BRS

Seve OB · 02-06-2020 8:39pm #1

Well the nice simple easy to use reliable BRS system looks like it has gone the way of the Devil.

Why can't simple things be kept simple and stop all the faffing about with bells and whistles when there is no need

HighLine · 02-06-2020 9:01pm

Completely agree. Also I find the app very buggy. If I click on it, it often fails to load and I have to force close the app and restart it to get it to work.

ronnie3585 · 02-06-2020 9:02pm

Couldn’t agree more. They’re made a right balls of the desktop version. The old version was simple and straightforward, the new version is laggy and bloated.

Golfgraffix · 02-06-2020 9:21pm

As a competitor to BRS I'd love to come on here and to lambase them but to be fair the past few weeks have been crazy for all suppliers the sheer number of traffic is massive. Clubv1 have no support in Ireland, all the staff furloughed, IG crashed for two days in the UK and Chrono allowing 6 people on a 3 ball line. Its hard to scramble to get settings ready for each Phase, I'd imagine all the suppliers are finding it difficult to keep up at the moment.

We have about 110 clubs on ClubNet (30 on the tee sheet), there are about 60,000 Irish club golfers using the platform, I think today we had almost 150,000 page views alone. For a few days we had issues with speed at 6pm to 7pm but that is now sorted

At its heart BRS is a very good product and they pretty much invented the tee booking market here its their barter model that I hate.

I'd say give them some time, I'm sure it will come good

J

Seve OB · 02-06-2020 11:35pm

Golfgraffix wrote: »

but to be fair the past few weeks have been crazy for all suppliers the sheer number of traffic is massive.

i accept that this has probably been the busiest and most demanding time golf booking systems have probably ever seen but as someone else has already said it, this quote really speaks for itself

For reasons known only to BRS they decided to release a revamp to their booking system during a period of high demand and sensitivity. The resulting additional demand on their server, coupled with golf clubs releasing timesheets for every day of the week

Ask anyone who has used multiple systems i think the majority will tell you that the original BRS was the best because it was simple and it worked.....i'm sure they will get the new version working, but from what i can see of it, its simply trying to do to much.

FixdePitchmark · 03-06-2020 6:20am

Fair enough , well explained.

But they just caused a major issue with no waiting list.
Unless this is sorted quickly enough

Seems extraordinary we have lost our much loved and needed waiting list.

BigChap1759 · 03-06-2020 8:24am

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Fair enough , well explained.

But they just caused a major issue with no waiting list.
Unless this is sorted quickly enough

Seems extraordinary we have lost our much loved and needed waiting list.

In a busy club a wait list is 100% essential

Spoke to someone at my club yesterday who had been in touch with them - they said they had a sw update this week and were adding more memory to the server. Hoping it will be better tomorrow when our times open up

GolfNut33 · 03-06-2020 8:37am

Maybe I'm missing something but the waiting list is working for me on the new website.

youcancallmeal · 03-06-2020 9:19am

GolfNut33 wrote: »

Maybe I'm missing something but the waiting list is working for me on the new website.

Yeah working for me as well except that I can't figure out how to remove myself from a waiting list on the app, not a big deal though as it works on the website.

With regards why it was updated I would guess it's an IT manager/consultant of some sort needed to use up budget/get a promotion and this process started well before coronavirus. I've seen it so many times before, websites or apps that are working perfectly fine getting updated(often very poorly) for no apparent reason. The consultancies that do the work are only too happy to oblige for a hefty fee, sometimes the budget means not everything can be brought over from a legacy site/app in the first phase so of course the end user loses out and the consultancy gets to keep the project going longer.

pakman · 03-06-2020 10:00am

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Fair enough , well explained.

But they just caused a major issue with no waiting list.
Unless this is sorted quickly enough

Seems extraordinary we have lost our much loved and needed waiting list.

Pro in Kilcock said it just wasn't available outside of comps. It would still be worth having all the time though. Valuable slots are going unfilled due to late withdrawals and I've played twice in 2 balls in past 5 days.

prawnsambo · 03-06-2020 10:06am

I'm a bit confused about this. Are we talking about a change from this interface?

thewobbler · 03-06-2020 10:54am

youcancallmeal wrote: »

Yeah working for me as well except that I can't figure out how to remove myself from a waiting list on the app, not a big deal though as it works on the website.

With regards why it was updated I would guess it's an IT manager/consultant of some sort needed to use up budget/get a promotion and this process started well before coronavirus. I've seen it so many times before, websites or apps that are working perfectly fine getting updated(often very poorly) for no apparent reason. The consultancies that do the work are only too happy to oblige for a hefty fee, sometimes the budget means not everything can be brought over from a legacy site/app in the first phase so of course the end user loses out and the consultancy gets to keep the project going longer.

