Covid 19 Part XXV-44,159 ROI (1,830 deaths) 21,898 NI (598 deaths) (13/10) Read OP

Jackman25 · 10-10-2020 11:05AM

Boggles wrote: »

Did he recommend culling the vulnurable?

Did anyone?

Hamsterchops · 10-10-2020 11:06AM

According to Sky News, apparently Trump is now Covid free, or close enough....

Will be very interesting to see if they can replicate his fast recovery in others who have contracted Covid-19.

Me_Grapes · 10-10-2020 11:06AM

Downlinz wrote: »

Alarming rise in number of deaths, hospital cases and those in ICU over the past week. It's very quickly starting to look like March/April again.

What country is this happening in??

GooglePlus · 10-10-2020 11:07AM

Me_Grapes wrote: »

What country is this happening in??

Pretty much every country in Europe.

eagle eye · 10-10-2020 11:07AM

niallo27 wrote:

Won't suit Tony's agenda for a total lockdown.

So you didn't even listen to it?

Ce he sin · 10-10-2020 11:07AM

Happydays2020 wrote: »

No it’s not. It could end up that way but certainly not right now.

https://twitter.com/higginsdavidw/status/1314696632835899394?s=21

I’m sure this has been said over and over again but this Higgins still doesn’t get it. Early in the year we were doing far less testing and at one point were only doing those with two or more symptoms. Now we’re testing contacts including those without symptoms so far more positives are going to be recorded. Comparing hospitalisation and deaths to the new and higher figures suggests a much lower rate of each but that’s not actually the case. The disease is not getting less dangerous.

niallo27 · 10-10-2020 11:09AM

eagle eye wrote: »

Can you please tell me exactly what you heard there?
Just so you know he never advised against lockdowns. He advised against lockdowns as the primary action.
We haven't been in lockdown for ages.
We need a lockdown to flatten the curve, reorganise and give our frontline workers a break, all things he said were good reasons for a lockdown.

In case you have been ignoring it, we have the harshest lockdown in all of Europe right now, we can't leave our county or visit family members, hundreds of thousands out of work. Why do the frontline workers need a break, we are no where near capacity. They are doing their jobs like the brilliant people they are but I think most of them will say they don't need a break.

s1ippy · 10-10-2020 11:10AM

Hamsterchops wrote: »

According to Sky News, apparently Trump is now Covid free, or close enough....

Will be very interesting to see if they can replicate his fast recovery in others who have contracted Covid-19.

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1314726995863900160?s=20

Yeah definitely take him on his word. Although, did he give his word?

Looney1 · 10-10-2020 11:10AM

Happydays2020 wrote: »

Exactly which means that the comparison on daily case numbers is at best inappropriate and at worst misleading.

The comparison on the other metrics is appropriate and as you can see it is approx 20% of ICU and Hospitalisations and 4% of deaths.

agree. but surely we dont want it getting to march/april levels??

Boggles · 10-10-2020 11:11AM

niallo27 wrote: »

You do know the Irish government is following the WHO guidelines all through this pandemic.

No they aren't.

We mandated for masks before the WHO, we have different social distance protocols.

The odd bit of Lip service is paid to the WHO, but as an organisation they are long finished. They was a bit of "outrage" when Trump blamed them for the China virus, but not that much. They failed in the last pandemic, they were told to reorganize, they didn't.

They are basically FIFA.

You think the likes of Germany are basing policy on what the WHO recommend?

They aren't.

Happydays2020 · 10-10-2020 11:11AM

Ce he sin wrote: »

I’m sure this has been said over and over again but this Higgins still doesn’t get it. Early in the year we were doing far less testing and at one point were only doing those with two or more symptoms. Now we’re testing contacts including those without symptoms so far more positives are going to be recorded. Comparing hospitalisation and deaths to the new and higher figures suggests a much lower rate of each but that’s not actually the case. The disease is not getting less dangerous.

He does get it. Look at the other metrics.

Happydays2020 · 10-10-2020 11:12AM

Looney1 wrote: »

agree. but surely we dont want it getting to march/april levels??

