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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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    #9812
    HalfAndHalf
    Registered Users Posts: 827 ✭✭✭HalfAndHalf


    GazzaL wrote: »
    The WHO said lockdowns are a last resort. Anti-science NPHET have repeatedly ignored the WHO.

    The police haven't been able to shut down premises in Poland and Italy, so the Gardai have no chance. In places like Lanzarote, at their highest restriction level, hospitality is still open!

    Nobody will force you to go into a restaurant or pub. If you want to stay at home, that's your personal choice. I would choose to go to a restaurant and support local jobs.

    Is this the same WHO that told us all back in January 2020 that the virus would not spread from human to human, hugely delayed upgrading Covid’s status from epidemic to pandemic and spent more time trying to not offend China than protect the rest of the world, the same world that funds their cushy jobs?! Yeah how ‘scientific’....


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    #9813
    dublin_paul
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭dublin_paul


    FintanMcluskey wrote: »
    Mitigation measure like social distancing ad mask wearing are perhaps the most effective

    Stay at home orders and business closures are counter productive

    Right now I can't agree with you regarding the opening of business, but very soon I will agree with you because the most vulnerable will have been vaccinated and the reasons for these extreme measures to suppress the virus will have largely disappeared


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    #9814
    growleaves
    Registered Users Posts: 7,763 ✭✭✭growleaves


    bb1234567 wrote: »
    And why do you think this issue should be free of scrutiny under the usual scientific processes?
    You can draw inferences, but they're not necessarily reliablle or showing the full picture and that's why polls are the only way of gauging opinon of a large number of people who you don't come into contact with regularly

    Ah but I didn't say we should be running purely on street smarts but that our own observations and intuition should come into things as well. If a have a strong personal perception of my own then I will allow it to influence me rather than block it out.

    As for the specific issue of polls, I believe the way that questions are phrased influences the outcome. Sometimes people will even feel intimidated and lie to pollsters.

    With the Trump-Brexit effect why are the polls always skewed one way? Some could say 'they're only out by ten percent' but why doesn't some pollster have Trump to get ten percent more votes than he did?

    In practice these polls always over-predict on the side of the establishment or most powerful faction of the establishment.

    The majority of people are go-along-to-get-along and, I think, even in favour of restrictions but I don't think it is a super-majority as represented by these polls. I simply don't believe it and yes I would call it gut instinct.

    The whole concept of a BS meter seems to have dropped out of culture entirely. But there is no obligation to ignore that little voice that says 'I don't believe it'.


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    #9815
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Mr. Karate wrote: »
    Agreed. If the Lockdowns and masks worked then this would already be over with months ago.

    Yeah, they don't appear to have done New Zealand any good at all.

    Oh hang on.

    https://twitter.com/Independent_ie/status/1350749008369770497


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    #9816
    HalfAndHalf
    Registered Users Posts: 827 ✭✭✭HalfAndHalf


    Mr. Karate wrote: »
    That's not our problem. They knew about about this potential second and third waves all year and failed to prepare for it. We should not be continually punished for their laziness and incompetence.



    Agreed. If the Lockdowns and masks worked then this would already be over with months ago.

    And how exactly do you prepare for second and third waves of a pandemic spread by people when some of those people have the attitude of ‘lockdowns and masks don’t work’!

    That’s right, as the saying goes, there’s no cure for stupid!


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    #9817
    growleaves
    Registered Users Posts: 7,763 ✭✭✭growleaves


    The Mail on Sunday columnist, christian and Burkean Conservative, Peter Hitchens, has said:

    “Opinion polls are a device for influencing public opinion, not a device for measuring it. Crack that, and it all makes sense.”

    I don’t agree with Hitchens on very much, but he is right about this.

    In his book The Broken Compass, Hitchens informs us that opinion polls are actually a device for influencing public opinion. He says that the establishment and the media are responsible for this manipulation, based on the misuse of statistics. The overall purpose is to “bring about the thing it claims is already happening”.

    The author cites contemporary examples of the media attacking Gordon Brown and the “predicted” win of the Conservative Party at the 2010 general election
    We know that political opinion polls are certainly not always an accurate reflection of public opinion. Samples of the population selected to participate may be biased. For example, asking Daily Mail readers who they will vote for will almost certainly produce a majority right wing set of responses. However, if you ask the same question on Twitter, you are much more likely to get a Labour majority.

    The polls do have an effect on voter intentions and on those trying to influence the outcome of elections.

    https://politicsandinsights.org/2017/04/29/political-polls-and-propaganda-the-writing-on-the-wall/


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    #9818
    Mr. Karate
    Registered Users Posts: 1,373 ✭✭✭Mr. Karate


    HalfAndHalf wrote: »
    And how exactly do you prepare for second and third waves of a pandemic spread

    Increasing the amount of ICU beds and Ventilators.


