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Covid 19 Part XXI-27,908 in ROI (1,777 deaths) 6,647 in NI (559 deaths)(22/08)Read OP

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Comments

  • #6302
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    Turkish1 wrote: »
    Maybe give the guards the right to just come in and search your house top to bottom at the drop of a hat without any reason - just cause, why not. Sure there could be people hiding under the beds

    Sure if you've nothing to hide, what's the problem?


  • #6303
    Limpy
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭Limpy


    theballz wrote: »
    Where do people think we really went wrong with this?

    Paul Murphy highlighted meet factory conditions in March and the Gov didn't do anything. Simple


  • #6304
    MickeyLeari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 917 ✭✭✭MickeyLeari


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/BloombergAsia/status/1292927914409963523?s=20

    Someone with the same opinion.

    Does the government think we can SD for 2 years?

    Another lockdown and hopefully the penny will drop with govt/health officials our border controls were the problem and they will apologise to us for squandering our good position in June.


    It is a legitimate position to have in respect to closing border but we all know the political sensitivity In respect to NI and our position in the EU with the U.K. leaving.

    But can you please be up front that the recent increases in cases are not related to travel.

    You can do all you want about travel but if the internal risks are not managed we will not be able to eliminate the virus and the damage to our economy will be far disproportionate to the risk of the virus which can be managed through more conventional domestic measures.


  • #6305
    ChikiChiki
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,949 ✭✭✭ChikiChiki


    theballz wrote: »
    Where do people think we really went wrong with this?

    Meat factories.

    HSA being lazy pricks. Read one report where they were reluctant to send nspectors into the meat factories because of the risk they would catch Covid. Its the inspectors job to ensure they are adhering to the guidelines.

    Ffs - you couldn't make it up. It really goes to show how quickly things can run south.

    I think there is a lot more than meets the eye with the factories.


  • #6306
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,917 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Stheno wrote: »
    keeping borders open
    Not protecting nursing homes
    No enforced quarantine

    Could add speeding up the phases also.


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  • #6307
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,760 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    Stheno wrote: »
    keeping borders open
    Not protecting nursing homes
    No enforced quarantine

    The lack of action on travel is genuinely shocking considering how much they go on about numbers. There’s just as much a possibility of community transmission from people returning from abroad as there is from people who stayed here.


  • #6308
    Limpy
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭Limpy


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Sure if you've nothing to hide, what's the problem?

    Where do u live? If you've nothing to hide let us all walk around for a gawk.


  • #6309
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    Turkish1 wrote: »
    But what's the plan here - the vaccine could quite realistically be another ,12+months away (if we ever get a vaccine). Have we another year+ of this jumping in and out of full/partial lockdown/restrictions.
    Yes unfortunately. And the government hasn't made that clear to people. I don't know why - perhaps they think people will give up if it is too far away. I think the opposite myself, you have to tell people the truth difficult and all as it is.

    We should know in the next 2 or 3 months if the vaccines are succeeding in their trials - but they would still need to be manufactured. Assuming that is good news, we'll at least know how this ends.


  • #6310
    WoollyRedHat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,462 ✭✭✭✭WoollyRedHat


    Why don't they make masks in all open workplaces mandatory? They also need to be doing way more (surprise) spot checks of businesses to ensure compliance on ongoing basis. My place of work hasn't being checked once since reopening despite all the structures they have in place.


  • #6311
    Rambling Man
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 358 ✭✭Rambling Man


    Stheno wrote: »
    keeping borders open
    Not protecting nursing homes
    No enforced quarantine

    Hoping for the best with meat and food production plants rather than doing stringent checks and risk assessmemts.


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  • #6312
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    Limpy wrote: »
    Where do u live? If you've nothing to hide let us all walk around for a gawk.

    Well the sarcastic tone was lost, I was agreeing with you.


  • #6313
    Turkish1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 273 ✭✭Turkish1


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Sure if you've nothing to hide, what's the problem?

