Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Why is there ever a debate about who was the best Irish Sports person ever? *READ OP*

Options
1…1011131516…22

Comments

  • Options
    #362
    Tom Mann Centuria
    Registered Users Posts: 10,913 ✭✭✭✭Tom Mann Centuria


    partyguinness wrote: »
    She was the stand out and most consistent female middle distance runner from say 92 to 97/98. Her league meets Euros and Worlds. Her 2000 Olympic silver was slightly unexpected as she had taken time off to have a child. Perhaps she didnt clean up with medals as she should have but she still dominated. Usian Bolt is an extreme example.

    Anyway, her record is still head and shoulders any other Irish sportsperson in their field.

    I agree she would get my vote, and was ultra consistent, but she didn't dominate. No one did in her era, at her distances, she was one of quite a few capable of winning the big events, as the records show. But to even be competitive in distance running was a huge feat in itself. Imo.

    Oh well, give me an easy life and a peaceful death.



  • Options
    #363
    Doctors room ghost
    Registered Users Posts: 4,801 ✭✭✭Doctors room ghost


    partyguinness wrote: »
    She was the stand out and most consistent female middle distance runner from say 92 to 97/98. Her league meets Euros and Worlds. Her 2000 Olympic silver was slightly unexpected as she had taken time off to have a child. Perhaps she didnt clean up with medals as she should have but she still dominated. Usian Bolt is an extreme example.

    Anyway, her record is still head and shoulders any other Irish sportsperson in their field.




    Because she was surrounded by a load of cheats and frauds.


  • Options
    #364
    ballsdeep69
    Registered Users Posts: 252 ✭✭ballsdeep69


    Big joe Joyce obviously 👊ðŸ½


  • Options
    #365
    ShatterAlan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭ShatterAlan


    feargale wrote: »
    You seem to take a special interest in this shagging business. I'd say there would be a run on popcorn in your house if it ever became an Olympic event.


    And the same in your house if cheap smartarse comments qualified.

    I don't care how many women a sports person beds.
    George Best was a notorious womaniser and I've no problem with that. He was the greatest player to come from the island...probably this hemisphere.
    Paul Gasgoine is another violent drunk but there's no denying his ability.

    I was talking about how people try to use a person's flaws as a reason to detract from their sporting acumen. A point that was clearly lost on you.

    But thanks for the snotty quip.


  • Options
    #366
    trashcan
    Registered Users Posts: 3,907 ✭✭✭trashcan


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    if best saw himself as irish , thats good enough for me , i dont think he did however

    if he is irish

    he is out in front as the best ever sports person from this country - island

    I actually think he probably did. He is on record as supporting an all Island football team.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #367
    partyguinness
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »
    She did not dominate her sport. Not at the elite level.

    You cannot call her a dominant female distance runner, when she went to 4 olympic games and only has one solitary silver medal to show for it.

    I'm sorry, but with the talent she had she should have achieved far more than that.

    As regards having a baby before the 2000 olympics... I'm the person who first highlighted this on the thread, and it was a massive error in judgement on her part. She was one the favourites for gold in those games, but basically blew her chances... so she only really has herself to blame on that one.

    She would certainly make any top 20 list comfortably, but she's definitely not the greatest ever. Not for me anyway.

    So what if you brought up her child first? It is of no relevance. She made a conscious decision to have a child. That is hardly a 'massive error of judgment'. It is a shame she didnt clean up in 96.

    She was certainly not favourite for the gold in 2000. I remember it well. The hope was she would compete for a medal but perhaps gold was probably stretching it. Expectation was subdued. But she sure as hell nearly did...purely from memory she was beaten on the home straight by Zsabo who later served a ban I recall correctly (not for failing a drug test at that race).


    Top 20 of all Irish people? Are you having a laugh..so not best (fine), not top 3 or top 5 or even top 10 but top 20!! So you would put her 11-20 on your list..I would love to see the 10 or even 19 other sports stars you would put before her.


  • Options
    #368
    sxt
    Registered Users Posts: 2,732 ✭✭✭sxt


    partyguinness wrote: »


    Top 20 of all Irish people? Are you having a laugh..so not best (fine), not top 3 or top 5 or even top 10 but top 20!! So you would put her 11-20 on your list..I would love to see the 10 or even 19 other sports stars you would put before her.

    She had the talent to be near the top. Maybe it was the Irish set up? Probably not the best? Do most countries value World and Olympic medals more than European meets. Sonia may have have been winning all those events but other countries may have been more focused on major competitions

    If Sonia o sullivan was British,she probably would have excelled. Based on results, would she be anywhere near top 100 world /Olympic athletes from UK of all time ?


