Health Insurance

shockwave · 11-09-2020 01:48PM

enfant terrible wrote: »

But say you pay for the scans privately are you then put on a public list for the operation?

The answer is yes because I did this myself a few years ago.

I paid around €180 for an ultrasound scan the results went back to my GP and I was put on the public waiting list (was nothing serious thank christ)

Geuze · 11-09-2020 01:51PM

sallyanne12 wrote: »

But what I don’t understand is: Can’t anyone go private if they just pay the money? Like for example, If you have a problem and you have private health insurance, you get referred to a specialist consultant and pay for it. If you are public, you get referred to private specialist consultant if you also pay? I don’t understand the difference...

Yes, of course, you can pay for private care yourself.

Geuze · 11-09-2020 01:54PM

sallyanne12 wrote: »

But could she not have paid privately for her colonoscopy even though she had no health insurance?

Yes, she could.

Geuze · 11-09-2020 01:56PM

sallyanne12 wrote: »

To the poster who said they wouldn’t like to get a cancer diagnosis without private health insurance because of the costs of scans and tests, Surely that wouldn’t be too expensive to pay yourself? I mean it would just be a once off scan and test etc. And then the treatment is free anyway if I’m correct? How long would it you be waiting for cancer treatment publicly v privately? And what’s the price difference?

I don't know if you can switch back and forth between public and private treatment.

If you are referred by a GP, and pay for scan/test yourself, then you a private patient.

JethroC · 11-09-2020 01:56PM

joeguevara wrote: »

So 80 euro a month is, in your words, the cut off of being rich?

A lot of people can't afford 960 a year for health insurance so to them people who can are certainly richer

Trigger Happy · 11-09-2020 02:01PM

Health insurance is a complete waste of money until you need it.

Eggs For Dinner · 11-09-2020 02:09PM

sallyanne12 wrote: »

But what I don’t understand is: Can’t anyone go private if they just pay the money? Like for example, If you have a problem and you have private health insurance, you get referred to a specialist consultant and pay for it. If you are public, you get referred to private specialist consultant if you also pay? I don’t understand the difference...

My most recent (of many) procedures cost circa €106k. My GP referred me to a consultant, scans done, operated on and done and dusted in a couple of months. I was told there was a 2 year public waiting list to see a consultant and my man told me he wouldn't have been able to do anything at that stage if I had gone down that route.

It's not a fair system, but if it's the only game in town, you need to do what you can.

enfant terrible · 11-09-2020 07:17PM

Eggs For Dinner wrote: »

My most recent (of many) procedures cost circa €106k. My GP referred me to a consultant, scans done, operated on and done and dusted in a couple of months. I was told there was a 2 year public waiting list to see a consultant and my man told me he wouldn't have been able to do anything at that stage if I had gone down that route.

It's not a fair system, but if it's the only game in town, you need to do what you can.

I think what Sally is asking is if without health insurance you pay the few hundred euros for the private scans and see the consultant, are you then no worse off than the person with health insurance.

Will you then be put on the same list as the person with health insurance for your operation, kinda like your playing the system.

Eggs For Dinner · 11-09-2020 07:33PM

enfant terrible wrote: »

I think what Sally is asking is if without health insurance you pay the few hundred euros for the private scans and see the consultant, are you then no worse off than the person with health insurance.

Will you then be put on the same list as the person with health insurance for your operation, kinda like your playing the system.

Of course you can pay privately for scans and consultants, even people with insurance have to pay for the initial consultation. However, that doesn't bump you up the list to get anything done with the findings and you can be sure the consultant you engage would want to see evidence of funds/insurance before following through with any procedures. There is no 'list' for private patients

happyoutscan · 11-09-2020 07:42PM

Would not go a day without it.

riclad · 11-09-2020 07:54PM

The difference with health insurance is you will get to see a doctor consultant quickly,not in 6-12 months
you will be sent to a private ward, you may have the option of being in a room by yourself.
Consultants in the public sector have long waiting lists, if you go to a hospital
you will be on a ward with 10-20 other patients,
maybe you will be on a trolley if you go in the winter .
there is a reason why people pay for health insurance.
its like getting a limo versus waiting at a bus stop to get on a crowded bus.
also because of covid non emergency operations are being cancelled .
private hospitals treat patients quickly and they do not put people on trolleys .
OF course if you are 20 years old and have never been sick you may think
whats they point of private health insurance.

enfant terrible · 11-09-2020 08:35PM

Eggs For Dinner wrote: »

Of course you can pay privately for scans and consultants, even people with insurance have to pay for the initial consultation. However, that doesn't bump you up the list to get anything done with the findings and you can be sure the consultant you engage would want to see evidence of funds/insurance before following through with any procedures. There is no 'list' for private patients

That's what I mean once you pay privately for the consultant will he then put you in as a public patient meaning you dont pay a penny more?

