Covid 19 Part XXIII-33,444 in ROI(1,792 deaths) 9,541 in NI(577 deaths)(22/09)Read OP

Wolf359f · 18-09-2020 09:51PM

Happydays2020 wrote: »

Thankfully someone is still asking questions.

https://twitter.com/markpaultimes/status/1306932733046910976?s=21

Some don’t like questions being asked. NPHET and HSE need to be held to account. 50000 people lost their jobs today.

This is not how track and trace works, which is what we are using. It's designed to stop spread further on and as such all resources should be focused on preventing the forward transmission.
If they focus on tracing back at the expense of preventing forward transmission we would be in an even worse state, but hey at least we know where to close, but it's ok, the new cases are so high it would be a total lockdown anyway.

niallo27 · 18-09-2020 09:52PM

speckle wrote: »

What if those millions that they have found now for business as they announce they have to close, had been put to sorting out out extra ICU beds and general beds/nightingales and staff over the summer

Even to retro fit restaurants with the best air filtration and ventilation systems?

Or even employ and train more contact tracers etc.

Or even make in Ireland respirator type hoods, so that newborn premature babies in hospital can learn to smile at the appropriate ages

Or give restuants an alternative, how about a limit of 4 people, only 2 households. How about some alternative thinking instead of let's shut it all down.

niallo27 · 18-09-2020 09:54PM

Wolf359f wrote: »

This is not how track and trace works, which is what we are using. It's designed to stop spread further on and as such all resources should be focused on preventing the forward transmission.
If they focus on tracing back at the expense of preventing forward transmission we would be in an even worse state, but hey at least we know where to close, but it's ok, the new cases are so high it would be a total lockdown anyway.

How do we know where to target with restrictions so.

Goldengirl · 18-09-2020 09:54PM

Happydays2020 wrote: »

Excess deaths this year will be statistically insignificant. Excess deaths in future years as a result of the lack of money available for the health Services will be in the 1000’s per year. I am not pretending that the lock down did not save lives but it is also costing lives.

Two members of my immediate family diagnosed one with cancer , and treated successfully , thank God , since this pandemic began .
Health services are up and running but what is stopping them are the continuing presence of this virus and surges in infection is what is wrecking our services and economy .

Wolf359f · 18-09-2020 09:58PM

niallo27 wrote: »

Or give restuants an alternative, how about a limit of 4 people, only 2 households. How about some alternative thinking instead of let's shut it all down.

And how would they confirm it's only 2 households?
Pinky-promise?
If people were asked to provide proof of address to visit a restaurant there would be uproar.
You could limit it, so you can only visit a restaurant twice a week (less social contacts) link it to credit/debit cards, again the public would be in uproar.

It's very easy to live with covid if the entire public decide to give up some social freedoms, but that will never happen. It can work in China.... for obvious reasons.

speckle · 18-09-2020 09:59PM

Ficheall wrote: »

If the frequency of Eflat ...... So your "doubling time" is 12 notes or semitones or whatever they're called.

I am rolling around here on the floor laughing...I really needed that...Not the best last 24hours, with senior family members in Dublin worried for the first time since this began, because of the scaremongery media. Been on the phone tree all day with them. ... so

Thanking you very much.:)

Sconsey · 18-09-2020 09:59PM

niallo27 wrote: »

Tell that to the people who have lost their jobs and businesses despite having followed every regulation to the letter of the law.

I was correcting you not them. Your mindset that this is some sort of punishment is just way off.

Wolf359f · 18-09-2020 10:01PM

niallo27 wrote: »

How do we know where to target with restrictions so.

I think the idea is to use resources to prevent restrictions. Obviously that didn't work out and now it's pretty much a lot of blanket restrictions. It's not just restaurants closing.

sterz · 18-09-2020 10:02PM

Kh1993 wrote: »

Has any journalist or politician asked NPHET or our cabinet decision makers what the grand plan is? What happens in 3/4/5/6 weeks when Dublin exits level 3? Open back up, repeat same experiment in other counties and in Dublin again in 3 months when cases inevitably rise again.

You’d at least be able to stomach it if NPHET came out and said you’ll be locked down every 6 months.

And what figures will they want to see in order for Dublin to open back up, have they mentioned that or will they just wing it?

