Opening of "No-Food" pubs pushed out again

Scoundrel · 02-12-2020 10:42AM

Gervais08 wrote: »

My local is opening Friday and isn’t imposing limits - their only rule is “be sound”.

I’m off work Friday as I was meant to up North scattering my Dad’s ashes and they have severe restrictions at the minute.

I’ll call in and while away a few hours with a book, a chat and swapping a few racing tips!

Good man yourself you march down there Friday and enjoy yourself and go back Saturday and Sunday if you want to and all don't pay any heed to the doom merchants and smug know it alls on here and if you get any decent tips don't be afraid to tell me!

I'm booked in Sunday myself have Monday off work haven't seen my mates in months I literally cannot wait for it.

02-12-2020 10:47AM

MrStuffins wrote: »

That seems quite extreme. May I ask what exactly you are basing this on?

My logic is based on knowing what "essential" means. Pubs are not essential.

What's essential for a proposed 3 week lockdown in March 2020 and what's essential in a plan that could last 2 years are very very different things.

SB71 · 02-12-2020 10:52AM

The anti pub brigade are welcome to stay at home cursing while the rest of us enjoy our Christmas drinks, a rake of gargle will be had

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000 · 02-12-2020 11:01AM

What about them creamy and delicious pints?

Gervais08 · 02-12-2020 11:04AM

Hunky Monster wrote: »

What about them creamy and delicious pints?

I drink Peroni - if they’re creamy the pipes are off!!!

brisan · 02-12-2020 01:34PM

SB71 wrote: »

The anti pub brigade are welcome to stay at home cursing while the rest of us enjoy our Christmas drinks, a rake of gargle will be had

Well I will be in my local at 3pm on Friday ,and in Howth and Town on Sat
Sunday yet to be decided

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000 · 02-12-2020 02:05PM

It's a sickner for me that the local is gone now. It's a €30 taxi ride two ways to "town" to one of the bigger pubs that sell food. Can't see myself doing it tbh.

El_Duderino 09 · 02-12-2020 02:09PM

fin12 wrote: »

No I like using boards but it’s nothing compared to hanging out physically with people.

Sorry I wouldn’t believe a thing this government say about timescales, I have myself geared for not being back to normal till 2022.

I’m not selling you a government timescale. I think “normal” will include distancing in the medium term.

But social media, video chats are what we have for the moment. It’s up to us to make the most of them - or not. That’s a choice we all have to make for ourselves. Not all choices are equally healthy, but the choices are ours to make.

El_Duderino 09 · 02-12-2020 02:19PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

As with so many posts on here it all boils down to one simple thing: "I'm alright Jack".

Another person who likely is barely affected by the entire scenario but has decided to call into question the troubles of those who are.

"Why don't they just pick up the phone and chat to somebody". "Why don't they just go for a walk with somebody". "Thats what I would do".

Well, bully for you, with your family and your job and your home and your settled social circle. But it would do no harm to wrap your head around the idea that the number of people without those things are not a "fairly small group".

I have plenty of sympathy for someone in those situations. But my sympathy runs dry when someone says they can only meet other people in the pub, shrug at the suggestion of chatting on the phone, meeting in person for a walk and a chat, don’t even suggest other ways they have tried to get some social interactions.

It’s a really strange threat for someone to make that they’re holding their own mental health to ransom if the pubs don’t open. Phone chats and meeting people outside are suboptimal but valid options in the current situation.

I live with one other person and a cat. I have not met family or friends in person since mid-October. It’s inconvenient but I do my best to keep in touch through phone calls and a few group chats with friends. We all make our own choices on how to deal with this situation and not all choices are equally healthy.

drunkmonkey · 02-12-2020 02:28PM

There's no substitute for the pub.

Tenzor07 · 02-12-2020 02:30PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I have plenty of sympathy for someone in those situations. But my sympathy runs dry when someone says they can only meet other people in the pub, shrug at the suggestion of chatting on the phone, meeting in person for a walk and a chat, don’t even suggest other ways they have tried to get some social interactions.