And your on the same waiting list for an operation as the person paying health insurance all his life?

ted1 · 12-09-2020 12:49AM

JethroC wrote: »

Don't you just love the society we live in

The rich have a better chance of living and the poor have a better chance of dying

Not really the rich. Middle class or just people with priorities sorted.

Greyfox · 12-09-2020 01:19AM

ted1 wrote: »

Not really the rich. Middle class or just people with priorities sorted.

People can have there priorities sorted and still not have health insurance, it's something that could end up being a waste of money.

ted1 · 12-09-2020 01:25AM

Greyfox wrote: »

People can have there priorities sorted and still not have health insurance, it's something that could end up being a waste of money.

Of course it’s a waste of money. Then you find a lump on your balls or breasts and then you start it’s not.

What kind of priority would Uiu have , and not have it ? Sky tv? Bottle of wine a week ?

12-09-2020 01:28AM

Unless you're in bad health, health insurance is a total scam.

If you're in bad health, you'll be well looked after by public system.

All in all, private healthcare is a waste of money and thankfully more and more people are discovering this.

We're an outlier in Europe with our two-tier system and we routinely rank near the bottom when it comes to healthcare.

ted1 · 12-09-2020 01:34AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Unless you're in bad health, health insurance is a total scam.

If you're in bad health, you'll be well looked after by public system.

All in all, private healthcare is a waste of money and thankfully more and more people are discovering this.

We're an outlier in Europe with our two-tier system and we routinely rank near the bottom when it comes to healthcare.

Earlier in the year I had Dodgy shoulder ,Went to my GP,next day had a MRI, three days later I was with a consultant in Vincent’s, 3 days later and another MRi I’m with another consultant in Blackrock getting my shoulder sorted.

I’m not in bad health I ran4 marathons in the past three years and cycle 300 km a week

Yes our health system sucks so does the NHS. Hopefully Slaintecare fixes it. I won’t mind paying additional taxes if it means I don’t pay for health insurance

12-09-2020 02:00AM

ted1 wrote: »

Earlier in the year I had Dodgy shoulder ,Went to my GP,next day had a MRI, three days later I was with a consultant in Vincent’s, 3 days later and another MRi I’m with another consultant in Blackrock getting my shoulder sorted.

I’m not in bad health I ran4 marathons in the past three years and cycle 300 km a week

Yes our health system sucks so does the NHS. Hopefully Slaintecare fixes it. I won’t mind paying additional taxes if it means I don’t pay for health insurance

Glad to hear you're being looked after, I wish you all the very best my man.

I suppose the point I was making is that there's far too much money being spaffed away every year on private health insurance that nobody benefits from, aside from the insurance companies bank accounts, that could at least be partially going to a good public system.

They're a wholly unnecessary middleman.

ted1 · 12-09-2020 02:03AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Glad to hear you're being looked after, I wish you all the very best my man.

I suppose the point I was making is that there's far too much money being spaffed away every year on private health insurance that nobody benefits from, aside from the insurance companies bank accounts, that could at least be partially going to a good public system.

They're a wholly unnecessary middleman.

Agreed but until the middleman is removed I’ll be paying it.

Yyhhuuu · 12-09-2020 02:12AM

vixdname wrote: »

if you can pay for scans \ treatment out of your own pocket youll get it quicker than public of course.
Bare in mind hospital overnight charges, even in public hospitals can be many €100 of euro per night, add on diagnostics (MRI, CT) etc plus consultants fees, plus surgery, plus anaesthetist fees etc and your talking €1000s.

In-patient PUBLIC hospital charges are capped at €80 per day or €800 per calendar year ( save in very rare cases such as certain infectious disease where the fee is waived)

I assume large teaching hospitals with multi-disciplinary teams with various specialities available for consultation can deliver better healthcare than certain private hospitals with only 1 consultant available. Often times when there is an emergency or the patients condition deteoriates in a private hospital they are transferred to a public hospital. Ideally you want a private floor in a large public teaching hospital such as the Royal Free in London. You have the best of both worlds.

Yyhhuuu · 12-09-2020 02:20AM

Say for instance you have no insurance and you are feeling unwell eg fatigue, malaise etc. You go to your gp requesting blood tests which show abnormalities such as anaemia etc. You request a CT ( costing about €100 & done immediately)scan privately as you are in pain. The CT Radiologist's report detects a mass indicative of a tumour. Your GP refers you to an oncologist / Surgeon querying Cancer. Surely you are seen immediately as time is of the essence in diagnosis.

What is the difference in this situation to a person having private insurance, apart from choosing your own consultant or a private hospital.

I assume both cases would be treated as quickly or is this being naive?

Eggs For Dinner · 12-09-2020 08:04AM

enfant terrible wrote: »

That's what I mean once you pay privately for the consultant will he then put you in as a public patient meaning you dont pay a penny more?