We absolutely do not. I think level 3 is appropriate. And maybe there will be a level 3 plus at some stage but it is not at the stage where 300k people should be put out of work again.

normanoffside · 10-10-2020 11:13AM

eagle eye wrote: »

Can you please tell me exactly what you heard there?
Just so you know he never advised against lockdowns. He advised against lockdowns as the primary action.
We haven't been in lockdown for ages.
We need a lockdown to flatten the curve, reorganise and give our frontline workers a break, all things he said were good reasons for a lockdown.

Yeah I did listen.
Western lockdowns cause untold poor health outcomes for the poor at home and all over the world.

We flattened the curve 6 months ago already and must look for other ways to deal with Covid now.

Widdensushi · 10-10-2020 11:14AM

Boggles wrote: »

Did he recommend culling the vulnurable?

I stopped listening to the WHO a long long time ago, the vast majority of countries in the world have followed suit.

There is a guy with his finger clearly on the pulse of the world.

The vast majority of countries are following your advice!!!!!

niallo27 · 10-10-2020 11:14AM

eagle eye wrote: »

So you didn't even listen to it?

I did listen to it, Tony's wants a full lockdown, no other options discussed, straight to it. WHO are saying it shouldn't be the first option.

niallo27 · 10-10-2020 11:16AM

Boggles wrote: »

No they aren't.

We mandated for masks before the WHO, we have different social distance protocols.

The odd bit of Lip service is paid to the WHO, but as an organisation they are long finished. They was a bit of "outrage" when Trump blamed them for the China virus, but not that much. They failed in the last pandemic, they were told to reorganize, they didn't.

They are basically FIFA.

You think the likes of Germany are basing policy on what the WHO recommend?

They aren't.

No I do agree with you there, I think they lost all credibility months ago. A joke of an organisation.

eagle eye · 10-10-2020 11:18AM

normanoffside wrote:

Yeah I did listen. Western lockdowns cause untold poor health outcomes for the poor at home and all over the world.

We flattened the curve 6 months ago already and must look for other ways to deal with Covid now.

I'm talking about the video posted and the claim made that the WHO are advising against lockdowns which is not the case.
They are advising against lockdown as the primary firm if protection, basically the world leaders shouldn't maintain lockdowns.
We need to lockdown to flatten the curve. We need a lockdown to reorganise ourselves. We need to maintain that lockdown then to give our frontline workers a break once we've flattened the curve?
Are you all for the ordinary man not being deprived his freedom but treat our frontline workers as slaves?

Thierry12 · 10-10-2020 11:18AM

eagle eye wrote: »

Can you please tell me exactly what you heard there?
Just so you know he never advised against lockdowns. He advised against lockdowns as the primary action.
We haven't been in lockdown for ages.
We need a lockdown to flatten the curve, reorganise and give our frontline workers a break, all things he said were good reasons for a lockdown.

You don't get it

Lockdowns in Europe ruin millions of lives in third world countries

A Domino effect

That was his point

You thought he inferred frontline workers would get holidays and we would reorganise the HSE to cope?

eagle eye · 10-10-2020 11:19AM

niallo27 wrote:

I did listen to it, Tony's wants a full lockdown, no other options discussed, straight to it. WHO are saying it shouldn't be the first option.

How are you calling it the first option when we've let numbers get completely out of hand by not having any lockdown for months?

normanoffside · 10-10-2020 11:22AM

eagle eye wrote: »

I'm talking about the video posted and the claim made that the WHO are advising against lockdowns which is not the case.
They are advising against lockdown as the primary firm if protection, basically the world leaders shouldn't maintain lockdowns.
We need to lockdown to flatten the curve. We need a lockdown to reorganise ourselves. We need to maintain that lockdown then to give our frontline workers a break once we've flattened the curve?
Are you all for the ordinary man not being deprived his freedom but treat our frontline workers as slaves?

The bolded point is such rubbish. Most frontline and essential workers want to work and are far from being treated as slaves.

You know well what Nabarro is saying as do I.
We are not in a state of emergency and do not need a lockdown

eagle eye · 10-10-2020 11:23AM

normanoffside wrote:

You know well what Nabarro is saying as do I. We are not in a state of emergency and do not need a lockdown

We are very close to a state of emergency. Our health service will be overrun in two weeks time if we don't take action now.

Boggles · 10-10-2020 11:30AM

normanoffside wrote: »

The bolded point is such rubbish. Most frontline and essential workers want to work and are far from being treated as slaves.

