Cycling on paths and other cycling issues (updated title)

magicbastarder · 19-06-2020 10:39PM

TaurenDruid wrote: »

See, Andy - it's quite possible you do sometimes actually make valid points.

But when they're rare gems hidden among such rampant made-up bull**** as this, we just start glossing over and missing the valid points.

much as it pains me to get involved with this particular strand of the discussion:

A survey of Irish drivers by Liberty Insurance has found that 67 per cent of us admit to using our mobile phones when behind the wheel.

https://www.completecar.ie/car-news/article/9354/Two-thirds-of-Irish-drivers-admit-to-mobile-phone-use

magicbastarder · 19-06-2020 10:40PM

i'm off to wash my hands.

Charles Babbage · 19-06-2020 10:50PM

magicbastarder wrote: »

True, you can see it by the number of people cyclists kill every year.

If death is the only measure, then we cannot discuss theft, rape, mugging, or fraud since any such thread can be derailed by someone just saying that it is OK to beat you up or rape you so long as nobody dies.

This would not be accepted as an excuse in such a thread, so why is it acceptable here?

But then I already said that in post #163

magicbastarder · 19-06-2020 10:53PM

i can't even remember the context in which i posted that, so you may well be correct.

Thargor · 19-06-2020 10:54PM

SeanW wrote: »

Unfortunately, that's not really an option IRL. On more than one occasion, I've had to jump out of the way of two-wheeled lawbreakers in circumstances similar to what is seen in that video.

A little more than once or twice.

You should watch the old TV show "The Sopranos" there was a mobster in it called Phil Leotardo, and just about every other scene, he would remind everyone "I did 20 years in the can" (prison)

Eventually, you stop wondering just how long Phil Leotardo spent in the can :pac:

Nice deflection. Can you do anything else?

So the main injury was to the drivers' pride and sense of self-respect/worth, not the only injury. I stand corrected.

Cyclists who menace pedestrians, sail through red lights and meander down the footpath act on purpose. Bicycles don't "accidentally" cycle across Sean O'Casey bridge. Bicycles don't "accidentally" sail merrily past red lights. They do it because they're lawbreakers and some cases hypocritical lawbreakers. This driver accidentally let their car slip down the rocks because they made some silly mistake.

Yes, some are more worthy of empathy than others.

There's a good chance one or both of that couple are going to give up driving, so I'm not sure what they have to learn in that case.

But don't worry, the most important thing is that you can gleefully use their misfortune to score cheap points in your own pathetic little crusade. And you can feel smug while you and your ilk sail past every red light and down every footpath, and menace pedestrians left, right and centre. :rolleyes:

TaurenDruid wrote: »

See, Andy - it's quite possible you do sometimes actually make valid points.

But when they're rare gems hidden among such rampant made-up bull**** as this, we just start glossing over and missing the valid points.

GRR! CARS KILL PEOPLE! GRR!

Are you just pretending you dont understand at this stage? Its like listening to American gun nuts demanding the same regulations and enforcement be placed on water pistols as they have on their rifles on the basis that a water pistols ability to annoy people is equivalent to a rifles ability to kill them...

ewc78 · 19-06-2020 11:23PM

meeeeh wrote: »

Progressive people who live in semi-ds with cardboard walls and who still walk to get newspaper when everyone else is accessing them online.

In my case kids are happy, we have space, house that's built to decent standards so it doesn't take a lot to heat, good school and woods in the doorstep where you can walk, run and kids can cycle. From middle of March to beginning of June ours didn't even sit in the car, they were in no shops but they went for our long walks or 10km cycles almost every day (they are 7 and 11).

I make about 20,000 km per year in car but that includes quite a bit of travel for wonk or trips around the country (my car is the family car). Commute to work is 6km and all the shopping is done when leaving work. The way my husband works we would always need two cars if we lived in a estate or a nice house with a garden. I understand the temptation to blame us living in the country for everything but Dublin isn't populated densely enough and any new development seems to be blocked because people need their front and back gardens in a city.

I reckon some think the world stops once you go past the Red Cow Roundabout.....:)

magicbastarder · 19-06-2020 11:31PM

meeeeh wrote: »

Progressive people who live in semi-ds with cardboard walls and who still walk to get newspaper when everyone else is accessing them online.

well, you do like your stereotypes.

meeeeh · 19-06-2020 11:32PM

ewc78 wrote: »

I reckon some think the world stops once you go past the Red Cow Roundabout.....:)

Well there is a whole less traffic and road rage of all kind once you get past it. Some here probably wouldn't be anle to cope.

meeeeh · 19-06-2020 11:39PM

magicbastarder wrote: »

well, you do like your stereotypes.

