Relaxation of Restrictions, Part V - Read OP for Mod Warnings

JRant · 05-10-2020 10:25AM

average_runner wrote: »

Why aren't they open now in Dublin?

Because there is a system in place now whereby a completely random set of numbers are being used. What those numbers are, I have no idea but then again neither do you. So to say people should just accept the blame for restrictions, maybe we should be given the actual data to show why it is necessary.

Ginger n Lemon · 05-10-2020 10:26AM

average_runner wrote: »

But most of the people in those countries don't behave like us with drink in us.

Are you calling Irish people imbeciles?

They ll lick all the door handles available if given choice?

More importantly, have you missed the part where OP said that THEIR CASES WERE DOUBLE than that of Ireland? :rolleyes:

Tenzor07 · 05-10-2020 10:26AM

average_runner wrote: »

But most of the people in those countries don't behave like us with drink in us.

Don't tar all the Citizens of Ireland with the same brush! People are the same here as anywhere, and of course there's a minority who can't behave but don't punish the rest of us for them..

Penfailed · 05-10-2020 10:27AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

While teachers dont actually hug or take children up on their arms or anything like that, in fact they are always 3 - 5 metres away from them.

It's quite obvious from this remark that you are not a teacher!

ThunbergsAreGo · 05-10-2020 10:27AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

I am not sure if you follow.

In July new cases were in single digits.

Public was behaving.

Dublin pubs, in fact wet pubs across whole country DID NOT reopen.

Do you have a question about above? Or you thought public behaving well is the equivalent of 0 new cases daily for a period of X months before we consider re opening wet pubs?

I can see both sides of this.

The virus isnt growing due to NPHET, however it also isnt growing due to the millions of people that are doing what they should be.

Its growing because
- its a contagious virus that has no symptoms in many people, that makes it hard to stop
- schools are open (and for some reason stay open!!!)
- there are a minority who have been told their whole life its someone else fault and think they are bullet proof. It could be level 100 and they wouldnt listen

Level 5 affects those that ARE currently living by the rules more than anyone else

ThunbergsAreGo · 05-10-2020 10:27AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Are you calling Irish people imbeciles?

The pandemic has shown there is a sizeable cohort of Irish people that are in fact stupid

robfowler78 · 05-10-2020 10:28AM

awec wrote: »

NPHET is just medical.

That what I thought.

shocksy · 05-10-2020 10:28AM

average_runner wrote: »

But most of the people in those countries don't behave like us with drink in us.

100%

Too many people in this country turn into crazed lunatics with a bit of drink in them and could'nt be trusted to behave which is why wet pubs stayed closed and rightly so. You only have to look at the videos that have been released in the past few weeks to prove that and most recently yesterday with GAA matches. Absolute disgrace. If people can't behave like adults and follow the guidelines they deserve to be treated like a child and kept away from things that they can't behave in.

The obsession with pubs in this country is crazy and if someone already didn't know they would now know that there is a huge drinking problem in this country.

Penfailed · 05-10-2020 10:29AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

This is confusing.

If you can only leave your home for essential reasons, why would non essential retail be open

It appears that I was wrong in this assertion. The handy infographic from the HSE doesn't make any mention of essential/non-essential businesses.

Ginger n Lemon · 05-10-2020 10:29AM

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

The pandemic has shown there is a sizeable cohort of Irish people that are in fact stupid

Yes. In an identical way as in Sweden, UK, Germany, France, Spain.

Did you hear about 20,000 + gathering on trafalgar square?

It seems like, wait for it, there are a lot of stupid people everywhere.... and Ireland are no exception.

Oh WOW. But we cant be like Sweden because because... :rolleyes:

shocksy · 05-10-2020 10:31AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Are you calling Irish people imbeciles.

Unfortunately YES. Once a big majority of them get drink into them they turn into wild animals that can't be trusted to follow simple guidelines.

Ginger n Lemon · 05-10-2020 10:33AM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

I've been to Belgium, Luxembourg, Malta, all with Case rates higher than Ireland, possibly double...
...the pubs are open, you don't need to buy a €9 protection meal... We never opened ours in Dublin... if some stretched the rules by opening without having a kitchen then I'm sure the authorities were notified and took action.

average_runner wrote: »

But most of the people in those countries don't behave like us with drink in us.

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Are you calling Irish people imbeciles?

They ll lick all the door handles available if given choice?

