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The UK response to Covid-19 [MOD WARNING 1ST POST]

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Comments

  • #3872
    A Dub in Glasgo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,436 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    RobMc59 wrote: »
    Unfortunately,there are many posters who refuse to believe the Scottish government makes the rules for Scotland-it doesn't fit into the 'English bullies overuling all other UK nations' false claims they like to throw about.

    Capture.jpg

    Evidently, the weekly board did not discuss the instruction to the PPE wholesalers for the care home sector


  • #3873
    Cupatae
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    They need to start lifting restrictions in the UK, people cant go on like this..the economy must be started soon, the virus isnt going anywhere people are just gonna have to learn to live with it.


  • #3874
    Enzokk
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,060 ✭✭✭Enzokk


    So on Saturday the UK announces that PPE would be arriving from Turkey on Sunday.

    And then they formally ask Turkey for the PPE on Sunday only. And it is now Tuesday and there is no sign of the PPE yet.

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1252541431064997888?s=20


  • #3875
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 43,878 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Cupatae wrote: »
    They need to start lifting restrictions in the UK, people cant go on like this..the economy must be started soon, the virus isnt going anywhere people are just gonna have to learn to live with it.
    Not sure whether you're trolling or not but just in case you are actually serious then if people are allowed go back to normal, they won't live with it, they'll die with it!


  • #3876
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 43,878 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Enzokk wrote: »
    So on Saturday the UK announces that PPE would be arriving from Turkey on Sunday.

    And then they formally ask Turkey for the PPE on Sunday only. And it is now Tuesday and there is no sign of the PPE yet.

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1252541431064997888?s=20
    Is anyone actually surprised?


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  • #3877
    Cupatae
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Not sure whether you're trolling or not but just in case you are actually serious then if people are allowed go back to normal, they won't live with it, they'll die with it!

    How many more will die because of the economic impact of the lockdown tho? they will have to start lifting em soon, as we have no cure and learning to live with it is the only option.

    Unless you want a lockdown till vaccine?


  • #3878
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 43,878 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Cupatae wrote: »
    How many more will die because of the economic impact of the lockdown tho? they will have to start lifting em soon, as we have no cure and learning to live with it is the only option.

    Unless you want a lockdown till vaccine?
    Before I try to answer your question, maybe you could tell us how many verifiable deaths there have been as a result of the economic impact of the lockdown?


  • #3879
    Cupatae
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Before I try to answer your question, maybe you could tell us how many verifiable deaths there have been as a result of the economic impact of the lockdown?

    I cant because it is something that will happen in the future as a result of the lockdown.


  • #3880
    AllForIt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,729 ✭✭✭AllForIt


    Rather refreshing to watch the Irish briefings in stark contrast to the UK ones where we don't see the same kind of gotcha journalism engaged in by those with agendas or looking for a hot angle to further their careers and their unwarranted salaries. And most importantly of greater benefit to the viewer.


  • #3881
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,853 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Review of the NHS Susan fiasco

    http://littleatoms.com/nhs-sockpuppet-allegations-dont-stand-scrutiny


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  • #3882
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Aegir wrote: »
    Review of the NHS Susan fiasco

    http://littleatoms.com/nhs-sockpuppet-allegations-dont-stand-scrutiny

    Interesting that someone who claims to investigate this properly manages to investigate in such thorough detail without managing to uncover the fact that
    a member of NHS staff had their photograph stolen and used in an account that was spreading government propaganda.

    People don't use deception by omission fallacies when they are being neutral, but they do when they are trying to ignore facts that do not suit their agenda by not mentioning them at all.


  • #3883
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,088 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Is anyone actually surprised?

    I know one or three people on here who will be. They will tell us that we are wrong in our interpretation of that story or any other story in relation to this news in fact.


  • #3884
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,088 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Cupatae wrote: »
    How many more will die because of the economic impact of the lockdown tho? they will have to start lifting em soon, as we have no cure and learning to live with it is the only option.

    Unless you want a lockdown till vaccine?

    Who's dying because of the lockdown?


  • #3885
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    AllForIt wrote: »
    Rather refreshing to watch the Irish briefings in stark contrast to the UK ones where we don't see the same kind of gotcha journalism engaged in by those with agendas or looking for a hot angle to further their careers and their unwarranted salaries. And most importantly of greater benefit to the viewer.

    Perhaps you ought to listen to a few Irish Government press conferences over the past few weeks and then listen to the UK ones and tell me what the differences are and then you might be able to work out why there is a differences.

    The Irish press conferences tend to be about updating the people and giving the latest information in a clear and transparent way. The British ones tends to be about spin, playing politics and making promises they cannot keep.

