Covid19 Part XVI- 21,983 in ROI (1,339 deaths) 3,881 in NI (404 deaths)(05/05)Read OP

Miike · 04-05-2020 12:48AM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Flu is blamed for the majority of stuff here without testing. I was quite badly sick in January and the doctor said it was the flu without testing me. I'm fairly certain this is a regular occurrence.

January is the peak of flu season. The likelihood you had flu is much higher than you having COVID19. Flu is a very serious illness and not to be scoffed at. It's debilitating. We generally don't test people in the community for flu unless they are severely ill, in which case you'll get tested in hospital.

cnocbui · 04-05-2020 12:49AM

US officials believe China covered up the extent of the coronavirus outbreak - and how contagious the disease is - to stock up on medical supplies needed to respond to it, intelligence documents show.

Chinese leaders "intentionally concealed the severity" of the pandemic from the world in early January, according to a four-page Department of Homeland Security report dated May 1 and obtained by The Associated Press.

https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-america/china-hid-coronavirus-severity-to-hoard-supplies-report-20200504-p54ph0.html

I rather suspected this was the case when reports came out of Chinese companies buying up a major chunk of the available PPE gear in Australia and shipping it to China before Australia was aware it would soon be needing it.

I hope the West can cooperate in formulating a reckoning for China's various reprehensible actions of late.

wakka12 · 04-05-2020 12:52AM

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

I've said it many times, this disease has been in Europe since Dec or earlier, and in Wuhan since Oct mostly likely. You don't fine these things straight away.

And why all the deaths in Europe occurred so suddenly and simultaneously across the continent right after the outbreak in Italy was uncovered? Why did none of the thousands of tests done in Ireland or UK or any other european country in February come back positive? How come loads of old people werent dying? Why did excess deaths only increase in March in Europe?

I know it is odd that it took so long to arrive to Europe given how infectious we are told it is. But theres actually a lot more proof it wasnt circulating(widely at least) in Europe until March than there is that it was

Stheno · 04-05-2020 12:58AM

Miike wrote: »

That would be the case, yes. But we have no retrospective diagnoses of this type of pneumonia. If our first case WAS someone presenting with this type of pneumonia it would be logical to assume there are other patients. In fact even in an isolated case prior to this being declared a PHEIC by WHO, contact tracing would have picked up other cases, but again, this relies on us actually knowing what we're dealing with (which by January, we sort-of did. Sort of.)

Sorry to answer you're question with more ifs and buts :pac:

It's certainly food for thought. I'm not saying it's IMPOSSIBLE it wasn't here months earlier. I just think (with what we now know in relation to how this spreads) it's HIGHLY unlikely.

Ah you're grand, I was more thinking it was here mid Janusry rather than November.

Time will tell when they do mass antibody testing as to the extent of it

Thanks!

fritzelly · 04-05-2020 01:00AM

cnocbui wrote: »

https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-america/china-hid-coronavirus-severity-to-hoard-supplies-report-20200504-p54ph0.html

I rather suspected this was the case when reports came out of Chinese companies buying up a major chunk of the available PPE gear in Australia and shipping it to China before Australia was aware it would soon be needing it.

I hope the West can cooperate in formulating a reckoning for China's various reprehensible actions of late.

Asked the question many many threads ago would this make countries think about having so much supply dependent on China
There used to be a time when countries all had supply chains feeding other countries so we were all inter dependent on each other but if one chain broke down you could easily switch
Now we rely so much on China for everything - tho it is changing as other Asian countries try to get in on the game

castletownman · 04-05-2020 01:08AM

Come to think of it, I know of at least two people who were admitted to hospital with pneumonia around the same time straddling Nov-Dec (although in mitigation both were elderly but one of them almost died). And I have said on here before that I had the worst bout of "flu" I have ever had around the same time. Was still coughing my lungs up now and again until February but only missed one day of work.

And I am starting to panic a bit now because if what I had WAS c19, then there was a girl who was doing a week's work experience in my work-place in February who has since contracted the virus and has been heavily sedated in hospital for a while. Crazy to think I may have spread it.

Miike · 04-05-2020 01:08AM

Stheno wrote: »

Ah you're grand, I was more thinking it was here mid Janusry rather than November.

Time will tell when they do mass antibody testing as to the extent of it

Thanks!

Yeah I'm really looking forward to the data from antibody testing, to be honest. We have some hurdles to jump over before that comes online though!

