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Relaxation of restrictions Part II

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  • #1232
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    Downlinz wrote: »
    I expected and hoped for easing restrictions on May 5th but at this point I think the lockdown is likely to continue for another couple of weeks and would agree with that outcome.
    The numbers haven't dropped quick enough and I think the goal from all this should be to ensure that this is the one and only lockdown, with the information we have on reoccurences in places like Singapore I think it's fair to say that if we re-open soon we're going to wind up in a state of flux bouncing between open and lockdown for the rest of the year which would be a horrible situation.

    Patience from everyone and locking down May and I think we'll see the path back to something resembling normality in June.

    But why though?
    Society has to reopen at some point and regardless of how gradually we reopen the various industries, or when we do it, there WILL be a spike in cases when that happens.
    Whether we do it in May or in June or even 2021 is irrelevant because there will be the same outcome. More movement = more cases.
    Striving to further reduce the amount of transmission (which is already extremely low) is absolutely fruitless when the second we open up anything, it’s undoubtedly going to rise again.
    The virus is going nowhere and the sooner we adapt to this new way of life the better.
    So staying locked up for another month is actually completely pointless and will do nothing but delay the inevitable.

    We have flattened the curve, prepared our hospitals and educated our people on the severity of the situation. That was the purpose & aim of the lockdown and we have achieved that goal. In the face of an untreatable, incurable novel virus, that’s about all we can do.

    We can’t stay at home forever and if we don’t get people back to work we’re going to have a much worse problem in a few months time from the impact this is having on everyone’s mental health & quality of life.
    I think we have all sacrificed plenty, we have put in as much effort & preparation as possible for the greater good but balance must be struck for the well-being of everyone.


  • #1233
    almostover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭almostover


    JoeA3 wrote: »
    I honestly feel that Varadkar, Harris, the CMO and RTÉ are speaking to the nation like we are all fcuking simpleton lemmings. If I hear one of them bleat about “staying the course” or “stay at home” one more time, I swear....

    I’m very weary of it. It’s only been 6-7 weeks but it feels like it’s been 6 months. I think the message they are feebly trying to bat us over the head with is rapidly losing meaning. I didn’t see tonight’s CMO conference but Tony was completely ridiculous lastnight. R0 down to near zero. No spread in community for 2 last weeks. Yet he’s speaking to us like some disapproving school teacher, that we’re still on “detention”.

    The media, including our national broadcaster are putting their own convenient spin on it. Here in the West of Ireland we’ve had the most miserable fcuking 6-7 months of endless rain and storm after storm. The lockdown just happens to coincide with a long overdue decent spell of sunshine. Quelle surprise. People are out and about enjoying the sunshine. Yet this is being reported like the people doing so are villainous cretins. It’s completely ludicrous, a spin to suit an agenda.

    It’s clear I’m not alone in this, judging by this thread and what I see all around me every day, particularly the last few days. Honestly I probably was a bit nervous about it all for about a week but it’s long since passed. I’m not worried about the virus. I don’t feel threatened by it. I don’t perceive it to be a threat at all in my community. What I am worried about is, what’s going to be left to go back to when this spineless government finally relent and let people get back to their livelihoods. Or what’s left of them.

    Let's just see how this post ages over the next few months. You don't perceive it to be a threat in your community? Do you have a medical degree or a specialism in virology? You might not feel worried or threatened by this pandemic but elderly residents of your community might. It's 10 more days at home. Grow a pair and get on with it


  • #1234
    martingriff
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,339 ✭✭✭✭martingriff


    JoeA3 wrote: »
    No.
    They’ve admitted it’s not in the community. R0 close to zero. No community spread in a fortnight. We’ve done all we can do and now they’re moving the goalposts because they’re still flappping around, deferring real decisions for more weeks. Harris is probably reading up Wikipedia on the previous 18 Covids....

    All this bleating about people becoming complacent and “stay the course” is a smokescreen for their complete cock ups in nursing homes, farcical testing cock ups and the PPE equipment fiasco.

