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Green Party wish list.

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    #2222
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Beechwoodspark wrote: »
    You obviously don’t know who David Wallace Wells is if you think it’s a work of fiction ffs
    Let's stop you there. Has it happened??? No??? Doom Porn!


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    #2223
    Robson99
    Registered Users Posts: 4,241 ✭✭✭Robson99


    We are only a drop in the Ocean with the carbon we are creating in relation to the rest of the world.
    Farming and Tourism ( in and out ) are a major part of our economy. The greens will not be given any power to effect these economies if FFG have any little bit of cop on


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    #2224
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    unhappys10 wrote: »
    Not getting into your stupid argument. I didn't mention price at all, they brought in the cheap tax which caused a flood of diesels in the country spewing nox gas everywhere.
    Take a look out your door to see the evidence.
    Cop on.

    Outta here, bunch of psychos, thank God the lunatics aren't in power alone and someone might put a stop to them.



    Reducing a cars tax by 100 euro, how could anyone guess that Irish people are so stupid they would prefer to spend thousands and thousands of euro to “upgrade” a perfectly good car to save a few quid on tax.

    Sorry that stupidity has nothing to do with any political party, that’s all our own making


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    #2225
    Micky 32
    Registered Users Posts: 6,556 ✭✭✭Micky 32


    Beechwoodspark wrote: »
    I’m not trolling I am an ardent “deep green” ecologist. Look it up micky

    I know you are and i don’t care to be honest.


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    #2226
    saabsaab
    Registered Users Posts: 7,900 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    Robson99 wrote: »
    We are only a drop in the Ocean with the carbon we are creating in relation to the rest of the world.
    Farming and Tourism ( in and out ) are a major part of our economy. The greens will not be given any power to effect these economies if FFG have any little bit of cop on


    The Greens will not be targeting farming but wll try to improve their lot with better policy for all. Many farmers are open to this. One way or another we have to change or fall off the cliff in the not too far distant future.


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    #2227
    efanton
    Registered Users Posts: 1,164 ✭✭✭efanton


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Only lunatic I see around here is you

    Reducing a cars tax by 100 euro, how could anyone guess that Irish people are so stupid they would prefer to spend thousands and thousands of euro to “upgrade” a perfectly good car to save a few quid on tax.

    Sorry that stupidity has nothing to do with any political party, that’s all our own making

    The greens reduced the tax on Diesel cars. Diesel was cheaper than petrol at the pumps. Diesel engines also gave more MPG.
    How on earth could you possibly claim that people were idiots for switching to diesel cars. They saved literally hundred of euro per year. Also Diesel cars were cheaper to insure.

    Do you ever think through an argument before posting?


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    #2228
    unhappys10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 692 ✭✭✭unhappys10


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Only lunatic I see around here is you

    Reducing a cars tax by 100 euro, how could anyone guess that Irish people are so stupid they would prefer to spend thousands and thousands of euro to “upgrade” a perfectly good car to save a few quid on tax.

    Sorry that stupidity has nothing to do with any political party, that’s all our own making

    100? Go and do some research before spouting crap.
    The point is they pushed diesels as a cleaner alternative when it was anything but.
    Fyi some cars tax decreased by 750 a year after 2008.


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    #2229
    Micky 32
    Registered Users Posts: 6,556 ✭✭✭Micky 32


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Reducing a cars tax by 100 euro, how could anyone guess that Irish people are so stupid they would prefer to spend thousands and thousands of euro to “upgrade” a perfectly good car to save a few quid on tax.

    Sorry that stupidity has nothing to do with any political party, that’s all our own making

    It’s highly unlikely someone upgraded their car for 100 euro cheaper tax. They were obviously going to upgraded them anyway, i’m sure you have evidence to suggest otherwise?

    Are you sure it’s not the fact people buy new cars that bother you?

    Even if it were because of cheaper tax at least the new cars produce less emissions than their older cars.

    It’s none of your business what people spend their money on.