    Just like Labour were out of touch with the public when they left government when Cameron won, the Tories have been in power for so long that they are also out of touch and focused on self preservation above all else rather than the actual welfare of doctors and the public.


  • #3886
    S.M.B.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,383 ✭✭✭S.M.B.


    Aegir wrote: »
    Review of the NHS Susan fiasco

    http://littleatoms.com/nhs-sockpuppet-allegations-dont-stand-scrutiny
    I think that's a fair enough assessment of the situation at the moment. I was very conscious of not taking it as being in anyway true but simply added the caveat that it would be shocking if there was any truth behind it and I await the evidence to be presented in full.

    The reality is that all these bits of finger pointing probably do snowball into an actual bias. The role of social media really is further complicating what is already a really difficult situation right now.


  • #3887
    Cupatae
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    Who's dying because of the lockdown?

    I think you misunderstood what was wrote read it again.


  • #3888
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    S.M.B. wrote: »
    I think that's a fair enough assessment of the situation at the moment. I was very conscious of not taking it as being in anyway true but simply added the caveat that it would be shocking if there was any truth behind it and I await the evidence to be presented in full.

    Indeed, if fair enough means reporting on the bits that suit your agenda and pretending the bits that don't aren't there.

    The photograph was stolen from an NHS Nurse who was a member of a respected trade union and then used on an account of a so called NHS doctor by a different name that was spewing out propaganda that seemed to be in line with the government.

    If you are saying that the above paragraph is not true then at best you are being extremely disingenuous and are stooping to Donald Trump levels of painting false narratives and deliberately misleading people.

    If someone can write a long detailed blog post about their investigation but can't manage to find out the biggest proven fact about the situation that has been discussed the most, then you have to either question if they are a terrible investigator or they have a motive for not being transparent about the fact an NHS staff member had their identity stolen.


  • #3889
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,853 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    devnull wrote: »
    Interesting that someone who claims to investigate this properly manages to investigate in such thorough detail without managing to uncover the fact that
    a member of NHS staff had their photograph stolen and used in an account that was spreading government propaganda.

    People don't use deception by omission fallacies when they are being neutral, but they do when they are trying to ignore facts that do not suit their agenda by not mentioning them at all.

    What has been ignored or missed?


  • #3890
    UrbanFret
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,061 ✭✭✭UrbanFret


    When they day Comes that they add in all the people who died outside of the hospitals the true horror that Johnson and the Tories reigned down on their people will become apparent.


  • #3891
    Cupatae
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    devnull wrote: »
    The photograph was stolen from an NHS Nurse who was a member of a respected trade union and then used on an account of a so called NHS doctor by a different name that was spewing out propaganda that seemed to be in line with the government.

    If you are saying that the above paragraph is not true then at best you are being extremely disingenuous and are stooping to Donald Trump levels of painting false narratives and deliberately misleading people.

    Hmmm, very disingenuous indeed!


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  • #3892
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,853 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    S.M.B. wrote: »
    I think that's a fair enough assessment of the situation at the moment. I was very conscious of not taking it as being in anyway true but simply added the caveat that it would be shocking if there was any truth behind it and I await the evidence to be presented in full.

    The reality is that all these bits of finger pointing probably do snowball into an actual bias. The role of social media really is further complicating what is already a really difficult situation right now.

    I just go on the basis that 99.9% of Twitter is nasty, vindictive bull****.


  • #3893
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 43,878 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    Who's dying because of the lockdown?
    Apparently nobody yet but an unknown number might :rolleyes:


  • #3894
    theological
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,831 ✭✭✭theological


    devnull wrote: »
    The photograph was stolen from an NHS Nurse who was a member of a respected trade union and then used on an account of a so called NHS doctor by a different name that was spewing out propaganda that seemed to be in line with the government.

    If you are saying that the above paragraph is not true then at best you are being extremely disingenuous and are stooping to Donald Trump levels of painting false narratives and deliberately misleading people.

    Any evidence to back up your assertion that the government are doing this yet?

    Goodness - this is becoming a bit obsessional.


  • #3895
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Aegir wrote: »
    What has been ignored or missed?

    Perhaps read the post that you quoted?

    I'll reproduce it below:
    Interesting that someone who claims to investigate this properly manages to investigate in such thorough detail without managing to uncover the fact that
    a member of NHS staff had their photograph stolen and used in an account that was spreading government propaganda.

    People don't use deception by omission fallacies when they are being neutral, but they do when they are trying to ignore facts that do not suit their agenda by not mentioning them at all.


  • #3896
    Cupatae
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Apparently nobody yet but an unknown number might :rolleyes:

    hmmm, i dont think you quite understand what was said, and have now resorted to using adolescent emojis...

    If the economy stays shut, how do the hospitals get funding? if the hospitals dont have funding what happens?

