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BRS

  • 02-06-2020 8:39pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 14,620 ✭✭✭✭ Seve OB


    Well the nice simple easy to use reliable BRS system looks like it has gone the way of the Devil.

    Why can't simple things be kept simple and stop all the faffing about with bells and whistles when there is no need


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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭ HighLine


    Completely agree. Also I find the app very buggy. If I click on it, it often fails to load and I have to force close the app and restart it to get it to work.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,675 ✭✭✭ ronnie3585


    Couldn’t agree more. They’re made a right balls of the desktop version. The old version was simple and straightforward, the new version is laggy and bloated.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,658 ✭✭✭ Golfgraffix


    As a competitor to BRS I'd love to come on here and to lambase them but to be fair the past few weeks have been crazy for all suppliers the sheer number of traffic is massive. Clubv1 have no support in Ireland, all the staff furloughed, IG crashed for two days in the UK and Chrono allowing 6 people on a 3 ball line. Its hard to scramble to get settings ready for each Phase, I'd imagine all the suppliers are finding it difficult to keep up at the moment.

    We have about 110 clubs on ClubNet (30 on the tee sheet), there are about 60,000 Irish club golfers using the platform, I think today we had almost 150,000 page views alone. For a few days we had issues with speed at 6pm to 7pm but that is now sorted

    At its heart BRS is a very good product and they pretty much invented the tee booking market here its their barter model that I hate.

    I'd say give them some time, I'm sure it will come good

    J


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,620 ✭✭✭✭ Seve OB


    but to be fair the past few weeks have been crazy for all suppliers the sheer number of traffic is massive.

    i accept that this has probably been the busiest and most demanding time golf booking systems have probably ever seen but as someone else has already said it, this quote really speaks for itself
    For reasons known only to BRS they decided to release a revamp to their booking system during a period of high demand and sensitivity. The resulting additional demand on their server, coupled with golf clubs releasing timesheets for every day of the week
    Ask anyone who has used multiple systems i think the majority will tell you that the original BRS was the best because it was simple and it worked.....i'm sure they will get the new version working, but from what i can see of it, its simply trying to do to much.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,380 ✭✭✭✭ FixdePitchmark


    Fair enough , well explained.

    But they just caused a major issue with no waiting list.
    Unless this is sorted quickly enough

    Seems extraordinary we have lost our much loved and needed waiting list.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,604 ✭✭✭ BigChap1759


    Fair enough , well explained.

    But they just caused a major issue with no waiting list.
    Unless this is sorted quickly enough

    Seems extraordinary we have lost our much loved and needed waiting list.

    In a busy club a wait list is 100% essential

    Spoke to someone at my club yesterday who had been in touch with them - they said they had a sw update this week and were adding more memory to the server. Hoping it will be better tomorrow when our times open up


  • Registered Users Posts: 352 ✭✭ GolfNut33


    Maybe I'm missing something but the waiting list is working for me on the new website.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭ youcancallmeal


    GolfNut33 wrote: »
    Maybe I'm missing something but the waiting list is working for me on the new website.

    Yeah working for me as well except that I can't figure out how to remove myself from a waiting list on the app, not a big deal though as it works on the website.

    With regards why it was updated I would guess it's an IT manager/consultant of some sort needed to use up budget/get a promotion and this process started well before coronavirus. I've seen it so many times before, websites or apps that are working perfectly fine getting updated(often very poorly) for no apparent reason. The consultancies that do the work are only too happy to oblige for a hefty fee, sometimes the budget means not everything can be brought over from a legacy site/app in the first phase so of course the end user loses out and the consultancy gets to keep the project going longer.


  • Registered Users Posts: 256 ✭✭ pakman


    Fair enough , well explained.

    But they just caused a major issue with no waiting list.
    Unless this is sorted quickly enough

    Seems extraordinary we have lost our much loved and needed waiting list.

    Pro in Kilcock said it just wasn't available outside of comps. It would still be worth having all the time though. Valuable slots are going unfilled due to late withdrawals and I've played twice in 2 balls in past 5 days.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,308 ✭✭✭✭ prawnsambo


    I'm a bit confused about this. Are we talking about a change from this interface?

    technology-brs-visitors.jpg


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  • Registered Users Posts: 782 ✭✭✭ thewobbler


    Yeah working for me as well except that I can't figure out how to remove myself from a waiting list on the app, not a big deal though as it works on the website.

