Belarus opposition leader kidnapped.

Rows Grower · 08-09-2020 6:08am #1

Sounds a bit dodgy....

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/europe/belarus-opposition-leader-is-bundled-into-van-on-street-and-now-missing-39512628.html

VinLieger · 08-09-2020 6:44am

Her press officer confirmed her abduction but also himself disappeared about 40 minutes later.....
The rest of her Press team is also missing along with her Coordination Council colleagues that were involved with talks with the Lukashenko the Dictator.

Random Account · 08-09-2020 6:51am

What’s up with that part of the world. Leaders over there are mad ***** and there we thought Leo was bad

VinLieger · 08-09-2020 6:57am

Random Account wrote: »

What’s up with that part of the world. Leaders over there are mad ***** and there we thought Leo was bad

Putin is the answer to your question

Wanderer78 · 08-09-2020 7:00am

Rows Grower wrote:

Sounds a bit dodgy....

Sounds like one dodgy country

Random Account wrote:

Whatâ€™s up with that part of the world. Leaders over there are mad ***** and there we thought Leo was bad

Corruption, poverty and serious inequality I'd say, I'd imagine most don't think Leo is bad, he's grand imho

TheRepentent · 08-09-2020 8:47am

Those are 3 brave women. Thatleader is a scumbag...only there cos of Putins support

Gatling · 08-09-2020 5:25pm

Maria Kolesnikova is currently being held by Belarus security forces at the border between Belarus and Ukraine they are actually trying to expel her out of the country ,some of her staff were forced into Ukraine by security forces ,Maria apparently damaged her passport in an attempt to prevent her force expulsion

https://www.euronews.com/2020/09/07/belarusian-opposition-figure-maria-kolesnikova-missing-after-bystander-reports-abduction

https://www.google.com/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/maria-kolesnikova-prominent-belarus-opposition-leader-detained-on-ukraine-border-12066651

Muahahaha · 08-09-2020 6:49pm

Shes a brave woman resisting being removed from Belarus. Sky News showed lots of Belorussian protestors who got lifted off the streets and absolutely battered with iron bars by the police, there was huge bruises all over their bodies. She could have suffered the same fate.

I wonder where the movement goes next. She and the two other women can still influence it online provided Lukashenko doesnt switch off the internet. I think he is flying to Moscow soon to meet Putin and there is the promise of Russian special forces entering the country to put down the protests. Sunday coming will be the 5th weekend in a row with protests of over 100k on the streets but it could be the last if the Russians get involved.

AMKC · 08-09-2020 6:53pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

Shes a brave woman resisting being removed from Belarus. Sky News showed lots of Belorussian protestors who got lifted off the streets and absolutely battered with iron bars by the police, there was huge bruises all over their bodies. She could have suffered the same fate.

I wonder where the movement goes next. She and the two other women can still influence it online provided Lukashenko doesnt switch off the internet. I think he is flying to Moscow soon to meet Putin and there is the promise of Russian special forces entering the country to put down the protests. Sunday coming will be the 5th weekend in a row with protests of over 100k on the streets but it could be the last if the Russians get involved.

Two scumbags meeting up together. Sure they will get on like a house on fire. The World would be much better off with these two scumbags out of it

Gatling · 08-09-2020 7:07pm

AMKC wrote: »

Two scumbags meeting up together. Sure they will get on like a house on fire. The World would be much better off with these two scumbags out of it

The Russians already stated if the protesters crossed particular line they would be assisting the return to order ,or as we seen in Ukraine the annexation of Crimea and occupations of East Ukraine.

Errashareesh · 08-09-2020 7:26pm

Random Account wrote: »

What’s up with that part of the world. Leaders over there are mad ***** and there we thought Leo was bad

Plenty don't think he's great but only idiots would compare him to a despot. And they do, bless their empty brains.

This country is utter paradise compared to many. Even compared to some other democracies.

Jimbob1977 · 08-09-2020 7:31pm

Former Soviet countries tend to be governed by despotic hard men with personality cults.

Usually ex-Communist senior officials.

Democracy is a Western concept that is lacking in many parts of the world.

In time, West may face direct conflict with East.

AMKC · 08-09-2020 8:05pm

Errashareesh wrote: »

Plenty don't think he's great but only idiots would compare him to a despot. And they do, bless their empty brains.

This country is utter paradise compared to many. Even compared to some other democracies.

