Madeleine McCann

foxyladyxx

MOD NOTE: There was a lot of discussion on the Madeleine McCann case in the "If you could solve three cases" thread so I moved all of those posts into their own thread.

As always, be respectful to all involved.

goat2 wrote: »

I have also read on jon benet case, and don't believe the brother did it

Maddie Mccanne, I believe was snatched by some child sex ring,

Tina Satchwell, lie detector will do

Maddie McCann is dead .She died on holiday with her parents. . possibly accidently but it was covered up . .I can provide proof of that.

Listen to the recent tapes of Jon Benet Ramsey's brother. .He is well dodgy, I need to read more but I do think authorities there believe it was the son who killed her.

Foweva Awone

Something Else

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Maddie McCann is dead .She died on holiday with her parents. . possibly accidently but it was covered up . .I can provide proof of that.

LOL you should probably go to the police with that proof.

TheQuietFella

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Maddie McCann is dead .She died on holiday with her parents. . possibly accidently but it was covered up . .I can provide proof of that.

I believe that to be true also but where is your proof?

rovertom

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Maddie McCann is dead .She died on holiday with her parents. . possibly accidently but it was covered up . .I can provide proof of that.

Proof. I doubt it.

smelly sock

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

TheQuietFella wrote: »

I believe that to be true also but where is your proof?

Being a parent i dont think any mother or father could knowingly cover it up and act it out for all these years.

I would say the child was snatched. Any of the missing kids cases is heart breaking.

TheQuietFella

smelly sock wrote: »

Being a parent i dont think any mother or father could knowingly cover it up and act it out for all these years.

I would say the child was snatched. Any of the missing kids cases is heart breaking.

I agree with your first point but something to my eye just doesn't sit right!
Not that I'm an expect in criminal analysis by the way but they seem to be hiding something! Skipping around some issues.

foxyladyxx

Foweva Awone wrote: »

LOL you should probably go to the police with that proof.

Police have all the proof they want but can't touch them,

foxyladyxx

smelly sock wrote: »

Being a parent i dont think any mother or father could knowingly cover it up and act it out for all these years.

I would say the child was snatched. Any of the missing kids cases is heart breaking.

Two doctors would be struck off the medical register if any trace of sedation was found in the body. The body was disposed of for some reason.

Injuries to the body would also result in similar action being taken,

smelly sock

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Two doctors would be struck off the medical register if any trace of sedation was found in the body. The body was disposed of for some reason.

Injuries to the body would also result in similar action being taken,

Stop it. It was there child. Behave. I think if something accidental happened and they knew keeping up this act would be the last thing they would do. They would surely just go quietly and let everyone forget.

goat2

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Maddie McCann is dead .She died on holiday with her parents. . possibly accidently but it was covered up . .I can provide proof of that.

Listen to the recent tapes of Jon Benet Ramsey's brother. .He is well dodgy, I need to read more but I do think authorities there believe it was the son who killed her.

Where is the proof, if you can prove it, would love to see it

RhubarbCrumble

I agree with everyone saying Madeline McCann's parents were somehow involved.
The bit that really irks me is to do with the other two children. They went out and left 3 tiny children on their own in a foreign country, but because they were both doctors and seen as 'upper class' nothing was ever done.
I'm sure if an unemployed couple from a council estate had done the same thing their other children would have been taken into care almost immediately.

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

RhubarbCrumble wrote: »

I agree with everyone saying Madeline McCann's parents were somehow involved.
The bit that really irks me is to do with the other two children. They went out and left 3 tiny children on their own in a foreign country, but because they were both doctors and seen as 'upper class' nothing was ever done.
I'm sure if an unemployed couple from a council estate had done the same thing their other children would have been taken into care almost immediately.

I dont know how involved or if at all they were but they sure made it easy for anyone to take Madeleine .Having seen the location with my own eyes I can bet my last euro that they would not have left their credit cards on the table in that apartment that night . In fact they were lucky not all three were taken if the perpetrator was an opportunist . The apartment could not be seen from the Tapas bar unless you had super vision and stood in a chair eating your dinner , and then only the one side of it . The steps to the sliding door were openly accessable from a public road and the three kids were neglectefully left in a high risk , dangerous position . Shame on anyone who would do that for a quiet dinner .

Aisling(",)

I obviously don't know what happened but I think if they had accidentally killed her and disposed of the body they'd have stopped campaigning as fervently as they have been.

