Covid 19 Part XXVIII- 71,942 ROI(2,050 deaths) 51,824 NI (983 deaths) (28/11) Read OP

road_high · 22-11-2020 01:22PM

Jim_Hodge wrote: »

Who wants people to be miserable? How many of them are there?

Reading this thread- a great many indeed

Gruffalux · 22-11-2020 01:31PM

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Go to the drive thru testing in Dublin airport and get tested a few days before Christmas. Results in a day or two. Then visit your family with a clear conscience and piece of mind for all

I actually think there is something to be said for that. I had hoped fast personal tests would be available by now to buy. If one is going to visit vulnerable people it would be a reasonable thing to do - to get clear tests and thereby create a little ''bubble'' where people can just be together..

hmmm · 22-11-2020 01:40PM

hotmail.com wrote: »

Imagine how stupid you would feel if you don't visit home this Xmas because of rules most people aren't sticking to.

Most people I know are following the rules and are planning for a Christmas with reduced numbers in the house. Even the Turkey farmers are on the news saying the demand for large turkeys is well down...

So no-one should feel "stupid" for taking no risks with a vaccine only around the corner. Even if you are getting encouraged to do so by Covid deniers and the anti-everything brigade.

22-11-2020 01:50PM

Goldengirl wrote: »

The jury is very much out on antigen testing.
I thought that by the time you are reacting positively to produce antigens, you have already been infectious for a while

The jury is not out. The internal community of medical professionals(Ireland excepted) has decided that Antigen testing has a vital role to play in suppression of transmission and Antigen testing should be used for mass testing to give respite to the Labs so that they are not swamped with needless test work.
The coronavirus has antigens which are tested by an antigen test, the human host doesn't. The coronavirus has RNA which is tested using PCR test.
Both PCR and Antigen test perform quite poorly with low levels of infection prior to symptoms being observed/observable.

In Germany at the moment the actual number of PCR tests are decreasing because the Labs find themselves processing tests for people with general Covid like symptoms which happen to be just the same symptoms as one would have normally seen in any other cold and flu season.
They are using Antigen testing for mass testing and those who test positive are sent for PCR test. Those who suffer symptoms which are specific to Corona like loss of taste and smell get PCR test and those who have been in close contact with infected people get PCR tests.
My source of reference is the Robert Koch weekly briefing from Thursday.

majcos · 22-11-2020 01:51PM

Cork2021 wrote: »

Has there been any flu cases identified so far this autumn/winter?

https://twitter.com/riochtconor2/status/1330438012149305345?s=21

There have been about 440 confirmed cases in Donegal and Limerick in the last two weeks. Limerick has 34 patients admitted and Letterkenny has 32. This tweet seems to imply that all of the cases admitted in those hospitals are hospital acquired.

Obviously with about 440 cases in the last two weeks in each of those counties, some of the admitted patients are coming from the community as well. His ‘stats’ and comments are so misleading.

No flu has been identified yet up to November 15th but the usual GP sentinel surveillance network has been disrupted by Covid. Hopefully will be functional again in next week or so. Of 825 samples tested for influenza by NVRL since September 28th, no confirmed influenza positive samples.

majcos · 22-11-2020 01:57PM

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Go to the drive thru testing in Dublin airport and get tested a few days before Christmas. Results in a day or two. Then visit your family with a clear conscience and piece of mind for all

It would be somewhat reassuring but you could still be incubating the virus and not test positive at that time but go on to infect other family members in the next few days. That’s why close contacts are tested on day 7 after last contact.

I suppose if you were in a position to completely self isolate for seven days and then get tested, that could work for some people. Again not 100% risk-free but nothing is.

Grab All Association · 22-11-2020 02:01PM

Young people being young people. I don’t begrudge them. As long as they aren’t causing trouble.

Is it their fault Fianna Fáil/Rory O’Hanlon closed district hospitals, reduced capacity in other hospitals, downgraded facilities and started employing foreign doctors with very dubious qualifications? Fake doctors who think elbows are ankles and don’t know what veins are.

Is it their fault the HSE/state stands back and does nothing whilst Mary is obese and has type 2 diabetes? Drinking a crate of Coca Cola and super macs for dinner.