  • Options
    #369
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,128 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Well Paula Radcliffe was her UK opposite and she was better than her.
    As someone said above Sonia was the dominant clean athlete of her time.


  • Options
    #370
    partyguinness
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    sxt wrote: »
    She had the talent to be near the top. Maybe it was the Irish set up? Probably not the best? Do most countries value World and Olympic medals more than European meets

    If Sonia o sullivan was British, would she be anywhere near top 100 world /Olympic athletes from UK of all time ?

    Of course she had the talent. What are on about. She is Ireland’s greatest female athlete and save for Ronnie Delaney’s gold in 1956 she would be Ireland’s greatest ever athlete. Full stop.

    The notion she might scrap into a Ireland’s top 20 is just utter horse ****.

    Who gives a **** about the UK. What type of rubbish is that. For a time in the mid 90s she was the best female middle distance runner in the world and went Into the 1996 Olympics as the overwhelming favourite. That trumps every country.


  • Options
    #371
    partyguinness
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    Water John wrote: »
    Well Paula Radcliffe was her UK opposite and she was better than her.
    As someone said above Sonia was the dominant clean athlete of her time.


    Yes. Paula Radcliffe never win an Olympic medal. Plus she was more long distance and a few years younger. They were not direct competitors.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #372
    partyguinness
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    Go and just have quick look at Sonia O’Sullivan’s wiki page and see the list of achievements.

    Nobody in Ireland comes close to her achievements and that applies across the board when compared to her peers in the 90s not just Ireland.

    How anyone can suggest she is merely top 20 in Ireland is a god damn idiot.


  • Options
    #373
    deckie66
    Registered Users Posts: 90 ✭✭deckie66


    partyguinness wrote: »
    Of course she had the talent. What are on about. She is Ireland’s greatest female athlete and save for Ronnie Delaney’s gold in 1956 she would be Ireland’s greatest ever athlete. Full stop.

    The notion she might scrap into a Ireland’s top 20 is just utter horse ****.

    Who gives a **** about the UK. What type of rubbish is that. For a time in the mid 90s she was the best female middle distance runner in the world and went Into the 1996 Olympics as the overwhelming favourite. That trumps every country.

    err . . . . .Pat O'Callaghan - Olympic gold medals in both 1928 and 1932


  • Options
    #374
    Choochtown
    Registered Users Posts: 1,268 ✭✭✭Choochtown


    partyguinness wrote: »
    In the one sense criticising the set up was fine but at the same time it was too effing late to do anything about it so it was rather pointless at that stage. So Keane should have perhaps kept it for the WC post mortem.

    I think Keane's decision to do the interview was his way to let off steam rather than letting it build up inside. If he bottled it up it he may very have exploded on the pitch and got sent off later on. It was almost theraputic.

    After the interview, the ball was in McCarthy's court and it was his decision to call the ill fated meeting.


    Keane's decision to do the interview was for the same reason he took the Villa job whilst neglecting his National team duties and the same reason he released his book the day before a crucial game and the same reason he abandoned the national team on the eve of a match to fly abroad to do punditry for ITV for a Champions League match ... MONEY


  • Options
    #375
    The Tetrarch
    Registered Users Posts: 2,092 ✭✭✭The Tetrarch


    Greyfox wrote: »
    Your having a laugh, the other 3 are only legends by Irish Standards. Keane is a legend by world standards, he's one of the best players to ever play in English football.
    Saying "You're having a laugh" is not proof.

    A legend by world standards suggests Keane was a world great.
    In the 1994 World Cup Ireland got out of the group when four teams tied on four points. Keane's comment "There was nothing to celebrate. We achieved little."
    The 1998 World Cup Ireland failed to qualify.
    The 2002 World Cup Ireland qualified. Keane threw a hissy fit.
    The 2006 World Cup. Ireland failed to qualify and Keane retired from international football to help prolong his club career.

    Keane never played league football outside Ireland, England, Scotland.
    He scored seven international goals, of which two were against Cyprus, one against Malta, one against Iceland, one against Northern Ireland.

    Gerson, Cruyff, Platini, Mattheus, Pirlo, Zidane, Iniesta would be a few I would rate as world class midfield greats.
    "Keane is a legend by world standards"? He is not.


  • Options
    #376
    castletownman
    Registered Users Posts: 11,027 ✭✭✭✭castletownman


    The Tetrarch wrote: »
    Saying "You're having a laugh" is not proof.

    A legend by world standards suggests Keane was a world great.
    In the 1994 World Cup Ireland got out of the group when four teams tied on four points. Keane's comment "There was nothing to celebrate. We achieved little."
    The 1998 World Cup Ireland failed to qualify.
    The 2002 World Cup Ireland qualified. Keane threw a hissy fit.
    The 2006 World Cup. Ireland failed to qualify and Keane retired from international football to help prolong his club career.