What Country are you talking about Ireland or Belarus? If it's the latter I doubt there is many over there at the moment that would see it that way.

Mongfinder General · 08-09-2020 8:11pm

Errashareesh wrote: »

Plenty don't think he's great but only idiots would compare him to a despot. And they do, bless their empty brains.

This country is utter paradise compared to many. Even compared to some other democracies.

I was there at a football match about 10 years ago. We were watched closely but I did not feel threatened. Minsk is not so bad - there were some half decent bars and eateries there. Living standard is poor. Absolutely zero chance of being harassed by a track suited Junkie or being robbed by some low life street gang. I can't say the same for Dublin.

TheValeyard · 08-09-2020 8:17pm

Belarus is very different to Crimea or Ukraine. There is no popular Russia support and Putin actually hates Lukashenko. Russia could just be happy if he goes and a popular leader takes over but keeps Russian economics interests in place. Worked in another place and so far so good.

kippy · 08-09-2020 8:19pm

Random Account wrote: »

What’s up with that part of the world. Leaders over there are mad ***** and there we thought Leo was bad

The grass is always greener on the other side.

Errashareesh · 08-09-2020 8:25pm

I'm talking about Ireland. When I see morons going on about wearing masks being a sign of dictatorship... some folk badly need a dictionary.

TheValeyard · 08-09-2020 8:26pm

Errashareesh wrote: »

I'm talking about Ireland. When I see morons going on about wearing masks being a sign of dictatorship... some folk badly need a dictionary.

Well thats just silly. Those folks cannot read.

Gregor Samsa · 08-09-2020 9:06pm

Mongfinder General wrote: »

I was there at a football match about 10 years ago. We were watched closely but I did not feel threatened. Minsk is not so bad - there were some half decent bars and eateries there. Living standard is poor. Absolutely zero chance of being harassed by a track suited Junkie or being robbed by some low life street gang. I can't say the same for Dublin.

I was in there last year for a week, and I work with a team based in Minsk. It is lovely. Nice people. Nice food. Quiet and peaceful. One of the girls I work with over there drives a BMW M3. There’s a KFC with a cool Communist relief sculpture over it. What’s not to like?

A cousin of mine spend some time in the rural south, in the area affected by the Chernobyl disaster. The poverty she described is appalling. The inhuman treatment of the children in the orphanages. They were watched and minded by officials everywhere they went. The corruption and the bribes needed to get through daily life.

Then you talk to the folk from Minsk in private. A very different story emerges.

Minsk is a facade. The acceptable face of a dictatorship who’s only purpose is to line the pockets of the corrupt elite. The safety one experience there is a side effect of a ruthless and corrupt police and security apparatus who’s main purpose is to keep the citizens in strict line.

I’ll take my chances with the junkies over the KGB any day.

Mongfinder General · 08-09-2020 9:29pm

Gregor Samsa wrote: »

I was in there last year for a week, and I work with a team based in Minsk. It is lovely. Nice people. Nice food. Quiet and peaceful. One of the girls I work with over there drives a BMW M3. There’s a KFC with a cool Communist relief sculpture over it. What’s not to like?

A cousin of mine spend some time in the rural south, in the area affected by the Chernobyl disaster. The poverty she described is appalling. The inhuman treatment of the children in the orphanages. They were watched and minded by officials everywhere they went. The corruption and the bribes needed to get through daily life.

Then you talk to the folk from Minsk in private. A very different story emerges.

Minsk is a facade. The acceptable face of a dictatorship who’s only purpose is to line the pockets of the corrupt elite. The safety one experience there is a side effect of a ruthless and corrupt police and security apparatus who’s main purpose is to keep the citizens in strict line.

I’ll take my chances with the junkies over the KGB any day.

I don't doubt your account. However, there are parts of our country that have become lawless, overrun with filth who drag anything or anybody decent down with them. And it is a growing problem. And it will get to the point were people here will vote for a party that will advocate for a police force with draconian powers.

Muahahaha · 08-09-2020 10:10pm

Jimbob1977 wrote: »

Former Soviet countries tend to be governed by despotic hard men with personality cults.

Usually ex-Communist senior officials.

Democracy is a Western concept that is lacking in many parts of the world.