More importantly, have you missed the part where OP said that THEIR CASES WERE DOUBLE than that of Ireland? :rolleyes:

shocksy wrote: »

Unfortunately YES. Once a big majority of them get drink into them they turn into wild animals that can't be trusted to follow simple guidelines.

:rolleyes:

05-10-2020 10:34AM

robfowler78 wrote: »

Spot on no one in the government or NPHET remotely effected by covid economic problems. We need some other voices to at least balance the debate. Is NPHET just medical people or are there any economists or buisness people involved. Also with all due respect to Tony he is a GP should someone more experienced with virus not be in charge?. I mean Dr Feeny had to resign because he disagreed with the government approach but if he is as equally qualified to give his opinion.

Why would you have economists involved in a national health emergency team? Their job is to try steer the country though this virus from a health perspective and make the best decisions with this in mind not economics.

05-10-2020 10:35AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Yes. In an identical way as in Sweden, UK, Germany, France, Spain.

Did you hear about 20,000 + gathering on trafalgar square?

It seems like, wait for it, there are a lot of stupid people everywhere.... and Ireland are no exception.

Oh WOW. But we cant be like Sweden because because... :rolleyes:

Did you not know that literally EVERY other European country is full of law abiding citizens that would do anything to be a pillar of the community?

It’s only Irish that can’t behave obviously.

Cases are not increasing in other countries at all because they are so well behaved.

05-10-2020 10:36AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Are you calling Irish people imbeciles?

They ll lick all the door handles available if given choice?

More importantly, have you missed the part where OP said that THEIR CASES WERE DOUBLE than that of Ireland? :rolleyes:

Judging by the behaviour of many over the last few weeks with large outdoor gatherings, house parties, anti-mask protests, people continuing to travel abroad etc there are certainly a reasonable number of total imbeciles in Ireland.

robfowler78 · 05-10-2020 10:40AM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Why would you have economists involved in a national health emergency team? Their job is to try steer the country though this virus from a health perspective and make the best decisions with this in mind not economics.

Not actual members of NPHET but at the start we listened to NPHET we took their advice locked down protected the health service which was correct in my opinion. But now it is much more then that it has other factors that need to be addressed and advised on. So we should be taken in advice from other areas and experts not just the medical side. This could go on for months and what we are doing isn't working.

Penfailed · 05-10-2020 10:45AM

setanta1984 wrote: »

This is outright FALSE, all non-essential retail is shut from level 5 - why you are stating the above as fact? Just wishing to downplay such a move? joke. People will see that and believe it.

https://assets.gov.ie/87604/405b1065-055a-4ca8-9513-390ce5298b10.pdf

Yep. You're correct. I made the mistake of only looking at the truncated version of the infographic. My mistake.

FintanMcluskey · 05-10-2020 10:47AM

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Why would you have economists involved in a national health emergency team? Their job is to try steer the country though this virus from a health perspective and make the best decisions with this in mind not economics.

Because when your life will not be impacted in anyway by the implementation of the restrictions its important to have relevant discussion with people who understand how it might.

I see teachers are looking for an out again, if they get it they have to be immediately put on the Covid payment, and anyone else who demands to sit at home.

I have travelled since March for work, I didnt once plea to be sent home for my safety, if I did I wouldnt have a job, and rightly so. My older colleagues with mortgages paid and children raised are all in favour of level 5 this morning.
Funny that

Loafing Oaf · 05-10-2020 10:50AM

robfowler78 wrote: »

Not actual members of NPHET but at the start we listened to NPHET we took their advice locked down protected the health service which was correct in my opinion. But now it is much more then that it has other factors that need to be addressed and advised on.

But what government is going to defy the advice of public health experts?

KindOfIrish · 05-10-2020 10:50AM

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

The pandemic has shown there is a sizeable cohort of Irish people that are in fact stupid

Sure, only stupid can't see that RTE, NPHET and the Government are destroying the country.

Whatsisname · 05-10-2020 10:52AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Is there a correlation between mask wearing and low case numbers?

I should preface this by saying I'm not anti-mask or whatever, I don't like wearing masks, I doubt anyone really does, but if I have to, I will.

But this data from UK a few weeks back I found interesting.

https://twitter.com/cricketwyvern/status/1304353617873440768?s=20

s1ippy · 05-10-2020 10:53AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Because when your life will not be impacted in anyway by the implementation of the restrictions its important to have relevant discussion with people who understand how it might.

I see teachers are looking for an out again, if they get it they have to be immediately put on the Covid payment, and anyone else who demands to sit at home.