ACitizenErased · 18-09-2020 10:03PM

HSE Daily Operations Update

75 in hospital, reduction of 2
7 confirmed cases in hospitals today

15 in ICU, increase of 1
7 ventilated, no change

Ficheall · 18-09-2020 10:03PM

speckle wrote: »

I am rolling around here on the floor laughing...

It wasn't a joke

Goldengirl · 18-09-2020 10:03PM

Wolf359f wrote: »

And how would they confirm it's only 2 households?
Pinky-promise?
If people were asked to provide proof of address to visit a restaurant there would be uproar.
You could limit it, so you can only visit a restaurant twice a week (less social contacts) link it to credit/debit cards, again the public would be in uproar.

It's very easy to live with covid if the entire public decide to give up some social freedoms, but that will never happen. It can work in China.... for obvious reasons.

What would work if we get out of this immediate bind , would be to reverse the decision to let pubs open , and just have restaurants as was originally planned ..cue uproar !

giveitholly · 18-09-2020 10:04PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

HSE Daily Operations Update

75 in hospital, reduction of 2
7 confirmed cases in hospitals today

15 in ICU, increase of 1
7 ventilated, no change

Any idea how many were in hospital this time last week ACE?

Goldengirl · 18-09-2020 10:05PM

speckle wrote: »

I am rolling around here on the floor laughing...I really needed that...Not the best last 24hours, with senior family members in Dublin worried for the first time since this began, because of the scaremongery media. Been on the phone tree all day with them. And it was compounded by hearing of nurses partying when they should not have been ... so

Thanking you very much.:)

I saw you said that before . What are you talking about here ?

Wolf359f · 18-09-2020 10:07PM

Goldengirl wrote: »

What would work if we get out of this immediate bind , would be to reverse the decision to let pubs open , and just have restaurants as was originally planned ..cue uproar !

I think it's madness allowing pubs open in the rest of the country.
For Dublin, they could have allowed Restaurants open, but no alcohol sales.
There are genuine restaurants who make a living from food and not alcohol sales.

speckle · 18-09-2020 10:08PM

Ficheall wrote: »

It wasn't a joke

No I know... I was laughing at myself for not thinking of it that way... sorry

Wolf359f · 18-09-2020 10:09PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

HSE Daily Operations Update

75 in hospital, reduction of 2
7 confirmed cases in hospitals today

15 in ICU, increase of 1
7 ventilated, no change

giveitholly wrote: »

Any idea how many were in hospital this time last week ACE?

53 and 7 in ICU
So an increase of 22 and 8

blowitupref · 18-09-2020 10:10PM

giveitholly wrote: »

Any idea how many were in hospital this time last week ACE?

53 in hospital and 7 in ICU last Friday.

Just 1 hospital case in the 3 main hospitals in Connacht and that person is in ICU.

speckle · 18-09-2020 10:16PM

Goldengirl wrote: »

I saw you said that before . What are you talking about here ?

Family members out of Dublin in a hotel for the first break since this began as they worked through it, leaving the 80+ ers alone, then phase 3 happens not due back til tomorrow and all the 80+ers hear on the radio, is the news of positive cluster in the hotel.

Goldengirl · 18-09-2020 10:16PM

Wolf359f wrote: »

I think it's madness allowing pubs open in the rest of the country.
For Dublin, they could have allowed Restaurants open, but no alcohol sales.
There are genuine restaurants who make a living from food and not alcohol sales.

Of course there are , and probably more concentrated in Dublin as hard to get enough drink licenses .
But even so the whole point of having food to keep people sober and distanced was lost in the € 9 meal rip off pubs .
Leo gave in to the VFA and should have said no , just restaurants for a while .
Only pubs that were proper gastro pubs should have been allowed open and the guards should have been given right to close those pubs outright that were not complying .

JP Liz V1 · 18-09-2020 10:17PM

bb1234567 wrote: »

Kildare were out in 3 weeks because there was no uncontrolled outbreak in kildare. It was clearly all in factories. If it was spreading in Kildare communities it would not have been all done and dusted in 3 weeks.Dublin is experiencing widespread community transmission

Dublin is far bigger than Kildare too and seems to be many there who like to be in different houses for a chat, mingle, cuppa or party

tobefrank321 · 18-09-2020 10:17PM

Goldengirl wrote: »

And how many died ?

