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Covid 19 Part XXX-113,332 ROI(2,282 deaths) 81,251 NI (1,384 deaths) (05/01) Read OP

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Comments

  • #3842
    Ace2007
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,029 ✭✭✭✭Ace2007


    It is jus a cop out to blame the government at this stage, I've said it numerous times before, that if this virus cause high mortality rates to the young as it does to the elderly, people would have no problem staying in doors and would tell their boss where to go if ask to come into the office ,or would have no problem telling their friends, neighbours, or basically anyone that was taking the piss to cop on.

    I know companies that are calling themselves essential and telling employees to go into the office, despite them being more than capable to work from home back in March.

    The government has to close down pretty much everything, because people don't listen or want to do as they are told for example - the gyms as you had gyms having an instructor and 10 people in magic squares and calling it individual training - Society in Ireland look at rules, and say well let's get around it by interpreting it to mean this or that.

    The Sh!t has hit the fan, and it's due to society as a whole, there was intense pressure put on the government to open shops for xmas, and to allow people to go home. This is going to get a lot worse before it gets better, we need to go into a full lockdown just like last March, and that means all companies that were working from home in March have to work from home now, no BS and dragging people into offices.


  • #3843
    theballz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,272 ✭✭✭theballz


    Can’t wait for this sh*te to be over.


  • #3844
    ElJeffe
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 725 ✭✭✭ElJeffe


    Arghus wrote: »
    Well, I reckon MM will be down those steps again before the lecturn has been even put away.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he's out as soon as tomorrow and the word curfew is being mentioned


  • #3845
    Mwengwe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 454 ✭✭Mwengwe


    Ironhead93 wrote: »
    Anyone hazard a guess when restrictions might be eased? Even into a level 5 minus? My guess is mid-late Feb

    Anyone who says later than that is letting the headlines get to them. It really does depend on how lockdown is observed and enforced for the next month or so.


  • #3846
    Happy4all
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,089 ✭✭✭Happy4all


    theballz wrote: »
    Can’t wait for this sh*te to be over.

    Don't hold your breath.


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  • #3847
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    hmmm wrote: »
    I don't get that impression from people I know. I think more than anything else it was the sense that you needed to get out and socialise while things were opened that had people packing into places.

    No enforcement of rules, rush to socialise, packed into places with all the windows closed, cold dry air - it was a perfect storm. Then after everyone had caught it in the pub, they got together with all their elderly relatives for Christmas dinner. Many of them will be meeting up again this evening, just at the point they are most infectious.

    It's a mixture of ignorance, political fecklessness and poor education on how the virus spreads.

    Is there an element here too though that the messaging was wrong?

    Now I probably pay a bit more attention than others but it was clear to me that there were choices to make, either go out for a meal/s or have family gatherings

    It was an easy one for me as my family is large and I've no idea how careful they have been, plus my other halfs children had planned their own Christmas

    So I got to.go out for a few meals with the other half, but have not been in another house, nor have i had visitors

    Its quite likely that people did not understand the messaging and thought they could do it all

    Or as the cynic in me thinks, a significant minority of people said screw it, im having Christmas like I always did


  • #3848
    Fr_Dougal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,166 ✭✭✭Fr_Dougal


    Stheno wrote: »
    30000 people came home from the UK for Christmas

    That no doubt added to the chaos

    ‘Repatriation flights”


  • #3849
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,017 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Ace2007 wrote: »
    It is jus a cop out to blame the government at this stage, I've said it numerous times before, that if this virus cause high mortality rates to the young as it does to the elderly, people would have no problem staying in doors and would tell their boss where to go if ask to come into the office ,or would have no problem telling their friends, neighbours, or basically anyone that was taking the piss to cop on.

    I know companies that are calling themselves essential and telling employees to go into the office, despite them being more than capable to work from home back in March.

    The government has to close down pretty much everything, because people don't listen or want to do as they are told for example - the gyms as you had gyms having an instructor and 10 people in magic squares and calling it individual training - Society in Ireland look at rules, and say well let's get around it by interpreting it to mean this or that.

    The Sh!t has hit the fan, and it's due to society as a whole, there was intense pressure put on the government to open shops for xmas, and to allow people to go home. This is going to get a lot worse before it gets better, we need to go into a full lockdown just like last March, and that means all companies that were working from home in March have to work from home now, no BS and dragging people into offices.

    No it isn’t a cop out. They are the government of this country and because of that they need to do what they were elected to do which is to lead and IMO there ability to lead has been getting worse as the months have gone on.

    At times I think some people(and thankfully it’s a small percentage) love to sit on their high horse and lecture people. I’m of the opinion that the vast vast majority of the people in the country over the past ten months have stuck to the rules as they existed at the time.


  • #3850
    Funsterdelux
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,376 ✭✭✭Funsterdelux


    Arghus wrote: »
    Well, I reckon MM will be down those steps again before the lecturn has been even put away.