With respect.

The old BRS system was designed before mobile phone browsers (iPhone, Android) came to prominence.

I’d expect that upwards on 80% of BRS traffic is now on mobile devices. Minor patches have been made to cater for this over the past 10 years, but they have been minor.

If you believe that only reason to rebuild software made for 18” screens, is “consultancy, commission, promotion”, then you shouldn’t be speaking on the subject.

You may have gotten used to working it in mobile to the point that it felt normal. But for new users and irregular users, on mobile devices, it was a far, far from optimised experience.

And a competitor could explain this to a golf club in less than minute.

This redesign has been long overdue.

youcancallmeal · 03-06-2020 11:06am

thewobbler wrote: »

With respect.

The old BRS system was designed before mobile phone browsers (iPhone, Android) came to prominence.

I’d expect that upwards on 80% of BRS traffic is now on mobile devices. Minor patches have been made to cater for this over the past 10 years, but they have been minor.

If you believe that only reason to rebuild software made for 18” screens, is “consultancy, commission, promotion”, then you shouldn’t be speaking on the subject.

You may have gotten used to working it in mobile to the point that it felt normal. But for new users and irregular users, on mobile devices, it was a far, far from optimised experience.

And a competitor could explain this to a golf club in less than minute.

This redesign has been long overdue.

So they had a website designed for laptops/monitors and a mobile app for ios and android devices. If they had traffic analysis that indicated most or even a large proportion of users were trying to use the website on a mobile device(Instead of the app) then doing a responsive redesign would be much easier and cheaper than a complete overhaul of the platform. But I get what your saying that any half decent IT sales person would be able to sell the idea of an overhaul and probably not even mention they could just do the responsive redesign as a workaround

thewobbler · 03-06-2020 11:26am

youcancallmeal wrote: »

So they had a website designed for laptops/monitors and a mobile app for ios and android devices. If they had traffic analysis that indicated most or even a large proportion of users were trying to use the website on a mobile device(Instead of the app) then doing a responsive redesign would be much easier and cheaper than a complete overhaul of the platform. But I get what your saying that any half decent IT sales person would be able to sell the idea of an overhaul and probably not even mention they could just do the responsive redesign as a workaround

It’s not a responsive redesign. It’s a rebuild of the user journey to optimise it for smaller devices. You can’t patch the latter directly on top of the former as the steps, pages and components will differ greatly.

I would expect any associated apps will either be retired or replaced by something completely different in the next few years. Having a booking app alongside a mobile optimised booking site makes little sense.

Seve OB · 03-06-2020 11:37am

I heard the waiting list was working in so far as you could put your name on it but if a space came free it wasn’t moving you into the slot. Instead it had to be manually done by pro shop staff.
So if they weren’t on the ball, someone drops out, maybe 5 guys in the waiting list but they don’t get moved. Someone else logs in and grabs the free slot

bustercherry · 03-06-2020 11:42am

youcancallmeal wrote: »

So they had a website designed for laptops/monitors and a mobile app for ios and android devices. If they had traffic analysis that indicated most or even a large proportion of users were trying to use the website on a mobile device(Instead of the app) then doing a responsive redesign would be much easier and cheaper than a complete overhaul of the platform. But I get what your saying that any half decent IT sales person would be able to sell the idea of an overhaul and probably not even mention they could just do the responsive redesign as a workaround

The new web interface is responsive :rolleyes:

This was 20+ year old platform using a technology stack that reflects that. Legacy software and infrastructure gets to the point it's too expensive to maintain (and add new features) over replacing with more modern stacks. You can't just put lipstick on a pig.

I also suspect (or at least that would have been the first thing I would have done) the entire backend was moved to a cloud provider over maintaining their own infrastructure too. Which is in the current climate could be a stroke of luck because things that are build 20+ years ago don't tend to scale quickly.

You know that statement about a little bit of knowledge...... I think that probably applies here.

youcancallmeal · 03-06-2020 11:54am

bustercherry wrote: »

The new web interface is responsive :rolleyes:

This was 20+ year old platform using a technology stack that reflects that. Legacy software and infrastructure gets to the point it's too expensive to maintain (and add new features) over replacing with more modern stacks. You can't just put lipstick on a pig.

I also suspect (or at least that would have been the first thing I would have done) the entire backend was moved to a cloud provider over maintaining their own infrastructure too. Which is in the current climate could be a stroke of luck because things that are build 20+ years ago don't tend to scale quickly.

