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The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

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    #6152
    KarlMarks
    Registered Users Posts: 53 ✭✭KarlMarks


    Nobotty wrote: »
    Any chance of a bit of slack here
    You all know every SF politician holds Brian Stanley's views
    He shouldn't have tweeted them out loud
    Its not illegal or breaking regulations to tweet the view,just stupid

    Attending a golf do in Galway,holding a large funeral or drink driving on the other hand...

    It wasn't stupid to tweet it. It was stupid of SF to make him take it down, and then have a posh Free Stater like Ó Broin talking about regret. Stanley was celebrating one of the PIRAs most stunning successes. A militart operation that targetted the foreign army invading our land, and resulted in no civilian loss of life.


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    #6153
    McMurphy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Barry Cowen and Dara Calleary ended up resigning for far less than the Stanley tweet.

    And far far less than what Leo did, just for clarity like.


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    #6154
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,837 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    KarlMarks wrote: »
    It wasn't stupid to tweet it. It was stupid of SF to make him take it down, and then have a posh Free Stater like Ó Broin talking about regret. Stanley was celebrating one of the PIRAs most stunning successes. A militart operation that targetted the foreign army invading our land, and resulted in no civilian loss of life.

    So you would promote this sort of behavior in 2020 from either side...

    Anything goes from either side?

    All free to say what they want about any loss of life on either side?

    Fook sympathy, compassion, understanding, loved ones who lost loved ones etc?

    Have we not moved on from this to be more tolerant and caring and sensitive to each other?

    Surely I can't be alone as an Irishman in wanting this type of behavior removed from our psyche?

    And surely there are loyalists and Unionists who would say the same for their side?


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    #6155
    RandomViewer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    KarlMarks wrote: »
    It wasn't stupid to tweet it. It was stupid of SF to make him take it down, and then have a posh Free Stater like Ó Broin talking about regret. Stanley was celebrating one of the PIRAs most stunning successes. A militart operation that targetted the foreign army invading our land, and resulted in no civilian loss of life.

    British army shot and killed Bill Hudson and injured his cousin on the Omeath side of Narrow water, Irish government did nothing


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    #6156
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Hubertj wrote: »
    I wasn’t aware there are different types of terrorist attacks. You can’t really distinguish between different types of murderers.

    There are indeed. Depends on who you ask. For example when the BA took road blocks off to allow terrorists murder Pat Finucane, that would make the BA complicit in an act of terrorism IMO. People and politics are complex. I can now understand why you tried to equate Varadkar leaking a confidential document to a pal with Maurice McCabe the whistleblower alerting us to Garda corruption.


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    #6157
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Solutionking wrote: »
    Seemingly people on this forum can. Blowing up men, women and children can be put into brackets. The PIRA sit in a bracket which allows you to glorify how great it was for them to blow people up.

    Like blowing up a chip shop when the PIRA knew the target was never in the building was probably an "excellent success", sure it was only 2 children that day

    And if you don't like that expect to be called any of the following "liar", "Beligerent unionist" or a "partitionist".

    That sounds terrible. You should quote these people celebrating children being blown up. Are you on about the BA carpet bombing towns and villages for dear old blighty?


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    #6158
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Hubertj wrote: »
    Any acts of cowardly murder are wrong. There is no justification for them whoever committed them. Its not about SF, the British or any other political party. Its about an elected representative celebrating an act of terrorism.

    Isn't it? If you can't get your head around the fact that some people saw the IRA as a legitimate army fighting another army, you've a long way to go in understanding. The paras are still celebrated and getting medals. I would expect people to be just as proud of their army. Calling one terrorist and only mentioning the other in an 'all' throw away, won't cut it.


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    #6159
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,267 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    McMurphy wrote: »
    And far far less than what Leo did, just for clarity like.

    Disagree, Varadkar was correct to share the document, it was just the way he did it that was a problem. Calleary was wrong to have the dinner, Cowen was wrong to turn away from the checkpoint as well as the way he accounted for it.

    In the case of Stanley, the sentiment as well as the expression of it were both wrong.

    Furthermore, in Stanley's case even his party agree he was wrong, not so in Varadkar's case.


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    #6160
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Solutionking wrote: »
    Every week you lads want a vote of no confidence. Next week if Ethel doesn't have the tea right will you want a vote of no confidence then as well?

    I think no confidence votes based on the crony leaking of a confidential document to a pal, the crony appointment of a pal and the like warrant such things. Accountability would be nice. Might keep them in line?


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    #6161
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,267 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Bowie wrote: »
    Isn't it? If you can't get your head around the fact that some people saw the IRA as a legitimate army fighting another army, you've a long way to go in understanding. The paras are still celebrated and getting medals. I would expect people to be just as proud of their army. Calling one terrorist and only mentioning the other in an 'all' throw away, won't cut it.

    Oh, we fully understand the fact that some people saw the IRA as a legitimate army. We just think that they are wrong, either through naivety, through adherence to the nasty ideology of exclusionist nationalism, through a failure to empathise or some other unacceptable reason.