That's not a stereotype, the build quality in a lot of those houses is shocking. I lived in some and visited enough and I am not impressed. Maybe building standards in last 10 years improved but a lot of what was there before is terrible. That is not a stereotype I am afraid and I'm not saying all houses are a disaster but you need proper insulation for warmth and safety reasons.

magicbastarder · 19-06-2020 11:54PM

yeah, as i said, you do like your stereotypes. i wasn't even referring to the houses. you took a throwaway comment about walking to the shops for the paper to denigrate people for being behind the times. you missed the point by a country mile, but it gave you a chance to pigeonhole people, and that's the prize.

John_Rambo · 20-06-2020 12:07AM

meeeeh wrote: »

That's not a stereotype, the build quality in a lot of those houses is shocking. I lived in some and visited enough and I am not impressed. Maybe building standards in last 10 years improved but a lot of what was there before is terrible. That is not a stereotype I am afraid and I'm not saying all houses are a disaster but you need proper insulation for warmth and safety reasons.

Your bad living choices and limited experience of urban and suburban living isn't a bench mark of said.

A lot of suburban people live in very well built houses, period three story Victorian and Georgian houses, large apartments, small apartments, excellent town houses, detached houses, very well built ex-council semi detached houses, ex-army terraced bungalows with massive back gardens. In some cases they live beside huge parks and forested areas, stunning beaches and trails & extensive cycle tracks. Not one of my peers, relatives or neighbours live in houses with "paper" walls, improper insulation or in unsafe dwellings. I've lived in a few properties in and close to the capital and never had the issues you experienced.

There are badly built houses everywhere. Rural and urban.

You are indeed stereotyping, it's akin to city people assuming everyone in rural Ireland lives some sort of bog. Pure ignorance I'm afraid. Walking to the shops is a perfectly normal thing to do, just because you don't do it doesn't make it weird.

AndrewJRenko · 20-06-2020 12:20AM

TaurenDruid wrote: »

See, Andy - it's quite possible you do sometimes actually make valid points.

But when they're rare gems hidden among such rampant made-up bull**** as this, we just start glossing over and missing the valid points.

GRR! CARS KILL PEOPLE! GRR!

https://www.completecar.ie/car-news/article/9354/Two-thirds-of-Irish-drivers-admit-to-mobile-phone-use

You're welcome.

Is this seriously a surprise for you? Do you go round with blinkers on or what? How could you possibly have not noticed the endemic levels of mobile phone abuse by drivers in Ireland?

AndrewJRenko · 20-06-2020 12:21AM

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Dammit - I nearly had this one off by heart earlier... how did it go again?

"Ah, sure at the end of the day, nobody was killed or injured, so they harmed nobody but themselves. it's all good."

That's what earns your "Thanks" clicks, isn't it?

Hilarious - now arguing about what posts I thanked!

spookwoman · 20-06-2020 01:18AM

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

The reality is we know exactly how many people are killed or seriously injured on the road, because the RSA tracks this in a very detailed way using data from a number of sources, including Gardai, emergency services and hospitals.

The data is absolutely clear as to the real source of danger on the roads.

Show me, looking at stats it does not give you the details. It gives you stats like time of day, age speed zones. There is no stats that say if speeding, drink, drugs, texting, undue care and attention for any road deaths.

meeeeh · 20-06-2020 05:47AM

magicbastarder wrote: »

yeah, as i said, you do like your stereotypes. i wasn't even referring to the houses. you took a throwaway comment about walking to the shops for the paper to denigrate people for being behind the times. you missed the point by a country mile, but it gave you a chance to pigeonhole people, and that's the prize.

I was responding to progressive comment. You had no problem with basically calling people living more ruraly backward but you got insulted when pointed to the irony of talking about going to shops for a newspaper which is disappearing as an activity. In the same way as is changing how we work or where we live. (More urban yes but in what kind of accommodation). A lot of sugestions here are anyway how to solve the problems the way it was done 30 years ago. You are talking about building cycling paths in cities for example when large parts of modern cities and towns are being closed for traffic and pedestrianised.

meeeeh · 20-06-2020 06:12AM

John_Rambo wrote: »

Your bad living choices and limited experience of urban and suburban living isn't a bench mark of said.

A lot of suburban people live in very well built houses, period three story Victorian and Georgian houses, large apartments, small apartments, excellent town houses, detached houses, very well built ex-council semi detached houses, ex-army terraced bungalows with massive back gardens. In some cases they live beside huge parks and forested areas, stunning beaches and trails & extensive cycle tracks. Not one of my peers, relatives or neighbours live in houses with "paper" walls, improper insulation or in unsafe dwellings. I've lived in a few properties in and close to the capital and never had the issues you experienced.