In time, West may face direct conflict with East.

yeah, without a doubt. Like Stalin killed way more people than Hitler and many were his own citizen. Yet Russian kids never read about that in their history books and he is venerated nationwide. There are statues of him everywhere across Russia to this day and he is affectionately known among the populace as 'Uncle Joe'. If you asked a Russian how many Russian citizens Stalin killed you would get a blind expression. Propaganda is a powerful thing.

TheValeyard wrote: »

Belarus is very different to Crimea or Ukraine. There is no popular Russia support and Putin actually hates Lukashenko. Russia could just be happy if he goes and a popular leader takes over but keeps Russian economics interests in place. Worked in another place and so far so good.

Yeah was thinking that myself. Lukashenko could easily find himself removed from power when on his visit to Moscow to beg Putin for help. Only thing is who would be his successor, it was supposed to be Lukashenkos son who he has been grooming for years but obviously thats now a non goer. Putin could put the Belorussian generals in charge for a year or so until they have fresh 'elections' to anoint the next Russian puppet. Whatever happens they are not getting any proper democracy here.

Elmer Blooker · 10-09-2020 2:59pm

Errashareesh wrote: »

Plenty don't think he's great but only idiots would compare him to a despot. And they do, bless their empty brains.

This country is utter paradise compared to many. Even compared to some other democracies.

I see your point, there are somewhat similar protests going on in Bulgaria but as EU and NATO members they are good guys and aren't on the 'hit list' so the media gives these protests as little attention as possible.
Big protests too in Montenegro but as they appear to be joining NATO soon so they are also the 'good guys' and not worth a mention on the 'news'.

Gatling · 10-09-2020 3:20pm

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I see your point, there are somewhat similar protests going on in Bulgaria

No not even close ,

Russian puppet fixes elections again and the people of Belarus want him gone.opposition leaders being detained and expelled from their own country

I'm sure the factory is peddling some nonsense about Nato as usual oh wait

Psychiatric Patrick · 10-09-2020 3:45pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

Shes a brave woman resisting being removed from Belarus. Sky News showed lots of Belorussian protestors who got lifted off the streets and absolutely battered with iron bars by the police, there was huge bruises all over their bodies. She could have suffered the same fate.

I wonder where the movement goes next. She and the two other women can still influence it online provided Lukashenko doesnt switch off the internet. I think he is flying to Moscow soon to meet Putin and there is the promise of Russian special forces entering the country to put down the protests. Sunday coming will be the 5th weekend in a row with protests of over 100k on the streets but it could be the last if the Russians get involved.

I'm always perplexed by the response of police or soldiers in situations like this or the protests in Hong Kong.

Like in anything there are good and bad people in uniform and some that honestly believe in what they do. The police in the riot gear are not all bad but why do the good ones do it. Are they afraid to say "I'm not hitting those students?"

EDIT: I meant protests and police all over the world because obviously yes in some places like Belarus, of course they'd be afraid

Gatling · 10-09-2020 6:32pm

Russian troops will be arriving in Belarus later in the month for the military exercise Slavic brotherhood 2020 , which was supposed to have Belarus , Serbian ,and Russian military forces conducting joint military exercises inside Belarus ,
Serbia publicly withdrew from the exercise Moscow is still sending troops thought ,
If Lukashenko isn't removed in the next two weeks it's safe to say Belarus will be under russian occupation to maintain law and order

Smiles35 · 10-09-2020 7:17pm

Interesting name for a country. Bela - Italian for beautiful. Rus - Historical name for the traders that lived along the rivers.
She is being held for now. They did'nt get her accross the border. Really, she should be released.

Gatling · 10-09-2020 7:30pm

Smiles35 wrote: »

They did'nt get her accross the border. Really, she should be released.

They told her either she went alive to Ukraine or be sent in pieces ,

I get the feeling she's in a very dangerous situation now

seenitall · 10-09-2020 7:41pm

Smiles35 wrote: »

Interesting name for a country. Bela - Italian for beautiful. Rus - Historical name for the traders that lived along the rivers.
She is being held for now. They did'nt get her accross the border. Really, she should be released.

You’re joking, yes?

Belo, bela, bielo, biela and many variations thereof mean “white” in Slavic languages.

Belarus = White Russia

Gatling · 10-09-2020 7:50pm

seenitall wrote: »

You’re joking, yes?

Belo, bela, bielo, biela and many variations thereof mean “white” in Slavic languages.

