Pete_Cavan wrote: »
I often wonder is AADT a bit of a blunt instrument sometimes. Probably gives a better indication on commuter routes where a high volume of traffic is concentrated in one direction in the morning and the other direction in the evening, meaning the road is overloaded. On a stretch of road like this, the traffic is probably spread more evenly in both directions over the day. Roads with a similar AADT would be the N3 Cavan bypass and N80 Carlow bypass but I don't think anyone would suggest dual carriageway on them. Also, the biggest constraints after upgrade on this road (N52) will likely be the roundabouts at either end, not the number of lanes in between.
Worth noting that the TII document states for this project; Cross-section: Expressway / TBD. Obviously not yet confirmed. It also states Forecast Cost Range: €80-100m which is based on €10m/km for 2+2 as used elsewhere. Given the route will almost certainly encompass the existing relatively recent good quality sections of N52 at northern and southern end, you are talking about ~3.5km of offline new build 2+2 plus just under 5km of single carriageway upgrade. Around €50m is probably a more accurate cost for 2+2 but even that is ridiculous for a minute or two reduction in journey time and no bottlenecks bypassed. I would see something like the recent N52 Turin to Billistown Realignment as what should happen here. That was 6km of mostly offline new build Type 1 Single Carriageway which cost €12.6m. Something similar between Tullamore and M6 J5 would cost less than €20m. Put the other €30m into an upgrade which bypasses a town and gives a meaningful reduction in journey time, plenty of candidates out there.
marno21 wrote: »
Emerging preferred route due this summer. Date tbc.
Preferred route out Thursday
Prefered route is announced. Making full use of the upgraded bits of the Tullamore bypass and the stretch from the M6 roundabout. (Combining option 2 and 3)
The logical choice. Looks like there will only be one junction along 8km of road between the existing roundabouts at either end plus a parallel R or L road all the way for local traffic.
This is a 80 to 100 Million projected cost project. The landscape is not very challenging there. Is there any breakdown on possible costing for the various elements e.g. planning, land acquisition, etc... at this stage beyond what is on n52tullamoretokilbeggan.ie.
I assume that figure came from the TII update publication? That assumed this project would be T2DC and seemed to value these projects at €10-12m/km. This looks like SC now and a good bit of online reuse so the cost would likely be revised downwards.
If this is single carraigeway then it is only going to improve travel times marginally. Dawdlers and farmers towing livestock trailers on that road even where it is at its best and widest really have a big impact on travel time for others. While I can be patient and tell myself "give it 10 minutes and you'll reach the motorway" most others aren't that patient and take unnecessary risks. The existing road isn't bad quality road, just heavily used and when those ahead of you decide to do 40km then that is the speed you travel too.
Where is the SC coming from?
The online sections are the approach to the roundabout on the M6 side which is paralleled by the old N52 which could be brought back into use, and south of the R421 which is also paralleled by the old N52 with the upgraded part being WS2 built as part of the Tullamore BP.
Read the previous posts; this is going to be Type 2 DC.
The Preferred Route shows a full movement junction with the R421/L2003 which obviously isn't compatible with DC. North of there could be DC but less than 5km.
Traffic levels don't justify DC, the existing road will remain and will take local/agricultural traffic. Simply building SC between the existing sections of good road at either end is much more likely to happen then building/upgrading to DC for the full length between the roundabouts.
Based on what?
Local/agricultural traffic is negligible on that road IMHO, probably less than 5%. The vast majority of traffic is throughput traffic. Stand at Durrow cross from a hour some day and you will clearly see this in action
I disagree with that statement from experience of using the road. While looking for overtaking opportunities I would be making judgements as to whether the cars approaching and travelling behind or ahead of me are local or passing through.
Irrespective, you will definitely not be reaching 100kmph on that road most of the day even though it is constructed to take cars at that speed.
What is a full movement junction? . Is it a junction similar to the current junction where the n52/r421 meet
I think the tide has turned against road building. If this is built as 2+2 I'll eat my hat. Single carriageway for sure.
Maybe in Dublin and in the inner workings of Eamon Ryan’s head sure, but there’s a real world out there outside of Dublin where road building is necessary for connectivity and this is fully supported in the National Planning Framework. There are also political considerations there and the world outside the middle class suburbs where the majority of Green Party candidates get votes will revolt if they feel forgotten like every other revolt by the forgotten worldwide in the last number of years
This road carries 14,000 vehicles per day (+/-). The upper limit for a Type 1 single is 11,600 vehicles per day. It makes absolutely no sense to build a single carriageway here given the volumes. It would be over capacity from day 1 if it was SC. 2+2 makes sense here
There is no need for any junction here except to connect the L2003 to the old N52 which will presumably be a continuation of the R421 to Kilbeggan. A simple overbridge would do the job. That would allow the WS2 bit of the N52 to be retrofitted 2+2. Any traffic for the Arden area of town would just use the roundabout where shell of the private hospital is.
In the old days this would have been built as 2+2 and the traffic levels still justify more than a single but who knows now. For the foreseeable future transport in most of Ireland will be car and truck based. Soon this will be electric or some other means other than internal combustion. Either way we need certain new roads and upgrades outside the cities done. But we shouldn’t be encouraging or facilitating more car based commuting into the cities.