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    #2230
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    efanton wrote: »
    The greens reduced the tax on Diesel cars. Diesel was cheaper than petrol at the pumps. Diesel engines also gave more MPG.
    How on earth could you possibly claim that people were idiots for switching to diesel cars. They saved literally hundred of euro per year. Also Diesel cars were cheaper to insure.

    Do you ever think through an argument before posting?

    Diesel cost more to buy the car in first place, to service, less economical in cities....people spent thousand to upgrade to an inefficient car so they didn’t save hundreds, the tco of the car cost them more....

    Some saved, thousands and thousands didn’t.....


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    #2231
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Micky 32 wrote: »
    It’s highly unlikely someone upgraded their car for 100 euro cheaper tax. They were obviously going to upgraded them anyway, i’m sure you have evidence to suggest otherwise?

    Are you sure it’s not the fact people buy new cars that bother you?

    Even if it were because of cheaper tax at least the new cars produce less emissions than their older cars.

    I buy new cars all the time, I bought new diesel. I didn’t say I wasn’t part of the stupidity did I?

    Just saying other people need to stop blaming political parties for their own stupidity


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    #2232
    Micky 32
    Registered Users Posts: 6,556 ✭✭✭Micky 32


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Diesel cost more to buy the car in first place, to service, less economical in cities.../quote]

    They cost slightly more to buy not much. The rest is false. I drive at least 1000km a week and it would cost me a lot more money if i ran petrol.


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    #2233
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Micky 32 wrote: »
    It’s none of your business what people spend their money on.

    Ninja edit

    I didn’t say it was, I was responding to someone complaint that first the greens seemingly gave free diesel and then they seemingly put a gun to everyone heads to buy a diesel

    I don’t give a s**t what you spend your money on, just pointing out the stupidity to blame a political party for your mistakes


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    #2234
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Micky 32 wrote: »
    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Diesel cost more to buy the car in first place, to service, less economical in cities.../quote]

    They cost slightly more to buy not much. The rest is false. I drive at least 1000km a week and it would cost me a lot more money if i ran petrol.

    Hence why I said some saved

    Even today for some people diesel is still the best fuel choice


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    #2235
    saabsaab
    Registered Users Posts: 7,900 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    In Government the Greens agenda will increase spending on transport infrastructure. All future capital spending on transport infrastructure will be split 2:1, favouring public transport over roads, and €360 million will be spent every year on cycling and walking infrastructure. This is a good policy helping to end reliance on foreign imported fossil fuels.


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    #2236
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,274 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Reducing a cars tax by 100 euro, how could anyone guess that Irish people are so stupid they would prefer to spend thousands and thousands of euro to “upgrade” a perfectly good car to save a few quid on tax.

    Sorry that stupidity has nothing to do with any political party, that’s all our own making


    Rubbish. The Eamon Ryan changed more than just the car tax. Cars were out in emissions bands. This not just effected there car tax but there VRT rate as well. Car manufacturers also reengineered there engines to lower there emissions to achieve these bands. The changing of these emissions made it uneconomical to buy large petrol cars. Your hypothesis about people changing for a 100 euro savings is rubbish.

    For the first 2-3 years after the change new car numbers actually fell as the country went into recession. But as the car tax difference widened and VRT changes narrowed the price gab even moderate mileages made petrol uneconomical on midsized and large cars especially when fuel costs were factored in

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #2237
    efanton
    Registered Users Posts: 1,164 ✭✭✭efanton


    saabsaab wrote: »
    In Government the Greens agenda will increase spending on transport infrastructure. All future capital spending on transport infrastructure will be split 2:1, favouring public transport over roads, and €360 million will be spent every year on cycling and walking infrastructure. This is a good policy helping to end reliance on foreign imported fossil fuels.

    Thats the theory, but it simply will not work like that.

    The Greens agreed that all existing major road projects that are already in progress, such as the M20 will continue.

    Last year the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport was given a total budget of 2.7 billion.