Belarus = White Russia

Does it not depend on how and who translates it , languages wouldn't be my best subject

Smiles35 · 10-09-2020 7:50pm

seenitall wrote: »

You’re joking, yes?

Belo, bela, bielo, biela and many variations thereof mean “white” in Slavic languages.

Belarus = White Russia

No, I wasnt. Genuinly. It makes a little more sence it being more local than Italian.

jimwallace197 · 10-09-2020 8:00pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Sounds like one dodgy country

Corruption, poverty and serious inequality I'd say, I'd imagine most don't think Leo is bad, he's grand imho

What are you talking about? Leo is grand?? first of all, hes not taoiseach anymore and hopefully will never be again.

Secondly, you do understand we live in a democracy in Western Europe I hope?? Its not comparable at all how our leaders would act here over an ex soviet union country.

Seriously, some people will find any opportunity to lick that snakes ass. Sad

seenitall · 10-09-2020 8:10pm

Well, no, it doesn’t depend. A word either draws its origin from somewhere or it doesn’t. Now, I’m not a Slavic etymologist so I don’t know the whole story with this but I do come from a Slavic language background, so to me this is a very basic, obvious fact. Other Germanic languages, for example, call Belarus White Russia* (e.g. ‘WeissRussland’ in German), so that is another big clue.

* to the point that I had to explain that belo means white to a German guy I knew once, as he kept hearing Belarus on Irish TV and was perplexed as to what country it may be. So then it was: “Aha! That is ze WeissRussland!”

ETA: got that German word wrong!

Smiles35 · 10-09-2020 8:15pm

Gatling wrote: »

They told her either she went alive to Ukraine or be sent in pieces ,

I get the feeling she's in a very dangerous situation now

The men talk rough over there. Thinking about this it comes accross as 'I work for the strongman, something happens and my strongman will get upset'.

Errashareesh · 10-09-2020 8:18pm

jimwallace197 wrote: »

What are you talking about? Leo is grand?? first of all, hes not taoiseach anymore and hopefully will never be again.

Secondly, you do understand we live in a democracy in Western Europe I hope?? Its not comparable at all how our leaders would act here over an ex soviet union country.

Seriously, some people will find any opportunity to lack that sneaks ass. Sad

If people don't think Leo is the devil incarnate, that's just their opinion - the anger is bizarre. Many don't buy that he was so terrible (because he obviously wasn't - and just saying that is not kissing his ass). People are looking at the bigger picture in relation to Ireland, which is an extremely good place to live. Right now look at the Covid payment. I just got a place on a Springboard (Higher Education Authority) funded course. A university post graduate worth €4,500 and I only have to pay €450. And I'm not even a job seeker! They don't have to pay anything. Not to mention all the freedoms we enjoy.

Yeah I know Ireland shouldn't be compared to a dictatorship but plenty of clowns do - particularly since Covid restrictions.

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I see your point, there are somewhat similar protests going on in Bulgaria but as EU and NATO members they are good guys and aren't on the 'hit list' so the media gives these protests as little attention as possible.
Big protests too in Montenegro but as they appear to be joining NATO soon so they are also the 'good guys' and not worth a mention on the 'news'.

I didn't think my first post to this thread was so unclear! You and Mongfinder - ye think I was defending Belarus's government?! How on earth could anyone (apart from its government) defend that?! I was referring to Ireland in response to a post about the way people in this country pretend here is a hell hole. Bit random I know - Gemma O'Doherty type commentary exhaustion I think!

Eleven Benevolent Elephants · 10-09-2020 8:21pm

It's a relic of Nazi Germany still alive and well in Europe.

Psychiatric Patrick · 10-09-2020 8:53pm

Gatling wrote: »

Russian troops will be arriving in Belarus later in the month for the military exercise Slavic brotherhood 2020 , which was supposed to have Belarus , Serbian ,and Russian military forces conducting joint military exercises inside Belarus ,
Serbia publicly withdrew from the exercise Moscow is still sending troops thought ,
If Lukashenko isn't removed in the next two weeks it's safe to say Belarus will be under russian occupation to maintain law and order

I'm rather surprised they haven't held such a war games exercise with the Yanks. Waiting until closer to their election I suppose

Gatling · 10-09-2020 9:19pm

Psychiatric Patrick wrote: »

I'm rather surprised they haven't held such a war games exercise with the Yanks. Waiting until closer to their election I suppose

Too busy playing bumber cars in Syria

Psychiatric Patrick · 10-09-2020 9:26pm

Gatling wrote: »

Too busy playing bumber cars in Syria

Yes. Trump has the election in the bag* anyway so Putin has a few more years before he needs to send troops to maintain peace and order in the US.