    Keane never played league football outside Ireland, England, Scotland.
    He scored seven international goals, of which two were against Cyprus, one against Malta, one against Iceland, one against Northern Ireland.

    Gerson, Cruyff, Platini, Mattheus, Pirlo, Zidane, Iniesta would be a few I would rate as world class midfield greats.
    "Keane is a legend by world standards"? He is not.

    I'm going to hazard a guess that you are perhaps an ABU and are thus coloured by that. Because world standards extends to club football at that level, and there were few better midfielders than Keane in his era, in terms of determination and leadership.

    All his contemporaries acknlowedge that fact, and he made United the team they were.

    And the statement that he never played league football outside of England, Ireland and Scotland is churlish. He was the best player for the best team in the Premier League for an extended period. My god, he had no ambition!!! You look at it today, when an Irish player breaks into a Premier League team its considered newsworthy.


  • Options
    #377
    The Tetrarch
    Registered Users Posts: 2,092 ✭✭✭The Tetrarch


    castletownman wrote: »
    I'm going to hazard a guess that you are perhaps an ABU and are thus coloured by that.
    Wrong. That is a weak stance to support the claim that Keane was world class.
    I put up a few players that would be considered great midfielders.

    A search on the net for great midfielders gives these ten:
    Xavi; Zidane; Zico; Charlton; Cruyff; Rijkaard; Zizinho; Laudrup; Maradona; Goggs.

    And a list of the top 50 midfielders in the world.
    https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1572011-50-greatest-midfielders-in-the-history-of-world-football

    Another list gives:
    Arturo Vidal; David Silva; Yaya Toure; Bastien Schweinsteiger; Paul Pogba; Iniesta; Eden Hazard; Luka Modric; Cesc Fabregas; Arjen Robben

    The three lists have a common factor - no Roy Keane.


  • Options
    #378
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    sxt wrote: »
    It is Roy Keane

    There is no other Irish person close. Who ever is second, is a distant second

    He is the most influential sports person in Irish sporting History, and in British football history, and one of the most influential in World soccer history

    19 major titles

    An inspirational force of nature with the guile, skill and will to win at all costs, he almost demanded it, and he inspired his team to do it. One of a very select few Irish sports persons to excel in the heat of battle.

    He literally dragged Man utd to their first Champions league win. Putting in an inspirational performance against Juventus in the the semi finals when they were looking at certain defeat against. Diego Maradona was left slack jawed at the dominance of the performance

    This is a player that would have been the first pick on any team or country in the world.

    This is a guy who played in the biggest and most competitive sport on the planet

    His legend will live on for centuries


    Influential ? Maybe in Manchester and Ireland , but the world ? Lol �� He wasn’t even Ireland’s best ever player. He will always be known for bottling it when the going got tough and allowed his personal issues get in the way (drink drink drink ) He will always be remembered for Saipan

    That Sham , Conor McGregor is more well known around the world than Keane will ever be

    Influential at what ? Man Utd 2008 team would quite possible match the 1998/1999 team man for man . The latter only had The Arsenal to worry about, where as Chelsea had risen by 2008 And Arsenal were still useful in the league .


  • Options
    #379
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    sxt wrote: »
    It is Roy Keane

    There is no other Irish person close. Who ever is second, is a distant second

    He is the most influential sports person in Irish sporting History, and in British football history, and one of the most influential in World soccer history

    19 major titles

    An inspirational force of nature with the guile, skill and will to win at all costs, he almost demanded it, and he inspired his team to do it. One of a very select few Irish sports persons to excel in the heat of battle.

    He literally dragged Man utd to their first Champions league win. Putting in an inspirational performance against Juventus in the the semi finals when they were looking at certain defeat against. Diego Maradona was left slack jawed at the dominance of the performance

    This is a player that would have been the first pick on any team or country in the world.

    This is a guy who played in the biggest and most competitive sport on the planet

    His legend will live on for centuries

    Dragged them to the final . ? Really ? Pretty sure But for Schiemeichael Heroics against Inter Milan in the QF, there’d be no semis

    Wouldn’t take a lot for Maradona to have a slack jaw , especially in those days


  • Options
    #380
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    Doctors room ghost wrote: »
    Ap McCoy

    He’s a Brit when it suits him

    Anyway, Barry Geraghty and Ruby Walsh both have vastly superior Cheltenham records despite AP starting earlier and having champion trainer Pipe as his man , before JP


  • Options
    #381
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    ratracer wrote: »
    Seán Kelly!