Phone calls and Zoom are all well and good, but I don't think it's fair that someone with privilege doesn't think that a rural pub is a place where often elderly isolated people go to see others in their community, they don't have Cafe's or shopping centers to go to, the local pub isn't a place where they go to knock back a load of pints and shouldn't be treated the same as pubs in busy towns and cities...
Rural pubs were already in decline in the "Before Covid" world, and now they are being killed off completely...
There's really little else in small communities, no activities for older people to meet up socially...
So a pint with some of your neighbours is the only human contact they will get... there's really no reason to keep them closed...

copeyhagen · 02-12-2020 03:02PM

MrStuffins wrote: »

Also, even if he really meant this, and genuinely thought that the only possible place he could meet his friends and family was the pub, that doesn't make it true.

I know a lad who "knows" that the moon is a base for a race of secret lizard overlords..... doesn't make him right!

i only see the lads in the pub. its called having friends and being close to middle aged, with wife and kids, i presume your lacking on the friends and social side of things.

dunno why though, you sound like a party.

El_Duderino 09 · 02-12-2020 03:24PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Phone calls and Zoom are all well and good, but I don't think it's fair that someone with privilege doesn't think that a rural pub is a place where often elderly isolated people go to see others in their community, they don't have Cafe's or shopping centers to go to, the local pub isn't a place where they go to knock back a load of pints and shouldn't be treated the same as pubs in busy towns and cities...
Rural pubs were already in decline in the "Before Covid" world, and now they are being killed off completely...
There's really little else in small communities, no activities for older people to meet up socially...
So a pint with some of your neighbours is the only human contact they will get... there's really no reason to keep them closed...

There’s one reason to keep the closed.... and I think we both know that.

I’m from a rural, one shop/post office, one pub, one one church, one sport team village originally. I get it.

If you’re concerned for the old people with nobody to talk to, have you called any of them?

In any case, the vaccine will hopefully sort it all out so the pubs open as close to normal as is sensible

El_Duderino 09 · 02-12-2020 03:26PM

copeyhagen wrote: »

i only see the lads in the pub. its called having friends and being close to middle aged, with wife and kids, i presume your lacking on the friends and social side of things.

dunno why though, you sound like a party.

That’s only one way for middle aged people to have friends. It’s a bit self-limiting to suggest that THE way to have friends in middle age.

But the main feature of this post is slagging someone for having no friends which is precisely the point for which other pro-opening pubs people are appealing sympathy.

Say you’re pro pub: “you’re privileged and don’t have sympathy for people without friends”
Slag off someone for having no friends: .... fine - as long as that person is opposed to opening pubs until it’s safe.

Tenzor07 · 02-12-2020 03:29PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

There’s one reason to keep the closed.... and I think we both know that.
I’m from a rural, one shop/post office, one pub, one one church, one sport team village originally. I get it.
If you’re concerned for the old people with nobody to talk to, have you called any of them?
In any case, the vaccine will hopefully sort it all out so the pubs open as close to normal as is sensible

If cafe's everywhere can open then a quiet pub with a small number of customers can do also, we're not talking groups of young lads necking pints every night here and as you come from a rural community then you know this already..

It would be pretty strange for me to start phoning strangers from all over the country right?

Small villages with zero cases of Covid should be allowed to live in "Tier 1" lockdown, no reason to keep them in the same level of Lockdown as Dublin or Cork..

El_Duderino 09 · 02-12-2020 03:36PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

If cafe's everywhere can open then a quiet pub with a small number of customers can do also, we're not talking groups of young lads necking pints every night here and as you come from a rural community then you know this already..

It would be pretty strange for me to start phoning strangers from all over the country right?

Small villages with zero cases of Covid should be allowed to live in "Tier 1" lockdown, no reason to keep them in the same level of Lockdown as Dublin or Cork..

Ok. Put your proposal for small pubs where nobody necks pints, to the government. I’m not in charge so no point telling me about it.

It depends on whether you care about the poor old fella who has nobody to talk to for his sake or just for your own sake of making a case for pubs to reopen.