You know that statement about a little bit of knowledge...... I think that probably applies here.

Sounds like many a sales pitch meeting I've been in before :rolleyes:

woodyg · 03-06-2020 2:02pm

Ok to fill in what i suspect BRS have done.
As they are a division of GolfNow (NBC Sports Group) they have migrated to using Kubernetes on Google Compute Engine.
This would have involved both a complete shift of the infrastructure and code base of the website.
GolfNow moved to using Node.js and MongoDB from the old on premise C# and SQL Servers a couple of years ago now so i fully suspect
BRS have followed the parent company to this DevOps model.

that level of work is a massive undertaking as you are completely redoing the entire companies systems and not just a straight forward website redesign.

anyways back to golf, i think the website is fine cause it means we are actually back playing golf!
i was delighted to play my 1st round saturday since the 6th of march.

Kiith · 03-06-2020 2:36pm

woodyg wrote: »

Ok to fill in what i suspect BRS have done.
As they are a division of GolfNow (NBC Sports Group) they have migrated to using Kubernetes on Google Compute Engine.
This would have involved both a complete shift of the infrastructure and code base of the website.
GolfNow moved to using Node.js and MongoDB from the old on premise C# and SQL Servers a couple of years ago now so i fully suspect
BRS have followed the parent company to this DevOps model.

that level of work is a massive undertaking as you are completely redoing the entire companies systems and not just a straight forward website redesign.

Sorry, couldn't resist, even though i understood most of that :P

woodyg · 03-06-2020 2:59pm

Kiith wrote: »

Sorry, couldn't resist, even though i understood most of that :P

trust me i was thinking the same as i was writing it

it's the curse of my day job

JCDUB · 03-06-2020 4:38pm

woodyg wrote: »

Ok to fill in what i suspect BRS have done.
As they are a division of GolfNow (NBC Sports Group) they have migrated to using Kubernetes on Google Compute Engine.
This would have involved both a complete shift of the infrastructure and code base of the website.
GolfNow moved to using Node.js and MongoDB from the old on premise C# and SQL Servers a couple of years ago now so i fully suspect
BRS have followed the parent company to this DevOps model.

that level of work is a massive undertaking as you are completely redoing the entire companies systems and not just a straight forward website redesign.

anyways back to golf, i think the website is fine cause it means we are actually back playing golf!
i was delighted to play my 1st round saturday since the 6th of march.

I know absolutely nothing about the technicalities of what has been or will be done with the BRS website.

However I, and the dogs on the street, do know that this was not the time to carry out a complete interface change to the website, thereby incapacitating the waiting list facility, along with whatever gremlins were thrown up.

Even if it worked perfectly, and there was a functioning waiting list, this was not the time for a change. I've heard multiple members of my club giving out about it. In fairness I think it's just the change they're giving out about, "I used to know my way around, now I can't find anything" etc.

That, coupled with no waiting list, stress around getting on the sheet and way higher demand on spots on the sheet, makes the timing absolutely ridiculous.

PARlance · 03-06-2020 4:40pm

bustercherry wrote: »

The new web interface is responsive :rolleyes:

This was 20+ year old platform using a technology stack that reflects that. Legacy software and infrastructure gets to the point it's too expensive to maintain (and add new features) over replacing with more modern stacks. You can't just put lipstick on a pig.

I also suspect (or at least that would have been the first thing I would have done) the entire backend was moved to a cloud provider over maintaining their own infrastructure too. Which is in the current climate could be a stroke of luck because things that are build 20+ years ago don't tend to scale quickly.

You know that statement about a little bit of knowledge...... I think that probably applies here.

It was required but rolling it out during the busiest period for bookings in those 20 years, was a crazy decision. It wouldn't have taken much foresight to see a huge surge once golf opened up again and that this would ease over the following months as people return to work.

thewobbler · 03-06-2020 5:12pm

PARlance wrote: »

It was required but rolling it out during the busiest period for bookings in those 20 years, was a crazy decision. It wouldn't have taken much foresight to see a huge surge once golf opened up again and that this would ease over the following months as people return to work.

I’d expect that the software was ready to go months ago but a certain virus put paid to final testing and release.

Judging by the comment two above, there would never have been a good time to relaunch for those people who “knew their way around”.

prawnsambo · 03-06-2020 5:31pm

prawnsambo wrote: »

I'm a bit confused about this. Are we talking about a change from this interface?

Nobody actually answered this, so I'll explain why I asked and maybe then get a definitive answer.