In another vein I'm also really looking forward to the RCTs on BCG vaccination as prophylaxis. Article for anyone interested: https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31025-4/fulltext

fritzelly · 04-05-2020 01:15AM

castletownman wrote: »

And I am starting to panic a bit now because if what I had WAS c19, then there was a girl who was doing a week's work experience in my work-place in February who has since contracted the virus and has been heavily sedated in hospital for a while. Crazy to think I may have spread it.

Why panic??? IF you had it you survived and hopefully have some immunity

New Home · 04-05-2020 01:19AM

fritzelly wrote: »

Why panic??? IF you had it you survived and hopefully have some immunity

If you read the rest, you'll see he's not worried for himself.

fritzelly · 04-05-2020 01:23AM

New Home wrote: »

If you read the rest, you'll see he's not worried for himself.

Spreading it 2/3 months later

New Home · 04-05-2020 01:25AM

Was still coughing my lungs up now and again until February but only missed one day of work.

And I am starting to panic a bit now because if what I had WAS c19, then there was a girl who was doing a week's work experience in my work-place in February who has since contracted the virus and has been heavily sedated in hospital for a while. Crazy to think I may have spread it.

That bit.

fritzelly · 04-05-2020 01:30AM

New Home wrote: »

That bit.

Why would you be going round that long coughing up your lungs - give up the fags

Sounds more like a madey uppey story

Stheno · 04-05-2020 01:38AM

fritzelly wrote: »

Why panic??? IF you had it you survived and hopefully have some immunity

If and it's a big if, mass antibody testing reveals twice the number of people had it than tested (NPHET modelling assumption) and I was one of those people, I'd wonder if I had unknowingly spread it to someone I knew became severely I'll

I think that's where the poster was coming from and it's understandable but not something for op to fret over

I was at my doctor in mid March with a cough, sore throat, blocked nose, chills, tiredness (slept 18 hours a day for a week), chest and muscle pain , most of which I have with a sinus infection bar the chills, sleeping and muscle pain

As I'd no temperature she was happy I didnt have it. I'd be sent for a test with the same symptoms if they changed the criteria to remove priority groups tomorrow

BorneTobyWilde · 04-05-2020 01:46AM

wakka12 wrote: »

And why all the deaths in Europe occurred so suddenly and simultaneously across the continent right after the outbreak in Italy was uncovered? Why did none of the thousands of tests done in Ireland or UK or any other european country in February come back positive? How come loads of old people werent dying? Why did excess deaths only increase in March in Europe?

I know it is odd that it took so long to arrive to Europe given how infectious we are told it is. But theres actually a lot more proof it wasnt circulating(widely at least) in Europe until March than there is that it was

Of course people were dying, but it had no name, there was no test. People were dead and buried and no one questioned it.

Stheno · 04-05-2020 01:47AM

fritzelly wrote: »

Why would you be going round that long coughing up your lungs - give up the fags

Sounds more like a madey uppey story

Whatever I had in March ( was at doctor on March 10) cleared about a week ago, mainly the cough, chest pain and tiredness!

jobeenfitz · 04-05-2020 01:47AM

I was convinced that people saying the virus was here earlier were talking shyte. My 9 year old granddaughter came to Spain with me before Christmas.

She had a sore throat and a bit of a temperature leaving Spain on 6th Jan. Her mother had to bring her to doctor next day cos of high temperature. She got a rash and after ringing doctor she said to switch to another medicine as she may be allergic. She was really sick for about 5 days.

I came back to Ireland on 8th with similar symptoms but not as bad as granddaughter. I had gotten flu jab in Galway in November.

Im not saying it was covid 19 but I'm now more open on the issue.

fritzelly · 04-05-2020 01:59AM

Stheno wrote: »

Whatever I had in March ( was at doctor on March 10) cleared about a week ago, mainly the cough, chest pain and tiredness!