    What you mean testing fiasco. It is not there fault there was a worldwide shortage of reagents.

    PPE equipment not sure how much faster they could gave been everyother country had the same problem.

    Nursing homes I agree but I dont see them covering it up.

    Of course they could not have just opened stuff up as soon as the transmission had fallen they had to make sure it was stable and they sure were not going to open it up the week of a bank holiday. May 5th was allways going to be the date.

    How anyone is surprised it is not before then is idiotic. Phase lifting of restriction will happen retail will be up and running with capacity like supermarkets are doing. Construction with masks or full head gear. Restaurants with reduced capacity. Social distancing as much as can be possible and working from home will stay for those who can


  • #1235
    Bobtheman
    Site Banned Posts: 2,799 ✭✭✭Bobtheman


    Building sites , factories and some shops May 5th. Thats it and then reviewed in 2 weeks


  • #1236
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,252 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    I've noticed a steady increase in local footfall and activity outside the window here in the last few days, cumulating yesterday in kids out playing and people walking around in the sunshine while a Garda strolled by without any issue with this.

    Lockdown is effectively already over because the objective was achieved - allow the health service time to respond, get people's attention, and reduce the rates of infetction to manageable levels.

    FG are being rapidly exposed in this new phase and that too is annoying people who are remembering why they didn't vote for them only a few weeks before this started. If they don't announce sensible but less restrictive measures from the 5th, I think any remaining patience in most people (who aren't sick and are low risk anyway) will evaporate in the face of seeing their families mental and financial wellbeing desroyed for another decade.


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  • #1237
    almostover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭almostover


    FintanMcluskey wrote: »
    We implemented restrictions to lower the Ro. We have achieved that. Thays all we were asked to do. Staying at home is now doing more damage. This is not a death sentence. 0.1% of those over 65 are at risk.
    Every death is a tragedy. And before Covid every death is a tragedy. And after Covid every death will be a tragedy. But the world doesnt stop as per W.H Auden.

    Lowering the R0 was the first step. Now we have to keep it low. No point being in a constant boom bust cycle with this virus no matter how acclamitised we are to the boom Bust situation in this country


  • #1238
    Spencer Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 268 ✭✭Spencer Brown


    Bobtheman wrote: »
    Building sites , factories and some shops May 5th. Thats it and then reviewed in 2 weeks

    Source?


  • #1239
    Gael23
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,147 ✭✭✭✭Gael23


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    I've noticed a steady increase in local footfall and activity outside the window here in the last few days, cumulating yesterday in kids out playing and people walking around in the sunshine while a Garda strolled by without any issue with this.

    Lockdown is effectively already over because the objective was achieved - allow the health service time to respond, get people's attention, and reduce the rates of infetction to manageable levels.

    FG are being rapidly exposed in this new phase and that too is annoying people who are remembering why they didn't vote for them only a few weeks before this started. If they don't announce sensible but less restrictive measures from the 5th, I think any remaining patience in most people (who aren't sick and are low risk anyway) will evaporate in the face of seeing their families mental and financial wellbeing desroyed for another decade.

    The past few days are showing people won’t tolerate and more and have been pushed as far as they will go. Peoples illingness to cooperate is wearing thin


  • #1240
    martingriff
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,339 ✭✭✭✭martingriff


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    I've noticed a steady increase in local footfall and activity outside the window here in the last few days, cumulating yesterday in kids out playing and people walking around in the sunshine while a Garda strolled by without any issue with this.

    Lockdown is effectively already over because the objective was achieved - allow the health service time to respond, get people's attention, and reduce the rates of infetction to manageable levels.

    FG are being rapidly exposed in this new phase and that too is annoying people who are remembering why they didn't vote for them only a few weeks before this started. If they don't announce sensible but less restrictive measures from the 5th, I think any remaining patience in most people (who aren't sick and are low risk anyway) will evaporate in the face of seeing their families mental and financial wellbeing desroyed for another decade.