* I assume so. Unless something happened to the loons.

Gatling · 10-09-2020 9:30pm

Psychiatric Patrick wrote: »

Yes. Trump has the election in the bag* anyway so Putin has a few more years before he needs to send troops to maintain peace and order in the US.

Maybe take it to the trump thread

Psychiatric Patrick · 10-09-2020 9:33pm

Gatling wrote: »

Maybe take it to the trump thread

No need. Just a thought that came to me from reading your post.

Hangdogroad · 10-09-2020 10:05pm

Mongfinder General wrote: »

I don't doubt your account. However, there are parts of our country that have become lawless, overrun with filth who drag anything or anybody decent down with them. And it is a growing problem. And it will get to the point were people here will vote for a party that will advocate for a police force with draconian powers.

Be careful what you wish for. Once draconian regimes come to power you cant just vote them out when you decide you're sick of them.

riffmongous · 10-09-2020 10:55pm

Gatling wrote: »

Does it not depend on how and who translates it , languages wouldn't be my best subject

No, the similarity to an Italian word is just coincidence, it means nothing. In German it's actually called Weissrussland rather than Belarus, which still translates to White Russia.

Edit: ah Seenitall got there first

blackwhite · 11-09-2020 1:20am

I see how Mick Wallace and his compadres are getting a free pass on their pushing of pro-Lukashenko propaganda.

If any party (FF, FG, SF, Lab, etc) was costing up to dictators like this there’d be a frenzy both on here, and in the media in general, but not a peep when it comes to our pension-stealing tax evader.

Psychiatric Patrick · 11-09-2020 8:55am

blackwhite wrote: »

I see how Mick Wallace and his compadres are getting a free pass on their pushing of pro-Lukashenko propaganda.

If any party (FF, FG, SF, Lab, etc) was costing up to dictators like this there’d be a frenzy both on here, and in the media in general, but not a peep when it comes to our pension-stealing tax evader.

I did not know Wallace was a fan of dictators. He seems ore like a person who is into no government at all.

Also there is no need for that kind of language.

EDIT: Sorry, you typed "tax evader" but I read "gob****e".

:P

Muahahaha · 13-09-2020 3:05pm

The protests are just as big today as any Sunday before it. Reports coming out that police have bundled over 250 protestors into vans and many of them are female.

Also its come out that an American company supplied Lukashenko with technology to block the internet in Belerus.

MontgomeryClift · 13-09-2020 5:07pm

"They took the babies out of the incubators, took the incubators, and left the children to die on the cold floor."

Scoondal · 13-09-2020 5:56pm

The protesters are brave people. If they are arrested what will they experience ? And their families then on the police "radar".

Gatling · 13-09-2020 6:01pm

Scoondal wrote: »

The protesters are brave people. If they are arrested what will they experience ? And their families then on the police "radar".

Probably some form or torture and forced expulsion if the last week was anything to go by

13-09-2020 6:36pm

https://twitter.com/e_guarducci/status/1305192846958489602?s=21

13-09-2020 6:38pm

Sorry was only meant to link last one showing cop punching the woman. The cop was then turned on by protesters and had to be rescued by other cops.

Muahahaha · 13-09-2020 7:26pm

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Sorry was only meant to link last one showing cop punching the woman. The cop was then turned on by protesters and had to be rescued by other cops.

I saw footage from a few days ago of about six cops beating a protestor with batons in a park, then a crowd of about 50 other protestors spotted it and began running towards the police who immediately backed off hitting the lad on the ground. For a moment it looked like the crowd of protestors were going to go for the six cops but they held off and didnt chase them once they had left the lad alone.

Scoondal wrote: »

The protesters are brave people. If they are arrested what will they experience ? And their families then on the police "radar".

Its certain that anyone snatched off the streets by the cops will be beaten badly, the BBC showed protestors who had been held in jails and their backs and legs were absolutely blue and black with bruising from the beating they got. Its a psychological tool the police are using, they know they will show their bruises to others who will then themselves be afraid of continuing on to protest for fear of getting a savage beating.

Belarus opposition leader kidnapped.

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