    "I was standing on these steps, speaking to you just 10 minutes ago"


  • #3851
    theballz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,272 ✭✭✭theballz


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    No it isn’t a cop out. They are the government of this country and because of that they need to do what they were elected to do which is to lead and IMO there ability to lead has been getting worse as the months have gone on.

    At times I think some people(and thankfully it’s a small percentage) love to sit on their high horse and lecture people. I’m of the opinion that the vast vast majority of the people in the country over the past ten months have stuck to the rules as they existed at the time.

    I can already tell by your bad grammar that you voted SF.


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  • #3852
    Ace2007
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,029 ✭✭✭✭Ace2007


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    No it isn’t a cop out. They are the government of this country and because of that they need to do what they were elected to do which is to lead and IMO there ability to lead has been getting worse as the months have gone on.

    At times I think some people(and thankfully it’s a small percentage) love to sit on their high horse and lecture people. I’m of the opinion that the vast vast majority of the people in the country over the past ten months have stuck to the rules as they existed at the time.

    So straight up - if the mortality rate for those in the 20-50 range was as high as it is for the elderly do you think people would have acted the same over xmas?


  • #3853
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    Stheno wrote: »
    Is there an element here too though that the messaging was wrong?

    Its quite likely that people did not understand the messaging and thought they could do it all

    Or as the cynic in me thina, a significant minority of people said screw it, im having Christmas like I always did
    I wonder. I don't mix with an anti-lockdown type of crowd, yet many of them still went out for a dinner/night in the pub because they felt that in many ways they had been "given the all clear". A lot of social pressure in peer groups also.

    In hindsight (and foresight) the messaging was wrong, but the fundamental problem in my opinion was opening hospitality during a busy period to seed large amounts of infection, and people then determined to have a "normal" Christmas despite the risks.


  • #3854
    brookers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 408 ✭✭brookers


    does anybody know how many in hospital now and is it likely we will be in a far stricter level 5 by the weekend, ie. a lot of essential declared non essential and 2km etc what about click and collect, was that allowed in the first lockdown. Just driving home from work this evening and the traffic was bumper to bumper, dont remember it like that in march/april.


  • #3855
    Arghus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,160 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    hmmm wrote: »
    I don't get that impression from people I know. I think more than anything else it was the sense that you needed to get out and socialise while things were opened that had people packing into places.

    No enforcement of rules, rush to socialise, packed into places with all the windows closed, cold dry air - it was a perfect storm. Then after everyone had caught it in the pub, they got together with all their elderly relatives for Christmas dinner. Many of them will be meeting up again this evening, just at the point they are most infectious.

    It's a mixture of ignorance, political fecklessness and poor education on how the virus spreads.

    Go back and read through an older version of this thread from about 5-4 weeks ago - all the insight you need into why we are where we are.


  • #3856
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    Funsterdelux wrote: »
    "I was standing on these steps, speaking to you just 10 minutes ago"
    (In a Cork accent) "The situation is now very serious. We know we want to do what is right for the country, our friends, our families. We know also that there is an economic cost to bear. But I say to you now that Kerry must be sacrificed to appease the gods. Let us not shirk our responsibilities, and let those who write history say that we took the difficult but necessary decisions. Go raibh mile maith agat."


  • #3857
    ixoy
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 18,042 Mod ✭✭✭✭ixoy


    Stheno wrote: »
    Is there an element here too though that the messaging was wrong?

    Now I probably pay a bit more attention than others but it was clear to me that there were choices to make, either go out for a meal/s or have family gatherings
    I don't even think that was the issue. The issue was that you could have up to three households over at a time. And people then took that to mean that, once some of of those left, you could have a different set of households over. And then go over and mix in another set of households but, as long as you kept the number three or below at any time, then it was okay.

    What really they should have hammered home was that they think you should only meet up with three households at all - be it in a house or a meal - over Christmas and try not to do more than that. And certainly could have pushed for a reduced mixing of households in restaurants (easy as that would be to bypass).


  • #3858
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,599 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Stheno wrote: »
    Is there an element here too though that the messaging was wrong?

    Now I probably pay a bit more attention than others but it was clear to me that there were choices to make, either go out for a meal/s or have family gatherings

    It was an easy one for me as my family is large and I've no idea how careful they have been, plus my other halfs children had planned their own Christmas

    So I got to.go out for a few meals with the other half, but have not been in another house, nor have i had visitors

    Its quite likely that people did not understand the messaging and thought they could do it all

    Or as the cynic in me thinks, a significant minority of people said screw it, im having Christmas like I always did

    I think the cynic in you is more correct than any of us would like.

    Mnny posters on this forum were saying that they did what they wanted. Telling people that nothing was stoppi g them from going to a meal or whatever.


  • #3859
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    hmmm wrote: »
    (In a Cork accent) "The situation is now very serious. We know we want to do what is right for the country, our friends, our families. We know also that there is an economic cost to bear. But I say to you now that Kerry must be sacrificed to appease the gods. Let us not shirk our responsibilities, and let those who write history say that we took the difficult but necessary decisions. Go raibh mile maith agat."

