Schools closed until February? (part 3)

30-10-2020 10:54AM

Blondini wrote: »

Obsessing about schools at 6 in the morning man?

I think we all get your opinion at this stage.
You think schools are not a major problem, despite many teachers here who live the experience, saying otherwise.

Let it go.

So I am browsing the news at 6:25am while having my breakfast before starting work and choose to share an article I have just read that is relevant to this thread? What is it to you? Some of us start work well before 9am you know, and finish after 4pm. And admittedly take time to post ****e during the day

meeeeh · 30-10-2020 10:56AM

khalessi wrote: »

The ASTI go on strike one. some nasty commentators,

No offence but that one was one of dumber ideas ASTI had. They won't go on strike because they would first have to persuade the 60% of their members who didn't bother to vote that they do want to stand outside in the rain and cold with no pay. All they did was to invite abuse. I didn't follow the other thread so I don't overly know what was said (although I can imagine and I actually don't agree with it) however by other reactions in media it was an own goal. And that from a union that had to go to court (or some sort dispute resolution) last time they were on strike because they they lost so many members.

wirelessdude01 · 30-10-2020 11:07AM

Have to laugh at the posters over in the ASTI thread that openly say that childcare is an essential component of a teachers job and as such if groups/classes/schools have to stay at home for a time period that teachers pay should be reduced accordingly for that time period regardless of the quality of online teaching provided.

Utter cesspit of a thread.

froog · 30-10-2020 11:10AM

Purplewaters wrote: »

Anyone notice this. If nurses speak out about conditions, they're brave and listened to. Many could be working with zero covid cases on an eye ward for example. Still heroes. Teachers are working in schools where 10 percent of primary have had cases and children are still wearing no masks even though in most countries they are and, and 40 percent of secondary schools have cases. To some people teachers will always be whingers. The fact is any work from home done was pointless because the view from the public is we all had the whole time off. Now there is a huge portion of the population sitting at home earning as much as they did before for actually not working at all, and rightly so as its not their choice. I think this countries attitudes towards teachers is an absolute disgrace. Regarding health care a huge portion of a hospital staff have no contact whatsoever with covid, get full ppe and their patients are tested. Dentists work in a far riskier role and they will never get a clap out the window. The last point I'll make is this. Every job, has the right, to fight for health and safety in their workplace. Every parent has a right to ask for it in their schools so their child doesn't get covid and bring it home. The Irish publics disgraceful attitude (majority but not all) is the reason the dept of ed has gotten away with squashing in all kids into non distanced classrooms in such an unsafe manner and not even counting most kids in classroom as contacts. Don't blame the teachers as all they get is venom when they try to fight for health and safety of them and the kids in school.

You simply cannot compare nurses working conditions to teachers.

JimmyVik · 30-10-2020 11:38AM

Blondini wrote: »

Obsessing about schools at 6 in the morning man?

I think we all get your opinion at this stage.
You think schools are not a major problem, despite many teachers here who live the experience, saying otherwise.

Let it go.

Its his job. He gets paid for it.

JimmyVik · 30-10-2020 11:47AM

irishblessing wrote: »

Oh? So the fb group of 117k people lends credibility to your statement that most of us are "perfectly happy" to leave kids in the schools? :pac::pac: There are tons of unhappy-or stressed, worried, people out there on the radio daily, on twitter, on fb, on here- not happy at ALL with the situation and lack of remote learning choice. The unions are speaking out and on the verge of strike.

It's just YOUR opinion. Don't go dragging in this invisible army called "most of us" to try and leverage your own opinion to a higher place than it is.

TBH id like to hear the actual figures from nphet.
I just dont understand why they wont just give the figures out.
If they want to discredit anyone elses numbers in an instant, surely releasing theirs in full would do that. Game over.

is_that_so · 30-10-2020 11:48AM

De latest, read all about it!

The elected leadership of the Association of Secondary Teachers, Ireland, will meet later today to consider a decision by members to support industrial action up to strike action, in pursuit of wider safeguards to protect teachers from the threat of Covid-19 in schools, as well as equal pay.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1030/1174825-gannon-foley/

rob316 · 30-10-2020 12:28PM

Equal pay? They are doing themselves no favor bringing that up at this time.

Str8outtaWuhan · 30-10-2020 12:32PM

froog wrote: »

You simply cannot compare nurses working conditions to teachers.