    Take the Sports budget (god help the minister that tries to cut the funding of the GAA), the tourism budget ( there will be the inevitable additional spending to get tourism back up and running in this country), and the existing commitments with regards transport infrastructure, and Eamon Ryan can split whatever is left any way he wants, there simply will not be any money left for pet projects. When Eamon goes running to Micheal ad Leo asking for money, how much extra do you think he is going to get it? Sweet FA.

    The greens have well and truly feck'd themselves. They have not got one solid commitment to any additional spending in their deal. The only concession they got was putting up carbon taxes.

    Once the Green actually realise what they have done signing this deal it will be too late. I'd give this government 2 years tops before it collapses and the greens pull out.


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    #2238
    Beechwoodspark
    Registered Users Posts: 15,405 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    Couldn’t they borrow money if push comes to shove to keep the govt going


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    #2239
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,217 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Borrowing for capital expenditure and day to day funding are two diff things.
    Shouldn't do the latter except in exceptional circumstances.


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    #2240
    Edgware
    Registered Users Posts: 5,875 ✭✭✭Edgware


    Beechwoodspark wrote: »
    Couldn’t they borrow money if push comes to shove to keep the govt going

    Is that you Mary Lou? Shouldn't you be practising your Dail speech

    Hint
    Change change change. This isn't what people voted for Up the Ra


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    #2241
    Beechwoodspark
    Registered Users Posts: 15,405 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    No but If the greens insist on certain spending then pascal can borrow to keep the show on the road until the next bust up


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    #2242
    Edgware
    Registered Users Posts: 5,875 ✭✭✭Edgware


    efanton wrote: »
    Thats the theory, but it simply will not work like that.

    The Greens agreed that all existing major road projects that are already in progress, such as the M20 will continue.

    Last year the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport was given a total budget of 2.7 billion.

    Take the Sports budget (god help the minister that tries to cut the funding of the GAA), the tourism budget ( there will be the inevitable additional spending to get tourism back up and running in this country), and the existing commitments with regards transport infrastructure, and Eamon Ryan can split whatever is left any way he wants, there simply will not be any money left for pet projects. When Eamon goes running to Micheal ad Leo asking for money, how much extra do you think he is going to get it? Sweet FA.

    The greens have well and truly feck'd themselves. They have not got one solid commitment to any additional spending in their deal. The only concession they got was putting up carbon taxes.

    Once the Green actually realise what they have done signing this deal it will be too late. I'd give this government 2 years tops before it collapses and the greens pull out.
    Wishful thinking. Ah sure it won't be long before the Council elections up North


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    #2243
    efanton
    Registered Users Posts: 1,164 ✭✭✭efanton


    Beechwoodspark wrote: »
    Couldn’t they borrow money if push comes to shove to keep the govt going

    They could, and thats the only way that anything the Green want done is going to happen.

    But was there any commitment in the deal to borrow for Green projects?
    Can you see Leo agreeing to borrowing yet more money (dont forget we have already borrowed nearly 30 billion for Covid) when his plan is for tax cuts in 3 or 4 years time.

    Personally I would like to see some of the green projects actually happening. The sooner we can get rid of of our fossil fuel powered electric generation plants the better. Also get people switch to EV's as soon as possible too.

    Green public transport sounds great but it going to take years for anything to happen even if they start work on that Monday morning. With design, planning, and actual construction, you are talking 5+ years for any of those projects to actually start making a difference.

    Getting the government to commit to borrowing and construction of offshore wind farms would be top of my list and the eradication of petrol and diesel cars. No planning hassles, and just look at the one in the English Channel that only took a year or two to construct., its absolutely massive, but the company's that construct them have so much experience now that for them its now a relatively quick process as long as you have the money to pay for it.

    The problem as I see it though is when Eamon Ryan goes looking for more money Leo and Michael will be too busy looking out for themselves. They will argue that wasn't in the program for government.
    I hope I am wrong, but I wouldn't trust FG or FF as far as I could kick them.


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    #2244
    JPCN1
    Registered Users Posts: 888 ✭✭✭JPCN1


    saabsaab wrote: »
    Most air travel is not necessary, people going to lie on a beach to get sunburned, have a boozy weekend or get stoned. Look at the spread of covid without mass air travel it wouldn't have happened.