    Brilliant!!


  • #3860
    Scuid Mhór
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,326 ✭✭✭Scuid Mhór


    Jim_Hodge wrote: »
    If you're a close contact you should be getting a test, not waiting to decide yourself if you have symptoms. Asymptomatic spread is a major issue.

    Yes, except that the HSE are now only offering tests to close contacts who have developed symptoms :confused:


  • #3861
    BorneTobyWilde
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,614 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    So Level 5 started midnight last night, and today streets were packed where I am, with all retailers open. It's beyond a joke, even the guards walking the streets buying their ice cream, This is Ireland, this is who we are .


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  • #3862
    stateofflux
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,563 ✭✭✭stateofflux


    theballz wrote: »
    Can’t wait for this sh*te to be over.

    I fear this is only the beginning and the Vaccine carrot is at the end of a very long stick. The chickens are coming home to roost. I hope i'm wrong.


  • #3863
    lawred2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,750 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    BorneTobyWilde wrote: »
    So Level 5 started midnight last night, and today streets were packed where I am, with all retailers open. It's beyond a joke, even the guards walking the streets buying their ice cream, This is Ireland, this is who we are .

    They were all maybe within 5km of their homes

    Including yourself

    But you're not the problem. They are.


  • #3864
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    BorneTobyWilde wrote: »
    So Level 5 started midnight last night, and today streets were packed where I am, with all retailers open. It's beyond a joke, even the guards walking the streets buying their ice cream, This is Ireland, this is who we are .

    Non essential retail is now shut


  • #3865
    Mwengwe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 454 ✭✭Mwengwe


    BorneTobyWilde wrote: »
    So Level 5 started midnight last night, and today streets were packed where I am, with all retailers open. It's beyond a joke, even the guards walking the streets buying their ice cream, This is Ireland, this is who we are .

    It didn't start last night as retail were allowed stay open until this evening. You can't judge anything on today other than people's tolerance for risk-taking.


  • #3866
    mcburns07
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭mcburns07


    brookers wrote: »
    does anybody know how many in hospital now and is it likely we will be in a far stricter level 5 by the weekend, ie. a lot of essential declared non essential and 2km etc what about click and collect, was that allowed in the first lockdown. Just driving home from work this evening and the traffic was bumper to bumper, dont remember it like that in march/april.

    People were afraid in March and had no idea what we were dealing with. The fear is mostly gone now and we’re just relying on people’s sense of obligation to society / family and friends.


  • #3867
    Ace2007
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,029 ✭✭✭✭Ace2007


    ixoy wrote: »
    I don't even think that was the issue. The issue was that you could have up to three households over at a time. And people then took that to mean that, once some of of those left, you could have a different set of households over. And then go over and mix in another set of households but, as long as you kept the number three or below at any time, then it was okay.

    What really they should have hammered home was that they think you should only meet up with three households at all - be it in a house or a meal - over Christmas and try not to do more than that. And certainly could have pushed for a reduced mixing of households in restaurants (easy as that would be to bypass).

    I even saw a social influencer who tbf to her is actually quite good at Q&A and providing information, but she answered a question by saying that it was within a 24 hour period the number of households that you could mix with.

    I personally thought given the situation that it was obviously the same household(s) for the entire lockdown. But i know others who interpret the way they want to and meet others.


  • #3868
    Happy4all
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,089 ✭✭✭Happy4all


    Ace2007 wrote: »
    So straight up - if the mortality rate for those in the 20-50 range was as high as it is for the elderly do you think people would have acted the same over xmas?

    Straight up, I think they look at the fact that 99.5% of all Covid positive s make a full recovery, so their isn't a visual of large amounts of old or young dying.


  • #3869
    The HorsesMouth
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 512 ✭✭✭The HorsesMouth


    stateofflux wrote: »
    I fear this is only the beginning and the Vaccine carrot is at the end of a very long stick. The chickens are coming home to roost. I hope i'm wrong.

    You have absolutely no reason or factual evidence to believe this so if I were you I'd rethink your fears.


  • #3870
    podgeandrodge
    Site Banned Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭podgeandrodge


    Ace2007 wrote: »
    So straight up - if the mortality rate for those in the 20-50 range was as high as it is for the elderly do you think people would have acted the same over xmas?

    Good point. I suspect no they wouldn't have been as free and easy. The level of adherence to the restrictions is related to people's perception of risk, and right now until recently anyway, that was quite low in terms of % op population actually contracting covid, and even lower again then, suffering or dying from it.


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  • #3871
    coastwatch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 909 ✭✭✭coastwatch


    Scuid Mhór wrote: »
    Yes, except that the HSE are now only offering tests to close contacts who have developed symptoms :confused:

    I think the advise is, that as a close contact you should restrict your movements for 14 days anyway, regardless of a test, same as in March / April.


This discussion has been closed.
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