    We will hear about them before Wednesday. While I agree about the increase you know people were allowed to go and walk around


  • #1241
    Cork Boy 53
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭Cork Boy 53


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    I've noticed a steady increase in local footfall and activity outside the window here in the last few days, cumulating yesterday in kids out playing and people walking around in the sunshine while a Garda strolled by without any issue with this.

    Lockdown is effectively already over because the objective was achieved - allow the health service time to respond, get people's attention, and reduce the rates of infetction to manageable levels.

    FG are being rapidly exposed in this new phase and that too is annoying people who are remembering why they didn't vote for them only a few weeks before this started. If they don't announce sensible but less restrictive measures from the 5th, I think any remaining patience in most people (who aren't sick and are low risk anyway) will evaporate in the face of seeing their families mental and financial wellbeing desroyed for another decade.

    What would you consider as sensible measures? Give examples.


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  • #1242
    sterz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 528 ✭✭✭sterz


    martingriff wrote: »
    We will hear about them before Wednesday. While I agree about the increase you know people were allowed to go and walk around

    What makes you think it'll be before Wednesday?


  • #1243
    normanoffside
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,228 ✭✭✭✭normanoffside


    normanoffside wrote: »
    The nursing home scandal will turn out to be a massive stain on Leo and Simon.
    They were looking in the wrong place for the virus (similar to Bandit Luke looking at the sweat left by joggers on the footpaths).

    Sorry, I Just want to clarify it was Kermit de frog, not Bandit Luke who was talking about toxic joggers sweat on footpaths.
    I got it wrong Bandit Luke, I apologise.


  • #1244
    almostover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭almostover


    Gael23 wrote: »
    The past few days are showing people won’t tolerate and more and have been pushed as far as they will go. Peoples illingness to cooperate is wearing thin

    What's the alternative, let's all have our own interpretation of the guidlines and let the virus run rampant again? Kill another thousand or so in a short space of time? Well as long as I get a BBQ with a few mates it's worth the lives of 50 old people


  • #1245
    martingriff
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,339 ✭✭✭✭martingriff


    sterz wrote: »
    What makes you think it'll be before Wednesday?

    To get owners time to prepare there businesses and give a little bit of hope to people. I say we would have heard about it this weekend but with the increased football they have delayed it. I feel it is a mistake. Maybe say it this weekend to get people to give it 1 last push


  • #1246
    Gael23
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,147 ✭✭✭✭Gael23


    almostover wrote: »
    What's the alternative, let's all have our own interpretation of the guidlines and let the virus run rampant again? Kill another thousand or so in a short space of time? Well as long as I get a BBQ with a few mates it's worth the lives of 50 old people

    Clearly the lockdown merchants don’t care about people’s mental health and livelihoods going to ruin as a result of these measures


  • #1247
    Jurgen Klopp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,807 ✭✭✭Jurgen Klopp


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    I've noticed a steady increase in local footfall and activity outside the window here in the last few days, cumulating yesterday in kids out playing and people walking around in the sunshin.

    I certainly hope you shouted out the window to ask their eircode or paddy green will be disappointed?


  • #1248
    alwald
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,290 ✭✭✭alwald


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    I've noticed a steady increase in local footfall and activity outside the window here in the last few days, cumulating yesterday in kids out playing and people walking around in the sunshine while a Garda strolled by without any issue with this.

    Lockdown is effectively already over because the objective was achieved - allow the health service time to respond, get people's attention, and reduce the rates of infetction to manageable levels.

    FG are being rapidly exposed in this new phase and that too is annoying people who are remembering why they didn't vote for them only a few weeks before this started. If they don't announce sensible but less restrictive measures from the 5th, I think any remaining patience in most people (who aren't sick and are low risk anyway) will evaporate in the face of seeing their families mental and financial wellbeing desroyed for another decade.

    I've noticed quite the opposite in the area where I live but it's quite interesting to know the differences.