There are badly built houses everywhere. Rural and urban.

You are indeed stereotyping, it's akin to city people assuming everyone in rural Ireland lives some sort of bog. Pure ignorance I'm afraid. Walking to the shops is a perfectly normal thing to do, just because you don't do it doesn't make it weird.

I'm glad you and your relatives and friends live in the best possible houses. You can continue your rural vs city game by yourself. It usually ends by you telling everyone how nobody could possibly have better lifestyle than you eating some delicious noodles somewhere in the city centre for 7 Euro. So we'll skip to that and say nobody lives better than you.

Duckjob · 20-06-2020 10:20AM

Me, trying to follow this thread:

Can AJR pls come and save it by posting some more pics of cars on bike lanes ?

AndrewJRenko · 20-06-2020 11:52AM

Duckjob wrote: »

Can AJR pls come and save it by posting some more pics of cars on bike lanes ?

I'll do my best, how about photos of the No. 16 buses backed up from the terminus at Kingston that Spook was looking for. It's good to see that they're not on the path or bike lane, or idling the engines this time, so perhaps they listened to some of the complaints they got.

There was another two or three at the terminus itself too.

Stark · 20-06-2020 11:52AM

Throwback to cheer you up https://twitter.com/jamieheaslip/status/1266016429008134144?s=19

AndrewJRenko · 20-06-2020 11:53AM

Stark wrote: »

Throwback to cheer you up https://twitter.com/jamieheaslip/status/1266016429008134144?s=19

Some ratio tho'

AndrewJRenko · 20-06-2020 01:53PM

Charles Babbage wrote: »

If death is the only measure, then we cannot discuss theft, rape, mugging, or fraud since any such thread can be derailed by someone just saying that it is OK to beat you up or rape you so long as nobody dies.

This would not be accepted as an excuse in such a thread, so why is it acceptable here?

But then I already said that in post #163

Death isn't the only measure though. The RSA report on 'KSI' stats, those killed and seriously injured, same as most authorities around the world. Cyclists feature as victims on those stats, not as aggressors.

Kermit.de.frog · 20-06-2020 02:40PM

TaurenDruid wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbttAigUIjI

See this every day.

They should be hung by the balls. (if they have balls)

Hurrache · 20-06-2020 03:31PM

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

See this every day.

They should be hung by the balls. (if they have balls)

There's loads of vids on YouTube, why do you keep watching the same one every day? Is it a turn on?

Kermit.de.frog · 20-06-2020 03:32PM

Yes, yes it is.

Rodney Bathgate · 20-06-2020 03:37PM

Hurrache wrote: »

There's loads of vids on YouTube, why do you keep watching the same one every day? Is it a turn on?

I suspect he means that he sees cyclists break red lights or cycle on the footpath every day. As opposed to him watching the video he posted every day.

AndrewJRenko · 20-06-2020 03:51PM

SeanW wrote: »

You should watch the old TV show "The Sopranos" there was a mobster in it called Phil Leotardo, and just about every other scene, he would remind everyone "I did 20 years in the can" (prison)

Eventually, you stop wondering just how long Phil Leotardo spent in the can :pac:

Great show, would be brilliant if it was repeated again.
Don’t remember that nugget about Phil though. I do remember him getting killed and the SUV crushing his skull at the gas station – remember that bit?

SeanW wrote: »

Nice deflection. Can you do anything else?

Deflection? It points clearly to the negligible levels of enforcement of traffic laws here.

SeanW wrote: »

So the main injury was to the drivers' pride and sense of self-respect/worth, not the only injury. I stand corrected.

SeanW wrote: »

There's a good chance one or both of that couple are going to give up driving, so I'm not sure what they have to learn in that case.

I’ve no idea how you managed to come to those conclusions. There is no information in the article I quoted to support those conclusions. Are you just spinning now?

SeanW wrote: »

Cyclists who menace pedestrians, sail through red lights and meander down the footpath act on purpose. Bicycles don't "accidentally" cycle across Sean O'Casey bridge. Bicycles don't "accidentally" sail merrily past red lights. They do it because they're lawbreakers and some cases hypocritical lawbreakers. This driver accidentally let their car slip down the rocks because they made some silly mistake.

Yeah, cyclists are menacing all right. But drivers who break speed limits are just being the best drivers in the world. Drivers who fail to control their vehicle endangering themselves and those around them (“Sgt Vincent Jennings of Salthill Garda Station said that it was a “miracle” that there were no fatalities or injuries”) deserve our empathy while cyclists mooching through a red light are ‘lawbreaking scum’.
Are you really that bad at evaluating risk?