You could just start with phoning an old person in that situation that worries you, and chat to them. But I’m not telling you what to do. You’ll decide whether you care enough about them to just use them for an argument or to do something to help them.

Neowise · 02-12-2020 03:36PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

If cafe's everywhere can open then a quiet pub with a small number of customers can do also, we're not talking groups of young lads necking pints every night here and as you come from a rural community then you know this already..

It would be pretty strange for me to start phoning strangers from all over the country right?

Small villages with zero cases of Covid should be allowed to live in "Tier 1" lockdown, no reason to keep them in the same level of Lockdown as Dublin or Cork..

I agree.

If a rural village was to build a barrier around itself, and ban all crossings of that barrier, and after two weeks was still covid free, then they should be able to goto "Tier 1" or 'level 1 of living with covid'.
But if anybody was to leave the village, they would not be allowed to return, or if they did return or someone new was to enter the vilage, they would need to quarantine for 2 weeks and the level of the village be raised until their quarantines were over.

bucketybuck · 02-12-2020 03:45PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I have plenty of sympathy for someone in those situations. But my sympathy runs dry when someone says they can only meet other people in the pub, shrug at the suggestion of chatting on the phone, meeting in person for a walk and a chat, don’t even suggest other ways they have tried to get some social interactions.

Chat to whom on the phone?

Meet who for a walk?

Why can't you understand that simple little part of the equation, that the chats, calls, zoom parties etc rely on pre-existing contacts. Meeting somebody you already know in other words.

But there are a lot of people who don't have those social contacts, and covid has taken away all of their options for getting one, because by definition the sort of social outreach to new people that they need is forbidden.

speckle · 02-12-2020 03:49PM

What about the hundreds of sq km around where I live... we should have been on the lower tiers all of this last year... many local pubs in villages and towns here unable to open for the locals. Yet we had 1000s of tourists from all over Ireland and the world. Do we not get to enjoy a pint or cuppa.
Hhm maybe we should build a wall/checkpoint for the hols and not let in anyone who helped make this discrimnatory rule the effects rural Ireland. You in the Dail etc that holidayed here..please dont expect a cead mile failte next time.

Cork2021 · 02-12-2020 04:28PM

VFI & LVA ain’t going to lay down anymore id say.

https://twitter.com/vfipubs/status/1334145871143899141?s=21

Scoundrel · 02-12-2020 04:34PM

Cork2021 wrote: »

VFI & LVA ain’t going to lay down anymore id say.

https://twitter.com/vfipubs/status/1334145871143899141?s=21

Good about time they grew a pair

mikekerry · 02-12-2020 04:46PM

Scoundrel wrote: »

Good about time they grew a pair

Can they not just get together and all open up.

speckle · 02-12-2020 04:55PM

Cork2021 wrote: »

VFI & LVA ain’t going to lay down anymore id say.

https://twitter.com/vfipubs/status/1334145871143899141?s=21

Could we hire them instead of Nephet.. thats a really good hard hitting analysis of the information on hand...better than some of the fuzzy stuff we hear from the experts.

Time for a court case like in Germany and other countrys if they cannot refute it with hard chain of evidence... not suposition from a belagured contact tracing tracing(who I am not blaming) and undetailed generalised epi reports.

02-12-2020 04:55PM

Cork2021 wrote: »

VFI & LVA ain’t going to lay down anymore id say.

https://twitter.com/vfipubs/status/1334145871143899141?s=21

Like Phoenix rising from the ashes. Finally waking up from their slumber and realising that the Irish public are being codded by selective manipulation of key data to portray traditional pubs in a negative light.

"The overall approach of the research is to use spurious correlation to imply causation."

Confirming what most of us already know. Enough is enough, open the traditional pubs for trade with the others on December 4. Rescuing a struggling sector from ruination, let the nervous nellies awaiting the vaccine stay at home. All parties are satisfied, except the curtain twitchers who are entitled to vent their sputum at Joe Duffy.

TomTomTim · 02-12-2020 05:39PM

speckle wrote: »

Could we hire them instead of Nephet.. thats a really good hard hitting analysis of the information on hand...better than some of the fuzzy stuff we hear from the experts.