    With regards why it was updated I would guess it's an IT manager/consultant of some sort needed to use up budget/get a promotion and this process started well before coronavirus. I've seen it so many times before, websites or apps that are working perfectly fine getting updated(often very poorly) for no apparent reason. The consultancies that do the work are only too happy to oblige for a hefty fee, sometimes the budget means not everything can be brought over from a legacy site/app in the first phase so of course the end user loses out and the consultancy gets to keep the project going longer.


    With respect.

    The old BRS system was designed before mobile phone browsers (iPhone, Android) came to prominence.

    I’d expect that upwards on 80% of BRS traffic is now on mobile devices. Minor patches have been made to cater for this over the past 10 years, but they have been minor.

    If you believe that only reason to rebuild software made for 18” screens, is “consultancy, commission, promotion”, then you shouldn’t be speaking on the subject.

    You may have gotten used to working it in mobile to the point that it felt normal. But for new users and irregular users, on mobile devices, it was a far, far from optimised experience.

    And a competitor could explain this to a golf club in less than minute.

    This redesign has been long overdue.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭ youcancallmeal


    thewobbler wrote: »
    With respect.

    The old BRS system was designed before mobile phone browsers (iPhone, Android) came to prominence.

    I’d expect that upwards on 80% of BRS traffic is now on mobile devices. Minor patches have been made to cater for this over the past 10 years, but they have been minor.

    If you believe that only reason to rebuild software made for 18” screens, is “consultancy, commission, promotion”, then you shouldn’t be speaking on the subject.

    You may have gotten used to working it in mobile to the point that it felt normal. But for new users and irregular users, on mobile devices, it was a far, far from optimised experience.

    And a competitor could explain this to a golf club in less than minute.

    This redesign has been long overdue.

    So they had a website designed for laptops/monitors and a mobile app for ios and android devices. If they had traffic analysis that indicated most or even a large proportion of users were trying to use the website on a mobile device(Instead of the app) then doing a responsive redesign would be much easier and cheaper than a complete overhaul of the platform. But I get what your saying that any half decent IT sales person would be able to sell the idea of an overhaul and probably not even mention they could just do the responsive redesign as a workaround


  • Registered Users Posts: 782 ✭✭✭ thewobbler


    So they had a website designed for laptops/monitors and a mobile app for ios and android devices. If they had traffic analysis that indicated most or even a large proportion of users were trying to use the website on a mobile device(Instead of the app) then doing a responsive redesign would be much easier and cheaper than a complete overhaul of the platform. But I get what your saying that any half decent IT sales person would be able to sell the idea of an overhaul and probably not even mention they could just do the responsive redesign as a workaround

    It’s not a responsive redesign. It’s a rebuild of the user journey to optimise it for smaller devices. You can’t patch the latter directly on top of the former as the steps, pages and components will differ greatly.


    I would expect any associated apps will either be retired or replaced by something completely different in the next few years. Having a booking app alongside a mobile optimised booking site makes little sense.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,620 ✭✭✭✭ Seve OB


    I heard the waiting list was working in so far as you could put your name on it but if a space came free it wasn’t moving you into the slot. Instead it had to be manually done by pro shop staff.
    So if they weren’t on the ball, someone drops out, maybe 5 guys in the waiting list but they don’t get moved. Someone else logs in and grabs the free slot


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭ bustercherry


    So they had a website designed for laptops/monitors and a mobile app for ios and android devices. If they had traffic analysis that indicated most or even a large proportion of users were trying to use the website on a mobile device(Instead of the app) then doing a responsive redesign would be much easier and cheaper than a complete overhaul of the platform. But I get what your saying that any half decent IT sales person would be able to sell the idea of an overhaul and probably not even mention they could just do the responsive redesign as a workaround

    The new web interface is responsive :rolleyes:

    This was 20+ year old platform using a technology stack that reflects that. Legacy software and infrastructure gets to the point it's too expensive to maintain (and add new features) over replacing with more modern stacks. You can't just put lipstick on a pig.

