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Covid 19 Part XXXI-187,554 ROI (2,970 deaths) 100,319 NI (1,730 deaths)(24/01)Read OP

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Comments

  • #7292
    seamus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,190 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    crossman47 wrote: »
    That is really worrying.
    Is it?

    This month, 40% of all patients hospitalised for Covid have been over 75.

    12.5% of those discharged dying within 140 days doesn't sound that crazy when you consider the age profile of those hospitalised.

    That said, the entire process of hospitalisation, treatment, movement, etc., may have significant life-shortening effect on people of these ages.

    It's another good reason why the impact of covid shouldn't just be viewed in terms of the number of people who die in hospital; but the medium and long-term effects on society of seeing such high levels of hospitalisation.

    This is another area where vaccination should see a major impact in a short space of time.


  • #7293
    podgeandrodge
    Site Banned Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭podgeandrodge


    gctest50 wrote: »
    Not great if you have been in hospital though it seems

    " One in eight Covid patients who are discharged from hospital die within 140 days

    https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/coronavirus-cases-hospitals-long-covid-19644975 "
    crossman47 wrote: »
    That is really worrying.

    is it though? If vast majority of deaths from covid are mid eighties and up, is it that surprising, given underlying conditions also, that 1 in 8 would die within the following year - or, put another way, how many people in their mid eighties die each year - a lot less than 1 in 8 or maybe 1 in 8?


  • #7294
    Talisman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,687 ✭✭✭Talisman


    This would be revolutionary if it proves to be successful.

    Grifols begins clinical trial of a new treatment that would provide immediate immunity against COVID-19
    The treatment could be administered in primary care centers to people who test positive for COVID-19, avoiding hospitalization due to the progression of the disease and complementing the vaccine in the early phase after vaccination

    The medicine, an anti-SARS-CoV-2 immunoglobulin, given subcutaneously, would provide immediate protection after exposure to the virus and could be used to protect the elderly and healthcare workers. It could also be given to immunocompromised patients for whom the vaccination isn’t indicated

    The treatment is based on the Grifols immunoglobulin Gamunex®-C, and contains anti-SARS-COV-2 polyclonal antibodies from plasma donors who have recovered from COVID-19

    The clinical trial to evaluate the safety and efficacy of the plasma-derived medicine will have doctors Oriol Mitjà and Bonaventura Clotet as the principal researchers and is expected to begin in early 2021


  • #7295
    TonyMaloney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,150 ✭✭✭TonyMaloney


    seamus wrote: »
    Is it?

    This month, 40% of all patients hospitalised for Covid have been over 75.

    12.5% of those discharged dying within 140 days doesn't sound that crazy when you consider the age profile of those hospitalised.

    That said, the entire process of hospitalisation, treatment, movement, etc., may have significant life-shortening effect on people of these ages.

    It's another good reason why the impact of covid shouldn't just be viewed in terms of the number of people who die in hospital; but the medium and long-term effects on society of seeing such high levels of hospitalisation.

    This is another area where vaccination should see a major impact in a short space of time.



    It is.

    The more worrying stat from the UK study (I posted this yesterday), is that 30% of those hospitalised are readmitted within five months.
    12.5% of them died in hospital.

    If we see similar here, then of the 2,553 hospitalised in the last 2 weeks, 766 will be readmitted within 5 months. 95 will die.

    For me this just underlines how important it is that we avoid another wave.


  • #7296
    podgeandrodge
    Site Banned Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭podgeandrodge


    Talisman wrote: »
    This would be revolutionary if it proves to be successful.

    Grifols begins clinical trial of a new treatment that would provide immediate immunity against COVID-19

    Open the pubs! :)


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  • #7297
    podgeandrodge
    Site Banned Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭podgeandrodge


    TonyMaloney wrote: »
    It is.

    The more worrying stat from the UK study (I posted this yesterday), is that 30% of those hospitalised are readmitted within five months.
    12.5% of them died in hospital.

    If we see similar here, then of the 2,553 hospitalised in the last 2 weeks, 766 will be readmitted within 5 months. 95 will die.

    For me this just underlines how important it is that we avoid another wave.

    Readmitted due to covid? Or old age factors?


  • #7298
    Scuid Mhór
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,326 ✭✭✭Scuid Mhór


    Recent Journal article isn’t painting a great picture of our ICU capacity. We’ll see what happens over the next few days.


  • #7299
    bb1234567
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,513 ✭✭✭bb1234567


    podgeandrodge wrote: »
    Readmitted due to covid? Or old age factors?

    The people in the study were not very old, average age 65.
    https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-nearly-a-third-of-coronavirus-patients-were-readmitted-to-hospital-within-140-days-study-suggests-12190897

    I didn't realise there was a control group but it was explained better in the skynews article. It's definitely pretty shocking results but the study has yet to be peer reviewed. If this turns out to be replicated/repeated in other countries well this is very big issue, that is a massive long term public health issue on our hands on top of COVID hospitalisations short term.
    The study group was compared with the same number of people from similar demographics and with similar medical profiles over the same period.

