Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

Jayesdiem wrote: »

I heard again today how clothes shops are going to have quarantine trousers for 24 hrs after try ons by customers. Kids will be shuttled round schools in military formation and don’t get me started on how ball breaking air travel is going to be from now on. All because we overreacted in 2020, our lives change forever.

Just curious to know who you heard from that clothes shops were going to have to "quarantine" trousers post after being tried on?
And let's be honest our lives have not changed forever......slightly ott comment.

Penfailed wrote: »

Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.

No. He’s (supposedly) Health Minister crowing about “social distancing” for the past 3 months. A large march with no social distancing and breaking several others of the blessed “rules” and he’s decidedly reticent to criticise

MickeyLeari wrote: »

Arghus - I asked you this but don’t know if you saw it. If you already answered my apologies.
I would genuinely like to know what your thoughts are on this?

I'll answer as best I can. At the end of the day I'm just another yahoo on boards. I don't pretend to have all the answers.

- do you think the current plans to ease out to August are appropriate? Noting also that it is moving to a new normal?

I think our current plans to ease out to August are very conservative, but I don't really have a problem with them taking a slow and steady approach to begin with. It all depends on case numbers. Today's number of cases was very encouraging - if that becomes a trend there's no real justification for dragging things out until August. If things continue to improve I don't have a problem with them moving things forward. I think once a government is formed and if there's no uptick in cases, I think they'll have to move quicker. 

- do you think that the 2m social distance requirement is sensible (noting Germany has a 1.5m requirement) and that such a requirement will reduce health care capacity and make many business unviable?

I think the 2m requirement should be looked at, bearing in mind that some - but not all - countries don't require that same level of distancing. I'm not a zealot on any of these issues - I can change my mind depending on new information. There seems to be a lot of uncertainty about the science still - despite what has become, in the eyes of many, an accepted fact over the last few weeks:

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-52522460

We have to take a calculated risk. Is 2m safer than 1m - yes. But does it create too much of an onerous burden on businesses, hospitals etc,etc and on social activity that outweigh it's potential benefits? Perhaps it does. If the virus isn't circulating freely and spreading, but yet businesses can't function because of the 2m rule - then you have to be prepared to change that rule. A recommendation of 2m, rather than a hard and unflexible rule of 2m is probably the way to go.

Though, I do think there's some merit in the argument that if you tell people to stay 2 metres apart, rather than 1 metre - it means that in practice people make more of an effort to maintain social distancing. They may not necessarily keep the full 2 metres, but they keep some distance - once you say 1 metre that can mean in practice people don't really maintain any noticeable difference.

- would you agree that an accelerated reopening with proper safeguards on the basis of risk may be more effective than an unregulated free for all?

Yes, of course.

- do you have any concerns in respect to the governance and structures influencing Government decisions (note today’s Irish Times with unnamed sources providing opinions ahead of the Nphet meeting on Thursday)?

Yes, I do.

- do you think blanket travel restrictions are necessary or perhaps better to have safe corridors based on risk?

Anything is better - if it's a workable and safe plan - than a blanket ban. Correct me if wrong but there hasn't been a blanket travel ban on international travel either to on from Ireland - there's been a strong recommendation to avoid all unessential travel - but if there was a flight and you wanted to catch it, you could still catch it. Now, you may still have to quarantine when you arrive at your destination - but that isn't anything to do with the Irish authorities.

I agree with quarantine measures for incoming tourists - it should have been imposed sooner - but realistically I don't think it's going to continue for a great deal longer. There's a lot of pressure on government already to scrap it and I think they'll take the easy win in the next fortnight or so and get rid of it, or at least modify it. I think it's a bit of a red herring to be honest. Can you see massive numbers of people flying all around Europe this summer? And whatever about the rest of it, I don't think we should take our lead when it comes to public health measures on what most pleases Michael O' Leary's bank balance.

My view is that this is a dangerous disease, that the decision to lock down was the right one at the time, but also that the Government has made a mess out of the last month in terms of easing this. They have been all over the place on messaging. The “plan” is overly complicated, is too long, is incoherent in terms of managing risk, and that this will be damaging in terms of bringing the people with them.

Yes, they have become increasingly erratic on the messaging. It doesn't help that the government is the last gasp of the previous one and I think all of the political players have been dragging their heels on purpose, hoping that shyte will blow over and then they can appear to ride to the rescue when all the hard work is over. There's been a willingness to hide behind NPHET and the DoH as time has gone on and to let them take the flack for every single unpalatable decision, even if they're only advising solely on the basis of public health - which is exactly what they are supposed to be doing - and ultimately decision making has to lie in the powers of the government.

jluv wrote: »

I'm in favour of hairdressers being back sooner but with the proper procedures being in place. Unity in a workgroup is important. I'm not a hairdresser BTW. The person working in the black market IMO is belittling the rest of their co workers. Only in it for their personal gain.

When barbers and hair dressers reopen, what does it matter if its tomorrow? Is the virus going to stop targeting them on whatever bull**** date the government has pulled out of their ass? If i was a high risk candidate, I just wouldnt go get my hair cut or get someone in household etc to do it....

