The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

paulie21 · 06-07-2020 06:56PM

Looks like the Chiefs and Mahomes have agreed on a 10 year deal through 2031

Mr. Guappa · 06-07-2020 06:58PM

The Chiefs and Patrick Mahomes have agreed to a TEN year extension according to Adam Schefter! The detail on this one will be interesting.

el Fenomeno · 06-07-2020 07:00PM

On one hand, it's smart from KC given that the price for QBs will only continue to rise.

On the other, contracts are pretty meaningless given the number of holdouts looking for bigger deals. Lets see how willing Mahomes is to stick to the agreed terms when halfway through his contract he finds he's no longer a top 10 paid QB.

06-07-2020 07:02PM

Surely the contract is awash with clauses.

Foxtrol · 06-07-2020 07:06PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Surely the contract is awash with clauses.

That or an agreed percentage of the cap rather than a specific dollar value. Alternatively having nearly the whole things guaranteed might make it understandable.

If not his agent has done him a terrible disservice.

Itssoeasy · 06-07-2020 08:41PM

The length of the contact and the alleged amount is all well and good and makes for good headlines but the devil is in the detail.

The_Honeybadger · 06-07-2020 08:53PM

Good for him and the Chiefs. He deserves that big contract, can’t imagine that he’d sign anything that puts him in a compromised position down the road.

What are they going to do with Chris Jones, he is saying he won’t play on the tag by all accounts and surely they can’t afford to pay him now? Mahomes was always going to be the priority but it would leave a big hole in the middle of their defence if they have to trade Jones away.

Foxtrol · 06-07-2020 09:26PM

If the current leaks are true then the Chiefs have an absolute steal and the agent fired on the spot.

Even saying that, it still really hurts teams that will be negotiating with QBs for over the next few years. Dak's price probably went up a bit again.

Foxtrol · 06-07-2020 10:14PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

If the current leaks are true then the Chiefs have an absolute steal and the agent fired on the spot.

Even saying that, it still really hurts teams that will be negotiating with QBs for over the next few years. Dak's price probably went up a bit again.

Rapoport coming out now with a much better sounding deal than Schefter's tweets earlier. Presumably Schefter was from the team while Rapoport the player.

I wonder who is getting the better info.

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1280261912568172553?s=20

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1280245527955812354?s=20

Blut2 · 06-07-2020 10:16PM

$400mn is a hell of a lot of money. I would wonder how smart the deal will be looking from Mahome's POV in 5 or 7 years time though, if QB salaries continue to inflate every year. I'll be curious to see the details to see how much is guaranteed, if the yearly salary increases with time etc.

raze_them_all_ · 06-07-2020 11:29PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

If the current leaks are true then the Chiefs have an absolute steal and the agent fired on the spot.

Even saying that, it still really hurts teams that will be negotiating with QBs for over the next few years. Dak's price probably went up a bit again.

Don't see it helping any qbs bar maybe the Ravens. Mahomes is the only qb to win mvo and superbowl under 25. Dak is delusional if he thinks he's worth the se as mahomes

Xavi6 · 07-07-2020 01:53AM

I am very happy at the prospect of another 12 years with Mahomes under centre.

MileHighGuy · 07-07-2020 08:31AM

Xavi6 wrote: »

I am very happy at the prospect of another 12 years with Mahomes under centre.

I can't see KC adopting a pro style offense with his skill set. He's far more dangerous in the shotgun imo

MileHighGuy · 07-07-2020 08:36AM

Blut2 wrote: »

$400mn is a hell of a lot of money. I would wonder how smart the deal will be looking from Mahome's POV in 5 or 7 years time though, if QB salaries continue to inflate every year. I'll be curious to see the details to see how much is guaranteed, if the yearly salary increases with time etc.

Yip, the Devil is in the details, but from first view it looks like a great deal for the Chiefs imo.

Great, 12 more years of Patrick Mahomes in the AFC West! But in fairness, he was never really going to be let go anywhere.

thomond2006 · 07-07-2020 08:50AM

The guarantees seem to be rolling ones where in the first few years the year n+2 salary is guaranteed on the 3rd league day of year n.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/patrick-mahomes-21751/

Foxtrol · 07-07-2020 01:47PM

raze_them_all_ wrote: »

Don't see it helping any qbs bar maybe the Ravens. Mahomes is the only qb to win mvo and superbowl under 25. Dak is delusional if he thinks he's worth the se as mahomes

That would be delusional but no one is making that argument...

The more QB deals that are made the worse it is for the Cowboys as they have shown that there is no sign of the QB market cooling. They'd have gotten Dak significantly cheaper if they'd made the deal prior to the deals the last 2 off seasons.

A rising tide lifts all boats. The top paying QB average per year yesterday went up nearly 30% from this ($35m to $45m) and now 9 QBs have average per year of $30m+.

Even if you just look at the impact to the franchise tag, once the more aggressive years of Mahomes' deal kicks in it will cause a few million increase to the cost in tagging a player, which generally has a knock on impact on what contract a player is willing to accept.

No player in the near term is going to be 'worth' the same as Mahomes, it doesn't stop this contract from increasing what they'll be able to demand.

Foxtrol · 07-07-2020 01:56PM

thomond2006 wrote: »

The guarantees seem to be rolling ones where in the first few years the year n+2 salary is guaranteed on the 3rd league day of year n.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/patrick-mahomes-21751/

I don't like the deal length for Mahomes to maximise his value but that guarantee structure really gives him a lot of protection.

Barring Chiefs deciding to blow everything up, they're basically unable to get rid of him. In a situation where they'd try he'd get a huge payout and their cap crippled.

eagle eye · 08-07-2020 01:26AM

This is a bar deal for Mahomes because it's likely he'll be surpassed by a few before he's halfway into this contract. It's a bad deal for the Chiefs because Mahomes has already been injured a couple of times and if he gets a bad one they are stuck in cap hell.

