Covid19 Part XIX-25,802 in ROI (1,753 deaths) 5,859 in NI (556 deaths) (21/07)Read OP

stephenjmcd · 13-07-2020 10:29AM

Surprising how few people actually knew this

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1282604718850744325?s=19

Eod100 · 13-07-2020 10:38AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Surprising how few people actually knew this

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1282604718850744325?s=19

Is anyone even enforcing that? If someone lied and said they were in the one place for 14 days and were travelling around the country then surely they should be fined. Even with powers of enforcement nothing seems to happen

Polar101 · 13-07-2020 10:38AM

Finland removed travel restrictions to 17 new European countries today, including Ireland. Intrestingly Czechia didn't make the list, because of the recent "surge" in cases. The criteria for making it on to the "green" list is less than 8 cases per 100,000 people. The obvious problem with this kind of criteria is that data from some countries wouldn't be the most reliable, for example China is on the green list as they generally report almost zero cases.

https://yle.fi/uutiset/osasto/news/finland_reopens_borders_with_28_countries/11445419

MickeyLeari · 13-07-2020 10:38AM

Goldengirl wrote: »

Some feel that the HEPA filtration on planes is good enough to filter everything .
I don't think so . Only larger particles and droplets , not viruses.
And only some planes have the state of the art filtration system .
Don't know for sure but would imagine your average bucket flight on a cheap airline would not have the best system .
Might be worth checking before you fly .

I thought viruses travel in droplets??

This is quite comprehensive. https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/sites/default/files/documents/EASA-ECDC_COVID-19_Operational-guidelines-for-management-of-passengers-issue-2.pdf

Plumbthedepths · 13-07-2020 10:39AM

caveat emptor wrote: »

We are going to have eradicate this. Can we just get on with it so we can get back to normal.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/12/immunity-to-covid-19-could-be-lost-in-months-uk-study-suggests

Eradication is not possible, suppressing the virus is all we an do and manage cases.

ednwireland · 13-07-2020 10:43AM

caveat emptor wrote: »

We are going to have eradicate this. Can we just get on with it so we can get back to normal.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/12/immunity-to-covid-19-could-be-lost-in-months-uk-study-suggests

garbage form the press again. all these studies are prelimenary results, it takes several months to get a peer reviewed paper accepted and published. ive stopped taking any notice of what the press reports because it could be the exact opposite by a different group of researchers next week.

MickeyLeari · 13-07-2020 10:44AM

Eod100 wrote: »

Is anyone even enforcing that? If someone lied and said they were in the one place for 14 days and were travelling around the country then surely they should be fined. Even with powers of enforcement nothing seems to happen

The reality is that most people arriving in an Irish airport either live here or are staying with family who live here. They are not travelling around the country and quite a few are actually restricting movement in accordance with the guidelines.

Fining tourists who are travelling around the country will not be easy. I would rather that we haver clear unambiguous rules based on risk rather than the current situation whereby Irish based people are being guilted/discouraged not to travel to relatively safe countries while people can arrive here from high risk jurisdictions (although numbers are low).

caveat emptor · 13-07-2020 10:45AM

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Eradication is not possible, suppressing the virus is all we an do and manage cases.

Well economically speaking.
When you have to impose rolling lockdowns to prevent economic damage year after year there comes a point that governments need to look beyond the immediate election horizon.

It makes sense I'm afraid.

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/08-05-2020-commemorating-smallpox-eradication-a-legacy-of-hope-for-covid-19-and-other-diseases

The declaration marked the end of a disease that had plagued humanity for at least 3 000 years, killing 300 million people in the 20th century alone.

It was ended, thanks to a 10-year global effort, spearheaded by the World Health Organization, that involved thousands of health workers around the world to administer half a billion vaccinations to stamp out smallpox.

The US$ 300m price-tag to eradicate smallpox saves the world well over US$ 1 billion every year since 1980.

cnocbui · 13-07-2020 11:02AM

Strazdas wrote: »

Interesting report from the Irish Times from Dublin Airport this morning, but according to their reporter, most of the people on board incoming US flights were Irish citizens or residents.

There seems to be a lot of hysterical commentary on Twitter about thousands of American tourists arriving.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/us-passengers-fly-into-dublin-i-m-here-for-six-days-i-guess-i-ll-have-to-stay-inside-1.4302719

Haven't you watched any zombie movies? It only takes one.

Away With The Fairies · 13-07-2020 11:05AM

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Eradication is not possible, suppressing the virus is all we an do and manage cases.

New Zealand was so close to it. It was imported cases that brought it back into their country.

So yes eradication is possible.

MickeyLeari · 13-07-2020 11:09AM

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

New Zealand was so close to it. It was imported cases that brought it back into their country.

So yes eradication is possible.

Correct but we will need to:

a) Build a wall between Ireland and Northern Ireland.
b) Ban all passenger flights and ferries.
c) Ban repatriation of Irish citizens into Ireland.