    The new Green utopia does sound like great fun altogether....


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    #2245
    KyussB
    Registered Users Posts: 2,314 ✭✭✭KyussB


    They have agreed to budget balancing i.e. likely austerity in as little as 2-2.5 years...of course there won't be the money for it, they have specifically excluded that, as a part of the agreement they made...


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    #2246
    efanton
    Registered Users Posts: 1,164 ✭✭✭efanton


    Edgware wrote: »
    Wishful thinking. Ah sure it won't be long before the Council elections up North

    So where do you think all the money is going to come from?
    There's absolutely no provision whatsoever in the program for government deal.


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    #2247
    PommieBast
    Registered Users Posts: 2,633 ✭✭✭PommieBast


    efanton wrote: »
    Hike the cost of aviation fuel and all that is going to happen is airlines will buy their fuel, in other countries.
    I think treaties related to aviation actually prohibit taxation of jet fuel.

    Beechwoodspark wrote: »
    The coming technology is solar powered ferries
    Solar powered airships seems a better bet to me.


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    #2248
    MrMusician18
    Registered Users Posts: 7,281 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    efanton wrote: »
    They could, and thats the only way that anything the Green want done is going to happen.

    But was there any commitment in the deal to borrow for Green projects?
    Can you see Leo agreeing to borrowing yet more money (dont forget we have already borrowed nearly 30 billion for Covid) when his plan is for tax cuts in 3 or 4 years time.

    Personally I would like to see some of the green projects actually happening. The sooner we can get rid of of our fossil fuel powered electric generation plants the better. Also get people switch to EV's as soon as possible too.

    Green public transport sounds great but it going to take years for anything to happen even if they start work on that Monday morning. With design, planning, and actual construction, you are talking 5+ years for any of those projects to actually start making a difference.

    Getting the government to commit to borrowing and construction of offshore wind farms would be top of my list and the eradication of petrol and diesel cars. No planning hassles, and just look at the one in the English Channel that only took a year or two to construct., its absolutely massive, but the company's that construct them have so much experience now that for them its now a relatively quick process as long as you have the money to pay for it.

    The problem as I see it though is when Eamon Ryan goes looking for more money Leo and Michael will be too busy looking out for themselves. They will argue that wasn't in the program for government.
    I hope I am wrong, but I wouldn't trust FG or FF as far as I could kick them.

    The government has not planned, and is not planning to finance or build offshore wind generation. ESB is however, and has been planning its green transition for the past few years - see its brighter future strategy. They ran an ad campaign and all about it.

    A lot of items regarding electricity generation in PfG were already in the works as part of the ESBs programme for change.


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    #2249
    efanton
    Registered Users Posts: 1,164 ✭✭✭efanton


    MrMusician18 wrote: »
    The government has not planned, and is not planning to finance or build offshore wind generation. ESB is however, and has been planning its green transition for the past few years - see its brighter future strategy. They ran an ad campaign and all about it.

    A lot of items regarding electricity generation in PfG were already in the works as part of the ESBs programme for change.

    Was unaware of that, but thats great news.

    Would sooner see the country getting rid of the fossil fuel power plants before the start on transport projects. Two very good reasons, first they would benefit the entire country, and second, that's where we are going to get the most carbon emissions reductions for the amount we spend.


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    #2250
    KyussB
    Registered Users Posts: 2,314 ✭✭✭KyussB


    Is there any cost (other than political) for the Green Party to just leave the coalition and collapse the government, after 2-2.5 years?

    I know from them going into the agreement in the first place, that they don't have the spine to even consider it - but am curious, nonetheless.


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    #2251
    Robson99
    Registered Users Posts: 4,241 ✭✭✭Robson99


    A party that want rural ireland to operate with a couple of cars between them and to bring back wolves to roam the countryside instead of cattle cannot be taken seriously.
    Hopefully Micheal and Leo will tell Ryan to stand in the corner for the next few years and to keep his mouth shut


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