I have travelled since March for work, I didnt once plea to be sent home for my safety, if I did I wouldnt have a job, and rightly so. My older colleagues with mortgages paid and children raised are all in favour of level 5 this morning.
Funny that

I try and block you out but I'm very curious to know how you get on every day on the road while managing 30 children? Or is your job not comparable to teaching?

05-10-2020 10:54AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

I see teachers are looking for an out again, if they get it they have to be immediately put on the Covid payment, and anyone else who demands to sit at home.

I have travelled since March for work, I didnt once plea to be sent home for my safety, if I did I wouldnt have a job, and rightly so. My older colleagues with mortgages paid and children raised are all in favour of level 5 this morning.
Funny that

You have a poor understanding of how things work if you think teachers would be put on the covid payment. In any case they wiil be working from home like large numbers of people all over the country.

The schools being open is risking the health of many people in the country, they should never have reopened in the first place and need to close asap.

I hope the work you were travelling for (and I really hope you don't mean travelling abroad) was essential as otherwise you should not have been doing it though much of the time since march and you should have been working from home and not going outside your 2km zone etc.

RoryMac · 05-10-2020 10:54AM

So on 1st Oct NPHET don't believe a move to level 3 is warranted but 3 days later the nuclear option of level 5 nationwide is needed!!

Serious answers needed from them for such a drastic change of advice in 3 days.

https://twitter.com/newschambers/status/1313052148402458625?s=20

statto25 · 05-10-2020 10:57AM

RoryMac wrote: »

So on 1st Oct NPHET don't believe a move to level 3 is warranted but 3 days later the nuclear option of level 5 nationwide is needed!!

Serious answers needed from them for such a drastic change of advise in 3 days.

All we will get is the rise in numbers spiel as usual

robfowler78 · 05-10-2020 10:57AM

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

But what government is going to defy the advice of public health experts?

A good government will take into account the needs of all its citizens and the needs of society. It can't be all one-sided. Once after careful consideration from all sides a decision is made then OK let's implement the government strategy.
Unfortunately we seem to be going from one strategy to the next. The whole level system has been a shambles from day 1 and I can't help but feel it will turn onto a blame game somewhere along the line.

Tony is very lucky to still have a job after the cancer debacle and should not be allowed lead this. There is no accountability at the top level and also no impact financially these people shouldn't have the full say.

facehugger99 · 05-10-2020 10:58AM

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

But what government is going to defy the advice of public health experts?

A government that can see the effects of the restrictions are going to have a far more damaging impact on lives that the virus

A government whose job it is to represent the best-interests of it's citizens.

A government with courage to do what is right, not what is easy.

A government that will hold the so called 'public health experts' to account. That will make them justify their recommendations. That will question and call on them to explain the logic of their approach and the science on which it is based.

Basically the kind of government this country doesn't have .

CoronaBlocker · 05-10-2020 11:02AM

So the teachers want to shut everything down and businesses want everything to remain open.
Gas, isn't it? We really need to find a different way to motivate some state sectors.

I would like to see teachers become self-employed and negotiate their own contracts with schools - just like footballers and their clubs. That would allow for results-related-pay and so on. It would motivate/improve the poor and the lazy and the more talented and harder-working teachers would prosper.

Loafing Oaf · 05-10-2020 11:05AM

facehugger99 wrote: »

A government that can see the effects of the restrictions are going to have a far more damaging impact on lives that the virus

A government whose job it is to represent the best-interests of it's citizens.

A government with courage to do what is right, not what is easy.

A government that will hold the so called 'public health experts' to account. That will make them justify their recommendations. That will question and call on them to explain the logic of their approach and the science on which it is based.

Basically the kind of government this country doesn't have .

But if things go wrong and people start to die in significant numbers again, it's a slam-dunk for the opposition: "NPHET told you to move to Level 5 again put you put the economy before public health." No government can risk that.

utyh2ikcq9z76b · 05-10-2020 11:10AM

Whatsisname wrote: »

I should preface this by saying I'm not anti-mask or whatever, I don't like wearing masks, I doubt anyone really does, but if I have to, I will.

But this data from UK a few weeks back I found interesting.

https://twitter.com/cricketwyvern/status/1304353617873440768?s=20

Loads of other things happening around that time as well, eat out scheme, schools going back etc as they say correlation ≠ causation

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part V - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part V - Read OP for Mod Warnings