True, nurses have no problem striking adding 1000's of days onto waiting lists due to cancelation of procedures and potentially killing hundreds of people.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2019/0129/1026127-nurses_strike/

eagle eye · 30-10-2020 12:34PM

rob316 wrote:

Equal pay? They are doing themselves no favor bringing that up at this time.

What about all the other stuff?

Maybe if everything else is done properly they are willing to go back without equal pay.

Thats me · 30-10-2020 01:51PM

froog wrote: »

You simply cannot compare nurses working conditions to teachers.

Can you please compare it for us?

My understanding there are two major differences:

Nurses cannot work remotely while teachers can (at least during L5 alert level)
Nurses are working in the environment with accepted risk of infection by default and therefore all possible protective measures are [supposed to be] at place even out of times of COVID-19 outbreaks.

Anything else?

froog · 30-10-2020 01:59PM

Str8outtaWuhan wrote: »

True, nurses have no problem striking adding 1000's of days onto waiting lists due to cancelation of procedures and potentially killing hundreds of people.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2019/0129/1026127-nurses_strike/

Nurses over the years have had plenty of legitimate reasons to strike and i fully supported them every time. Appaling conditions , crazy hours, staff shortages, ****e pay. On top of being one the hardest jobs i can think of, a job most of us simply could not do.

froog · 30-10-2020 02:02PM

Thats me wrote: »

Can you please compare it for us?

My understanding there are two major differences:
Nurses cannot work remotely while teachers can (at least during L5 alert level)

Nurses are working in the environment with accepted risk of infection by default and therefore all possible protective measures are [supposed to be] at place even out of times of COVID-19 outbreaks.

Anything else?

Jesus christ. I seriously suggest you talk to some nurses before spouting rubbish like that.

Thats me · 30-10-2020 02:05PM

froog wrote: »

Jesus christ. I seriously suggest you talk to some nurses before spouting rubbish like that.

No worries, i just was hoping you have any substantial input.

meeeeh · 30-10-2020 03:09PM

Why is there such a need to compare nursing and teaching? Because they are dominated by women? Because they are dominated by children of farmers who go into it because it's a pensionable job and you can stay in the country and build on family land? They are not comparable.

Where I come from nursing is a high school programme and you can specialise in university programme. Teaching is an university programme. I know education is structured differently here but surely there are higher demands to get into teaching than nursing.

The work conditions are completely different, working hours and working week are different, holidays are different. They are two professions that have very little in common except being PS.

froog · 30-10-2020 03:22PM

meeeeh wrote: »

Why is there such a need to compare nursing and teaching? Because they are dominated by women? Because they are dominated by children of farmers who go into it because it's a pensionable job and you can stay in the country and build on family land? They are not comparable.

Where I come from nursing is a high school programme and you can specialise in university programme. Teaching is an university programme. I know education is structured differently here but surely there are higher demands to get into teaching than nursing.

The work conditions are completely different, working hours and working week are different, holidays are different. They are two professions that have very little in common except being PS.

You need to go to university for four years to be a nurse in Ireland.

Same as teachers (3 years arts degree + 1 year hdip)

TTLF · 30-10-2020 03:41PM

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1322185826986590208

RTÉ news segment on the possible strike

So, as it stand, if/when ASTI strike, schools would stay closed (If the school is under the ASTI union?)

meeeeh · 30-10-2020 03:43PM

It won't happen. No scoop just common sense.

MerlinSouthDub · 30-10-2020 04:05PM

meeeeh wrote: »

It won't happen. No scoop just common sense.

It might have happened if case numbers were increasing rapidly as they were a couple of weeks ago. But they are falling steadily, so there is no case for closing schools, and there would be no public support for it. I do support any practical additional measures which can be taken in schools such as more testing, quicker testing turnaround times etc and I'm sure that some improvements can be made.

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 30-10-2020 04:17PM

froog wrote: »

You need to go to university for four years to be a nurse in Ireland.

Same as teachers (3 years arts degree + 1 year hdip)

Arts 4 yrs in some colleges and DIP gone to 2 yrs

Smacruairi · 30-10-2020 04:19PM

For all those spouting on about Sweden - they are going into forms of lockdown.

Die Zeit reported that Dr Tegnell, who was the key person behind that approach, said Sweden is now at a critical juncture as the number of daily cases has increased by 70 per cent in a week.