Away With The Fairies · 13-07-2020 11:13AM

MickeyLeari wrote: »

Correct but we will need to:

a) Build a wall between Ireland and Northern Ireland.
b) Ban all passenger flights and ferries.
c) Ban repatriation of Irish citizens into Ireland.

Northern Ireland is also doing good. We need to work together in the fight of this.

We don't need to ban flights and ferries or ban Irish coming back. We need mandatory quarantine for people coming into the country, none of this self-isolation sh!t.

Ficheall · 13-07-2020 11:14AM

MickeyLeari wrote: »

Correct but we will need to:

a) Build a wall between Ireland and Northern Ireland.
b) Ban all passenger flights and ferries.
c) Ban repatriation of Irish citizens into Ireland.

Imposing mandatory quarantine or just telling Americans to f*ck off would be a good first step.

mloc123 · 13-07-2020 11:18AM

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

Northern Ireland is also doing good. We need to work together in the fight of this.

We don't need to ban flights and ferries or ban Irish coming back. We need mandatory quarantine for people coming into the country, none of this self-isolation sh!t.

How did mandatory quarantine work out in Australia? Who would guess, packing people together into quarantine hotels would actually create clusters...

ChikiChiki · 13-07-2020 11:27AM

Anyone hear that piece on Sarah McInerney there??

FFS, reported that people traveled from all over and attended a house party in Killarney at a rented house and one of the tools that attended tested positive for Covid-19 the day before attending the party.

Plumbthedepths · 13-07-2020 11:29AM

caveat emptor wrote: »

Well economically speaking.
When you have to impose rolling lockdowns to prevent economic damage year after year there comes a point that governments need to look beyond the immediate election horizon.

It makes sense I'm afraid.

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/08-05-2020-commemorating-smallpox-eradication-a-legacy-of-hope-for-covid-19-and-other-diseases

I have no interest in a two and fro with you as I had this conversation further back in the thread. What you are proposing won't happen it is not just economically damaging but the societal damage is also huge plus there is also that small matter of the six counties.

13-07-2020 11:35AM

mloc123 wrote: »

How did mandatory quarantine work out in Australia? Who would guess, packing people together into quarantine hotels would actually create clusters...

And those people out in the community would also create clusters.

Quarantining has been really effective in the countries that implemented it. The fact I can return to Ireland and realistically do what I want isn't good.

stephenjmcd · 13-07-2020 11:35AM

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

Northern Ireland is also doing good. We need to work together in the fight of this.

We don't need to ban flights and ferries or ban Irish coming back. We need mandatory quarantine for people coming into the country, none of this self-isolation sh!t.

Mandatory isn't going to happen. Attorney general advice to government has been and continues to be that legally its extremely difficult

stephenjmcd · 13-07-2020 11:36AM

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Anyone hear that piece on Sarah McInerney there??

FFS, reported that people traveled from all over and attended a house party in Killarney at a rented house and one of the tools that attended tested positive for Covid-19 the day before attending the party.

Been in the news since late last week.

Eod100 · 13-07-2020 11:37AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Mandatory isn't going to happen. Attorney general advice to government has been and continues to be that legally its extremely difficult

I think that excuse is used when they don't want to do something. I'm sure if there was a will they could at least have a fine like UK.

Drumpot · 13-07-2020 11:37AM

Don’t some asian places have some sort of scanning device in shops?

So could we not make it mandatory to download COVID app for anybody living or coming into the country? Have a lot of shops (certainly popular shops) have these scanners that maybe do random checks on shoppers and if you don’t the app you get in trouble?

There is mostly compliance to these things (the threat is enough for most people), yoh will always hey inconsiderate morons putting everybody else at risk for their own pleasure but I think this would mostly be followed.

Maybe this isn’t feasible but we need to have a compromise while there is no vaccine if we want to open up the economy and allow travel in/out. Why is there no talk of how we adapt, everything seems to be open or close....

Zonda999 · 13-07-2020 11:37AM

Goldengirl wrote: »

Some feel that the HEPA filtration on planes is good enough to filter everything .
I don't think so . Only larger particles and droplets , not viruses.
And only some planes have the state of the art filtration system .
Don't know for sure but would imagine your average bucket flight on a cheap airline would not have the best system .
Might be worth checking before you fly .

The jury seems to be out but I haven't seen any media reports pointing out planes as a particular issue, surely at this point there would have heard if planes were a particular issue, passenger aircraft have been flying throughout this thing around the world.

https://simpleflying.com/hepa-filters/

The above article goes through how HEPA filters work, in theory they should be very effective at stopping the virus but at the same time even with masks I imagine there is still arisk to people sitting immediately next to someone with the virus on a flight of a few hours

Most common passenger aircraft appear to have these filters with the exception of some small regional aircraft, I have no doubt that of the current fleet of European passenger aircraft, 99% would have HEPA filters. The Boeing 737 (Ryanair use) and Airbus A320 series (Aer Lingus use) have them for sure and these are the two most common short haul passenger aircraft in the world.

snotboogie · 13-07-2020 11:38AM

caveat emptor wrote: »

We are going to have eradicate this. Can we just get on with it so we can get back to normal.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/12/immunity-to-covid-19-could-be-lost-in-months-uk-study-suggests

More sensationalist headlines. It is absolutely standard for antibody level to drop off in the months after fighting off a virus. This is assumed in most of the vaccine trials.