    During the study period, hospital readmissions were 3.5 times higher among the group of former coronavirus patients while deaths were 7.7 times higher.


  • #7300
    froog
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭froog


    Talisman wrote: »
    This would be revolutionary if it proves to be successful.

    Grifols begins clinical trial of a new treatment that would provide immediate immunity against COVID-19

    sounds like one of those antibody treatments that is very expensive and not practical on a large scale. open to correction on that.


  • #7301
    Gruffalux
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,023 ✭✭✭Gruffalux


    At 75 one still has 12 years of life expectancy remaining. My dear friend in her 70s has recently sold up, and adventurously moved half way across a continent to live in a remote area. I do not expect them or me to live forever but to have a 12.5% chance of dying within a few months after being hospitalised for a virus is still an unpleasant stat.


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  • #7302
    Derek Zoolander
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 434 ✭✭Derek Zoolander


    Talisman wrote: »
    This would be revolutionary if it proves to be successful.

    Grifols begins clinical trial of a new treatment that would provide immediate immunity against COVID-19

    its part of the COVIG alliance with other plasma companies - likely only to help in severe cases - trial has started in the US already, certainly helpful but can't see it being revolutionary


  • #7303
    majcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 596 ✭✭✭majcos


    Stheno wrote: »
    Thanks for taking the time. I got wondering how those on CPAP communicated or ate if they were well enough

    What are the Helmets Italy used called, if you know?

    Generally there are called hoods here but the term helmet is also used. There are in use in Irish hospitals now too.


  • #7304
    josip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,792 ✭✭✭✭josip


    crossman47 wrote: »
    That is really worrying.


    If you think that's worrying, then remember that every single person who contracts Covid will die within 43000 days.
    This is not a virus that discriminates between young and old.


  • #7305
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Derek Zoolander wrote: »
    its part of the COVIG alliance with other plasma companies - likely only to help in severe cases - trial has started in the US already, certainly helpful but can't see it being revolutionary
    Article states it is viewed as a complement to vaccines and also as a gap filler where vaccinations have not been rolled out fully.


  • #7306
    Rebelbrowser
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,348 ✭✭✭Rebelbrowser


    GP referral figures up unfortunately. Met criteria cases up from 3.57 to 4.38.....


  • #7307
    MerlinSouthDub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,627 ✭✭✭MerlinSouthDub


    Today's GP covid test referral data is out.

    As normal, there is an increase on referrals on Monday (weekend effect) - which then feeds into the usual swab numbers spike on Wednesday. The spike is more pronounced than it was last Monday. Hopefully, nothing of concern but will watch tomorrow's data closely.

    https://tomorrowscare.ie/covid/2021-01-19_COVID_GP_Survey_Results.pdf

    A more positive way of looking at the data (I am an optimist...) is that the raw number of test referrals for yesterday was 43% lower than last Monday (not bad).


  • #7308
    Windmill100000
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 585 ✭✭✭Windmill100000


    podgeandrodge wrote: »
    is it though? If vast majority of deaths from covid are mid eighties and up, is it that surprising, given underlying conditions also, that 1 in 8 would die within the following year - or, put another way, how many people in their mid eighties die each year - a lot less than 1 in 8 or maybe 1 in 8?

    I think you need to remember as well that a proportion of elderly people that are in hospital are in there often. Hospitals see familiar patients all the time, especially elderly people coming in with ongoing complications of existing conditions (diabetes, UTIs, recurrent falls).


  • #7309
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    A new vaccine?!
    A self-styled Sri Lankan holy man’s supposed miracle potion to prevent Covid-19 has turned sour after a minister who publicly drank it was taken to hospital with the virus.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/19/sri-lankan-holy-mans-miracle-potion-for-covid-turns-sour


  • #7310
    bb1234567
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,513 ✭✭✭bb1234567


    Windmill100000 wrote: »
    I think you need to remember as well that a proportion of elderly people that are in hospital are in there often. Hospitals see familiar patients all the time, especially elderly people coming in with ongoing complications of existing conditions (diabetes, UTIs, recurrent falls).

    Yes everyone knows the people who are hospitalised with COID generally are pretty unhealthy people with diabetes ,obesity, hypertension etc, but the point is this cohort of people who were hospitalised with COVID are now much more likely to die after hospitalisation than those in the matched age group in the general population with similar health conditions who were never hospitalised with COVID.


  • #7311
    Derek Zoolander
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 434 ✭✭Derek Zoolander


    bb1234567 wrote: »
    The people in the study were not very old, average age 65.
    https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-nearly-a-third-of-coronavirus-patients-were-readmitted-to-hospital-within-140-days-study-suggests-12190897

    I didn't realise there was a control group but it was explained better in the skynews article. It's definitely pretty shocking results but the study has yet to be peer reviewed. If this turns out to be replicated/repeated in other countries well this is very big issue, that is a massive long term public health issue on our hands on top of COVID hospitalisations short term.

    the control group was very different in terms of general health


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  • #7312
    majcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 596 ✭✭✭majcos


    Derek Zoolander wrote: »
    except people that have been vaccinated can still get covid

    especially if they only have received the first injection
    Yes. They can but hopefully less likely to be hospitalised or have significant symptoms. About 500 healthcare workers have been admitted to hospital to date with 61 of those admitted to ICU up to January 9th and 10 reported deaths. (Missing data from 19th to 27th of December.)