    Neighbors and people living in nearby roads/estates are acting with social distancing which is quite remarkable.

    One neighbor, in his 70s, invited his sons/daughters for lunch today with their grand kids, all live within 2km from each other and it took place in the garden with clear social distancing...before any of the "anti lockdown merchants" will jump on this opportunity no I wasn't spying on him but I have him on facebook and he posted several photos himself.


  • #1249
    JoeA3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,550 ✭✭✭JoeA3


    almostover wrote: »
    Let's just see how this post ages over the next few months. You don't perceive it to be a threat in your community? Do you have a medical degree or a specialism in virology? You might not feel worried or threatened by this pandemic but elderly residents of your community might. It's 10 more days at home. Grow a pair and get on with it

    Another man who’s read what he wanted to read. You should get a gig with RTE news.

    If I thought it was “just 10 more days” or if I believed the powers that be have any conviction in what they’re saying or a real plan of action, I’d row in with you. But I don’t.

    I’m already bracing myself for Leo’s next grand speech. I wonder which poets he’ll quote from the teleprompter this time.


  • #1250
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,252 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Cork Boy 53 wrote: »
    What would you consider as sensible measures? Give examples.

    OK, how about:

    - Social distancing remains but the 2km limit is removed

    - Retail stores open but with the same practises supermarkets are currently operating

    - Pubs and large venues stay closed. Restrictions on large gatherings

    - People continue to WFH where possible

    - Schools and childcare needs to be looked at ASAP so people can get back to work where kids are involved


    ... essentially we roll things back a few weeks with some modifications and we evaluate for a fortnight BUT there needs to be an acceptance that cases WILL increase in that time - however, so long as it's manageable by the health service, every effort should be made to avoid reimposing harsher restrictions.

    I don't think the Government will have a choice. It's do that and retain some buy-in from the general public, or "lose control" of the situation completely (as is already starting to happen)


  • #1251
    Downlinz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,666 ✭✭✭Downlinz


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    We can’t stay at home forever and if we don’t get people back to work we’re going to have a much worse problem in a few months time from the impact this is having on everyone’s mental health & quality of life.

    Some serious rhetoric here I've seen repeated plenty.

    We can stay at home, only making essential trips out for supplies for as long as is required, it's pretty easy actually. We don't need lattes or to go to bowling alleys.

    The economic point is debatable. Most businesses are pretty happy at the moment with government paying their workers and shielding them from eating the costs of vastly reduced business, they certainly wouldn't appreciate that being removed until we reach a point where the majority feel confident to mingle in public again.
    In terms of the national picture, a single lockdown with a steady recovery after is in all of our best interests. A lockdown - open - lockdown ping pong game serves nobody.

    Not to be callous but in terms of mental health that's an issue for you to deal with. It's a pandemic, it's not a happy time and most people are going to feel the effects of it. If you're only bemoaning boredom and quality of life then I think you're fortunate it's not much worse to be mourning relatives in isolation or fighting for your own life.


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  • #1252
    Dr. Bre
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,839 ✭✭✭Dr. Bre


    normanoffside wrote: »
    Bottle banks will become breeding grounds?
    Jesus wept, do you think they all go around licking each other’s bottles?

    Be careful of the corona bottles


  • #1253
    Benimar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭Benimar


    martingriff wrote: »
    To get owners time to prepare there businesses and give a little bit of hope to people. I say we would have heard about it this weekend but with the increased football they have delayed it. I feel it is a mistake. Maybe say it this weekend to get people to give it 1 last push

    That won’t work without Strict enforcement of the current lockdown. A number of people have already decided the lockdown is over, to tell them it definitely is on May 5th would only exacerbate the situation, and more people will ‘relax’

    The only way to stop more and more people breaking lockdown early is to come down hard on those who do.

    To be honest I’d support a full lockdown (No movement except for essential supplies) for 10 days at this stage (To keep the idiots off the streets) if it meant current restrictions could definitely be eased on the 5th.


