Covid 19 Part XXV-44,159 ROI (1,830 deaths) 21,898 NI (598 deaths) (13/10) Read OP

yawhat? · 07-10-2020 09:04AM

Hamsterchops wrote: »

I tend to agree with you, but its hard to know what to do, I already suggested a short sharp shock (level 5 now) for a short term, then ease up restrictions before Christmas, but that didn't go down well either.
I see on the Sky News website today that they discuss the "Great Barrington Declaration", which sounds very grandiose, but I think it just means herd immunity ???
North East of England has it very bad.

Link: http://news.sky.com/story/scientists-and-politicians-split-over-how-to-tackle-rising-covid-infections-as-northern-leaders-say-restrictions-are-not-working-12096597

You can’t see it from the article, but one of the signatories is the nutty Professor Gupta who seems to involved in every single call for herd immunity. What would James Joyce make of that?

is_that_so · 07-10-2020 09:07AM

suicide_circus wrote: »

No. Adults set the record straight in the face of slanderous claims in order to maintain their standing.

In other words keep the fight going till someone caves in. Standing and slander are bywords for ego.

Widdensushi · 07-10-2020 09:09AM

Boggles wrote: »

Consistent with his ego.

His only problem seems to be they met on a Sunday, imagine an emergency task force meeting on Sunday during a once in a generation pandemic. How dare they.

Leo was probably in the park drinking cans.

It can't work without some border agreements, more travel restrictions etc. There would need to weeks of planning and discussions, it doesn't matter if it was a Monday meeting recommending it for Friday it was too soon.

Icyseanfitz · 07-10-2020 09:09AM

Deleted User wrote: »

No one sensible here is arguing for "Let it rip". By characterising those who don't argue for a zero covid strategy as "let it rip merchants", some are creating a false equivalence, and in fact the are arguing a point that others are making.

On the other hand, if you truly believe there will be no lasting immunity, a vaccine is pointless and "herd immunity", as happened with all previous pandemics, is the only way out as the virus becomes endemic in the population with a level of resistance mitigates the worst effects somewhat

I don't believe anything, scientific studies across the world are showing no lasting immunity and reinfection to be the case, which would fall in line with other corona viruses such as the common cold

Boggles · 07-10-2020 09:09AM

yawhat? wrote: »

You can’t see it from the article, but one of the signatories is the nutty Professor Gupta who seems to involved in every single call for herd immunity. What would James Joyce make of that?

Yip. She wants to cull the vulnerable before her ex husband has a chance to get the vaccine out.

Usually divorced couples fight over the kids.

hetuzozaho · 07-10-2020 09:10AM

Boggles wrote: »

Tánaiste tells FG meeting Level 5 'circuit break' is highly possible

You couldn't write it.

I know the FG grass roots and party as a whole prefer Convey, but surely it is time to give a him a crack.

That's consistent with what he said on prime time though no?

suicide_circus · 07-10-2020 09:10AM

is_that_so wrote: »

In other words keep the fight going till someone caves in. Standing and slander are bywords for ego.

Their standing in this case means public confidence in them as a team which is critically important. If they genuinely didnt leak that letter then they need to say it because their reputation has been tarnished.

GooglePlus · 07-10-2020 09:10AM

weldoninhio wrote: »

That was looney lefts attempting to attack peaceful marchers. See last week, no looney left attackers, zero incidents reported by Gardai.

A come out of it, we all seen the videos and know the history of those involved. Racist hillbillies.

Boggles · 07-10-2020 09:11AM

Widdensushi wrote: »

It can't work without some border agreements, more travel restrictions etc. There would need to weeks of planning and discussions, it doesn't matter if it was a Monday meeting recommending it for Friday it was too soon.

What's the got to do with shoot from the Leo questioning the professionalism and ability of NPHET live on TV?

is_that_so · 07-10-2020 09:14AM

suicide_circus wrote: »

Their standing in this case means public confidence in them as a team which is critically important. If they genuinely didnt leak that letter then they need to say it because their reputation has been tarnished.

If you're going to make an extremely restrictive recommendation with 1 day's notice your standing is already called into question. I'm happy with what NPHET do and support them but they messed this one up. We may yet get to Level 5 and they'll be proven right but that's not today but now we are informed of that potentially imminent possibility.

Hector Savage · 07-10-2020 09:16AM

caveat emptor wrote: »

She wants travel restrictions forever basically !! shock horror !!
Who would think a far leftist marxist would support such a move!!!

No commie plot just a professor of public health saying the same thing for the past 8 months.[/QUOTE]

Well they can f*ck off if they expect this forever restrictions crap to last, especially for something with such a low death rate

eleventh · 07-10-2020 09:17AM

is_that_so wrote: »

Some thoughts on virus fatigue and yes it is the much loved WHO.

Quote:
The World Health Organization has said European countries will need to “move beyond biomedical science” to overcome Covid-19 as “pandemic fatigue” and new infections rapidly rise across the continent.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/06/europe-must-go-beyond-science-to-survive-covid-crisis-says-who

Translation:
time for next phase of the plan: invasive tracking of people's movements

Boggles · 07-10-2020 09:19AM

hetuzozaho wrote: »

That's consistent with what he said on prime time though no?