    Please please please tell me that's sarcasm

    Edit: thankfully it was


  • #6314
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    landofthetree wrote: »
    We were down to around 300 active cases at one stage.

    Now up to 2200+.

    We should have went for 0 cases.

    I suspect the UK and Ireland will end up going for a zero strategy as we face into the winter.

    It is clear as mud. Unless politicians are holding this back from us or thinking it will just go away. All scientists saying we have to do this. They are the experts. Why are the politicians not listening to the experts?


  • #6315
    mean gene
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 875 ✭✭✭mean gene


    Making it up as they go along rubbish government


  • #6316
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    theballz wrote: »
    Where do people think we really went wrong with this?
    There's no "wrong". It's a dangerous virus which spreads rapidly. We're trying to control it with primitive tools until we develop vaccines and treatments.

    If this had been a hundred years ago we'd have large numbers of dead and injured by now, and the pandemic would be over.


  • #6317
    Doctors room ghost
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,839 ✭✭✭Doctors room ghost


    Stheno wrote: »
    keeping borders open
    Not protecting nursing homes
    No enforced quarantine




    Cheltenham going ahead and lads traveling over and coming back sick


  • #6318
    Always_Running
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,839 ✭✭✭Always_Running


    Can someone remind me what was the median age of cases during the peak of this virus on this island in April?


  • #6319
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    hmmm wrote: »
    There's no "wrong". It's a dangerous virus which spreads rapidly. We're trying to control it with primitive tools until we develop vaccines and treatments.

    If this had been a hundred years ago we'd have large numbers of dead and injured by now, and the pandemic would be over.

    And in this case we will saved a few thousand people and plunged the world into 40% unemployment and all of the problems that will create, but society has decided they prefer the former.


  • #6320
    ChikiChiki
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,949 ✭✭✭ChikiChiki


    Doctors room ghost wrote: »
    Cheltenham going ahead and lads traveling over and coming back sick

    Yeah but that was all sorted. This is wave 2. We have to look at what went wrong since early June when restrictions were eased.


  • #6321
    Arghus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,223 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    Lundstram wrote: »
    No we wouldn't, did you actually read the post? The virus was imported. Quench it with a hard lockdown for 20 days - month then seal borders.

    This flip flopping bullsh1t of restrictions and local lockdowns is just kicking the can down the road. We are a long way away from a vaccine, throw in another year for each and every one of us to actually get it. Pie in the sky stuff thinking a vaccine will come soon and save us all.

    20 days wouldn't do it, you can't quench this thing that quickly no matter how hard you lock down.

    First of all you'd still be finding cases for a period of weeks after locking down. Which of itself would take longer than 20 days. Then once you were down to zero, you'd have to maintain that level of lockdown for one incubation period - even perhaps 2 periods - to be totally sure that you were free. You are probably looking at about 6 weeks if everything went perfectly.


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  • #6322
    coastwatch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 909 ✭✭✭coastwatch


    Always_Running wrote: »
    Can someone remind me what was the median age of cases during the peak of this virus on this island in April?

    52-53?


  • #6323
    An Ciarraioch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,806 ✭✭✭An Ciarraioch


    Always_Running wrote: »
    Can someone remind me what was the median age of cases during the peak of this virus on this island in April?

    The median age of cases was always around the mid-forties, it was only the averages for deaths that were generally in the low-eighties.


  • #6324
    caveat emptor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,134 ✭✭✭caveat emptor


    MickeyLeari wrote: »
    It is a legitimate position to have in respect to closing border but we all know the political sensitivity In respect to NI and our position in the EU with the U.K. leaving.

    But can you please be up front that the recent increases in cases are not related to travel.

    You can do all you want about travel but if the internal risks are not managed we will not be able to eliminate the virus and the damage to our economy will be far disproportionate to the risk of the virus which can be managed through more conventional domestic measures.

    If you can look at this chart see how quick they got it under control (y-axis is date) x-axis is different provinces.

    Country of a billion people have less cases.