99% of these young people will have mild illness if they were to contract covid 19. If you’re at risk of severe covid 19 with underlying conditions then you need to take whatever precautions not to contract Covid 19, even if it means having to wear a hazmat suit 24hrs a day.

When this pandemic is over, the HSE and government need to stop funding treatments for the likes of T2 diabetes, a REVERSIBLE condition which costs our health service 100s of millions EUR per year to treat. A higher VAT rate needs to be applied to potatoes, bread, fast food and sweets/chocolates.

They had 8 months to increase icu capacity, lure back our own competent Irish doctors with decent wages and reopen/restore services to hospitals like Cashel and Nenagh. Didn’t do it.

22-11-2020 02:02PM

If you want to get a PCR test through a private lab then do so. Do not soak up the capacity of the Health Service's labs.

Happydays2020 · 22-11-2020 02:07PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If you want to get a PCR test through a private lab then do so. Do not soak up the capacity of the Health Service's labs.

So if I have symptoms I should go private?

Happydays2020 · 22-11-2020 02:09PM

Grab All Association wrote: »

Young people being young people. I don’t begrudge them. As long as they aren’t causing trouble.

Is it their fault Fianna Fáil/Rory O’Hanlon closed district hospitals, reduced capacity in other hospitals, downgraded facilities and started employing foreign doctors with very dubious qualifications? Fake doctors who think elbows are ankles and don’t know what veins are.

Is it their fault the HSE/state stands back and does nothing whilst Mary is obese and has type 2 diabetes? Drinking a crate of Coca Cola and super macs for dinner.

99% of these young people will have mild illness if they were to contract covid 19. If you’re at risk of severe covid 19 with underlying conditions then you need to take whatever precautions not to contract Covid 19, even if it means having to wear a hazmat suit 24hrs a day.

When this pandemic is over, the HSE and government need to stop funding treatments for the likes of T2 diabetes, a REVERSIBLE condition which costs our health service 100s of millions EUR per year to treat. A higher VAT rate needs to be applied to potatoes, bread, fast food and sweets/chocolates.

They had 8 months to increase icu capacity, lure back our own competent Irish doctors with decent wages and reopen/restore services to hospitals like Cashel and Nenagh. Didn’t do it.

Nice bit of racism there... the Irish doctors get trained here and then go to the likes of the Middle East and Australia for a nice bit of wedge. Many of the foreign doctors also train here and are very competent.

22-11-2020 02:09PM

Happydays2020 wrote: »

So if I have symptoms I should go private?

read my last contribution with regard to change of focus on testing strategy from Robert Koch Institute.
If you have symptoms which aren't specifically peculiar to covid19 then in this Cold and Flu season you probably have a Cold or Flu.

Happydays2020 · 22-11-2020 02:12PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

read my last contribution with regard to change of focus on testing strategy from Robert Koch Institute.
If you have symptoms which aren't specifically peculiar to covid19 then in this Cold and Flu season you probably have a Cold or Flu.

They share many of the same symptoms. I would say getting tested would be a better strategy.

Should add I agree with you on antigen testing although the Tony Holohan Institute does not.

22-11-2020 02:17PM

If you are symptomatic shedding large quantities of virus an Antigen test would be almost certainly telling you that you are positive and then a PCR test makes sense.
If you have lost sense of taste or smell then PCR test makes sense.
If you have been in close contact with a confirmed case a PCR test makes sense.

A PCR test is a hammer and you only use a hammer for one specific task unless it is the only tool you have in your toolbox in which case you use it for everything.
If the time using the hammer is at the rest of society's expense then you should not use a hammer.

Happydays2020 · 22-11-2020 02:20PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If you are symptomatic shedding large quantities of virus an Antigen test would be almost certainly telling you that you are positive and then a PCR test makes sense.
If you have lost sense of taste or smell then PCR test makes sense.
If you have been in close contact with a confirmed case a PCR test makes sense.

A PCR test is a hammer and you only use a hammer for one specific task unless it is the only tool you have in your toolbox in which case you use it for everything.
If the time using the hammer is at the rest of society's expense then you should not use a hammer.