    The IRA were nobody's army, they were a criminal exploitative gang. Even McGuinness came to that realisation near the end even while Adams was still singing the praises of "good" republican criminals.


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    #6162
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Barry Cowen and Dara Calleary ended up resigning for far less than the Stanley tweet.

    What law did he break and try cover up? What government restriction did he flout?
    He posted a tweet. His only err was deleting it IMO. He should have stood by it and explained himself.


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    #6163
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,152 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Disagree, Varadkar was correct to share the document, it was just the way he did it that was a problem. Calleary was wrong to have the dinner, Cowen was wrong to turn away from the checkpoint as well as the way he accounted for it.

    In the case of Stanley, the sentiment as well as the expression of it were both wrong.

    Furthermore, in Stanley's case even his party agree he was wrong, not so in Varadkar's case.

    His party agree it was insensitive. Varadkar confessed to wrongdoing. His party and Taoiseach didn't disagree with that as far as I know.

    We still don't know what SIPO or the Gardai will find about it.


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    #6164
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users Posts: 19,142 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    His party agree it was insensitive. Varadkar confessed to wrongdoing. His party and Taoiseach didn't disagree with that as far as I know.

    We still don't know what SIPO or the Gardai will find about it.

    Or the PSNI when Bobby’s inquiry reaches conclusion.

    Strong rumours that Stanley will be asked to step back tomorrow.


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    #6165
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Disagree, Varadkar was correct to share the document, it was just the way he did it that was a problem. Calleary was wrong to have the dinner, Cowen was wrong to turn away from the checkpoint as well as the way he accounted for it.

    In the case of Stanley, the sentiment as well as the expression of it were both wrong.

    Furthermore, in Stanley's case even his party agree he was wrong, not so in Varadkar's case.

    Because he wanted to and FF/FG/Greens have little in the way of ethics doesn't excuse it.

    You claimed Stanley's tweet was worse than covering up a drunk drive/dodging checkpoint and flouting his own covid regulations by going on a golf piss up now you're struggling to find proof.


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    #6166
    Nobotty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 788 ✭✭✭Nobotty


    I dont think Stanley's tweet is a resigning matter
    All core SF members and politicians hold the same view as him
    Its just not pc to to put it out there in a tweet
    For him and say Mary lou to broadcast these views outside of the core circle would be like an Iman shouting death to America on 5th avenue
    Stupid basically
    All that happened with Stanley is he forgot himself, that's all


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    #6167
    KarlMarks
    Registered Users Posts: 53 ✭✭KarlMarks


    Bowie wrote: »
    What law did he break and try cover up? What government restriction did he flout?
    He posted a tweet. His only err was deleting it IMO. He should have stood by it and explained himself.

    Or not explain himself. He's a member of SF, not a self-loathing blueshirt who would have no issue celebrating the tans, but would condemn the PIRAs most successful military action against a foreign aggressor.


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    #6168
    IAMAMORON
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,078 ✭✭✭IAMAMORON


    KarlMarks wrote: »
    Or not explain himself. He's a member of SF, not a self-loathing blueshirt who would have no issue celebrating the tans, but would condemn the PIRAs most successful military action against a foreign aggressor.

    This guy really is a class act.

    I would say he makes a fortune taxing heroin dealers.. nationwide.


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    #6169
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,152 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Brendan Bendar wrote: »
    Or the PSNI when Bobby’s inquiry reaches conclusion.

    Strong rumours that Stanley will be asked to step back tomorrow.

    Where are the strong rumours coming from Brendi? Catherine Murphy just wants an apology to the committee and thinks anything else is a matter for SF. Labour PAC members have no issue nor does Mark McSharry.


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    #6170
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,267 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Brendan Bendar wrote: »
    Strong rumours that Stanley will be asked to step back tomorrow.



    The boys in Belfast haven't made a decision yet. Heard Pearse on the radio this morning who said he hadn't yet had the chance to talk to Mary-Lou about any next steps. Decision awaited in that regard.

    While the Belfast lads will have loved the sentiments Stanley expressed, they know that they are words you must not say in public and they fear the loudmouths - look at the way Reada and Violet-Anne have been disappeared from the airwaves - so poor Brian's career will probably have peaked.


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    #6171
    RandomViewer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Disagree, Varadkar was correct to share the document, it was just the way he did it that was a problem. Calleary was wrong to have the dinner, Cowen was wrong to turn away from the checkpoint as well as the way he accounted for it.

    In the case of Stanley, the sentiment as well as the expression of it were both wrong.

    Furthermore, in Stanley's case even his party agree he was wrong, not so in Varadkar's case.

    If Stanley resigns his seat, which I suspect is what's going to happen it puts pressure on FG to ask the same of Varadkar and to a lesser extent McEntee


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    #6172
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,152 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    blanch152 wrote: »
    The boys in Belfast haven't made a decision yet. Heard Pearse on the radio this morning who said he hadn't yet had the chance to talk to Mary-Lou about any next steps. Decision awaited in that regard.