    523414.jpg


  • #6325
    Arghus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,223 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    Stheno wrote: »
    keeping borders open
    Not protecting nursing homes
    No enforced quarantine

    All of this is true, as well as taking the eye off the ball in relation to meat factories and Direct Provision centres, but, also people have to take personal responsibility as well.

    All of the reasons you've outlined are valid, but they're also things that are easy to point to - because they involve failings on the part of the state or other authorities, it absolves "us" - wider society - of any blame - but people have also flaunted regulations and advice so not every piece of blame can be laid at the feet of the authorities. For all their failings, a lot comes down to the actions of individuals too.


  • #6326
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    And in this case we will saved a few thousand people and plunged the world into 40% unemployment and all of the problems that will create, but society has decided they prefer the former.
    We don't know what the death toll will be if we let it run, and if the hospitals become overwhelmed (which would happen very quickly). We can lower the mortality rate now with top-class ICU care and drugs. Covid sends a large number of people to hospital - most of them we can treat easily with the right equipment if we have it. We also don't know what the long-term impacts are on people from infection.

    I'm not an expert on this, but there is a clear consensus from those who are that this is a dangerous virus, and cannot be allowed spread unchecked.


  • #6327
    LuasSimon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,208 ✭✭✭LuasSimon


    Larry Goodman is renting out his meat factories for indoor sports matchs .... he wants a million euro a week lodged to his accounts in Luxembourg!


  • #6328
    completedit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,639 ✭✭✭completedit


    My prediction is in 5 years time this whole event will be a case study in why we shouldn't always head the advice of people who have found themselves hungry on power, given the once in a generation opportunity to flaunt their credentials and dictate whole government policy, and also how from the top down, we were derailed and led into depression because of the hysteria of social media and crowds.


  • #6329
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    MickeyLeari wrote: »
    It is a legitimate position to have in respect to closing border but we all know the political sensitivity In respect to NI and our position in the EU with the U.K. leaving.

    But can you please be up front that the recent increases in cases are not related to travel.

    You can do all you want about travel but if the internal risks are not managed we will not be able to eliminate the virus and the damage to our economy will be far disproportionate to the risk of the virus which can be managed through more conventional domestic measures.

    I think you are confusing CAUSE and AFFECT. The cause of the numbers is imported cases and the effect is it will get into all those settings that we are seeing now which we saw back in April and May. The nursing homes, the meat plants, the offices, homes etc. You cannot keep it out of those places when it is in the community. Imported cases were 20 per cent of our total cases at one point.

    Internal risks will sort themselves out when cases are low.
    Why is there similar outbreaks in the North? Meat plants North and South didnt suddenly get slack in August. The cases in the countries increased. This virus here did originally come from another country.

    Politicians North/South wil have to agree this policy when we are back in lockdown next month. Plenty of time then for them to come to joint zero covid agreement. We will have to suffer two lockdowns though because of our politicians and political difficulties north/south.


  • #6330
    boggerman1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,069 ✭✭✭boggerman1


    completedit wrote: »
    My prediction is in 5 years time this whole event will be a case study in why we shouldn't always head the advice of people who have found themselves hungry on power enlisted with the responsibility of health and well-being during this pandemic and also how from the top down, we were derailed and led into depression because of the hysteria of social media and crowds.
    Agree with this.the tribunal of enquiry in a couple of yrs time will be a **** show


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  • #6331
    MickeyLeari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 917 ✭✭✭MickeyLeari


    There were serious strategic and tactical errors with this today. The Cabinet has a gun put to its head (and it was leaked - by whom?). This was panicked and will not deliver the necessary calm. the way things planned out today I would not be surprised if there were Ministers whatsapping journalists from the Cabinet meeting - what is going on?

    They should have had a meeting between the Cabinet sub committee and key NPHET officials who would then be asked to look at specific measures targeted at the real risks and then come back with proper considered and tested proposals with clear reasoning and importantly give the PR people a chance to move on it.

    This was a disaster which suits no one. Heads need to be knocked together to ensure this does not happen again.


This discussion has been closed.
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