I agree with all that except the policy from the TH Institute is that the only tools in the toolbox are a lockdown and a hammer.

22-11-2020 02:20PM

Listened to the news bulletin on Newstalk at 1pm. Lead out item? "Monaghan GP is worried vaccines might not necessarily reduce the impact of Covid in the coming years". Who greenlights this garbage? At the very least, report on a survey of GPs instead of leaning upon a single voice. If there isn't consensus from a broad sample then we're in subjective territory. This sort of unreliable fearmongering shouldn't be broadcast on the national airwaves.

niallo27 · 22-11-2020 02:32PM

hmmm wrote: »

Most people I know are following the rules and are planning for a Christmas with reduced numbers in the house. Even the Turkey farmers are on the news saying the demand for large turkeys is well down...

So no-one should feel "stupid" for taking no risks with a vaccine only around the corner. Even if you are getting encouraged to do so by Covid deniers and the anti-everything brigade.

So wanting to spend Christmas with your family makes you a covid denier now, how in the name of Jesus did you come to that idiotic conclusion.

The_Brood · 22-11-2020 02:44PM

niallo27 wrote: »

So wanting to spend Christmas with your family makes you a covid denier now, how in the name of Jesus did you come to that idiotic conclusion.

Well Covid 19 doesnt go on holiday during Christmas, does it? It's not less dangerous, is it? In fact family gatherings would be the biggest danger of a new spread. Are we dealing with a virus we can take breaks from and therefore is not that serious and therefore we have pissed the last year away for absolutely nothing....or if not then no Christmas no nothing until it is all over.

The experts have to decide either way, but this idea of Covid holidays is completely patronizing and insulting. "The virus is dangerous" until the parents start wagging their fingers at the government.

hmmm · 22-11-2020 02:49PM

niallo27 wrote: »

So wanting to spend Christmas with your family makes you a covid denier now, how in the name of Jesus did you come to that idiotic conclusion.

Don't put words into my mouth. The original OP said that people would feel "stupid" for not spending Christmas with their families because "most" people are not following the rules.

Most people are following the rules. Most families are having discussions about what is safe for Christmas. If you're pretending the virus doesn't exist and are going to host a big family gathering because you don't like the man telling you what to do, that's a Covid-denier.

polesheep · 22-11-2020 02:50PM

Deleted User wrote: »

If you want to get a PCR test through a private lab then do so. Do not soak up the capacity of the Health Service's labs.

I think the HSE is doing a good job of that itself. Quite a few families in my neighbourhood have Covid in the household due to a school cluster. Some of them have been called for a test three or four times. One person was called in two days in a row. And one child has been called for a test even though he is on day 19!

The HorsesMouth · 22-11-2020 02:56PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Listened to the news bulletin on Newstalk at 1pm. Lead out item? "Monaghan GP is worried vaccines might not necessarily reduce the impact of Covid in the coming years". Who greenlights this garbage? At the very least, report on a survey of GPs instead of leaning upon a single voice. If there isn't consensus from a broad sample then we're in subjective territory. This sort of unreliable fearmongering shouldn't be broadcast on the national airwaves.

This sort of BS absolutely infuriates me.
We have developed a vaccine with 95% efficiency which has been hailed all over the world as the solution to the end of this. But no the local GP in Monaghan has decided that that's too much positivity and good news for now...let's just throw out some random unfounded opinion on it to dampen down this good vibe.
I actually blame Newstalk more for giving this opinion airtime.

niallo27 · 22-11-2020 02:57PM

hmmm wrote: »

Don't put words into my mouth. The original OP said that people would feel "stupid" for not spending Christmas with their families because "most" people are not following the rules.

Most people are following the rules. Most families are having discussions about what is safe for Christmas. If you're pretending the virus doesn't exist and are going to host a big family gathering because you don't like the man telling you what to do, that's a Covid-denier.

