Abortion in Ireland: 2 years on

No, I would have still voted to repeal. Absolutely, 100%

Voted to repeal and would do so again without hesitation.

Voted to repeal and would do so again, it's a womans body and as a man my only role is to facilitate whatever choice a woman wants to make.

The sky hasn't fallen in yet, has it.

It just means slightly less trauma for many girls, women & families quietly in the background. Let them have that small peace, don't be re-hashing the same old ****e.

downinbigsmoke wrote: »

The number of abortions was 6,666 last year (2019). In 2017 (which was quite a high year) there were 3,061 abortions linked to Ireland in the UK. It seems to me (but maybe not you) the public have been mislead. Would this have changed your vote?

Where did that 3,061 come from though?

My understanding is that previous to 2019, this data was collected from UK statistics based on the home address of women who had obtained abortions there.

Which means that realistically 3,061 is a minimum figure. How many women didn't give an Irish home address? How many gave a local address so as to remain anonymous? How many went to other places in Europe - EU citizens would probably go to their home country to get an abortion rather than go to England.

It doesn't seem to me that the Irish public have been misled. Far from it - that 3,061 is an honest figure - "These are the women that we know about, who are going to the UK". Where they could have done all sorts of extrapolations and manipulations, they didn't.

It now seems likely that the numbers we had underestimated the number of abortions by more than 50%.

Would I change my vote? Nope. Absolutely not. This even solidifies further for me that it was the right thing to do.

The number of 6,666 last year is statistic zero. It is the first time we have an actual, traceable number for the number of Irish residents getting abortions.

If it shoots up next year, you might have a point.

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I'd still vote no, I thought it would lead to wholesale abortion and I wasn't happy that potential fathers have no rights. Those figures pretty much reinforce my reasons for voting no.
No issue if it's for medical reasons but that's not what the vote was on.
I'd like to see the data behind the figures to see who's having them, if it's girls who don't have the means or feel they don't have support it's a travesty.

The vote was on removing the constitutional ban and allowing the government to govern as they see fit.


Potential fathers is an emotive issue but if you look at it logically, you cannot control the woman's body. If she doesnt want it and you do, what do you propose to do, enforce her to carry to term?


Also, frankly, it's none of anyone's business why they are having terminations. The people voted, the law was introduced, no reason is needed up to 12 weeks. To be honest, I'd be in favor of a 24 week timeframe like the UK. Or, no timeframe at all. If a woman wants an abortion, she should have one.

downinbigsmoke wrote: »

Now that we've all had time to collect our thoughts, I was hoping to gather some opinions on what people in this country think of the longterm effects Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Act 2018 have been. With the benefit of hindsight, is there anybody who would have changed their vote?

For full disclosure, I voted No in the referendum, which was apparently a pretty odd point of view for 21 year old Trinity student, who was otherwise not particularly right-wing. I would not change it.

But the argument from the Yes side (made by most lobby groups) that I found most convincing is that legalising abortion would not change the raw number of abortions but only the locations. This has turned out to be completely untrue.

The number of abortions was 6,666 last year (2019). In 2017 (which was quite a high year) there were 3,061 abortions linked to Ireland in the UK. It seems to me (but maybe not you) the public have been mislead. Would this have changed your vote?

Your post is a bit ingenious.
There were a lot of people who gave birth where the foetus was not viable. They did not go to England to have an abortion for a number of reasons.
That option is now available to them.

Have you figures for that? Absolute figures is not the right way to do it.

I voted yes, partly at least because of the case doctors made that it created difficulties for them. Now that I see over 6,000 abortions, I would have to consider changing my vote. That number is horrific when only a small number were on genuine medical grounds.

Voted yes, would do so again.

Women were also going to Amsterdam and other locations for abortions, or unsafely ordering abortion pills online.

There’s no reason to believe the actual numbers of abortions has dramatically increased.

As a father of two young kids both under the age of 3, I would absolutely still vote yes tomorrow.

On a separate note, the religious crackpots are going to go nuts over that specific 6666 number.

It was a no from me and remains so.

I wasn't living in Ireland at the time, I think I would have voted yes but I was on the fence and I certainly would have put more research and thought into it if I was at home and did have a vote. I don't see it as a straightforward black and white issue. Fundamentally we're saying that there is some specific day, and before that day a developing human has no rights, and after that day they do. Whether that is at 12 weeks, 24 weeks or at birth, it is a pretty significant decision. Which is why I would have educated myself more if I was going to vote.

One thing I did notice amongst friends (who were pretty much 100% yes) is that pretty much every article and argument shared prior to the referendum was about women with serious medical conditions being denied life saving healthcare because of the baby (which I don't see how anyone could possibly argue against), then the day after the referendum that seemed to go out the window in favour of state-funded on demand abortion for anyone in any circumstances (which is of course more controversial)

It seemed a little disingenuous looking on from a distance. I'm not sure I even know what the state of the actual law is now as it hasn't personally effected me or anyone I know of - which is the reason I'd most likely lean towards yes as it is perhaps not my place to dictate.

quokula wrote: »

I wasn't living in Ireland at the time, I think I would have voted yes but I was on the fence and I certainly would have put more research and thought into it if I was at home and did have a vote. I don't see it as a straightforward black and white issue. Fundamentally we're saying that there is some specific day, and before that day a developing human has no rights, and after that day they do. Whether that is at 12 weeks, 24 weeks or at birth, it is a pretty significant decision. Which is why I would have educated myself more if I was going to vote.

One thing I did notice amongst friends (who were pretty much 100% yes) is that pretty much every article and argument shared prior to the referendum was about women with serious medical conditions being denied life saving healthcare because of the baby (which I don't see how anyone could possibly argue against), then the day after the referendum that seemed to go out the window in favour of state-funded on demand abortion for anyone in any circumstances (which is of course more controversial)

It seemed a little disingenuous looking on from a distance. I'm not sure I even know what the state of the actual law is now as it hasn't personally effected me or anyone I know of - which is the reason I'd most likely lean towards yes as it is perhaps not my place to dictate.

You obviously weren’t paying close attention. The government made it very clear well in advance that they were going to legislate for abortion on request up to 12 weeks.