  • #1254
    RugbyLad11
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 547 ✭✭✭RugbyLad11


    almostover wrote: »
    What's the alternative, let's all have our own interpretation of the guidlines and let the virus run rampant again? Kill another thousand or so in a short space of time? Well as long as I get a BBQ with a few mates it's worth the lives of 50 old people

    What is your alternative? lock people inside for years and years until there is a vaccine


  • #1255
    martingriff
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,339 ✭✭✭✭martingriff


    Gael23 wrote: »
    Clearly the lockdown merchants don’t care about people’s mental health and livelihoods going to ruin as a result of these measures

    Of course people care about people mental health and the economy (there own jobs) but they also care about not letting this get out of control and another lockdown having to be done.

    As for people mental health there is loads someone can do. Ring people, plenty of apps to facetime, Skype, of there with your 2km radius give them a wave and hello through the window.

    I be concerned about domestic violence also but again people can help by reporting anything they hear or see


  • #1256
    Dickie10
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,067 ✭✭✭Dickie10


    so do people agree that restauraunts may open with liited capacity? i wonder will this work and would it be economical? id say they would all be at capacity for the first month mid week and all


  • #1257
    almostover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭almostover


    JoeA3 wrote: »
    Another man who’s read what he wanted to read. You should get a gig with RTE news.

    If I thought it was “just 10 more days” or if I believed the powers that be have any conviction in what they’re saying or a real plan of action, I’d row in with you. But I don’t.

    I’m already bracing myself for Leo’s next grand speech. I wonder which poets he’ll quote from the teleprompter this time.

    Maybe take off the tin foil hat. 'They' are the goverment. We elect them. This is an unprecedented situation, hence the difficulty in planning. All that's being asked is people to act in accordance with the guidline from high qualified medical professional.

    This whole thing reminds me of the crack down on drink driving. Ah sure what harm am I doing driving down the boreen with 3-4 pints and a few small ones in me. Never harmed anyone. I'm sound out no fear of me. Sure if I hit someone what business had they out walking the roads


  • #1258
    alwald
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,290 ✭✭✭alwald


    RugbyLad11 wrote: »
    What is your alternative? lock people inside for years and years until there is a vaccine

    The same question could be asked to you. What do you propose??


  • #1259
    Tenzor07
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,328 ✭✭✭Tenzor07


    JoeA3 wrote: »
    I’m already bracing myself for Leo’s next grand speech. I wonder which poets he’ll quote from the teleprompter this time.

    Leo may want us to speak up?




  • #1260
    RugbyLad11
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 547 ✭✭✭RugbyLad11


    alwald wrote: »
    The same question could be asked to you. What do you propose??

    Get on with it and live our lives, adopt the Korean model


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  • #1261
    normanoffside
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,228 ✭✭✭✭normanoffside


    titan18 wrote: »
    There were articles saying we didn't have enough PPE in hospitals. How would spreading that amount amongst more people have been done?

    Nursing homes were complaining nurses were being recruited by HSE. Where would the extra nurses have come from if we didn't do that?

    There was huge backlogs in testing at the start. How would we have tested more people when we already couldn't test fast enough?

    The ban on healthy people going out was so we wouldn't overwhelm hospitals. If we let people out and didn't close pubs, or reduce the reproductive rate, how would our hospitals cope with more cases along with the idiots in a&e cos they're drunk.

    As it is with the first set of restrictions before pubs closed, we had temple bar and other pubs packed, we had people flocking to beaches and parks. If our population could be responsible adults, it'd have been grand but there's far too many idiots here to leave things go. Even now cos we haven't enforced fines etc people are taking the piss.

    Irish people are generally logical people. we are not rebellious but when something doesn't make sense we don't believe it and we don't follow it.

    Pedestrian signals are a good example. If there is no traffic coming on either side we will cross the road.

    I used to live in Belgium and people would never cross the road unless there was a green light to tell them to do it. I could never understand that mentality.


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