How does it make you a covid denier, the original poster said nothing about a big family Christmas just having his kids over, knowing the risks and taking precautions does not make you a covid denier.

niallo27 · 22-11-2020 02:59PM

The_Brood wrote: »

Well Covid 19 doesnt go on holiday during Christmas, does it? It's not less dangerous, is it? In fact family gatherings would be the biggest danger of a new spread. Are we dealing with a virus we can take breaks from and therefore is not that serious and therefore we have pissed the last year away for absolutely nothing....or if not then no Christmas no nothing until it is all over.

The experts have to decide either way, but this idea of Covid holidays is completely patronizing and insulting. "The virus is dangerous" until the parents start wagging their fingers at the government.

People are meeting up with family all over the country right now and guess what, the sky isn't falling in.

hmmm · 22-11-2020 03:02PM

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

This sort of BS absolutely infuriates me.
We have developed a vaccine with 95% efficiency which has been hailed all over the world as the solution to the end of this. But no the local GP in Monaghan has decided that that's too much positivity and good news for now...let's just throw out some random unfounded opinion on it to dampen down this good vibe.
I actually blame Newstalk more for giving this opinion airtime.

Agreed. 95% vaccines which give good responses in all age groups are better than even the best-case predictions a few months ago - we thought we'd be doing well for 70%, and have better vaccines a few years down the road. It's the equivalent of another moon-landing, we just don't realise it yet I think.

There is a bit of a worry I think that the news of vaccines will make people relax and take risks. If anything I think it's the other way around - there is an end line in sight, and if more people knew about the effectiveness of the vaccines being produced they'd be less inclined to take risks. Why risk the grandparents health at Christmas for example knowing they are likely to get vaccinated early next year? This also hugely helps with people's morale.

wadacrack · 22-11-2020 03:07PM

Transmission of the virus appears like they maybe are dropping in NI but very limited testing

https://twitter.com/vincekearney/status/1330511799343525891

Cork2021 · 22-11-2020 03:19PM

wadacrack wrote: »

Transmission of the virus appears like they maybe are dropping in NI but very limited testing

https://twitter.com/vincekearney/status/1330511799343525891

What is the story with testing in the north? Seems very low in comparison. If we do 12,000 a day they should at least be doing 4000/5000 a day

normanoffside · 22-11-2020 03:31PM

Cork2021 wrote: »

What is the story with testing in the north? Seems very low in comparison. If we do 12,000 a day they should at least be doing 4000/5000 a day

They don't test close contacts unless symptomatic. They just ask them to self isolate for 14 days.
Basically you only get a test if you are symptomatic.

https://www.publichealth.hscni.net/covid-19-coronavirus/testing-and-tracing-covid-19/testing-covid-19

AssetBacked2 · 22-11-2020 03:43PM

The_Brood wrote: »

Well Covid 19 doesnt go on holiday during Christmas, does it? It's not less dangerous, is it? In fact family gatherings would be the biggest danger of a new spread. Are we dealing with a virus we can take breaks from and therefore is not that serious and therefore we have pissed the last year away for absolutely nothing....or if not then no Christmas no nothing until it is all over.

The experts have to decide either way, but this idea of Covid holidays is completely patronizing and insulting. "The virus is dangerous" until the parents start wagging their fingers at the government.

You know covid doesn't just lurk in the air and you pick it up by just being around other people? It isn't like covid suddenly appears just because people meet each other, hug and shake hands.

hmmm · 22-11-2020 03:46PM

AssetBacked2 wrote: »

You know covid doesn't just lurk in the air and you pick it up by just being around other people?

If someone is infected, this is exactly how Covid is spread.

wadacrack · 22-11-2020 03:46PM

AssetBacked2 wrote: »

You know covid doesn't just lurk in the air and you pick it up by just being around other people? It isn't like covid suddenly appears just because people meet each other, hug and shake hands.

It can indoors in rooms with poor ventilation

AssetBacked2 · 22-11-2020 03:49PM

hmmm wrote: »

If someone is infected, this is exactly how Covid is spread.

wadacrack wrote: »

It can indoors in rooms with poor ventilation

"If", "can".
:rolleyes:

Covid 19 Part XXVIII- 71,942 ROI(2,050 deaths) 51,824 NI (983 deaths) (28/11) Read OP

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