It seems a lot of people are trying to convince themselves they all had this in Nov/Dec/Jan
There is just no justification for it
Some strange flu like virus that flu tests showed negative for then some scientist somewhere in the world would have spotted it - you don't just have people ending up in hospital because of pneumonia and all tests are negative so you just say ah well next patient

Just going by the number of people on this thread if it was coronavirus then it would have been rampant thru the country and hospitals should have been overloaded - but they weren't

As for the other poster worrying about having spread it to here colleague - as Dr Holohan says, no blame for spreading it can be put on anyone, it like most viruses are easily spreadable. You could spread flu to someone and it kills them but if they didn't catch off you they could have caught it off someone else.

owlbethere · 04-05-2020 02:00AM

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20181101-the-mystery-viruses-far-worse-than-flu

This is a good read from November 2018.

shaveAbullock · 04-05-2020 02:01AM

jobeenfitz wrote: »

Im not saying it was covid 19 but I'm now more open on the issue.

That's it exactly, Europe has had had COVID-19 since november. That's why ICU's across the continent units have been full since December. All hospital stall were told not to tell the general public until March to avoid panic.

Now you will have some on here say what you and your daughter had was a nasty strain of the flu that was not covered in the vaccine(4 strains are covered in the vaccine)

But don't believe them, please make up your own mind.

Miike · 04-05-2020 02:03AM

owlbethere wrote: »

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20181101-the-mystery-viruses-far-worse-than-flu

This is a good read from November 2018.

If you actually liked reading this and are into this kind of historical perspective on things you should check out the book "The Ghost Map" by Steven Johnson. Very good read!

Miike · 04-05-2020 02:04AM

shaveAbullock wrote: »

That's it exactly, Europe has had had COVID-19 since november. That's why ICU's across the continent units have been full since December. All hospital stall were told not to tell the general public until March to avoid panic.

Now you will have some on here say what you and your daughter had was a nasty strain of the flu that was not covered in the vaccine(4 strains are covered in the vaccine)

But don't believe them, please make up your own mind.

:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

fritzelly · 04-05-2020 02:04AM

shaveAbullock wrote: »

That's it exactly, Europe has had had COVID-19 since november. That's why ICU's across the continent units have been full since December. All hospital stall were told not to tell the general public until March to avoid panic.

Now you will have some on here say what you and your daughter had was a nasty strain of the flu that was not covered in the vaccine(4 strains are covered in the vaccine)

But don't believe them, please make up your own mind.

You forgot to mention 5G is the cause

Xertz · 04-05-2020 02:06AM

There was a bad flu going around at the end of last year.
I was vaccinated. I always get a flu jab, both because it’s just handy to have less chance of getting flu but also because I’ve vulnerable relatives I visit from time to time and need to protect them.

However, around Christmas Day I got a really bad set of flu like symptoms. Fever, headache, cough, chest tightness, when I was breathing out it sounded like Rice Krispies snap, crackle and pop. It had me in bed for nearly two weeks and I lost a full stone in weight.

I recovered but it took ages to get back to normal.

Other family members (who I don’t live with but would be in contact with a lot) also all got the same virus.

My dad got it and developed pneumonia (diagnosed based on blood oxygen), but was just treated at home with antibiotics, antivirals, steroids and an inhaler. He *still* has a cough and it’s only slowly improving this last couple of weeks.

He had a lung check - CT and bronchoscopy in February due to the seriousness of the cough but it revealed nothing of any concern.

Anyway, we all survived but I’d be fascinated to see if I have antibodies for Coronavirus / SARS-CoV-2.

I’m willing to accept it was most likely flu but even so, just would be very interring to see.

Stheno · 04-05-2020 02:07AM

fritzelly wrote: »

It seems a lot of people are trying to convince themselves they all had this in Nov/Dec/Jan
There is just no justification for it
Some strange flu like virus that flu tests showed negative for then some scientist somewhere in the world would have spotted it - you don't just have people ending up in hospital because of pneumonia and all tests are negative so you just say ah well next patient

Just going by the number of people on this thread if it was coronavirus then it would have been rampant thru the country and hospitals should have been overloaded - but they weren't

As for the other poster worrying about having spread it to here colleague - as Dr Holohan says, no blame for spreading it can be put on anyone, it like most viruses are easily spreadable. You could spread flu to someone and it kills them but if they didn't catch off you they could have caught it off someone else.

Eh I was responding to you saying someone with a cough for weeks was making something up

Dont think I ever claimed this was around since November

The illness I had was in March and took about six weeks to clear

RicketyCricket · 04-05-2020 02:08AM

shaveAbullock wrote: »

That's it exactly, Europe has had had COVID-19 since november. That's why ICU's across the continent units have been full since December. All hospital stall were told not to tell the general public until March to avoid panic.

