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The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

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Comments

  • #3962
    mynamejeff
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭mynamejeff


    maccored wrote: »
    he was a member of the sf ard chomhairle - so yes, it was perfectly acceptable to share that information. SF are part of the executive, the ard chomhairle is part of SF. Not hard logic to follow.

    and the army council ? where do they slot in the chain of command ?


  • #3963
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    mynamejeff wrote: »
    and the army council ? where do they slot in the chain of command ?

    How long after the International Monitors state that the 'army' (IRA) is engaged in 'exclusively democratic means' does the term 'Army Council' cease to exist?

    These people were invited into the democratic fold, and actively encouraged to by what are now hypocrites.

    They use a defunct term to describe perfectly ordinary party members in order to exclude people from the democratic process. Exactly the same exclusionary tactics engaged in by sectarian and bigoted unionists that caused the problems for partition.


  • #3964
    grayzer75
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 980 ✭✭✭grayzer75


    mynamejeff wrote: »
    and the army council ? where do they slot in the chain of command ?

    Probably in the heads of FFG supporters......


  • #3965
    mynamejeff
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭mynamejeff


    the problem with lying is that if you do it all the time ,

    people will assume that everything you say is a lie

    there is no army council , Gerry was never in the ira , sf have no connection to organised crime and on and on and on


  • #3966
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    mynamejeff wrote: »
    the problem with lying is that if you do it all the time ,

    people will assume that everything you say is a lie

    there is no army council , Gerry was never in the ira , sf have no connection to organised crime and on and on and on

    Why would they require an Army COuncil for an organisation commtited to exclusively democratic means Jeff?


    Are you saying the governments have been hoodwinked by the Monitoring agencies? Do explain yourself for once.


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  • #3967
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,332 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Next thing they will try to tell you that large scale smuggling and diesel washing isn’t going on.

    And that the PSNI have full control in certain areas and are welcome.

    And then argue the toss for about 30 pages.


  • #3968
    grayzer75
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 980 ✭✭✭grayzer75


    mynamejeff wrote: »
    the problem with lying is that if you do it all the time ,

    people will assume that everything you say is a lie

    there is no army council , Gerry was never in the ira , sf have no connection to organised crime and on and on and on

    The real problem is living in the past and not moving on with the times. All you comments about army councils etc are so last century so just leave it there.


  • #3969
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Brendan Bendar wrote: »
    Next thing they will try to tell you that large scale smuggling and diesel washing isn’t going on.

    Can you link to the data on this?

    You say it is large scale, shouldn't be hard to give us the source of your information.


  • #3970
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,332 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Can you link to the data on this?

    You say it is large scale, shouldn't be hard to give us the source of your information.

    Hold on Francie till I go on to the ‘Smuggling and Diesel Washing NI.co .uk ‘

    site.

    I’m sure these lads put all their activities on line.;)


  • #3971
    mynamejeff
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭mynamejeff


    lol ,

    one mention of the controlling power of sf and the "boys" go nuts.


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  • #3972
    mynamejeff
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭mynamejeff


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Why would they require an Army COuncil for an organisation commtited to exclusively democratic means Jeff?


    Are you saying the governments have been hoodwinked by the Monitoring agencies? Do explain yourself for once.

    "On 20 October 2015, the Assessment on Paramilitary Groups in Northern Ireland, commissioned by the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland on the structure, role and purpose of paramilitary organisations reported the structures of the IRA remain in existence "


  • #3973
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Brendan Bendar wrote: »
    Hold on Francie till I go on to the ‘Smuggling and Diesel Washing NI.co .uk ‘

    site.

    I’m sure these lads put all their activities on line.;)

    So no data Brendi...just a feeling in your waters.


    Fuel Fraud and smuggling are criminal matters.
    If any political party is engaged in fraud then they should be dealt with.


  • #3974
    joeguevara
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,247 ✭✭✭joeguevara


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Can you link to the data on this?

