Madeleine McCann

Tristen Hissing Typhoon wrote: »

I've already said it was poor judgement, the children were left unattended or unaccompanied for a period of time with people checking in on them intermittently. This is not abandonment or neglect or whatever hyperbolic over dramatic term you want to use. The parents have addressed this numerous times, they were a short distance away, they felt the children were safe and they were checking in on them. They've said that they regret this decision and realise it was a mistake. I can't understand how people keep harping on about this time and time again.

But the checks were lied about, they were few and far between according to the restaurant staff. The last 'check' involved a friend going into the apartment but not going into the bedroom allegedly.

Why anyone would ruin a perfectly good evening out with all that hassle instead of just paying the babysitter is beyond me, but there you go.

Tristen Hissing Typhoon wrote: »

Would everybody here pass the same purity test or better yet, would your own parents pass that purity test?

Well nobody is perfect but I was never left on my own on holiday as a child. I wasn't left home alone for any length of time until I was a teenager, it's a pretty crappy way to treat a toddler and 2 babies to be fair.

I doubt the parents left their credit cards or money in the flat. And even if they did leave valuables there, ironic that no valuables or passports etc. were reported as stolen, since the current potential suspect/perpetrator was apparently an opportunistic burglar aswell.

So they left their three kids under the age of three alone night after night, and then one night, one of them is gone.

Think about that.

Such a bizarre case entirely. Still not sure if either of the parents were involved in her disappearance, but they were responsible for it. And forget about telling me that the "abductor" was responsible, he wouldn't have been if the kids had been properly looked after. No excuses will work for me on that front anymore. I could forgive a one off, but not night after night TBH.

Speculation is the only thing left now, since the current suspect doesn't seem to be generating any traction, with due respect to those whom he defiled etc.

Rock77 wrote: »

I have been thinking about this a lot recently and as you know I do not think the parents were involved and I feel so sorry for them and Madeleine. Their behaviour contributed massively to the disappearance of their child and their minds must be tortured about that daily..

I always assumed she was abducted, however.....

If she wandered out of the apt and was then taken I would be a lot less sympathetic to the parents. I don’t think it was ok to leave them but I can understand they thought it was ok at the time but the least they could have done is made sure the kids couldn’t get out of bed and leave the apt.(although Kate said the kids couldn’t open the door)

You have said a couple of times now ‘I doubt they left their credit cards or money in the flat’ can I just say what a disgusting comment that is. Absolutely no need for it. You said yourself you are not sure the parents were involved but you think insinuating they would rather their child was taken instead of their money is ok?

These people lost their daughter, probably to a child predator..

The point I was making regarding NOT leaving money or cards in the flat was that it seemed to me that those things were more valuable than their little children. That's all.

Leave the emotion out of it and look at it coldly.

Everyone's view is valid now.

marklazarcovic wrote: »

No I'm saying they should be charged with reckless endangerment or the equivalent.. as there is n
Zero evidence of a abduction the only people we know who had opportunity were the parents,they just walk away...yes terrible loss for them if innocent,but what if not innocent,a child is still missing because of them ..that's the bottom line,unless proven otherwise,they were responsible.

That’s extremely disingenuous to say the parents were the only ones with an opportunity, particularly when not one person has been able to come up with a conclusive timeline in which the parents could have done it anyway.

One of the most common theories is that they were being watched, their apartment was accessible from the street and they left the door unlocked.
It was common knowledge around the hotel that a group of Brits were leaving their kids alone while they dined every night, and they booked the same table at the same restaurant for the same time every night to facilitate this.
Again, common knowledge among hotel staff.

The general area was rife with rapists, sex attackers pedophiles and other degenerates at that time.
All it would take would be one person noticing their routine and taking their opportunity to take Madeleine in between checks.
There is plenty of evidence to support her being abducted if you are open to it.