Its not life or death, getting hair done. So if the virus could be be life or death for you, I'd suggest leaving going to the local barber or hairdresser to get your hair done!

road_high wrote: »

Normally I’d be down on welfare fraud like a ton of bricks but in this case I say fair fcuks to them- get the cash in hand and take the payment too. These unmitigated idiots closed the economy, none of these people had any say or choice. Idiots like Varadkar and Harris deserve all they get.

That's a very disgraceful opinion IMO..

road_high wrote: »

Is there any reason we can’t have the important instruction now?

No..we have to see how we as a country how each restriction impacts us. But I actually would support hairdressers coming back one phase sooner than planned. Still dont support black market accepting covid payment. Choose one or the other..

Idbatterim wrote: »

Which bit do you disagree with ?

The redistribution here of wealth here from the working poor to wasters on welfare, in government and spent on appalling value for money projects, the words most expensive hospital, a printer that doesn't fit into the dail etc ...

Someone who is actively earning and accepting a social welfare payment while flouting the instruction from the goverment that they are taking the payment from..

Idbatterim wrote: »

Better in a workers hand than wasted by the government. What will they spend it on? Margaret cash 80k welfare a year etc. Decreasing the oap age in a cynical vote grab? It's the young to youmgish and workers here screwed, nobody else ...

ah, i was wondering when you would drag up Margaret cash and some mythical wellfare figure that doesn't exist.

road_high wrote: »

Normally I’d be down on welfare fraud like a ton of bricks but in this case I say fair fcuks to them- get the cash in hand and take the payment too. These unmitigated idiots closed the economy, none of these people had any say or choice. Idiots like Varadkar and Harris deserve all they get.

so wellfare fraud is fine when you disagree with da gubbament?
right so.

Idbatterim wrote: »

Yes and who's paying the price for all of this? The previous bust, bank bailout. Shutting people out of the housing market with their holy grail of property related robbery and wealth transfer to the older generations and banks etc? Its depraved. I fully support recentky unemployed aking everything they can. It just means less to be spent on wasters and ****e down the road. The dog financial geniuses came up with the flat e350 rate to be silent in local economy, which they have **** down. Taje it all while it lasts. Bevaysevthey **** show they have engineered ie going to become apparent to the masses in a few months...

less to be spent on wasters?
the amount of money that goes to wasters is tiny.
it will be things like housing and infrastructure and other services which will have less spent on them, the very things you are often complaining about on here.

Penfailed wrote: »

Eh? No one. Absolutely no one wants more cases.

That’s good to hear ;-)

end of the road wrote: »

not fair play to them and hopefully the government will penalise them in some form.
we all want these restrictions lifted as quickly as possible but businesses instructed not to open until a later faze breaking the rules cannot be tolerated at any cost.

Yep we're entirely fúcked if the likes of Brown Thomas takes over the show:pac:. The government such as it is need to start leading here.

jluv wrote: »

That's a very disgraceful opinion IMO..

Yep. Complaining that lockdown is affecting the economy but condoning people doing the double and affecting the economy.

end of the road wrote: »

not fair play to them and hopefully the government will penalise them in some form.
we all want these restrictions lifted as quickly as possible but businesses instructed not to open until a later faze breaking the rules cannot be tolerated at any cost.

Nah I completely disagree. These are only guidelines not laws, if they can open with precautions in place and new operating procedures to ensure safety then more power to them.
Might get a few of the 1.1 million people currently signing on off the live register which can only be a good, positive thing.

They are forcing businesses into a financial suicide mission by forcing them to stay closed for another month (and longer) having been closed for almost three months already, meanwhile Leo gave the nod of approval to the mass gathering of thousands at the protest yesterday.
The government are talking out both sides of their mouth and business owners can see right through it.

If I could afford to go in and support their efforts I would but unfortunately having lost my job I’m in no position to do so.
Hopefully others will be able to spend in there so some money can be pumped into the local economy.

Idbatterim wrote: »

When barbers and hair dressers reopen, what does it matter if its tomorrow? Is the virus going to stop targeting them on whatever bull**** date the government has pulled out of their ass? If i was a high risk candidate, I just wouldnt go get my hair cut or get someone in household etc to do it....

Its not life or death, getting hair done. So if the virus could be be life or death for you, I'd suggest leaving going to the local barber or hairdresser to get your hair done!

Personally doesn't affect me. Grey hair and pull back.
It's a very hands on, fully contact job. Safety of the supplier and the customer. Both equally important. Need to get it right to to ensure safety to both. Hairdressers/barbers have families too that they may be concerned about too. So another few weeks..

jluv wrote: »

Personally doesn't affect me. Grey hair and pull back.
It's a very hands on, fully contact job. Safety of the supplier and the customer. Both equally important. Need to get it right to to ensure safety to both. Hairdressers/barbers have families too that they may be concerned about too. So another few weeks..

Reopening isn’t mandatory, regardless of when we allow businesses to do so.
If any hairdressers and barbers still think it’s too risky they are under no obligation to start taking appointments.
Most of the ones I know have plans in place since late March and full waiting lists and are now raring to get back going.
They shouldn’t all be prevented from doing so just because a small phantom minority of them might still have concerns.

Equally, going to the hairdressers won’t be compulsory for the general public so those who are risk averse won’t be effected.
I myself will be back in the chair at the earliest opportunity possible, I have a deposit paid and appointment booked for over 2 months now.