And your on the same waiting list for an operation as the person paying health insurance all his life?

No you're not. There is no waiting list going privately and you will be treated within weeks rather than months/years

phormium · 12-09-2020 08:36AM

Yyhhuuu wrote: »

Say for instance you have no insurance and you are feeling unwell eg fatigue, malaise etc. You go to your gp requesting blood tests which show abnormalities such as anaemia etc. You request a CT ( costing about €100 & done immediately)scan privately as you are in pain. The CT Radiologist's report detects a mass indicative of a tumour. Your GP refers you to an oncologist / Surgeon querying Cancer. Surely you are seen immediately as time is of the essence in diagnosis.

What is the difference in this situation to a person having private insurance, apart from choosing your own consultant or a private hospital.

I assume both cases would be treated as quickly or is this being naive?

I would imagine (but I don't know) that if the GP then sends a referral to the public hospital/consultant with the results of your scan that it would get you a quicker appointment with that consultant but don't know how much quicker than all the cases they would already have on file waiting for appointment.

Funny story from years ago, friend of mine had sore throat with difficulty swallowing for a while, doc wanted him to see consultant, no health insurance but made an appointment with a private one as couldn't be waiting as was worried. I went with him to appointment, doc had a look, said it looked serious, could be cancer (actually said that at appointment, how to frighten the life out of someone!) suggested booking into private hospital for 3 days for various tests. When we mentioned no health insurance in place then said he could do nothing obviously and go back to GP. Now as it happened this person worked for someone who was great friends with the ENT in public hospital, boss made a call and person had appointment for that afternoon with ENT after he finished his surgeries in Public hospital outside of his normal appointments. Went over to hospital and waited and saw ENT who examined my friend and pronounced there was nothing wrong with him at all, yes sore looking throat but diagnosed the swallowing difficulty as stress related. The problem cleared up after a while and no treatment needed other than the peace of mind being told it was nothing to worry about. The private hospital system would have done well though out of 3 days bed charges and tests though that obviously would have not been needed in the end as there was no serious problem!

That was pure luck though to be able to get the fast appointment, again it's all down to a personal attitude to risk and a gamble as to whether you will every need health insurance.

starbaby2003 · 12-09-2020 08:49AM

phormium wrote: »

I would imagine (but I don't know) that if the GP then sends a referral to the public hospital/consultant with the results of your scan that it would get you a quicker appointment with that consultant but don't know how much quicker than all the cases they would already have on file waiting for appointment.

Funny story from years ago, friend of mine had sore throat with difficulty swallowing for a while, doc wanted him to see consultant, no health insurance but made an appointment with a private one as couldn't be waiting as was worried. I went with him to appointment, doc had a look, said it looked serious, could be cancer (actually said that at appointment, how to frighten the life out of someone!) suggested booking into private hospital for 3 days for various tests. When we mentioned no health insurance in place then said he could do nothing obviously and go back to GP. Now as it happened this person worked for someone who was great friends with the ENT in public hospital, boss made a call and person had appointment for that afternoon with ENT after he finished his surgeries in Public hospital outside of his normal appointments. Went over to hospital and waited and saw ENT who examined my friend and pronounced there was nothing wrong with him at all, yes sore looking throat but diagnosed the swallowing difficulty as stress related. The problem cleared up after a while and no treatment needed other than the peace of mind being told it was nothing to worry about. The private hospital system would have done well though out of 3 days bed charges and tests though that obviously would have not been needed in the end as there was no serious problem!

That was pure luck though to be able to get the fast appointment, again it's all down to a personal attitude to risk and a gamble as to whether you will every need health insurance.

There are more holes in this story than in a colander.

Greyfox · 12-09-2020 09:42AM

ted1 wrote: »

What kind of priority would Uiu have , and not have it ? Sky tv? Bottle of wine a week ?

I'd say more things like gym membership and Netflix. If I had health insurance the last 10 years I would of got nothing back in return for it as never needed it. I think you should only get health insurance if your in poor health or if you have plenty of money or your job pay for it.

NeonCookies · 12-09-2020 12:57PM

ted1 wrote:

Earlier in the year I had Dodgy shoulder ,Went to my GP,next day had a MRI, three days later I was with a consultant in Vincentâ€™s, 3 days later and another MRi Iâ€™m with another consultant in Blackrock getting my shoulder sorted.

The way it's been described to me is that if you have a serious, life threatening condition then public care is usually quite timely (although private would be quicker) and good. However if you have something like the above that is maybe causing chronic pain but not life threatening as such then this is where the waiting lists can be years, and health insurance can be invaluable. Thankfully I don't have too much experience of either side so don't know if that's true in reality, but I've heard a few people describe it that way.