I also find it really interesting that people say they should be punished because they ‘got away with’ neglecting their child.
They have been abused, slandered and criticised by people on forums, social media and the press for the last 13 years. All sorts of abhorrent unfounded accusations have been made against them, from Gerry being a kiddie fiddler to Kate being a member of a satanic cult and being a schizophrenic.
They have been judged in the court of public opinion, take a look under any news article about Madeleine on FB and the vitriol towards them comes out instantly.
They have to live with this, along with the knowledge that their actions lead to their child being taken, every single day.
I honestly can’t think of a worse punishment and I would get no joy in rubbing salt in their very much open wound by insisting they be legally prosecuted along with having their lives completely ruined. Their family will never ever recover from this.

There is zero evidence that they are responsible for Madeleine disappearing, and the only person who should be charged for her disappearance is the person who took her.

callmehal wrote: »

What's the evidence supporting that she was abducted?

As of now, there's more evidence against the McCanns than anyone else.

No there isn't. There is no evidence of anything beyond a child being missing.

Rock77 wrote: »

I know that’s what you meant and you can of course say whatever you like, and of course everyone’s view is valid.

However saying things like you did, implying they would rather their child taken than their money is a terrible thing to say.

These people probably had their child snatched by a paedophile, they and their friends left all of their kids home alone. They checked on them through the evening, they weren’t far from them. They were in holiday mode, they were more relaxed than usual. They made what turned out to be a grave error of judgement.

I’d say they brought their money/credit cards to pay for their food and drinks.

Or would you think they said ‘Gerry, don’t leave your wallet here in case someone breaks in, they can just take a child, Sure we have 3’

I would never ever think of leaving my three children under the age of three alone in a strange place either. What about nappy changes, and waking in the night and all that,I would want to be there to comfort them and make sure they were safe.

But I suppose I am one of the difficult ones in your eyes. I can see the possible dangers and abductors would not have entered my head either.

The only word we know now is PROBABLY.

callmehal wrote: »

There's more evidence against the McCanns than anyone. The dogs finding the scent of death in numerous places, the lies, the deleted phone records etc.

No hard evidence of course but more on them than anyone else.

The dogs didn't find the scent of death anywhere, or blood, at any 'crime' scene they were brought in on after retiring from the UK police force. They did bark a lot.

The deleted phone records are accounted for by the Portuguese investigators in their files. You can delete something from your phone, but not from the records of your network provider who keep everything except the contents of voice and text messages (supposedly). If I recall, Gerry said he deleted a multitude of messages telling him voice mail messages had been left and that when the PJ checked, there were indeed a multitude of txt messages sent to his phone from one or more Vodafone numbers. Nothing suspicious was found in the Network records.

Inconsistencies in witness statements are normal, their absence would actually be abnormal. They don't mean people are lying, so much as having inaccurate memories. Stress adversely affects recall, which I think is why Gerry thought he was yakking on one side of the road when it was probably the other. His memory was faulty, he wasn't lying.

There is no evidence.

callmehal wrote: »

So your claim "There is plenty of evidence to support her being abducted if you are open to it", was completely false. You can't list any evidence to support that?

As has been pointed out to you, there is no hard evidence but the dogs, the lies, the deleting of records etc is more than against the McCanns than anyone else.

I just listed it, I’m not typing it out for a third time because you are choosing to ignore it.
A brief synopsis: unsupervised, unlocked apartment with roadside access, the fact that a bunch of kids were being left unattended by a gang of Brits every night was common knowledge with hotel staff, the area was rife with pedophiles & sex attackers.
13 sets of unidentified fingerprints, hundreds of samples of unidentified hair, and an unpreserved crime scene meaning any evidence left behind was completely destroyed.
Not to mention the biggest issue of all: there is no conclusive timeline in which they did it. You haven’t even offered up one.

Nothing still means nothing.
You can’t keep listing the dogs as proof when you are quite aware that a) they have been completely wrong before and b) there was no physical evidence to support their false positive.
So that still equals nothing. Repeating it over and over doesn’t change that.

The McCanns were investigated and no charges were brought against them. Why would they continuously draw attention to themselves over and over by keeping the case in the public eye if they were responsible?

I’m still waiting to hear your rough timeline of events? What do you think happened?

Rock77 wrote: »

Em.... what? When did I say you were an abductor? When did I say it would be ok to leave your kids alone? When did I say you were a difficult one? What on Earth are you talking about.

So do you stand by your comment that the McCann parents would prefer their child was taken instead of their money?

Yes.