    I also suspect (or at least that would have been the first thing I would have done) the entire backend was moved to a cloud provider over maintaining their own infrastructure too. Which is in the current climate could be a stroke of luck because things that are build 20+ years ago don't tend to scale quickly.

    You know that statement about a little bit of knowledge...... I think that probably applies here.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭ youcancallmeal


    The new web interface is responsive :rolleyes:

    This was 20+ year old platform using a technology stack that reflects that. Legacy software and infrastructure gets to the point it's too expensive to maintain (and add new features) over replacing with more modern stacks. You can't just put lipstick on a pig.

    I also suspect (or at least that would have been the first thing I would have done) the entire backend was moved to a cloud provider over maintaining their own infrastructure too. Which is in the current climate could be a stroke of luck because things that are build 20+ years ago don't tend to scale quickly.

    You know that statement about a little bit of knowledge...... I think that probably applies here.

    Sounds like many a sales pitch meeting I've been in before :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,202 ✭✭✭ woodyg


    Ok to fill in what i suspect BRS have done.
    As they are a division of GolfNow (NBC Sports Group) they have migrated to using Kubernetes on Google Compute Engine.
    This would have involved both a complete shift of the infrastructure and code base of the website.
    GolfNow moved to using Node.js and MongoDB from the old on premise C# and SQL Servers a couple of years ago now so i fully suspect
    BRS have followed the parent company to this DevOps model.

    that level of work is a massive undertaking as you are completely redoing the entire companies systems and not just a straight forward website redesign.

    anyways back to golf, i think the website is fine cause it means we are actually back playing golf!
    i was delighted to play my 1st round saturday since the 6th of march.


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 21,858 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Kiith


    woodyg wrote: »
    Ok to fill in what i suspect BRS have done.
    As they are a division of GolfNow (NBC Sports Group) they have migrated to using Kubernetes on Google Compute Engine.
    This would have involved both a complete shift of the infrastructure and code base of the website.
    GolfNow moved to using Node.js and MongoDB from the old on premise C# and SQL Servers a couple of years ago now so i fully suspect
    BRS have followed the parent company to this DevOps model.

    that level of work is a massive undertaking as you are completely redoing the entire companies systems and not just a straight forward website redesign.

    87b9cb4a6223d224e1dd778bed9bbab6.png

    Sorry, couldn't resist, even though i understood most of that :P


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,202 ✭✭✭ woodyg


    Kiith wrote: »
    87b9cb4a6223d224e1dd778bed9bbab6.png

    Sorry, couldn't resist, even though i understood most of that :P
    trust me i was thinking the same as i was writing it :D
    it's the curse of my day job


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,225 ✭✭✭ JCDUB


    woodyg wrote: »
    Ok to fill in what i suspect BRS have done.
    As they are a division of GolfNow (NBC Sports Group) they have migrated to using Kubernetes on Google Compute Engine.
    This would have involved both a complete shift of the infrastructure and code base of the website.
    GolfNow moved to using Node.js and MongoDB from the old on premise C# and SQL Servers a couple of years ago now so i fully suspect
    BRS have followed the parent company to this DevOps model.

    that level of work is a massive undertaking as you are completely redoing the entire companies systems and not just a straight forward website redesign.

    anyways back to golf, i think the website is fine cause it means we are actually back playing golf!
    i was delighted to play my 1st round saturday since the 6th of march.

    I know absolutely nothing about the technicalities of what has been or will be done with the BRS website.

    However I, and the dogs on the street, do know that this was not the time to carry out a complete interface change to the website, thereby incapacitating the waiting list facility, along with whatever gremlins were thrown up.

    Even if it worked perfectly, and there was a functioning waiting list, this was not the time for a change. I've heard multiple members of my club giving out about it. In fairness I think it's just the change they're giving out about, "I used to know my way around, now I can't find anything" etc.