Pauliedragon

How would 2 people in unfamiliar surroundings know enough about the area to dump a body and it still hasn't turned up 11 years later?

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Pauliedragon wrote: »

How would 2 people in unfamiliar surroundings know enough about the area to dump a body and it still hasn't turned up 11 years later?

I tend to agree with that . But equally baffling is not one single clue left anywhere . Not one hint , not one sighting , nothing at all .
Personally I think it was an inside job then it was a glaring pattern how the kids were left defenceless and at risk .
The front door ( far side away from the Tapas bar ) was shaded by trees and dark and not immediately seen by a passer by . A car could pull in , take a child and be gone in minutes . And away into the remote country to the north and gone before she was ever missed

fixXxer

Has anyone come across a podcast that actually goes in depth on this case?

DublinHun72

Something Else

fixxxer wrote: »

Has anyone come across a podcast that actually goes in depth on this case?

Quite a few . Generation Why is one I’ve listened to on apple podcast app.

B-D-P--

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

RhubarbCrumble wrote: »

I agree with everyone saying Madeline McCann's parents were somehow involved.
The bit that really irks me is to do with the other two children. They went out and left 3 tiny children on their own in a foreign country, but because they were both doctors and seen as 'upper class' nothing was ever done.
I'm sure if an unemployed couple from a council estate had done the same thing their other children would have been taken into care almost immediately.
given a free house at the taxpayers expence

Fixed for you

pc7

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Its an horrific case whichever way you look at it (if it was the parents or someone else), that poor kid and family. There is just no way they should have been left. I've two smallies similar ages and I practically can't leave the room without them getting into mischief, let alone while asleep leaving the house. I can't imagine the guilt they feel daily (even if they weren't directly involved). It is amazing with all the resources poured into it that its never been solved.

Seve OB

pc7 wrote: »

Its an horrific case whichever way you look at it (if it was the parents or someone else), that poor kid and family. There is just no way they should have been left. I've two smallies similar ages and I practically can't leave the room without them getting into mischief, let alone while asleep leaving the house. I can't imagine the guilt they feel daily (even if they weren't directly involved). It is amazing with all the resources poured into it that its never been solved.

I would never leave my kids either but look at it this way. This was 11 years ago now. Fresh in your mind as your nippers are growing up and a reason for us to be so protective over our kids.
Maybe this case is a contributing factor to the protective nature we place on our kids nowadays.

I mean go back to when I was the same age back in the 80s and was left out on the street all day playing ball etc.

Times change, the McCanns got caught out, but just maybe there is more cotton wool around our kids nowadays because of Madeline.

tretorn

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Seve OB wrote: »

I would never leave my kids either but look at it this way. This was 11 years ago now. Fresh in your mind as your nippers are growing up and a reason for us to be so protective over our kids.
Maybe this case is a contributing factor to the protective nature we place on our kids nowadays.

I mean go back to when I was the same age back in the 80s and was left out on the street all day playing ball etc.

Times change, the McCanns got caught out, but just maybe there is more cotton wool around our kids nowadays because of Madeline.

The Mc Canns were three and twins of approximately twenty months.

No responsible parent would ever let children that age out playing ball even in the 1960s.

Getting a babysitter to sit with your children while you eat tapas with your friends isnt wrapping them in cotton wool,these were two wealthy professionals so its not as if they couldnt pay someone eight euros an hour to sit in the apartment.

Wheety

Accident happened, parents hid body

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Two doctors would be struck off the medical register if any trace of sedation was found in the body. The body was disposed of for some reason.

Injuries to the body would also result in similar action being taken,

Sounds like you don't know what proof means.

Seve OB

tretorn wrote: »

The Mc Canns were three and twins of approximately twenty months.

No responsible parent would ever let children that age out playing ball even in the 1960s.

Getting a babysitter to sit with your children while you eat tapas with your friends isnt wrapping them in cotton wool,these were two wealthy professionals so its not as if they couldnt pay someone eight euros an hour to sit in the apartment.

They were asleep in bed not playing ball. I'm making comparisons to how times change.
Parents were outside, not far away.
I wouldn't do it.... Back in the 80s I'd say most parents would have done it.

pc7

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

I asked my folks would they do it and they said not in a month of sundays based on the ages of the babies and likelihood to wake at that hour. They weren't outside, they were a mighty distance away imo.

tretorn

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

No, you are wrong, most parents wouldnt do it.