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    #9819
    JRant
    Registered Users Posts: 12,921 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    Graham wrote: »
    Yeah, they don't appear to have done New Zealand any good at all.

    Oh hang on.

    https://twitter.com/Independent_ie/status/1350749008369770497

    You know what else NZ didn't do?
    They didn't allow 10's of thousands travel from the UK, which was rampant with COVID at the time, untested and with no quarantine. But sure, we all partied, now where have I heard that awful phrase before.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



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    #9820
    fin12
    Registered Users Posts: 10,934 ✭✭✭✭fin12


    HalfAndHalf wrote: »
    Is this the same WHO that told us all back in January 2020 that the virus would not spread from human to human, hugely delayed upgrading Covid’s status from epidemic to pandemic and spent more time trying to not offend China than protect the rest of the world, the same world that funds their cushy jobs?! Yeah how ‘scientific’....

    Also told us not to bother wearing masks. I know people love to never give Trump credit for anything, but he cut fundingfrom that useless corrupt organization.


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    #9821
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    growleaves wrote: »
    https://politicsandinsights.org/2017/04/29/political-polls-and-propaganda-the-writing-on-the-wall/

    Ignore opinion poles, ignore government, ignore the medical profession, ignore the media.

    That sounds like a sound basis to crack a pandemic.


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    #9822
    Ironhead93
    Registered Users Posts: 60 ✭✭Ironhead93


    GazzaL wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/otwieramy

    This twitter account highlights some of the businesses like restaurants, bars, hotels and recreational activity venues etc. that are re-opening in Poland despite the restrictions. It's a long list! Great to see.

    Unfortunately I doubt that would ever happen here, we're a nation of cowards.


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    #9823
    HalfAndHalf
    Registered Users Posts: 827 ✭✭✭HalfAndHalf


    Mr. Karate wrote: »
    Increasing the amount of ICU beds and Ventilators.

    And how exactly does that stop the spread of the virus?

    You conveniently ignored the rest of my post I see....so masks and lockdowns don’t prevent person to person transmission, more hospital beds do! Got to be the best one yet! LOL!


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    #9824
    HalfAndHalf
    Registered Users Posts: 827 ✭✭✭HalfAndHalf


    JRant wrote: »
    You know what else NZ didn't do?
    They didn't allow 10's of thousands travel from the UK, which was rampant with COVID at the time, untested and with no quarantine. But sure, we all partied, now where have I heard that awful phrase before.

    120,000 Irish people came home at Xmas, is this the U.K. travel you refer to?


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    #9825
    growleaves
    Registered Users Posts: 7,763 ✭✭✭growleaves


    Graham wrote: »
    Ignore opinion poles, ignore government, ignore the medical profession, ignore the media.

    That sounds like a sound basis to crack a pandemic.

    It depends. Which opinion Poles? Many Poles are against lockdown ;)


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    #9826
    Mr. Karate
    Registered Users Posts: 1,373 ✭✭✭Mr. Karate


    HalfAndHalf wrote: »
    And how exactly does that stop the spread of the virus?

    You conveniently ignored the rest of my post I see....so masks and lockdowns don’t prevent person to person transmission, more hospital beds do! Got to be the best one yet! LOL!

    We can't stop the spread of the flu. Stopping this is a pipe dream. The best thing they could have done was beefed up their emergency rooms and ICUs with beds, ventilators and other equipment so the rest of us could go on with our lives.


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    #9827
    Kunta Kinte
    Registered Users Posts: 718 ✭✭✭Kunta Kinte


    fin12 wrote: »
    Also told us not to bother wearing masks. I know people love to never give Trump credit for anything, but he cut fundingfrom that useless corrupt organization.

    In a few days time after the orange moron is rightly ****ed out of the White House President Biden will be reversing a lot of that ****tard`s decisions hopefully including restoring funding to the WHO.


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    #9828
    fin12
    Registered Users Posts: 10,934 ✭✭✭✭fin12


    Kunta Kinte wrote: »
    In a few days time after the orange moron is rightly ****ed out of the White House President Biden will be reversing a lot of that ****tard`s decisions hopefully including restoring funding to the WHO.

    Don’t give a f*ck what Biden does. Jeeze trump really is like a bull to a red flag to you... lol


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    #9829
    Lundstram
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭Lundstram


    I see some trouble is brewing regarding the vaccine. Head of Coombe hospital apparently brought home some vaccines for his kids. Throwing out the "they were going to be dumped anyway" line to try cover his arse. Interesting to see how this plays out.

    Here we all are locked down awaiting this vaccine and this sh1t is going on. Sickening.