Our club has been on a newer interface of this for over a year. I've seen the above older one on other club websites in the intervening time. So if that's the case, the rollout didn't just start in the last month, but has been tested on a number of sites for a considerable period.

bustercherry · 03-06-2020 5:47pm

Am I missing something, the new site and app was available before Covid-19?
Unless there was some sort of A/B testing going on but our club was using the latest prior to lockdown.

I'd say they dodged a bullet by having this out. I wouldn't have liked to try and scale the old BRS to accommodate the current loads on the system.

prawnsambo · 03-06-2020 6:17pm

bustercherry wrote: »

Am I missing something, the new site and app was available before Covid-19?
Unless there was some sort of A/B testing going on but our club was using the latest prior to lockdown.

I'd say they dodged a bullet by having this out. I wouldn't have liked to try and scale the old BRS to accommodate the current loads on the system.

Exactly what I was saying. We've had that running since the end of January last year. And running concurrently with the old one for a couple of months before that.

HighLine · 03-06-2020 7:20pm

Another (minor) gripe I have with the desktop version, they no longer have different colours for different formats of play. So for my club, next Monday for is divided up into different hours of competitions and causal golf but all the one colour. A simple colour differentiation worked well on the old version and is also present on the current app.

PARlance · 03-06-2020 7:43pm

bustercherry wrote: »

Am I missing something, the new site and app was available before Covid-19?
Unless there was some sort of A/B testing going on but our club was using the latest prior to lockdown.

I'd say they dodged a bullet by having this out. I wouldn't have liked to try and scale the old BRS to accommodate the current loads on the system.

Our desktop & mobile site only changed about 10 days ago so it must have been staggered/testing going on.

Seve OB · 03-06-2020 8:13pm

prawnsambo wrote: »

Nobody actually answered this, so I'll explain why I asked and maybe then get a definitive answer.

Our club has been on a newer interface of this for over a year. I've seen the above older one on other club websites in the intervening time. So if that's the case, the rollout didn't just start in the last month, but has been tested on a number of sites for a considerable period.

that screen grab looks more like the older version if you ask me

Golf is my Game · 03-06-2020 9:06pm

We have the new one since last year some time. HAvent noticed any difference in the way it works, but it does look a bit more modern. The old one did seem a bit like a DOS era look to it.

FixdePitchmark · 03-06-2020 9:14pm

HighLine wrote: »

Another (minor) gripe I have with the desktop version, they no longer have different colours for different formats of play. So for my club, next Monday for is divided up into different hours of competitions and causal golf but all the one colour. A simple colour differentiation worked well on the old version and is also present on the current app.

To be honest the colour coding across everything is terrible - mostly a blob of grey - hard to even pick names out .

Seve OB · 03-06-2020 9:15pm

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

To be honest the colour coding across everything is terrible - mostly a blob of grey - hard to even pick names out .

harder now
on my one anyway they have bunched two names together on top of each other rather than spread out. you actually need to study it to see whats happening or if it a 3ball or 4ball

the.red.baron · 03-06-2020 9:22pm

Not sure why people are going on about scaling the old system, are you all opening your timesheets at the same time or what

If not then the load is hardly going to be an issue really

If it is then move the timesheet opening time

prawnsambo · 03-06-2020 9:47pm

Seve OB wrote: »

that screen grab looks more like the older version if you ask me

It is.

This thread is starting to remind me of this:

davegilly · 03-06-2020 10:45pm

pakman wrote: »

Pro in Kilcock said it just wasn't available outside of comps. It would still be worth having all the time though. Valuable slots are going unfilled due to late withdrawals and I've played twice in 2 balls in past 5 days.

I was one of the late withdrawals on Monday due to work. It seems to be a pretty regular occurrence with people working from home putting their names down but having to pull out last minute due to being too busy with work, I've ended up in 2 two balls as well. However i reckon with the weather changing you wont have anywhere near as many midweek players now.

Doesnt make any sense that you can't operate a waiting list for casual games though.

fearruanua · 04-06-2020 12:00pm

Seve OB wrote: »

harder now
on my one anyway they have bunched two names together on top of each other rather than spread out. you actually need to study it to see whats happening or if it a 3ball or 4ball

on the laptop anyway if you click on "detail" in the top right corner it tidies the lines up a bit. makes it easier to see. they're in a line across instead of being bunched up.

FixdePitchmark · 04-06-2020 5:39pm

davegilly wrote: »

I was one of the late withdrawals on Monday due to work. It seems to be a pretty regular occurrence with people working from home putting their names down but having to pull out last minute due to being too busy with work, I've ended up in 2 two balls as well. However i reckon with the weather changing you wont have anywhere near as many midweek players now.

Doesnt make any sense that you can't operate a waiting list for casual games though.