They wouldnt even drop into the neighbour next door for more than two minutes if they had children that age asleep in bed.

All those resorts provide childcare for parents as it would be understood that most parents wouldnt go out and leave three under threes alone with only a quick glance into the room every twenty minutes being the supervision.

Aisling(",)

The parents did it

Aisling(",) wrote: »

I obviously don't know what happened but I think if they had accidentally killed her and disposed of the body they'd have stopped campaigning as fervently as they have been.

It's called hiding in plain sight

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Seve OB wrote: »

They were asleep in bed not playing ball. I'm making comparisons to how times change.
Parents were outside, not far away.
I wouldn't do it.... Back in the 80s I'd say most parents would have done it.

No they wouldn't . I reared my kids in rhe 80,s and I wouldn't dream of it . Nor would anyone I know .
The parents were not just outside they were dining in a restaurant which was the far side of a complex

Steve F

Something that I always thought strange was the video showing Gerry allegedly laughing and joking a few days after the disappearance
Just didn't look or feel right

sweetie

Something Else

Aisling(",) wrote:

I obviously don't know what happened but I think if they had accidentally killed her and disposed of the body they'd have stopped campaigning as fervently as they have been.

Thou dost protest too much

robwen

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Did the other people Kate & Gerry were having dinner/ on holidays with leave their kids in the same situation?

Something Else

There wasn't a great deal of evidence in this case, but the evidence that there was all pointed to the parents. The theory that she died in the apartment and the parents covered it up is the most believable and somewhat backed up by evidence. The dogs signalled ONLY in the McCanns apartment and car. Background checks were done and nobody ever died in that apartment before. They washed her cuddle toy and bedsheets. Their statements each contradicted each other. Their behaviour in general and reluctance to do a reenactment was odd. The window didn't open from the outside, Kate's DNA was found on the window.

When Kate first noticed her missing, she yelled "They've taken her". Strange assumption to make when your child has just gone missing

Why the McCanns keep the case alive publically and why Scotland Yard don't seem to suspect them in any way is truly baffling though.

Ultimately, there is not enough evidence to proceed with this case.

optimist16

www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nCfPFx5ogk


The discrepancies in the statements, discrediting of the dogs, the couple that gave statements to the police about lewd conduct and the police not forwarding the statements, the people chosen to handle the situation from the outset, the relative who said that charitable donations would be used for legal fees.....


If you're so inclined it's fascinating.

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

robwen wrote: »

Did the other people Kate & Gerry were having dinner/ on holidays with leave their kids in the same situation?

One family had the granny with them who was babysitting . The others were all left alone too . The Mc Canns apartment was more vulnerable as it was the nearest to the road and the steps from the patio led right onto a public road

bucketybuck

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

foxyladyxx wrote: »

I can provide proof of that.

"Proof" isn't some made up imaginary word that means whatever you want it to be.

Either you have proof or you don't, so come on, lets see your proof?

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

tretorn wrote: »

No, you are wrong, most parents wouldnt do it.

They wouldnt even drop into the neighbour next door for more than two minutes if they had children that age asleep in bed.

All those resorts provide childcare for parents as it would be understood that most parents wouldnt go out and leave three under threes alone with only a quick glance into the room every twenty minutes being the supervision.

In that particular resort The Mc Canns had access to a free babysitting service where they could leave the kids under supervision and also access to a paid service where a nanny would sit in the apartment with the kids . They chose to do neither but to get their kids into bed by 7 pm and leave them alone to go out to eat with friends

retro:electro

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

I don’t think Kate and Gerry had anything to do with it. I think the most obvious answer is what likely happened. Someone had been watching their behaviour on previous nights and acted on opportunity when they knew the kids were alone. I don’t think Kate and Gerry are particularly nice people, in fact I don’t like them at all and they are partly responsible for what happened to their daughter. But I just don’t think they’re capable of what some people are accusing them of. It’s clear as day that Kate is tormented ever since and she has grief written all over her face. I think they’re cold and detached and odd and have made a lot of strange decisions but I don’t think they’re murderers.