Last week, Sweden had its first regional lockdown when around 170,000 citizens of Uppsala, a town near Stockholm, were asked to work from home. They were also asked to avoid social gatherings, physical contact and public transport.

And they didn’t stop just in one region:

The Health Agency also moved to tighten pandemic recommendations for three additional regions, including Sweden’s biggest cities Stockholm and Gothenburg, saying infection rates were rising sharply in these areas.

meeeeh · 30-10-2020 04:20PM

MerlinSouthDub wrote: »

It might have happened if case numbers were increasing rapidly as they were a couple of weeks ago. But they are falling steadily, so there is no case for closing schools, and there would be no public support for it. I do support any practical additional measures which can be taken in schools such as more testing, quicker testing turnaround times etc and I'm sure that some improvements can be made.

The problem is that almost 60% of their members didn't respond to the ballot. If people didn't bother filling in a form it is hard to imagine it will be easier to persuade them to strike. I think even union officials are at pains to point out strike is last resort.

s1ippy · 30-10-2020 04:27PM

https://twitter.com/ToryFibs/status/1322195672460939265?s=20

Meanwhile we just dropped to 5% positivity today for the first time since September. Good thing the schools aren't an issue here. :rolleyes:

blanch152 · 30-10-2020 04:28PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Honestly some of the views held and ignorance on display in that place actually frightens me at times. The utter hatred is ridiculous. Sad really when you read it that some can't or won't allow themselves to see further than the tip of their own nose.

The scariest part of it all are the teachers who ignore the science and rely on Facebook to back up their views. Science says the schools are safe, but teachers think because a page on Facebook says the opposite, they are not safe.

If that is the type of learning our children are getting, it is seriously worrying.

blanch152 · 30-10-2020 04:33PM

s1ippy wrote: »

https://twitter.com/ToryFibs/status/1322195672460939265?s=20

Meanwhile we just dropped to 5% positivity today for the first time since September. Good thing the schools aren't an issue here. :rolleyes:

Northern Ireland is a much worse place to be than here.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1030/1174938-coronavirus-northern-ireland/

"The seven-day rate of infection per 100,000 for Northern Ireland is 288.2."

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/1029/1174560-nphet-meeting/

That is pretty much the same as our 14-day rate of 292, which means Northern Ireland infections are running at twice our levels at the moment. The biggest threat to infection rates in Ireland is the lack of control in the North and the open border.

Theboinkmaster · 30-10-2020 04:36PM

s1ippy wrote: »

Meanwhile we just dropped to 5% positivity today for the first time since September. Good thing the schools aren't an issue here. :rolleyes:

Dropping below 5% is nothing to do with schools, they've only been closed 4 days

that < 5% rate is for people who caught CV-19 before the mid-term

Thats me · 30-10-2020 04:56PM

meeeeh wrote: »

It won't happen. No scoop just common sense.

Does not common sesnse also telling on highest level of lockdown schools should be closed and education provided remotely?

blanch152 wrote: »

Science says the schools are safe

Science recently told me that children are likely super-spreaders of the infection, that superspreaders are responsible for 80% of cases and schools adding 24% to R.

What science said to you, blanch152? Do you refer some undefined "overwhelming evidence"?

Theboinkmaster · 30-10-2020 05:08PM

Thats me wrote: »

Does not common sesnse also telling on highest level of lockdown schools should be closed and education provided remotely?

yeah common sense - my primary school has 700+ kids in it and not a single case in 8 weeks.

all my friends are the same - zero cases in their own kids schools.

100% the primary schools should stay open.

Blondini · 30-10-2020 05:13PM

blanch152 wrote: »

The scariest part of it all are the teachers who ignore the science and rely on Facebook to back up their views. Science says the schools are safe, but teachers think because a page on Facebook says the opposite, they are not safe.

If that is the type of learning our children are getting, it is seriously worrying.

Standard of teacher slating has really gone to the dogs around here.

Where's Fringey and Marko and all that gang. They had some scruples.

s1ippy · 30-10-2020 05:14PM

Theboinkmaster wrote: »

Dropping below 5% is nothing to do with schools, they've only been closed 4 days

that < 5% rate is for people who caught CV-19 before the mid-term

They closed last Friday, which makes it a week today by my estimate. Given the fact that it takes a 5 days to show symptoms, people who would have been contracting it the Monday just gone weren't, thus reducing the positivity rate coming into this weekend.

Schools closed until February? (part 3)

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