Don't have health insurance yet although I'm due a pay rise from this month so looking into it now (before the extra money gets swallowed up by something else!) It's very confusing looking at all the plans.

Eggs For Dinner · 12-09-2020 01:13PM

Greyfox wrote: »

I'd say more things like gym membership and Netflix. If I had health insurance the last 10 years I would of got nothing back in return for it as never needed it. I think you should only get health insurance if your in poor health or if you have plenty of money or your job pay for it.

A lot of people are in good health and then, out of the blue, they find there is a problem. It's too late at that stage to take out a policy

inthenip · 12-09-2020 02:05PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Unless you're in bad health, health insurance is a total scam.

If you're in bad health, you'll be well looked after by public system.

All in all, private healthcare is a waste of money and thankfully more and more people are discovering this.

We're an outlier in Europe with our two-tier system and we routinely rank near the bottom when it comes to healthcare.

Would you be happy waiting a year for a colonoscopy instead of a week with health insurance?

tscul32 · 12-09-2020 02:33PM

I grew up in a family with no health insurance, and never needed it. My husband got his covered in work and we added me to it for having kids. I went semi private in Dublin 3 times. Once I spent a night in the public ward cos there were no semi p beds available, and I have to say I hated every second of it. His current employer covers the whole family. We've hardly used it, husband broke his leg and went through the vhi swiftcare clinic, the odd very minor injury other than that. One kid broke an arm while we were in the UK. I know people complain about the NHS but from dropped at the hospital to collection with a cast, sling and DVD of xrays for home was just under 3 hours and completely free and they were great, so nice. At home it would have been many more hours in Temple St as not an emergency and €100 for the privilege. Unfortunately the swiftcare fracture clinic wouldn't deal with us when we got home cos we didn't start with them so it was a whole morning in Temple St for his hard cast and the same again to get it off.
Insurance for something like a broken bone just means you can get it sorted in the vhi clinic or laya equivalent in a couple of hours in
a more pleasant environment instead of many more hours in a not so nice place.
My parents have no insurance, both had one issue each in the past few years, mini stroke, but received top care in the public system.
If you're an emergency case then you'll get seen. Insurance comes in for something that's not an emergency. My sister had a thing before that wasn't an emergency so she was put on a long list. However if it ruptured she'd be seen immediately because it would be an emergency. She didn't fancy that so paid a couple of grand to get it sorted privately. And then got health insurance.
Edited to add: Have to say, even though we haven't used it much I'm much happier knowing we have it.

Yyhhuuu · 12-09-2020 03:17PM

tscul32 wrote: »

I grew up in a family with no health insurance, and never needed it. My husband got his covered in work and we added me to it for having kids. I went semi private in Dublin 3 times. Once I spent a night in the public ward cos there were no semi p beds available, and I have to say I hated every second of it. His current employer covers the whole family. We've hardly used it, husband broke his leg and went through the vhi swiftcare clinic, the odd very minor injury other than that. One kid broke an arm while we were in the UK. I know people complain about the NHS but from dropped at the hospital to collection with a cast, sling and DVD of xrays for home was just under 3 hours and completely free and they were great, so nice. At home it would have been many more hours in Temple St as not an emergency and €100 for the privilege. Unfortunately the software fracture clinic wouldn't deal with us when we got home cos we didn't start with them so it was a whole morning in Temple St for his hard cast and the same again to get it off.
Insurance for something like a broken bone just means you can get it sorted in the vhi clinic or laya equivalent in a couple of hours in
a more pleasant environment instead of many more hours in a not so nice place.
My parents have no insurance, both had one issue each in the past few years, mini stroke, but received top care in the public system.
If you're an emergency case then you'll get seen. Insurance comes in for something that's not an emergency. My sister had a thing before that wasn't an emergency so she was put on a ling list. However if it ruptured she'd be seen immediately because it would be an emergency. She didn't fancy that so paid a couple of grand to get it sorted privately. And then got health insurance.

I have no health insurance at the moment although I had it in the past. I was admitted to hospital with a life threatening infection. I was a week hospitalised, a few days of which were in a nightingale long ward in a large teaching hospital.It was a dreadful experience, no privacy as essentially thrown on a trolley in the ward and not a proper bed, adjacent patient had radio switched on at 8am etc etc.. Luckily a kind nurse moved me to a semi private room. I thought to myself all the money I had was worthless to me in this situation. I observed the consultants visiting other what I assume were private patients spending a lot more time at their bedside in the semi private room. The only benefit of the public hospital was that I had three consultants and their teams sering me two of whom were utterly useless contradicting each other on the necessity for investigations ordered. I think had I been private the consultant would have taken more time with me rather than delegating to over worked junior doctors. Having said this I have little trust in some private hospitals for serious life threatening conditions.

A gp acquaintance of mine ( who is a complete miser) impressed upon me the necessity of private health insurance

Health Insurance

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