Zonda999 · 13-07-2020 11:40AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Mandatory isn't going to happen. Attorney general advice to government has been and continues to be that legally its extremely difficult

I think political will would go a long way here, would people really be pushing to send any new law in this area to the Supreme Court in order to challenge it? I very much doubt it.

Its futile at this point though I think, if any action hasn;t been done by now then I doubt it will be.

snotboogie · 13-07-2020 11:41AM

MickeyLeari wrote: »

Correct but we will need to:

a) Build a wall between Ireland and Northern Ireland. Reach an agreement with Northern Ireland to work together
b) Ban all passenger flights and ferries. Enforce mandatory 14 day quarantines for all people entering the country
c) Ban repatriation of Irish citizens into Ireland. Enforce mandatory 14 day quarantines for all people entering the country

Fixed for you

stephenjmcd · 13-07-2020 11:43AM

Zonda999 wrote: »

I think political will would go a long way here, would people really be pushing to send any new law in this area to the Supreme Court in order to challenge it? I very much doubt it.

Its futile at this point though I think, if any action hasn;t been done by now then I doubt it will be.

You'll always get some idiot who will, the likes of Gemma etc

Drumpot · 13-07-2020 11:45AM

Zonda999 wrote: »

The jury seems to be out but I haven't seen any media reports pointing out planes as a particular issue, surely at this point there would have heard if planes were a particular issue, passenger aircraft have been flying throughout this thing around the world.

https://simpleflying.com/hepa-filters/

The above article goes through how HEPA filters work, in theory they should be very effective at stopping the virus but at the same time even with masks I imagine there is still arisk to people sitting immediately next to someone with the virus on a flight of a few hours

Most common passenger aircraft appear to have these filters with the exception of some small regional aircraft, I have no doubt that of the currently fleet of European passenger aircraft, 99% would ahve HEPA filters. The Boeing 737 (Ryanair use) and Airbus A320 series (Aer Lingus use) have them for sure and these are the two most short haul passenger aircraft in the world.

Being in close proximity in an enclosed environment increases your chances of contracting the virus. I’d love to see scientific peer review evidence of how effective these filtration systems are with regards to COVID. I’d be very cynical of why this information isn’t available. Surely it’s in airlines interest to prove beyond doubt that planes are safe, if these filtration systems were as effective as being implied, they would be promoting the results of tests all over the place.

But there’s not just planes when it comes to travel. It’s getting to and from airports. Interacting with countless different people from all corners of the world, sometimes just getting connecting flights with no capacity to trace when a person gets infected in an airport.

Like schools, airports/planes are a vital part of economies and our way of living. I don’t think we will find definitive evidence that proves they are safe. We will just get ambiguous statements about them being safe, probably any snippets of information that suggests they aren’t so bad will be loudly promoted and maybe some anecdotal evidence that tries to herd us into accepting its grand.

Rob A. Bank · 13-07-2020 11:46AM

A cautionary tale

State of Victoria, Australia (pop 6,630 million).

That population is comparable to the island of Ireland and like us the virus was under good control until just recently.

Then illicit sex between private guards and quarantined travelers plus passing around a cigarette lighter leads to… what looks like the beginning of exponential growth.

d8bf180c-f313-4cfc-a952-d1431f45fc7a?published=1594002895891

d8bf180c-f313-4cfc-a952-d1431f45fc7a?published=1594002895891

The virus found a small weakness in their excellent defenses and exploited it.

Yet we allow people from virus ridden hot-spots like Texas to roam free around our country.

And the only assurance we get is that the cabinet might discuss it next week.

FFS

13-07-2020 11:50AM

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

A cautionary tale

State of Victoria, Australia (pop 6,630 million).

That population is comparable to the island of Ireland and like us the virus was under good control until just recently.

Then illicit sex between private guards and quarantined travelers plus passing around a cigarette lighter leads to… what looks like the beginning of exponential growth.

The virus found a small weakness in their excellent defenses and exploited it.

Yet we allow people from virus ridden hot-spots like Texas to roam free around our country.

And the only assurance we get is that the cabinet might discuss it next week.

FFS

If it doesn't spike a lot in Ireland, there must be immunity and way bigger spread than currently thought.

Away With The Fairies · 13-07-2020 11:51AM

mloc123 wrote: »

How did mandatory quarantine work out in Australia? Who would guess, packing people together into quarantine hotels would actually create clusters...

The Australians are thick as fcuk if what they say is true. Security getting the ride from diseased fcukers.

Covid19 Part XIX-25,802 in ROI (1,753 deaths) 5,859 in NI (556 deaths) (21/07)Read OP

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