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    #9830
    fin12
    Registered Users Posts: 10,934 ✭✭✭✭fin12


    Lundstram wrote: »
    I see some trouble is brewing regarding the vaccine. Head of Coombe hospital apparently brought home some vaccines for his kids. Throwing out the "they were going to be dumped anyway" line to try cover his arse. Interesting to see how this plays out.

    Why would vaccines have been dumped?


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    #9831
    Lundstram
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭Lundstram


    fin12 wrote: »
    Why would vaccines have been dumped?
    I think they've a short life once defrosted, I'm not privy to the exact timeframe, though.

    Nursing home up the road from me here has only 30% of staff vaccinated and here's your man bringing it home. Unbelievable.


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    #9832
    Neamhshuntasach
    Registered Users Posts: 2,168 ✭✭✭Neamhshuntasach


    fin12 wrote: »
    Why would vaccines have been dumped?

    Once they are thawed out for use. They have a short shelf life. They can't just go back or be transported elsewhere for use. So it's pretty much use it or lose it. But bringing in family members to take them is ridiculous.


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    #9833
    fin12
    Registered Users Posts: 10,934 ✭✭✭✭fin12


    Neamhshuntasach wrote: »
    Once they are thawed out for use. They have a short shelf life. They can't just go back or be transported elsewhere for use. So it's pretty much use it or lose it. But bringing in family members to take them is ridiculous.

    Ok so then why weren’t they used and left to thaw out?


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    #9834
    Neamhshuntasach
    Registered Users Posts: 2,168 ✭✭✭Neamhshuntasach


    Lundstram wrote: »
    I think they've a short life once defrosted, I'm not privy to the exact timeframe, though.

    Nursing home up the road from me here has only 30% of staff vaccinated and here's your man bringing it home. Unbelievable.

    Pfizer is 5 days at standard fridge. Moderna is a fair bit longer at 30 days I think. Seems like it's grand to just throw back into a fridge and take away. But doesn't see like there is a standard refrigerated process to take any extras away and bring elsewhere. Probably because they aren't planning for extras. The extras come from the different number of doses extracted from each vial primarily. Or no shows. Which I believe are very low here.


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    #9835
    Neamhshuntasach
    Registered Users Posts: 2,168 ✭✭✭Neamhshuntasach


    fin12 wrote: »
    Ok so then why weren’t they used and left to thaw out?

    See above comment from me. Some vials have 4 doses. Some have 5 and some 6. Depends on needle used and extraction.

    Plan to do 200 people at one site so there are 50 vials. But it turns out that 20 of the vials allowed for 5 shots while 10 allowed for 6. There's 40 extra. And it's not like they are just thawed onsite. They arrive ready.


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    #9836
    Kunta Kinte
    Registered Users Posts: 718 ✭✭✭Kunta Kinte


    fin12 wrote: »
    Don’t give a f*ck what Biden does. Jeeze trump really is like a bull to a red flag to you... lol

    The correct phrase is "like a red flag to a bull ". If you are going to give a smart reply then at least get it right. And yeah that orange piece of ****e has blood on his hands. The sooner he is taken away in chains and locked away for the rest of his moronic life the better.


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    #9837
    fin12
    Registered Users Posts: 10,934 ✭✭✭✭fin12


    Neamhshuntasach wrote: »
    See above comment from me. Some vials have 4 doses. Some have 5 and some 6. Depends on needle used and extraction.

    Plan to do 200 people at one site so there are 50 vials. But it turns out that 20 of the vials allowed for 5 shots while 10 allowed for 6. There's 40 extra. And it's not like they are just thawed onsite. They arrive ready.

    I don’t understand any of that .


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    #9838
    Neamhshuntasach
    Registered Users Posts: 2,168 ✭✭✭Neamhshuntasach


    fin12 wrote: »
    I don’t understand any of that .

    Well that's on you a chara.


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    #9839
    dalyboy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,431 ✭✭✭dalyboy


    Kunta Kinte wrote: »
    The correct phrase is "like a red flag to a bull ". If you are going to give a smart reply then at least get it right. And yeah that orange piece of ****e has blood on his hands. The sooner he is taken away in chains and locked away for the rest of his moronic life the better.

    Ahh , your both wrong. It’s “red rag to a bull”


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    #9840
    Kunta Kinte
    Registered Users Posts: 718 ✭✭✭Kunta Kinte


    fin12 wrote: »
    I don’t give a f*ck what u think or about Trump ... on ignore cause what I really want to say to u will be me banned.

    Likewise.


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    #9841
    fin12
    Registered Users Posts: 10,934 ✭✭✭✭fin12


    Neamhshuntasach wrote: »
    Well that's on you a chara.

    Yes I know it is, not trying to be smart , as I genuinely don’t understand and even this vaccine makes no sense to me as someone says u can still get the virus when vaccinated just don’t get sick.


This discussion has been closed.
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