A better question would be "how many covid deaths can be linked directly to restaurant clusters?"

Living with covid was supposed to involve world class testing and contact tracing. But they've already been unable to contact trace in many cases, basically losing track of the virus.

How hard would it be to track a new infection to someone or a contact visiting a restaurant? And if they did track it to one restaurant close that one down for a week rather than every one in Dublin.

NPHET and the government really have lost the plot on this one.

stockshares · 18-09-2020 10:17PM

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

I thought community transmission could not be traced

I thought it couldn't be traced either when they explained tracing earlier in the year.

However they were never tracing back to the place where the person picked up or thought they had picked up the virus 5 days previously.

They only trace back 24hrs and that leads to a lot of cases documented as community transmission because no specific location or premises can be found .

If they had of fully traced from the start restrictions could have been more targeted and a lot of bad feeling could have been avoided.

I think Nephet said today that they don't have resources to trace that far back but that's hard to believe. The fault appears to be on the Gov side

Goldengirl · 18-09-2020 10:19PM

speckle wrote: »

Family members out of Dublin in a hotel for the first break since this began as they worked through it, leaving the 80+ ers alone, then phase 3 happens not due back til tomorrow and all the 80+ers hear on the radio, is the news of positive cluster in the hotel.

Is this the Tullamore one?
I didn't realise they were healthcare workers?

JP Liz V1 · 18-09-2020 10:19PM

speckle wrote: »

Family members out of Dublin in a hotel for the first break since this began as they worked through it, leaving the 80+ ers alone, then phase 3 happens not due back til tomorrow and all the 80+ers hear on the radio, is the news of positive cluster in the hotel.

A Dublin hotel?

Jim_Hodge · 18-09-2020 10:21PM

stockshares wrote: »

If they had of fully traced from the start restrictions could have been more targeted and a lot of bad feeling could have been avoided

Oh, isn't that so easy to say or type out?

Wolf359f · 18-09-2020 10:21PM

Goldengirl wrote: »

Of course there are , and probably more concentrated in Dublin as hard to get enough drink licenses .
But even so the whole point of having food to keep people sober and distanced was lost in the € 9 meal rip off pubs .
Leo gave in to the VFA and should have said no , just restaurants for a while .
Only pubs that were proper gastro pubs should have been allowed open and the guards should have been given right to close those pubs outright that were not complying .

If an unaccompanied learner driver is stopped by guards, their car can be seized,
maybe the state should be able to seize pubs/restaurants flouting licencing laws.
They are both licencing issues!

18-09-2020 10:22PM

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Yeah sure. Me too.

I think the argument is about people losing income from jobs or business.

It's a really tough one, but I can understand the necessity.

People are just not adhering to advice.
I have contact with one friend, outdoors, my parents, my partner, that is it. Since March.

No point in blaming the government really.
People are carrying on as if there is no health crisis.

igCorcaigh wrote: »

None.

All I know is that the virus is spreading through human contact.

So prioritise contacts.
School is essential.
Pubs and eating out, not essential.

Genuinely, for me this wouldn't be a life worth living. This may work fine for you but if this was something I had to do for a prolonged period, I wouldn't last.

These aren't as simple decisions as you make out, to just cut human contact.

KaneToad · 18-09-2020 10:25PM

tobefrank321 wrote: »

A better question would be "how many covid deaths can be linked directly to restaurant clusters?" .

This is the problem, it's too hard to know. This can only be a hypothesis based on other known information.

KaneToad · 18-09-2020 10:27PM

AdamD wrote: »

Genuinely, for me this wouldn't be a life worth living. This may work fine for you but if this was something I had to do for a prolonged period, I wouldn't last.

These aren't as simple decisions as you make out, to just cut human contact.

This is one of the biggest problems. I could easily cut all human contact - other than family in my household - for months. I'd miss it but I'd easily cope. I can understand your predicament as you feel exactly the opposite.

Covid 19 Part XXIII-33,444 in ROI(1,792 deaths) 9,541 in NI(577 deaths)(22/09)Read OP

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