Now you will have some on here say what you and your daughter had was a nasty strain of the flu that was not covered in the vaccine(4 strains are covered in the vaccine)

But don't believe them, please make up your own mind.

That some ****e you're spouting.

fritzelly · 04-05-2020 02:08AM

Stheno wrote: »

Eh I was responding to you saying someone with a cough for weeks was making something up

Dont think I ever claimed this was around since November

The illness I had was in March and took about six weeks to clear

Wasn't having a go at you, just airing my thoughts

jobeenfitz · 04-05-2020 02:10AM

fritzelly wrote: »

It seems a lot of people are trying to convince themselves they all had this in Nov/Dec/Jan
There is just no justification for it
Some strange flu like virus that flu tests showed negative for then some scientist somewhere in the world would have spotted it - you don't just have people ending up in hospital because of pneumonia and all tests are negative so you just say ah well next patient

Just going by the number of people on this thread if it was coronavirus then it would have been rampant thru the country and hospitals should have been overloaded - but they weren't

As for the other poster worrying about having spread it to here colleague - as Dr Holohan says, no blame for spreading it can be put on anyone, it like most viruses are easily spreadable. You could spread flu to someone and it kills them but if they didn't catch off you they could have caught it off someone else.

Maybe most of it was flu or something else and people are mistaken. Maybe there were some sporadic cases though.

If it was in any other European country earlier than first thought, then there's a decent chance it was also here. how can you be so sure it wasn't covid. We're they checking for it here in January?

Are we sure none of the people who died in Jan/Feb died from covid?

Miike · 04-05-2020 02:10AM

Xertz wrote: »

There was a bad flu going around at the end of last year.
I was vaccinated. I always get a flu jab, both because it’s just handy to have less chance of getting flu but also because I’ve vulnerable relatives I visit from time to time and need to protect them.

However, around Christmas Day I got a really bad set of flu like symptoms. Fever, headache, cough, chest tightness, when I was breathing out it sounded like Rice Krispies snap, crackle and pop. It had me in bed for nearly two weeks and I lost a full stone in weight.

I recovered but it took ages to get back to normal.

Other family members (who I don’t live with but would be in contact with a lot) also all got the same virus.

My dad got it and developed pneumonia (diagnosed based on blood oxygen), but was just treated at home with antibiotics, antivirals, steroids and an inhaler. He *still* has a cough and it’s only slowly improving this last couple of weeks.

He had a lung check - CT and bronchoscopy in February due to the seriousness of the cough but it revealed nothing of any concern.

Anyway, we all survived but I’d be fascinated to see if I have antibodies for Coronavirus / SARS-CoV-2.

I’m willing to accept it was most likely flu but even so, just would be very interring to see.

SARS-CoV-2 is very obvious in patients with severe illness in imaging studies. The CT would have showed bilateral ground glass and consolidative pulmonary opacities.

Xertz · 04-05-2020 02:11AM

shaveAbullock wrote: »

That's it exactly, Europe has had had COVID-19 since november. That's why ICU's across the continent units have been full since December. All hospital stall were told not to tell the general public until March to avoid panic .

No offence but, how the hell would you get *all* the ICU staff in Europe to do that. You’re talking about tens of thousands of hospitals and hundreds of thousands of staff. They’re not going to keep something like that a secret. It’s an impossible and ludicrous suggestion.

They’re not even all hospitals run by the same owners / management. Most EU countries, including Ireland, have public systems with a range of public and private providers and hospitals. Many EU countries have more of a universal public health insurance model than a direct provision one like the NHS.

If you’d an outbreak in hospitals you could count to 10 by the time it would be alerted to health agencies that track it and you would have had it in the media by lunch time. This is Europe, not China. There isn’t an ability or desire to do coverups like that. If anything, the systems are setup to do the complete opposite and you’d have had it published in various reports and journals, with academics rushing to get their papers out.

If SARS-CoV-2 was in Europe or North America late last year on a small scale, it would have had to be going unnoticed and being misidentified as flu and generic viral pneumonia.

shaveAbullock · 04-05-2020 02:12AM

RicketyCricket wrote: »

That some ****e you're spouting.

I'm not the one that said they contracted COVID-19 in November from visiting Spain.

Covid19 Part XVI- 21,983 in ROI (1,339 deaths) 3,881 in NI (404 deaths)(05/05)Read OP

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