I know things can happen - but in these times, people should only be putting themselves down if they are very sure they will play - times are restricted - BRS is a mess. It isn't a time to be just sticking yourself in - or your mates who you in liberality do not know if they are going to play.

Should be something issued from clubs in light of BRS - and the lack of times.

Don't put yourself in or anyone else unless you are playing - was out today and loads of gaps - but a full time sheet.

davegilly · 04-06-2020 9:07pm

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Don't put yourself in or anyone else unless you are playing

But I was playing. And then something came up?

FixdePitchmark · 04-06-2020 10:50pm

davegilly wrote: »

But I was playing. And then something came up?

Yes - I understand. There are genuine cases.

But there are far more that are not. And just people not turning up - or worse were stuck down by someone - and were never going to play.

At this time - only stick yourself in - if very certain of playing.

bmay529 · 05-06-2020 12:46am

Our BRS system is set to open bookings from 8.10pm and the response time is very slow. Is BRS booking time in all Irish clubs the same?

GolfNut33 · 05-06-2020 6:50am

bmay529 wrote: »

Our BRS system is set to open bookings from 8.10pm and the response time is very slow. Is BRS booking time in all Irish clubs the same?

They're mostly different days/times.

Golf is my Game · 05-06-2020 6:53am

Booking opening time is set by the club itself, so up to the manager or member that handles BRS there.

I think I seen a setting also that allows the club to only allow the member who is logged in to book himself and not others or his mates as well. This would stop some of the overbooking and noshows.

Seve OB · 05-06-2020 12:01pm

Golf is my Game wrote: »

I think I seen a setting also that allows the club to only allow the member who is logged in to book himself and not others or his mates as well. This would stop some of the overbooking and noshows.

yes that can be done. i know of a club who use it all the time. however, i know at least a half dozen members there, and they all have each others log in details and book each other regularly, without even checking if they are going to play or not

BigChap1759 · 11-06-2020 12:11pm

Our timesheet opened at 12 today - the screen hung for 30 seconds then I was booted out to the login page again and by the time I'd logged in again all times gone - total shambles :mad::mad::mad:

ronnie3585 · 11-06-2020 2:43pm

BigChap1759 wrote: »

Our timesheet opened at 12 today - the screen hung for 30 seconds then I was booted out to the login page again and by the time I'd logged in again all times gone - total shambles :mad::mad::mad:

Were you using the desktop version?

I’ve found the iPhone app a hell of a lot more reliable than the desktop version.

Lefty2Guns · 12-06-2020 7:44am

Same. I was using my laptop to book via the golf clubs website and the website crashed. Started using the BRS app and no problems since.

finglashoop · 15-06-2020 9:19am

Is BRS worse than Chronogolf?

I tried to use the webpage this morning on phone browser and laptop and it is horrendous to use.

I know there is a lot of traffic but the app doesnt open until about 5 mins after browser and it should be able to cope imo

the.red.baron · 15-06-2020 11:37am

it can't be any worse that's for sure

Seve OB · 15-06-2020 12:29pm

finglashoop wrote: »

Is BRS worse than Chronogolf?

I tried to use the webpage this morning on phone browser and laptop and it is horrendous to use.

I know there is a lot of traffic but the app doesnt open until about 5 mins after browser and it should be able to cope imo

nothing is worse than chronogolf

bmay529 · 21-06-2020 4:15pm

Updated my Android tablet BRS app after noticing there was a BRS update from 10/6 (I think). Then tried same on my Android phone but did not to require update!!! even though I would have thought I had not updated it in the past 2 weeks!!!

My problems have been
1. Android tablet sometimes blank screened when app selected but fine when loaded a second time.
2. Countdown timer out of synch with another user... once 15 seconds ahead, another time 30 seconds behind with same user
3. Most lines on Booking page not available on entry as soon as countdown hit "0" and screen refreshed
4. Several times when "Book Now" button hit was told line not available. This repeated a second time only to then find there were no "reasonable" times available... frustrating I understand the concept of record locking.
5. Waiting list not automatically allocated when booking removed
6. Old style screens appeared accasonally but have not noticed that for a while.

I would imagine those with very fast internet speeds would have an advantage but there seems to be other factors influencing booking availability.

I presume there are different apps for PC/laptops, Android tablet/phone, iPad/iPhone. I wonder which are most reliable?

mighty magpie · 25-06-2020 4:21pm

Rumour round our place now is that there is a macro to book tee times on BRS once they are live.

Saturday and sunday are a nightmare to get booked in since lockdown was lifted but this one group have managed the same time everyweek.

BRS

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