SusieBlue

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Steve F wrote: »

Something that I always thought strange was the video showing Gerry allegedly laughing and joking a few days after the disappearance
Just didn't look or feel right

Firstly, people react very differently to stress & sadness. If I'm nervous about something, I get the giggles. There is no "correct" way to deal with and act when your child disappears.
And secondly, that photo was one of maybe 100 snapshots taken by that photographer. In the rest of the photos, his expression might have looked neutral, or sad, or stressed, or angry.
But which one got published? The one that portrays the father of a newly missing child as having the lols, of course.
Because its a better story and it'll sell more copies.

loyatemu

If they did it, they're phenomenal actors and totally impervious to pressure, both of them. That seems unlikely. They obviously shouldn't have left the kids alone but they were also incredibly unlucky. Whoever snatched the girl probably killed her in the next few days and the body was disposed of well away from the resort.

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

loyatemu wrote: »

If they did it, they're phenomenal actors and totally impervious to pressure, both of them. That seems unlikely. They obviously shouldn't have left the kids alone but they were also incredibly unlucky. Whoever snatched the girl probably killed her in the next few days and the body was disposed of well away from the resort.

It was Madeleine who was unlucky , let down by her parents .

All My Stars Aligned

What get's to me is that they were not prosecuted for child neglect. I don't think they murdered their child but it was their actions that led to the poor child's murder/disappearance. Had they been working class parents the public reaction would have been very different and I somehow doubt the British authorities would still be investigating.

Alrigghtythen

iamwhoiam wrote: »

One family had the granny with them who was babysitting . The others were all left alone too . The Mc Canns apartment was more vulnerable as it was the nearest to the road and the steps from the patio led right onto a public road

The granny was at the table in the tapas bar. Wasn't another child ill that night?

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Alrigghtythen wrote: »

The granny was at the table in the tapas bar. Wasn't another child ill that night?

Was one child vomiting and a dad stayed with it . Sorry , I think the gran might have been babysitting other night , maybe not the night in question . Now I am confused too !

Alrigghtythen

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Was one child vomiting and a dad stayed with it . Sorry , I think the gran might have been babysitting other night , maybe not the night in question . Now I am confused too !

It's very confusing with all the different accounts and media stories all contradicting each other! It seems (from Jane Tanners police interview) that the father was supposed to stay at home with the sick child. She left for dinner at 20:30 and he turned up a half an hour later at 21:00?
.


http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JANE-TANNER-10MAY.htm

Ev was sick and had difficulty with sleeping stayed with her father, who had arrived in the meantime, (on the previous night the deponent stayed later in the bedroom because her daughter had difficulty in sleeping; on this night it was her husband's turn). She left the apartment and went to the Tapas, for dinner, around 20h30.


When she arrived at the restaurant there were already some adult members of the group, namely the McCanns, without their children. They [the children] were supposedly sleeping.


Around 21h00 her husband arrived at the restaurant, Ev, meanwhile, having fallen asleep.

fritzelly

Thanks for the YT link, never seen it before
Always thought at the time seeing the interviews that Gerry just seemed off about the whole thing and Kate was an innocent (maybe) bystander to something nefarious
And after watching those documentaries I'm now even more convinced.

Purple Mountain

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

goat2 wrote: »

Where is the proof, if you can prove it, would love to see it

Have we got a psychic in our midst?

Steve F

SusieBlue wrote: »

Firstly, people react very differently to stress & sadness. If I'm nervous about something, I get the giggles. There is no "correct" way to deal with and act when your child disappears.
And secondly, that photo was one of maybe 100 snapshots taken by that photographer. In the rest of the photos, his expression might have looked neutral, or sad, or stressed, or angry.
But which one got published? The one that portrays the father of a newly missing child as having the lols, of course.
Because its a better story and it'll sell more copies.

It wasn't a photo,it was video.It was posted on youtube but I can't remember the channel

The parents did it

MBM had, that morning, asked the reason why her parents had not come to the bedroom when she and her brother had cried (the previous night)

I think this speaks loudly

Steve F

Speaks loudly in what why?

retro:electro

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I think this speaks loudly

That’s so sad. What kind of parents leave their child alone again when they’ve said something like that to you. Utterly shameful.

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Steve F wrote: »

Speaks loudly in what why?

For me its shows the disregard of the parents who chose to leave the children despite a three year old telling them that her brother cried and no one came .

Forget the risk of abduction in this case but the other risks they took are glaring .The risk of a child falling , having a seizure , vomiting , a fever , the risk of a child crying in fear after a dream , the risk of a child coughing and choking and no one came . Two doctors disregarding all of this to have dinner with mates .Shame on all of them .

runningbuddy

Thinking Sideways Podcast also cover this case. Worth a listen.