Podge_irl · 08-07-2020 07:19AM

eagle eye wrote: »

This is a bar deal for Mahomes because it's likely he'll be surpassed by a few before he's halfway into this contract. It's a bad deal for the Chiefs because Mahomes has already been injured a couple of times and if he gets a bad one they are stuck in cap hell.

You can't treat both those things in isolation.

eagle eye · 08-07-2020 08:34AM

Podge_irl wrote:

You can't treat both those things in isolation.

I can give my opinion on why it's a bad deal for both sides.

adrian522 · 08-07-2020 08:43AM

eagle eye wrote: »

This is a bar deal for Mahomes because it's likely he'll be surpassed by a few before he's halfway into this contract.

This is true of every QB deal. He is earning $10M more than Wilson per year right now. Realistically the Chiefs cannot afford to pay him more than they are without compromising the rest of their team.

eagle eye wrote: »

It's a bad deal for the Chiefs because Mahomes has already been injured a couple of times and if he gets a bad one they are stuck in cap hell.

Well not really. Unless he gets a serious injury in the next 3 years. After that his Dead Money hit would only be $4m in 2023, $2m in 2024 and nothing from then on.

Again this is pretty much the same for any big money QB contract, there is always that risk.

MrKingsley · 08-07-2020 09:51AM

No one really knows what language is used in the contract.

What we do know is that the Chiefs are set at QB for the next 12 years (Injuries are a risk with every single contract) and that Mahomes is set for life. I can easily see why both parties got it done

StringerBell · 08-07-2020 10:22AM

It depends on the detail of the contract of course but I wouldn't be convinced its a good deal for the Chiefs at all, for Mahomes of course it looks very good and if it does happen that QB salaries shoot up and eclipse his money he will likely be able to renegotiate but either way he is going to be a very rich man so how much is enough? My concern for the team would be how much of an impact this is going to have on them in terms of cap space come 4/5 years down the line and what get outs do they have if he goes down injured which can happen anytime especially with the mobile QBs who like to run.

adrian522 · 08-07-2020 11:05AM

The details are available on the contract. In the unlikely event that the Chiefs want to move on from Mahomes they can do so relatively cheaply after 2022.

For Mahomes his salary looks pretty solid for the next 5-7 years, after that you'd expect them to restructure.

For example the cap hit in 2027 is nearly $60m so you would imagine that a restructure would happen at that point if not before.

https://chiefswire.usatoday.com/2020/07/07/kansas-city-chiefs-qb-patrick-mahomes-contract-breakdown-base-salary-bonus-salary-cap/#:~:text=Kansas%20City%20Chiefs%20quarterback%20Patrick,in%20the%20event%20of%20injury.

Podge_irl · 08-07-2020 11:53AM

eagle eye wrote: »

I can give my opinion on why it's a bad deal for both sides.

No, what you've done is highlight the trade offs for both parties, ignoring the fact that the downside for one is the upside for the other. The entire point of negotiations will be trade off longevity, guarantees, remuneration and risk. The Chiefs open themselves up to a cap hit if he gets injured. Mahomes risks becoming undervalued due to longevity of the contract. However, the guarantees he has offset his injury risk. The longevity of the contract and set salary offset the injury risk for the Chiefs.

eagle eye · 08-07-2020 12:55PM

Podge_irl wrote:

No, what you've done is highlight the trade offs for both parties, ignoring the fact that the downside for one is the upside for the other. The entire point of negotiations will be trade off longevity, guarantees, remuneration and risk. The Chiefs open themselves up to a cap hit if he gets injured. Mahomes risks becoming undervalued due to longevity of the contract. However, the guarantees he has offset his injury risk. The longevity of the contract and set salary offset the injury risk for the Chiefs.

No I've given my opinion looking at it from both sides separately.

Foxtrol · 08-07-2020 02:53PM

adrian522 wrote: »

Well not really. Unless he gets a serious injury in the next 3 years. After that his Dead Money hit would only be $4m in 2023, $2m in 2024 and nothing from then on.

Again this is pretty much the same for any big money QB contract, there is always that risk.

I don't think what you're saying here is accurate. The dead money hit isn't showing currently because the rolling guarantees haven't been met but they will kick in a year or two prior to the dates you mention.

Using your example, per the released contract details on the 3rd day of the 2021 league year Mahomes' 2023 salary and bonuses will become fully guaranteed. Also, on the 3rd day of the 2022 league year all of Mahomes 2024 compensation will become fully guaranteed.

If they decided to cut him in the offseason after the prior to 2023 league starting, the dead money isn't $4m, it'll be more like $81m because Mahomes' 2023 and 2024 compensation will already guaranteed.

Those cap sites will update their dead cap numbers when the guarantees are met during the contract and the Chiefs become liable. It is a tough contract to get out of for the Chiefs and it might be a direction more big players try to go with their contracts.

Podge_irl · 08-07-2020 02:53PM

eagle eye wrote: »

No I've given my opinion looking at it from both sides separately.

Selling a house is a bad deal, because then you no longer own the property.
Buying a house is a bad deal, because then you no longer have the money.

This is essentially what you've just done. It makes absolutely no sense to look at both sides separately.

You can basically flip your exact points and claim its a great deal for both parties:

This is a good deal for the Chiefs because it locks down their QB for a long period of time and potentially at good value.
This is a good deal for Mahomes because it comes with a good structure of guarantees to offset any problems in the future.

08-07-2020 05:01PM

I don't see why 'winning' the deal is so important anyway. He gets a horse load of money and they get a top QB - great.

helimachoptor · 09-07-2020 09:00AM

And no ones considering the amount of money he's gonna make from endorsements

The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

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