    You say it is large scale, shouldn't be hard to give us the source of your information.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/seven-arrested-in-psni-crackdown-on-money-laundering-crime-gang-1.4147016?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fpolitics%2Fseven-arrested-in-psni-crackdown-on-money-laundering-crime-gang-1.4147016

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30976759.html


  • #3975
    mynamejeff
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭mynamejeff


    grayzer75 wrote: »
    The real problem is living in the past and not moving on with the times. All you comments about army councils etc are so last century so just leave it there.

    their victims have a way of holding onto things especially when there was no justice grayzer

    that's legacy sf ira are very poor at dealing with and they keep popping up

    the Quinns Maria Cahill etc , until they deal with these people property they will never go away


  • #3976
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    mynamejeff wrote: »
    "On 20 October 2015, the Assessment on Paramilitary Groups in Northern Ireland, commissioned by the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland on the structure, role and purpose of paramilitary organisations reported the structures of the IRA remain in existence "

    As usual you hypocritically cherrypick what you want to believe...or rather what you would like others to believe. Here are the full reports of the IMC and some of the bits you hypocritically left out of the 2015
    The IMC’s report concluded that the IRA’s so-called military departments had been disbanded and its former terrorist capability had been lost. In addition, its army council was by conscious decision being allowed to fall into disuse.

    “PIRA [the Provisional IRA] had in these ways completely relinquished the leadership and other structures appropriate to a time of conflict,” it found.

    While a small number of former IRA members had given assistance to dissident republicans, it said this was not surprising following the dissolution of organisation’s structures.

    On the issue of leadership, it found that in addition to “maintaining its clear stance against all forms of terrorist activity and involvement of members in crime”, the leadership continued in more specific ways to demonstrate its commitment to peaceful means.

    https://cain.ulster.ac.uk/issues/politics/docs/imc/imcreports.htm


  • #3977
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    joeguevara wrote: »
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/seven-arrested-in-psni-crackdown-on-money-laundering-crime-gang-1.4147016?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fpolitics%2Fseven-arrested-in-psni-crackdown-on-money-laundering-crime-gang-1.4147016

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30976759.html

    So?

    We know it goes on.

    How 'large scale' is it, was the question.


  • #3978
    grayzer75
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 980 ✭✭✭grayzer75


    mynamejeff wrote: »
    their victims have a way of holding onto things especially when there was no justice grayzer

    that's legacy sf ira are very poor at dealing with and they keep popping up

    the Quinns Maria Cahill etc , until they deal with these people property they will never go away

    The IRA were willing to sign up to a Truth Commission but the Brits won't sign up for some reason (must have something to hide) so the full truth will never come out which is a pity for the victims and their families.


  • #3979
    joeguevara
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,247 ✭✭✭joeguevara


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    So?

    We know it goes on.

    How 'large scale' is it, was the question.

    Well the fact that in one bust it centred around 215 million operation.

    An interesting scholar article discusses it https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/1057610X.2019.1678878?scroll=top&needAccess=true&journalCode=uter20 here and outlines the scale of it.


  • #3980
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    At least 50 properties and 200 employees. Big party. Lot of money washing around......


  • #3981
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    joeguevara wrote: »
    Well the fact that in one bust it centred around 215 million operation.

    An interesting scholar article discusses it https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/1057610X.2019.1678878?scroll=top&needAccess=true&journalCode=uter20 here and outlines the scale of it.

    Fuel Fraud was at 250 million in 2004
    Fuel fraud costs the UK taxpayer hundreds of millions of pounds in lost revenue every
    year. Northern Ireland alone is estimated to have lost £70 million in 2009-10. Only five
    years ago this figure was as high as £250 million,

    https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201012/cmselect/cmniaf/1504/1504.pdf

    It was reckoned to be 40 million last year.
    HMRC said in 2016-17, the illicit market for diesel in Northern Ireland resulted in an estimated loss of £30m in duty and a further £10m in VAT, giving a total loss of £40m.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-46844898

    A diminishing problem the data suggests.