    That, coupled with no waiting list, stress around getting on the sheet and way higher demand on spots on the sheet, makes the timing absolutely ridiculous.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,576 ✭✭✭✭ PARlance


    The new web interface is responsive :rolleyes:

    This was 20+ year old platform using a technology stack that reflects that. Legacy software and infrastructure gets to the point it's too expensive to maintain (and add new features) over replacing with more modern stacks. You can't just put lipstick on a pig.

    I also suspect (or at least that would have been the first thing I would have done) the entire backend was moved to a cloud provider over maintaining their own infrastructure too. Which is in the current climate could be a stroke of luck because things that are build 20+ years ago don't tend to scale quickly.

    You know that statement about a little bit of knowledge...... I think that probably applies here.

    It was required but rolling it out during the busiest period for bookings in those 20 years, was a crazy decision. It wouldn't have taken much foresight to see a huge surge once golf opened up again and that this would ease over the following months as people return to work.


  • Registered Users Posts: 782 ✭✭✭ thewobbler


    PARlance wrote: »
    It was required but rolling it out during the busiest period for bookings in those 20 years, was a crazy decision. It wouldn't have taken much foresight to see a huge surge once golf opened up again and that this would ease over the following months as people return to work.

    I’d expect that the software was ready to go months ago but a certain virus put paid to final testing and release.

    Judging by the comment two above, there would never have been a good time to relaunch for those people who “knew their way around”.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,308 ✭✭✭✭ prawnsambo


    prawnsambo wrote: »
    I'm a bit confused about this. Are we talking about a change from this interface?

    technology-brs-visitors.jpg
    Nobody actually answered this, so I'll explain why I asked and maybe then get a definitive answer.



    Our club has been on a newer interface of this for over a year. I've seen the above older one on other club websites in the intervening time. So if that's the case, the rollout didn't just start in the last month, but has been tested on a number of sites for a considerable period.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭ bustercherry


    Am I missing something, the new site and app was available before Covid-19?
    Unless there was some sort of A/B testing going on but our club was using the latest prior to lockdown.

    I'd say they dodged a bullet by having this out. I wouldn't have liked to try and scale the old BRS to accommodate the current loads on the system.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,308 ✭✭✭✭ prawnsambo


    Am I missing something, the new site and app was available before Covid-19?
    Unless there was some sort of A/B testing going on but our club was using the latest prior to lockdown.

    I'd say they dodged a bullet by having this out. I wouldn't have liked to try and scale the old BRS to accommodate the current loads on the system.
    Exactly what I was saying. We've had that running since the end of January last year. And running concurrently with the old one for a couple of months before that.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭ HighLine


    Another (minor) gripe I have with the desktop version, they no longer have different colours for different formats of play. So for my club, next Monday for is divided up into different hours of competitions and causal golf but all the one colour. A simple colour differentiation worked well on the old version and is also present on the current app.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,576 ✭✭✭✭ PARlance


    Am I missing something, the new site and app was available before Covid-19?
    Unless there was some sort of A/B testing going on but our club was using the latest prior to lockdown.

    I'd say they dodged a bullet by having this out. I wouldn't have liked to try and scale the old BRS to accommodate the current loads on the system.

    Our desktop & mobile site only changed about 10 days ago so it must have been staggered/testing going on.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,620 ✭✭✭✭ Seve OB


    prawnsambo wrote: »
    Nobody actually answered this, so I'll explain why I asked and maybe then get a definitive answer.



    Our club has been on a newer interface of this for over a year. I've seen the above older one on other club websites in the intervening time. So if that's the case, the rollout didn't just start in the last month, but has been tested on a number of sites for a considerable period.

    that screen grab looks more like the older version if you ask me


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 296 ✭✭ Golf is my Game


    We have the new one since last year some time. HAvent noticed any difference in the way it works, but it does look a bit more modern. The old one did seem a bit like a DOS era look to it.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,380 ✭✭✭✭ FixdePitchmark


    HighLine wrote: »
    Another (minor) gripe I have with the desktop version, they no longer have different colours for different formats of play. So for my club, next Monday for is divided up into different hours of competitions and causal golf but all the one colour. A simple colour differentiation worked well on the old version and is also present on the current app.

    To be honest the colour coding across everything is terrible - mostly a blob of grey - hard to even pick names out .


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