You know well what Nabarro is saying as do I.
We are not in a state of emergency and do not need a lockdown

If it gets bad enough health care workers will not be sacrificial lambs, they are striking in Madrid and have threatened mass walkouts unless the governance do something about the rising rates of hospitalization.

But I am interested to know what modelling are you using and how that differs from NPHETs?

Or are you of the opinion that we don't need further national restrictions whatever happens?

What number would you act at?

Hospitalizations have basically doubled in 15 days.

You don't have to be Nolan to work out how high that number gets by the end December.

screamer · 10-10-2020 11:31AM

eagle eye wrote: »

We are very close to a state of emergency. Our health service will be overrun in two weeks time if we don't take action now.

No one cares..... unless in 2 weeks time some of them or their family needs care......
that’s why we are where we are. As I said before, we all need to control what we can, protect ourselves and our families and hope that we don’t need care from the health services.

normanoffside · 10-10-2020 11:39AM

Boggles wrote: »

But I am interested to know what modelling are you using and how that differs from NPHETs?

The modelling I am using is that many countries in western Europe have much worse rates and do not feel the need to lock down.

Also the fact that Dublin's 14 incidence has dropped 3 weeks into level 3 restrictions and that's likely to follow nationwide in a few weeks.

eagle eye · 10-10-2020 11:41AM

normanoffside wrote:

Also the fact that Dublin's 14 incidence has dropped 3 weeks into level 3 restrictions and that's likely to follow nationwide in a few weeks.

It's still rising, do you not understand that?
It's not like it's falling. Clearly closing pubs and restaurants have helped but there is still a problem. We need to shut more things to flatten the curve.

John.Icy · 10-10-2020 11:44AM

I know I shouldn't facilitate them too much, but the senate interview has really renewed their vigor of the COVID hospitalisation number being full of people with broken legs who just so happen to test positive.

As far as I'd see it, if you show up with a broken leg and get a COVID test...if you are positive you would be sent home on grounds you have to isolate. The daily discharge is nearly always 10-20 people. I'd imagine these are the people who go in with small issues, test positive and are sent home. Ergo, the COVID numbers in hospital at the end of the day are generally not people with broken legs as they are sent home OR what is becoming clear is that people in hospital already there for more serious issues are catching it, as admission/discharge rates are neck and neck these days yet we are having 20+ increases in total number. That's a whole other problem of who is not protecting patients already in hospital.

Are Irish hospitals actually locking up patients with broken legs in hospital for 2 weeks? Hardly. Open to correction if someone has more information on this??

xhomelezz · 10-10-2020 11:50AM

normanoffside wrote: »

The modelling I am using is that many countries in western Europe have much worse rates and do not feel the need to lock down.

Also the fact that Dublin's 14 incidence has dropped 3 weeks into level 3 restrictions and that's likely to follow nationwide in a few weeks.

Other countries still have free beds in the hospitals.

rob316 · 10-10-2020 11:50AM

In 2 weeks time the schools will be closed for 2, possibly 3 weeks I think that will be enough to buy us some time, combined with pubs and restaurants closed for indoor dining that would leave just non-essential retail which we know isn't a risk.

SeaBreezes · 10-10-2020 11:51AM

normanoffside wrote: »

The bolded point is such rubbish. Most frontline and essential workers want to work and are far from being treated as slaves.

You know well what Nabarro is saying as do I.
We are not in a state of emergency and do not need a lockdown

In madrid Health care workers are threatening to strike if lockdowns not implemented.

In sweden 100 drs, hundreds of health care workers resigned, 4,700 of them listed as 'injured due to covid'

In uk 540 health care workers dead.

This is what happens when health systems are overloaded with covid.

What is the point of paying experts for their opinions if your not going to listen?

The time lag and exponential increase of this virus seems to catch every lay person. If Tony was making decisions based on ICU occupancy today, hes two weeks too late.

The point is not to overload and endanger the frontline staff.

niallo27 · 10-10-2020 11:52AM

eagle eye wrote: »

We are very close to a state of emergency. Our health service will be overrun in two weeks time if we don't take action now.

Our health service has been overrun for the last 30 years.

Covid 19 Part XXV-44,159 ROI (1,830 deaths) 21,898 NI (598 deaths) (13/10) Read OP

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