    Inclined to agree but he got busted twice for drugs , one of which he claims was cough syrup but ..


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #382
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    Pawwed Rig wrote: »
    Roy Keane is not even the best footballer. In this order
    1. Liam Brady
    2. Paul McGrath
    3. John Giles
    4. Roy Keane

    Ronnie Whelan is miles ahead of Roy too


  • Options
    #383
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    .anon. wrote: »
    He was from Belfast, which is in Ireland, not Britain, as can clearly be seen from aerial photographs.

    Belfast is part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. It’s British. His family were ORANGEMEN, it way less bigoted to Irish people


  • Options
    #384
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    AdrianBalboa wrote: »
    Katie Taylor has totally dominated her sport for almost twenty years but the patriarchal mainstream media and social media sites like this one will have you believe that she isn’t as important as Roy Keane or Brian O Driscoll because she has “less competition.”

    The talent pool does not exist. That’s why she dominated for so long without much of a challenge , that’s why she is doing so Well in the pros .

    Fair play to her, but we can’t pretend that there are too many genuine top class talents in her sport - should add, she had moments of good fortune in the good medal fight in London, that girl needed just another round or two to cause her more trouble

    Nothing to do with patriarchal nonsense ,


  • Options
    #385
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    ReginaldSmythV wrote: »
    It’s just a vehicle for the gambling industry. Unlike soccer, et it wouldn’t exist at all as a spectator sport without being able to bet on it.

    Football bets dominate the bookies business now a days

    So you can’t sit down and watch horse racing without a bet, that’s on you . Don’t talk for others


  • Options
    #386
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    I think Michelle Smith got a bit of a raw deal, she did win the medals but the controversy after overshadowed her achievement.

    Not really. Her success inn1994 and 1995 sports games (Words and euro championships) were considered suspicious too . GarynO’Toole was quiet vocal then and wasn’t impressed

    Her husband was dodgy and got caught ,likewise her sister in law (his sister) a Dutch swimmer


  • Options
    #387
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    py2006 wrote: »
    Hard not to look passed this young lady:

    WCsb28_j.png

    Quite easy actually

    Every great champion is remembered for who they bet and how good those fighters were . So....

    Name Katie’s best opponents , name 3, without Wikipedia


  • Options
    #388
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    partyguinness wrote: »
    I am actually going to go with Sonia O'Sullivan because it is such an individual sport.

    I cannot think of any other Irish sportsperson that dominated their sport quite like she did back in the 90s.

    Ya. Individual sports has to be how it’s determined. It’s not like Keane had bad Man Utd teams, and that Ireland team of 2001/2002 was a talented bunch .

    She did it all. Track and cross country. Euro, worlds and Olympic medals . Tough competition and a sport were doping is rife. She was at her peak in 1996 but sadly illness stopped her ,and she got dogs abuse over it ! Such is the fickleness of the so called great Irish sports fans. It was a serious achievement ,at her age to medal in 2000


  • Options
    #389
    Randy Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »
    She did not dominate her sport. Not at the elite level.

    You cannot call her a dominant female distance runner, when she went to 4 olympic games and only has one solitary silver medal to show for it.

    I'm sorry, but with the talent she had she should have achieved far more than that.

    As regards having a baby before the 2000 olympics... I'm the person who first highlighted this on the thread, and it was a massive error in judgement on her part. She was one the favourites for gold in those games, but basically blew her chances... so she only really has herself to blame on that one.

    She would certainly make any top 20 list comfortably, but she's definitely not the greatest ever. Not for me anyway.

    It at elite level? Multiple world championships at two different distances, you are waffling. Athletics is not all about the Olympics. Worlds and euros are bread and butter . She bet former And reigning Olympic Champions to win those medals .

    Time and time again, we have seen questionable results at the Olympics

    Her health robbed her of a chance to shine in 1996, coming in as a two distance world champ and euros

    2000 was a pleasant surprise


  • Options
    #390
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    B.A._Baracus wrote: »
    Agreed.
    I am not the biggest fan of his attitude but you could go to the arse end of Mongolia and someone would have heard of the MMA fighter Conor McGregor.

    he'd definitely win best known Irish scumbag arsehole


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #391
    py2006
    Registered Users Posts: 9,847 ✭✭✭py2006


    Randy Archer wrote: »
    Quite easy actually

    Every great champion is remembered for who they bet and how good those fighters were . So....

    Name Katie’s best opponents , name 3, without Wikipedia

    I think you are being a bit unfair. What she has achieved is phenomenal and may be you don't rate it because its women boxing and they aren't household names but she has fought tough opponents and won.

    She deserves a mention


Advertisement