    While the Belfast lads will have loved the sentiments Stanley expressed, they know that they are words you must not say in public and they fear the loudmouths - look at the way Reada and Violet-Anne have been disappeared from the airwaves - so poor Brian's career will probably have peaked.

    Mary-Lou has said there will be no next step.

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/mary-lou-mcdonald-will-not-punish-brian-stanley-for-insensitive-tweet-as-it-was-a-singular-one-off-mistake-39812726.html


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    #6173
    McMurphy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    blanch152 wrote: »
    . Calleary was wrong to have the dinner, .

    This is interesting, I could swear you're all over the Seamus Woulfe thread exclaiming that he did nothing wrong by attending the same dinner Calleary was wrong to attend:confused:

    Explain please why Calleary was wrong in attending the dinner, yet his resignation was sound, but not Woulfe.

    And Seamus not even a Green.

    This'll be interesting.


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    #6174
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,267 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    McMurphy wrote: »
    This is interesting, I could swear you're all over the Seamus Woulfe thread exclaiming that he did nothing wrong by attending the same dinner Calleary was wrong to attend:confused:

    Explain please why Calleary was wrong in attending the dinner, yet his resignation was sound, but not Woulfe.

    And Seamus not even a Green.

    This'll be interesting.

    Because Calleary was at the Cabinet meeting that changed the rules and definitively knew the rules were changed. Everyone else at the dinner didn't have that knowledge. Simple as that.


    P.S. You never answered the question about whether you agreed with your party leader and what she said about Stanley


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    #6175
    McMurphy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Because Calleary was at the Cabinet meeting that changed the rules and definitively knew the rules were changed. Everyone else at the dinner didn't have that knowledge. Simple as that.


    Funnily enough, Hogan wasn't a member of cabinet either - and I'm pretty sure you're on record on this site stating his resignation calls were correct.

    Also, the saying ignorance of the rules should be no excuse has never been more apt when a supreme judge is who at the centre of what we're discussing.
    P.S. You never answered the question about whether you agreed with your party leader and what she said about Stanley

    I don't have a "party leader" blanch, I'm not a member of any political party, Sinn Fein or otherwise, but I'll answer your question.

    My opinion on Stanley's tweet hasn't changed since yesterday, I think he should have let it stand.

    I had zero issues with the content of it.

    Shinner voiced his support of two successful IRA operations shocker.


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    #6176
    Solutionking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 678 ✭✭✭Solutionking


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Mary-Lou has said there will be no next step.

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/mary-lou-mcdonald-will-not-punish-brian-stanley-for-insensitive-tweet-as-it-was-a-singular-one-off-mistake-39812726.html

    Hardly a shocking revelation is it?


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    #6177
    costacorta
    Registered Users Posts: 479 ✭✭costacorta


    McMurphy wrote: »
    Funnily enough, Hogan wasn't a member of cabinet either - and I'm pretty sure you're on record on this site stating his resignation calls were correct.

    Also, the saying ignorance of the rules should be no excuse has never been more apt when a supreme judge is who at the centre of what we're discussing.



    I don't have a "party leader" blanch, I'm not a member of any political party, Sinn Fein or otherwise, but I'll answer your question.

    My opinion on Stanley's tweet hasn't changed since yesterday, I think he should have let it stand.

    I had zero issues with the content of it.

    Shinner voiced his support of two successful IRA operations shocker.

    Oh not a SF supporter and on here 24/7 supporting them . Then running to the mods reporting people’s post . You would have been a great informer if you were involved with the RA . Nothing but a little snitch you big girls blouse .. Now report that as I’m outta here anyway . Mc Murphy the Snitch should be your name 😢

    Mod: Banned


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    #6178
    gourcuff
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭gourcuff


    what was the issue with the Kimicheal part of the tweet? the state would have had a formal commemoration of Kilmichael if not for covid, and have done so in the past..


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    #6179
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,152 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Solutionking wrote: »
    Hardly a shocking revelation is it?

    Well it would be to the guys claiming that there was to be a meeting of the white bearded men in the Hills of Antrim before the Shinners came to a decision on the matter.


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    #6180
    Solutionking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 678 ✭✭✭Solutionking


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Well it would be to the guys claiming that there was to be a meeting of the white bearded men in the Hills of Antrim before the Shinners came to a decision on the matter.

    Mary Lou had no issues covering up for Gerry Adams over his brother, she didn't think he needed to leave SF after that. Why would anyone think she would call for anyone resignation?
    Unless they walked in a actually killed someone in government building in front of her and the entire population, live on TV, then you might see her call for a resignation.


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    #6181
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Solutionking wrote: »
    Mary Lou had no issues covering up for Gerry Adams over his brother, she didn't think he needed to leave SF after that. Why would anyone think she would call for anyone resignation?
    Unless they walked in a actually killed someone in government building in front of her and the entire population, live on TV, then you might see her call for a resignation.
    Three Sinn Féin members resign over Covid grants

    Do you write in a vacuum?


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