What he said on prime time was NPHET were unable to give various guarantees around moving to level 5.

Of course they can't give guarantees for FFS.

But less than 24 hours later he is touting it to his party after declaring live on TV NPHET had not "thought it through".

He has created a divide, them versus us. Whilst at the same time touting what them recommends.

Again that interview was for one purpose and purpose only, to stroke his ego and continue the charade that Leo is in opposition.

He has created an absolute shít storm which has potentially made us all less safe because he could.

suicide_circus · 07-10-2020 09:26AM

is_that_so wrote: »

If you're going to make an extremely restrictive recommendation with 1 day's notice your standing is already called into question. I'm happy with what NPHET do and support them but they messed this one up. We may yet get to Level 5 and they'll be proven right but that's not today but now we are informed of that potentially imminent possibility.

The anger was about;

1. Jumping from 2 to 5 (most of the country)

2. The unprofessional manner in which it was announced (leaked)

If they didn't leak it, they owe it to the public to say so.

We may well go to level 5 at some stage but there are ways of doing things.

Nermal · 07-10-2020 09:28AM

wadacrack wrote: »

Few here could do with looking at this.

I'm relying on google translate here, but:

1) They say immunity is short-lived because antibodies disappear after a few months, when of course your body remembers how to produce them. Show us large-scale reinfection if you want this objection to be taken seriously.

2) They complain you can't implement shielding because asymptotic transmission is possible, the people to be shielded require support from others, and there's limited testing capacity. So what? Focus the testing capacity where it can be most useful. Use PPE when interacting with the shielded population. Apply the same effort to this plan that you apply in shutting down our economy and restricting the healthy.

3) Serious, long-lasting side effects 'cannot be ruled out'. Go find evidence for them then. You have a quarter of a billion subjects to look at. Go find evidence for this chimera, and try harder than the study I have seen posted here sampled from a Facebook support group.

froog · 07-10-2020 09:28AM

Is anyone questioning the contact tracing time period with NPHET/government? 48 hours before onset of symptoms will miss a lot of contacts. If it was 5-7 days I'd say we'd be in a much better situation right now.

is_that_so · 07-10-2020 09:29AM

suicide_circus wrote: »

The anger was about;

1. Jumping from 2 to 5 (most of the country)

2. The unprofessional manner in which it was announced (leaked)

If they didn't leak it, they owe it to the public to say so.

I have no issue with 2 personally as stuff leaks all the time and is forgotten but number 1 is the big one especially in the context of everything being allegedly peachy two days earlier.

is_that_so · 07-10-2020 09:33AM

froog wrote: »

Is anyone questioning the contact tracing time period with NPHET/government? 48 hours before onset of symptoms will miss a lot of contacts. If it was 5-7 days I'd say we'd be in a much better situation right now.

I think they are finding the contacts, it's what some of the contacts are doing. There have been large numbers of contacts not bothering to do what they are advised, something that was repeated to me recently via a contact tracer. The perceived difference between 14 days for contacts and possibly only 10 days for the infected doesn't help matters.

Eod100 · 07-10-2020 09:33AM

froog wrote: »

Is anyone questioning the contact tracing time period with NPHET/government? 48 hours before onset of symptoms will miss a lot of contacts. If it was 5-7 days I'd say we'd be in a much better situation right now.

Definitely but they're not being resourced enough as it is to go back 48 hours even. They must be fairly desperate if they're going public to the media. https://twitter.com/DrZeroCraic/status/1313752413724200961?s=19

Boggles · 07-10-2020 09:34AM

froog wrote: »

Is anyone questioning the contact tracing time period with NPHET/government?

Yes, the people tasked with contact tracing.

Public health departments 'can no longer cope' with Covid-19 demand

Contact tracing has nothing to do with NPHET all though Glynn has written 3 times to the HSE telling them it needs to be beefed up.

Drumpot · 07-10-2020 09:35AM

suicide_circus wrote: »

The anger was about;

1. Jumping from 2 to 5 (most of the country)

2. The unprofessional manner in which it was announced (leaked)

If they didn't leak it, they owe it to the public to say so.

We may well go to level 5 at some stage but there are ways of doing things.

Yeh, the way it was leaked was poor, whoever did it.

But if the data suggests it’s inevitable that we will go to level 5, what is the cost of us delaying the move to level 5 while we argue about the best way to do it?

I’m sorry but this is a huge issue that often crops up when we just need to get things done. We get bogged down in pointless finger pointing and arguing about how to fix a leak while the boat sinks.

I will tell you what’s worse, is our governments pathetic communication skills and mixed messages. Leo was wrong to attack NEPHET in the manner he went about it, this represented an inability to address the issue in a composed fashion and was pure grandstanding that appealed to a significant portion of the population. Ironic that some are accusing Honohan of arrogance and in the same breath Lauding Leo for being just that.