SeanW wrote: »

But don't worry, the most important thing is that you can gleefully use their misfortune to score cheap points in your own pathetic little crusade. And you can feel smug while you and your ilk sail past every red light and down every footpath, and menace pedestrians left, right and centre. :rolleyes:

The important thing, imho, is that we take whatever action is necessary to stop drivers killing 2 or 3 people each week on our roads. Yes, zero is a long way off, and is unlikely to be achievable in the medium term at least, but that’s no excuse for doing better. And of course, we can do better, if we set our minds to it. But it seems that some people have too much fun playing zoom zoom games to be bothered about saving lives.

SeanW wrote: »

I'm going to try this one. more. time.

CARS ARE ALREADY HIGHLY VISIBLE!

That really depends on their position (reflectors on one side only) and their driver knowing how to operate their lights correctly.
But wouldn’t they be MORE HIGHLY VISIBLE with hi-vis stripes on all sides, to give MORE notice to approaching road users?

SeanW · 20-06-2020 05:00PM

Rogerrabit wrote: »

Hi cycling in footpaths is very dangerous for pedestrians especially now with this virus pandemic. Every day I witness these events cyclists on the footpaths spewing out germs as they cycle past pedestrians less than two feet from them. If any of these cyclists have the virus the pedestrians have no chance they will pick up the disease. Why do the police allow this carry on. They should be protecting the elderly instead of turning a blind eye to this outrageous carryon. What do yo think out there in Ireland the country whose population do not know how to wear a facemask.

Now, I fail to see what Andy's questionable 98% claim or silly old drivers in Galway have to do with this.

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Deflection? It points clearly to the negligible levels of enforcement of traffic laws here.

What does it have to do with the OP?

I’ve no idea how you managed to come to those conclusions. There is no information in the article I quoted to support those conclusions. Are you just spinning now?

Old people very often give up driving as they age. It would be foolish not to think that might happen here.

Yeah, cyclists are menacing all right. But drivers who break speed limits are just being the best drivers in the world. Drivers who fail to control their vehicle endangering themselves and those around them (“Sgt Vincent Jennings of Salthill Garda Station said that it was a “miracle” that there were no fatalities or injuries”) deserve our empathy while cyclists mooching through a red light are ‘lawbreaking scum’.
Are you really that bad at evaluating risk?

Intent matters. That's the reason why attempted murder can be treated more harshly than manslaughter.

This driver did something incredibly silly. Dangerous, yes, potentially, but entirely accidental. Cyclists menace pedestrians etc as a matter of routine on purpose. And then they come to boards/social media and accuse others.

The important thing, imho, is that we take whatever action is necessary to stop drivers killing 2 or 3 people each week on our roads. Yes, zero is a long way off, and is unlikely to be achievable in the medium term at least, but that’s no excuse for doing better. And of course, we can do better, if we set our minds to it. But it seems that some people have too much fun playing zoom zoom games to be bothered about saving lives.

And yet, even countries where best practice is followed to a much greater degree than Ireland, such as the Netherlands - they do worse than Ireland by some metrics in terms of road fatality statistics. And you called for Irish drivers to be uniquely subject to routine re-testing despite the fact that the country with the heaviest regulated licensing system - which has the closest to what you want - having worse road safety outcomes than Ireland by ALL measures.

So your claims about Irish drivers "playing zoom zoom" are irrelevant at best, mendacious at worst.

That really depends on their position (reflectors on one side only) and their driver knowing how to operate their lights correctly.
But wouldn’t they be MORE HIGHLY VISIBLE with hi-vis stripes on all sides, to give MORE notice to approaching road users?

The difference is no-one defends drivers going out with lights they don't use or that are broken. Even with malfunctioning lights, cars are still highly visible.

But cyclists do defend their "right" to go out dressed like a ninja and blend into the background. And then to blame others if they get into an accident as a result.

Pinch Flat · 20-06-2020 05:07PM

Was out driving earlier. Saw a guy on a bike on the path, coming up behind a pedestrian. My heart was in my mouth. My god how's this going to play out. The pedestrian could be horribly injured or killed. Nah. He just swerved around her and carried on. I breathed a sigh of relief and drove on.

Hurrache · 20-06-2020 05:23PM

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

I suspect he means that he sees cyclists break red lights or cycle on the footpath every day. As opposed to him watching the video he posted every day.

Nah, it's the latter .

Hurrache · 20-06-2020 05:25PM

Pinch Flat wrote: »

. I breathed a sigh of relief

Wait till I tell Pat Kenny that a cyclist I know of was spewing plumes of Covid-19.

Cycling on paths and other cycling issues (updated title)

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