Time for a court case like in Germany and other countrys if they cannot refute it with hard chain of evidence... not suposition from a belagured contact tracing tracing(who I am not blaming) and undetailed generalised epi reports.

It's "experts", not experts. People who are often wrong should never have the title of being an expert in something. A degree alone, certainly doesn't make someone an expert in a field.

El_Duderino 09 · 02-12-2020 05:39PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Chat to whom on the phone?

Meet who for a walk?

Why can't you understand that simple little part of the equation, that the chats, calls, zoom parties etc rely on pre-existing contacts. Meeting somebody you already know in other words.

But there are a lot of people who don't have those social contacts, and covid has taken away all of their options for getting one, because by definition the sort of social outreach to new people that they need is forbidden.

Are we talking about people who have absolutely no family or friends AND get ALL their social contact in the pub? I just don’t think there are “hundreds of thousands” of people in that exact situation, as another poster claimed earlier.

Are you in that situation yourself? Absolutely nobody you could call for a chat or a walk or whatever innovative way you can think of, to get some social contact?

It’s a bummer for anyone in that situation, no doubt about that. No system is perfect an some people will fall through the cracks - not something I’m happy about, just an observation of fact.

But if people won’t try anything else to get some social contact, then I think it’s hard to expect the government to give in to their first demand.

speckle · 02-12-2020 05:44PM

TomTomTim wrote: »

It's "experts", not experts. People who are often wrong should never have the title of being an expert in something. A degree alone, certainly doesn't make someone an expert in a field.

'So called experts' then so it is.

bucketybuck · 02-12-2020 07:28PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

But if people won’t try anything else to get some social contact

I thought you might be wrapping your head around the issue but then you finish with this.

Try what else? What else should they try? Enlighten us?

SOCIAL CONTACT IS HEAVILY RESTRICTED and most definitely heavily discouraged as a public health issue. So if you are a person with no social contacts today, how do you go about getting them? Where do you go?

Remember, any answer you give needs to adhere to the public health restrictions in place.

El_Duderino 09 · 02-12-2020 07:43PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

I thought you might be wrapping your head around the issue but then you finish with this.

Try what else? What else should they try? Enlighten us?

SOCIAL CONTACT IS HEAVILY RESTRICTED and most definitely heavily discouraged as a public health issue. So if you are a person with no social contacts today, how do you go about getting them? Where do you go?

Remember, any answer you give needs to adhere to the public health restrictions in place.

Are you one of the people with no family or friends to phone or go for a walk with and can only chat with strangers or acquaintances in the pub?

Sure, going to the pub doesn’t adhere to the guidelines either so have you struck that off the list? But if we’re including things like pubs, then the scope is wide open.

There no point me suggesting a list of things and you telling me why you don’t want to do them. So I’ll just tell you one instance I heard about from my mother at the weekend: our small village as mentioned earlier, someone put up a hand written sign in the shop window offering to go for a walk at whatever time on Sunday.

Simple, to the point, practical. I don’t know who posted the sign or who turned up. But the notion that pubs are the only place people are allowed to meet and talk, is just untrue.

But I’m sure you’ve tried things like that already.... right?

Gervais08 · 02-12-2020 07:49PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Are you one of the people with no family or friends to phone or go for a walk with and can only chat with strangers or acquaintances in the pub?

Sure, going to the pub doesn’t adhere to the guidelines either so have you struck that off the list? But if we’re including things like pubs, then the scope is wide open.

There no point me suggesting a list of things and you telling me why you don’t want to do them. So I’ll just tell you one instance I heard about from my mother at the weekend: our small village as mentioned earlier, someone put up a hand written sign in the shop window offering to go for a walk at whatever time on Sunday.

Simple, to the point, practical. I don’t know who posted the sign or who turned up. But the notion that pubs are the only place people are allowed to meet and talk, is just untrue.

But I’m sure you’ve tried things like that already.... right?

Sure yeah, I’ll just go for a walk in a remote area with someone who put a sign up in a window.

Don’t see any drawbacks to that plan.....

Opening of "No-Food" pubs pushed out again

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