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Any link for that ?

I dont see much compliance in my area either. Not anecdotal btw, people just dont give a shi*.

It's the dictionary definition lad. :pac:

Boggles · 26-01-2021 06:05PM

GazzaL wrote: »

Infection rates dropping like a stone despite all the people breaking restrictions

Tell me, what restrictions are you breaking?

hynesie08 · 26-01-2021 06:07PM

PTH2009 wrote: »

Having a laugh are we lads

Smirking at the Hospitality question

Getting mad at made up scenarios again are we?

Itssoeasy · 26-01-2021 06:07PM

Boggles wrote: »

Nope. Infection rates dropping like a stone.

Regardless of what is happening in your anecdotal "big bad world" the vast vast majority of the country are complying with restrictions.

It’s the fact that we are going back into full lockdown until March 5th that may be an issue. That’s not ideal but I think most people would say okay but the issue that I have is that beyond lockdowns of varying levels there isn’t any other plan. I’m sure it’s affected politicians like it’s affected us all but the government haven’t communicated that in any good way and keep saying the public are doing a good job but they don’t seem able to come across as genuine in their sentiments about it.

Ginger n Lemon · 26-01-2021 06:09PM

Kunta Kinte wrote: »

Here is one from 2018.and the situation in rural areas worsened between then and up to the period before March 2020.

https://www.newstalk.com/podcasts/highlights-from-lunchtime-live/decline-pub-rural-ireland

B]"Over 70 rural pubs closed in 2018, according to industry analysis by the Drinks Industry Group of Ireland (DIGI).

The figure is a stark reminder of the pub’s continued decline in rural Ireland. In the period between 2005 and 2018, 1,535 or nearly 20% of rural pubs closed; many were forced to shut up shop during the recession.

DIGI’s analysis of Revenue figures show the rural pub population declined by almost a quarter in Mayo (-21% or 98 pubs), Tipperary (-22.5% or 118 pubs) and Cork (-25.6% or 313 pubs) down from 1221 to 908 in same period 2005-2018".[/B]

BTW speaking about Dublin pubs I`m surprised you actually visited any of them considering you refused to support Irish hospitality last summer and went off on a foreign holiday despite caterwauling for weeks about them not being reopened quickly enough.

Ehhh I suppose you missed the part where alcohol only pubs in Dublin have NOT been allowed to re open since March 2020.

Well now you know.

That is so funny lol you dont seem to be very well informed at all :pac:

Penfailed · 26-01-2021 06:09PM

growleaves wrote: »

Some positive news:

Irish booksellers have record year as lockdown helps boost sales

I wasn't expecting this since the book trade is another one those industries that was supposed to be on its last legs anyway.

I made a point of buying books from an independent bookshop rather than ordering online during the year and at Christmas.

Kunta Kinte · 26-01-2021 06:11PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Any link for that ?

I dont see much compliance in my area either. Not anecdotal btw, people just dont give a shi*.

Boggles perhaps you could consider leaving your house once in a while to get some real world update, other than what you listen on RTE?

Any link for that old buddy? :rolleyes:

Boggles · 26-01-2021 06:11PM

Itssoeasy wrote: »

It’s the fact that we are going back into full lockdown until March 5th that may be an issue. That’s not ideal but I think most people would say okay but the issue that I have is that beyond lockdowns of varying levels there isn’t any other plan. I’m sure it’s affected politicians like it’s affected us all but the government haven’t communicated that in any good way and keep saying the public are doing a good job but they don’t seem able to come across as genuine in their sentiments about it.

Ahh, vaccinating people?

Ginger n Lemon · 26-01-2021 06:12PM

Kunta Kinte wrote: »

Any link for that old buddy? :rolleyes:

Extremely high cases in Dublin north.

You can tune in to Tony H at 6.01 to find out all about that.

emeldc · 26-01-2021 06:12PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

That is great, top notch analysis.

Have you considered that if restrictions werent as ridiculous, especially relating to pubs that have been demonised as if all of covid cases since March 2020 been attributable to them, maybe those 2 would not have shut down?

I remember in July there were 6 new cases on like a Thursday.

I also remember alcohol only pubs not being allowed to reopen until 20th of Sept.

Fkers used schools as an excuse..... ironically to close schools down anyways even though alcohol only pubs that have not actually traded could not have contributed to any cases :rolleyes:

LOL, what a drama queen. No analysis needed really. The pubs around here don't open until 6pm and they'd be lucky to see a handful of punters each all night. You don't need to be mathematician to know that it would take far less than a pandemic to close them down.

risteard7 · 26-01-2021 06:15PM

Have to really feel for the poor elderly people who will continue to be afraid to go to the hospital for any treatment they may require.

Generally empty hospitals might I add. But maybe I'm not allowed to say that around here.

emeldc · 26-01-2021 06:16PM

risteard7 wrote: »

Have to really feel for the poor elderly people who will continue to be afraid to go to the hospital for any treatment they may require.

Generally empty hospitals might I add. But maybe I'm not allowed to say that around here.

What hospital do you work in Risteard.

VonLuck · 26-01-2021 06:17PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Yawn, been hearing that for a year now.

I honestly think people here want to see ICU's overrun for some kind of bizarre justification for lockdowns. It's like saying seatbelts are not needed in cars because deaths from car crashes are low.

risteard7 · 26-01-2021 06:17PM

emeldc wrote: »

What hospital do you work in Risteard.

Well I'd rather not say. Why do you ask?

Ginger n Lemon · 26-01-2021 06:17PM

risteard7 wrote: »

Have to really feel for the poor elderly people who will continue to be afraid to go to the hospital for any treatment they may require.

Generally empty hospitals might I add. But maybe I'm not allowed to say that around here.

Shocking.

risteard7 · 26-01-2021 06:19PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Shocking.

Fact. Working in A&E is an absolute doddle now

Ginger n Lemon · 26-01-2021 06:19PM

risteard7 wrote: »

Well I'd rather not say. Why do you ask?

Probably wants to desperately prove you wrong.

26-01-2021 06:20PM

risteard7 wrote: »

Have to really feel for the poor elderly people who will continue to be afraid to go to the hospital for any treatment they may require.

Generally empty hospitals might I add. But maybe I'm not allowed to say that around here.

Oh god, I was in A+E in Connolly hospital last week and I gave my personal account.

I had several posters jumping all over me for saying how quiet A+E was.

I would have been better off pretending I waited 2 days while watching healthcare workers pass out with stress.

emeldc · 26-01-2021 06:20PM

risteard7 wrote: »

Well I'd rather not say. Why do you ask?

Because you could be making it up. There is no shortage of dr's, nurses going on the record saying it's bedlam. Why don't you ring Pat Kenny and tell him it's all nonsense.

emeldc · 26-01-2021 06:21PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Probably wants to desperately prove you wrong.

What's wrong with that?

risteard7 · 26-01-2021 06:21PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Probably wants to desperately prove you wrong.

Hand on heart I 100% work in a HSE hospital on a general ward.

Sorry I mean HSE staff not agency

risteard7 · 26-01-2021 06:23PM

emeldc wrote: »

Because you could be making it up. There is no shortage of dr's, nurses going on the record saying it's bedlam. Why don't you ring Pat Kenny and tell him it's all nonsense.

Well every other hospital in the country must be bedlam bar the one I work in. If I could bring you in and show you you'd be shocked.

Besides Pat wouldn't have me on, Luke o'neill has that gig

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII Read OP For Mod Warnings