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  • #3982
    blanch152
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,851 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    At least 50 properties and 200 employees. Big party. Lot of money washing around......

    It was those criminals over there, look, over there, nothing to do with us good republicans.


  • #3983
    joeguevara
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,247 ✭✭✭joeguevara


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Fuel Fraud was at 250 million in 2004



    https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201012/cmselect/cmniaf/1504/1504.pdf

    It was reckoned to be 40 million last year.



    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-46844898

    A diminishing problem the data suggests.

    In 2015 fuel and tobacco smuggling around the border was costing a billion to the exchequer annually.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/fuel-laundering-tobacco-smuggling-costing-1bn-annually-1.2114673?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fireland%2Firish-news%2Ffuel-laundering-tobacco-smuggling-costing-1bn-annually-1.2114673


  • #3984
    mynamejeff
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭mynamejeff


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Fuel Fraud was at 250 million in 2004



    https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201012/cmselect/cmniaf/1504/1504.pdf

    It was reckoned to be 40 million last year.



    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-46844898

    A diminishing problem the data suggests.

    So as long as one of the parts of the criminality that your party are directly involved with and profit from is diminishing its ok ?


  • #3985
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    mynamejeff wrote: »
    So as long as one of the parts of the criminality that your party are directly involved with and profit from is diminishing its ok ?

    ...and more unbacked up lies.

    Can we see Revenue, Garda and PSNI data that has linked SF to this activity?

    Let me get this straight here: If a party member or members are caught demanding money in return for planning influence,(as has happened) is it ok to say to a FGer ' your party are directly involved with and profit from planning bribes'?

    Would that be acceptable even here on boards.ie?


  • #3986
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    https://twitter.com/sjamcbride/status/1326175299361513474?s=21

    The sort of clear, no nonsense, decisive governance we have come to expect from SF and the DUP.


  • #3987
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    joeguevara wrote: »
    Can I ask a question. Why is a senior sinn fein party member and solicitor acting on behalf of Daniel Kinahan?

    Email them.

    Why would I know why a solicitor takes a case?


    Why would Jim O'Callaghan FF represent Gerry Adams, given his party's views?

    Why would anyone accused of a crime get representation?

    You might want to widen that debate out and ask the Law Society.


  • #3988
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/sjamcbride/status/1326175299361513474?s=21

    The sort of clear, no nonsense, decisive governance we have come to expect from SF and the DUP.

    I have been saying it for years. A failed state that cannot govern itself due to the problems created by a ridiculous partition.

    Would you agree Johnny?


  • #3989
    blanch152
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,851 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    grayzer75 wrote: »
    The IRA were willing to sign up to a Truth Commission but the Brits won't sign up for some reason (must have something to hide) so the full truth will never come out which is a pity for the victims and their families.

    Nothing stopping a unilateral Truth Commission or one restricted to Northern Ireland actors. Perhaps the Stormont Executive could provide for one is Sinn Fein not willing to do it themselves.


  • #3990
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,597 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Nothing stopping a unilateral Truth Commission or one restricted to Northern Ireland actors. Perhaps the Stormont Executive could provide for one is Sinn Fein not willing to do it themselves.

    Your hypocrisy exposed again. Or maybe it's a failure to understand the word 'truth'.

    How can you get at the truth when key players absent themselves from the process?

    What you want of course is a one sided confession process.


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  • #3991
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    I have been saying it for years. A failed state that cannot govern itself due to the problems created by a ridiculous partition.

    Would you agree Johnny?


    Which failed State, Francie? Not sure SF think the Dublin Government is fit for purpose either if I've read your party constitution correctly. A puppet government I believe.



    Anyways, there's a pandemic on, so the knuckle-draggers up there need to get the finger out and work together. Complete amateur hour stuff up there.


This discussion has been closed.
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