Le Bruise · 07-10-2020 09:37AM

screamer wrote: »

An awful lot of employers are not allowing people to work from home anymore, even though they could well do their job from home. My spouse has said the traffic to Dublin every morning has been busier and busier and are almost back to pre Covid levels now. Restrictions won’t help to curtail the infection rates when people don’t follow them, and half the country commutes to Dublin for work.

What route does your spouse take if you don't mind me asking?

I travel from Wicklow to Dublin every day and the traffic has been fairly non-existent the last few months (bar the odd crash). Nowhere near pre-covid times and one of the only positives (in a sea of negatives) from this pandemic.

Eod100 · 07-10-2020 09:41AM

Boggles wrote: »

Yes, the people tasked with contact tracing.

Public health departments 'can no longer cope' with Covid-19 demand

Contact tracing has nothing to do with NPHET all though Glynn has written 3 times to the HSE telling them it needs to be beefed up.

If the government truly cared about the economy then surely better investing money in that then paying PUP for businesses to close with restrictions?

is_that_so · 07-10-2020 09:41AM

Le Bruise wrote: »

What route does your spouse take if you don't mind me asking?

I travel from Wicklow to Dublin every day and the traffic has been fairly non-existent the last few months (bar the odd crash). Nowhere near pre-covid times and one of the only positives (in a sea of negatives) from this pandemic.

If you listen to Dublin City FM, a lot of it seems to be via the N4/N7 direction. The M1 slows up a bit but more like Friday traffic and I know people who find the N2 route pretty busy.

seamus · 07-10-2020 09:50AM

A paper out of UCLA yesterday suggested that a lot of the long-term effects of Covid that people are talking about - fatigue, aches, insomnia, lack of focus - could possibly be a form of PTSD and not lingering effects of the virus;
https://www.uclahealth.org/brain-fog-following-covid-19-recovery-may-indicate-ptsd#:~:text=A%20new%20report%20suggests%20that,such%20as%20SARS%20and%20MERS.

When you consider how random these long-term effects appear to be and that many people recover completely in weeks while others report being affected for months, then PTSD definitely seems like a worthwhile issue to look at.

stephenjmcd · 07-10-2020 09:51AM

https://twitter.com/SeanDefoe/status/1313761117156651008?s=19

Some further detail
[Url]

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1313763663770251264?s=19

[/url]

07-10-2020 09:55AM

SeaBreezes wrote: »

https://www.thailandmedical.news/news/breaking-news-covid-19-study-reveals-that-sars-cov-2-uses-cd4-cells-to-infect-t-helper-lymphocytes--covid-19-a-potent-version-of-airborne-hiv

The headline is click bait but the studies showing what it does to the immune system are the worry.
For kids no worries they can create new cells

But adults? Could be trouble over time.

That's only been observed in severe cases not mild or moderate ones and only in a small subset of cells. It doesn't really tell us the effects long term beyond "it's complicated" and needs further study.

Also I don't really understand the comparison to HIV. They're not the same. A more apt (but still not accurate) comparison would probably be Measles.

07-10-2020 09:55AM

pjohnson wrote: »

They should take it up with the above mentioned anti-everything idiots who are incapable of following advice. They cause these measures.

The idea that we're under restrictions because people can't keep to the lesser restrictions is idiotic. Cases go up - restrictions go up - cases go down - country opens up - cases go back up - restrictions come back.

Its not rocket science, you can tell yourself that everybody broke the rules more often and that's what caused this, if blaming somebody makes you feel better. But ultimately, rules were relaxed, the economy opened up, people went on staycations (within the rules!!), schools opened etc etc

That causes cases to go up, not everything has to be a bloody blame game. And more, posts like this give the idea that if people *just* kept to the rules things would almost be back to normal - they wouldn't.

screamer · 07-10-2020 09:57AM

Le Bruise wrote: »

What route does your spouse take if you don't mind me asking?

I travel from Wicklow to Dublin every day and the traffic has been fairly non-existent the last few months (bar the odd crash). Nowhere near pre-covid times and one of the only positives (in a sea of negatives) from this pandemic.

Yep, N7

hetuzozaho · 07-10-2020 09:57AM

Boggles wrote: »

What he said on prime time was NPHET were unable to give various guarantees around moving to level 5.

Of course they can't give guarantees for FFS.

But less than 24 hours later he is touting it to his party after declaring live on TV NPHET had not "thought it through".

He has created a divide, them versus us. Whilst at the same time touting what them recommends.

Again that interview was for one purpose and purpose only, to stroke his ego and continue the charade that Leo is in opposition.

He has created an absolute shít storm which has potentially made us all less safe because he could.

I think he said things he shouldn't have on Claire Byrne. But we knew they had gone against NPHET then anyway. I'm not seeing the shít storm from the Claire Byrne show just yet, but maybe you will be right!

My main take away is you really don't like Leo?

Covid 19 Part XXV-44,159 ROI (1,830 deaths) 21,898 NI (598 deaths) (13/10) Read OP

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