    Even just the first dose provides more protection than the influenza vaccine usually does. Data on reduction in transmission is limited yet but hopefully by reducing viral load, it will have at least some impact.


  • #7313
    majcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 596 ✭✭✭majcos


    Loafing Oaf wrote: »
    Even if the number of cases plateaus as you predict, the vaccination of care home residents will surely slash the death toll, and the number of ICU cases will also fall dramatically with the vaccination of all elderly...

    Vaccinations to date will hopefully reduce death toll but won’t have as much an impact on ICU admissions as those in nursing homes are unlikely to be admitted to ICU anyway.


  • #7314
    Rebelbrowser
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,348 ✭✭✭Rebelbrowser


    majcos wrote: »
    Vaccinations to death will hopefully reduce death toll but won’t have as much an impact on ICU admissions as those in nursing homes are unlikely to be admitted to ICU anyway.

    I think you meant "to date"!


  • #7315
    Derek Zoolander
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 434 ✭✭Derek Zoolander


    majcos wrote: »
    Yes. They can but hopefully less likely to be hospitalised or have significant symptoms. About 500 healthcare workers have been admitted to hospital to date with 61 of those admitted to ICU up to January 9th and 10 reported deaths. (Missing data from 19th to 27th of December.)

    Even just the first dose provides more protection than the influenza vaccine usually does. Data on reduction in transmission is limited yet but hopefully by reducing viral load, it will have at least some impact.

    agreed and we can look to Israel to see the data - essentially based on the contracts that were released yesterday Israel is a real time clinical trial for the Pfizer vaccines. The early data is that after the second shot the transmission looks less - so hopefully that pushes us to go with the Pfizer recommendation of completing both shots rather than the uk approach..

    my main point is that we have been terrible on messaging and need to get the messaging right for vaccinations and what the risk profile post vaccination looks like


  • #7316
    josip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,792 ✭✭✭✭josip


    Derek Zoolander wrote: »
    the control group was very different in terms of general health


    Is that the 'control' group on the right?
    Is this some kind of a f**g joke? (not you OP, the study)


  • #7317
    bb1234567
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,513 ✭✭✭bb1234567


    Derek Zoolander wrote: »
    agreed and we can look to Israel to see the data - essentially based on the contracts that were released yesterday Israel is a real time clinical trial for the Pfizer vaccines. The early data is that after the second shot the transmission looks less - so hopefully that pushes us to go with the Pfizer recommendation of completing both shots rather than the uk approach..

    my main point is that we have been terrible on messaging and need to get the messaging right for vaccinations and what the risk profile post vaccination looks like

    When would deaths in Israel be expected to reduce? Still climbing over there, would have thought they'd see a bit of drop off in deaths by now


  • #7318
    bb1234567
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,513 ✭✭✭bb1234567


    Derek Zoolander wrote: »
    the control group was very different in terms of general health

    Jaysus pretty odd the study co-ordinators tried to claim these are comparable control groups!
    God you really can't take any the COVID info at face value anymore no matter where or who it's from can you. Surrounded by misinformation on all fronts, totally frustrating and confusing


  • #7319
    timsey tiger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,768 ✭✭✭timsey tiger


    bb1234567 wrote: »
    When would deaths in Israel be expected to reduce? Still climbing over there, would have thought they'd see a bit of drop off in deaths by now

    Their recent case numbers are worse than ours.


  • #7320
    Derek Zoolander
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 434 ✭✭Derek Zoolander


    bb1234567 wrote: »
    Jaysus pretty odd the study co-ordinators tried to claim these are comparable control groups!
    God you really can't take any the COVID info at face value anymore no matter where or who it's from can you. Surrounded by misinformation on all fronts, totally frustrating and confusing

    will never be similar as we know COVID impacts people with compromised immune system worse - so a hospitalized group of COVID patients will never be a good proxy to the general population


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  • #7321
    majcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 596 ✭✭✭majcos


    podgeandrodge wrote: »
    is it though? If vast majority of deaths from covid are mid eighties and up, is it that surprising, given underlying conditions also, that 1 in 8 would die within the following year - or, put another way, how many people in their mid eighties die each year - a lot less than 1 in 8 or maybe 1 in 8?

    I haven’t read that paper yet but it is something that should be tracked although the percentage of deaths within a year of any hospital admission are relatively high. All-cause readmission rates are very high too.

    The median age of deaths in Ireland is in reference to all deaths. 1096/2351 deaths up to 9th of January took place in hospitals. If there was an analysis of the age of those who died in hospitals, it might be a little bit younger.


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