    No the economy should be restarted and restrictions should be eased, we have no vaccine for the virus and cant stay on lockdown for the next 2 years....we must just learn to live with it guys!


  • #3897
    theological
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,831 ✭✭✭theological


    devnull wrote: »
    Perhaps you ought to listen to a few Irish Government press conferences over the past few weeks and then listen to the UK ones and tell me what the differences are and then you might be able to work out why there is a differences.

    The Irish press conferences tend to be about updating the people and giving the latest information in a clear and transparent way. The British ones tends to be about spin, playing politics and making promises they cannot keep.

    Just like Labour were out of touch with the public when they left government when Cameron won, the Tories have been in power for so long that they are also out of touch and focused on self preservation above all else rather than the actual welfare of doctors and the public.

    I disagree. There are always medical experts there. I'm always more interested in what they are saying.

    The minister is helpful for an insight on policy.

    There's no basis for claiming that the medical experts are simply at these briefings to issue "spin". I'm thankful for the presentation of the data day in day out and the opportunity for media engagement that they provide.


  • #3898
    S.M.B.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,383 ✭✭✭S.M.B.


    devnull wrote: »
    Indeed, if fair enough means reporting on the bits that suit your agenda and pretending the bits that don't aren't there.

    The photograph was stolen from an NHS Nurse who was a member of a respected trade union and then used on an account of a so called NHS doctor by a different name that was spewing out propaganda that seemed to be in line with the government.

    If you are saying that the above paragraph is not true then at best you are being extremely disingenuous and are stooping to Donald Trump levels of painting false narratives and deliberately misleading people.

    If someone can write a long detailed blog post about their investigation but can't manage to find out the biggest proven fact about the situation that has been discussed the most, then you have to either question if they are a terrible investigator or they have a motive for not being transparent about the fact an NHS staff member had their identity stolen.
    Is anyone denying that what you say in the paragraph didn't happen? That in itself is not the reason that the tweet got so much traction. It's the link to the DHSC that's the smoking gun and there is zero proof yet.

    Surely if there's one thing to learn from the clear and obvious facts that do exist is that's it's not wise to automatically assume that everything you read on twitter is as it's presented.

    To be honest, from the few actual tweets by @nhs_susan that I saw they seem to be all over the place, some appearing to be 'backing the government' with others seem to be a poor attempt at humou. Her profile seems like a liberal caricature designed to provoke those on the right.


  • #3899
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    theological wrote: »
    Any evidence to back up your assertion that the government are doing this yet?

    Goodness - this is becoming a bit obsessional.

    Not sure why you are directing that question at me, because that is not what my post has said.

    My post simply stated that the photograph was stolen from an NHS Nurse who was a member of a respected trade union and then this photo was subsequently used on an account of a so called NHS doctor by a different person that was spewing out tweets that were supporting the British Government. This is not my opinion, this is the fact of the matter and the hospital of whom this staff member has working for has reported the account to Twitter for such impersonation.

    The debate about NHS Susan has been widespread on twitter and almost everywhere this has discussed it has been mentioned that a real NHS worker has had their identity stolen. Do you not think it's strange that an 'investigation' failed to uncover something that an ordinary person could find in a few seconds. Do you think this is because they are a poor investigator, or that it is because they decided to leave this proven fact out (deception by omission) because it did not suit the agenda that they were ploughing?


  • #3900
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    S.M.B. wrote: »
    To be honest, from the few actual tweets by @nhs_susan that I saw they seem to be all over the place, some appearing to be 'backing the government', others seem to be a poor attempt at humour while the one highlighted in the original thread last night actually seems like a liberal caricature designed to provoke those on the right.

    Do you have any full screenshots of such tweets from twitter? I would like to see them and since you have done hopefully you can point me in the right direction since I wasn't aware of any tweets aimed at right wingers.

    I've seen people actually saying these things but I've never seen any actual proof that this is the case. The one I have seen doesn't look like twitter since the layout is completely different which makes me doubt it's authenticity since it could have been knocked up in photoshop.


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  • #3901
    theological
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,831 ✭✭✭theological


    devnull wrote: »
    Not sure why you are directing that question at me, because that is not what my post has said.

    My post simply stated that the photograph was stolen from an NHS Nurse who was a member of a respected trade union and then this photo was subsequently used on an account of a so called NHS doctor by a different person that was spewing out tweets that were supporting the British Government. This is not my opinion, this is the fact of the matter and the hospital of whom this staff member has working for has reported the account to Twitter for such impersonation.

    The debate about NHS Susan has been widespread on twitter and almost everywhere this has discussed it has been mentioned that a real NHS worker has had their identity stolen. Do you not think it's strange that an 'investigation' failed to uncover something that an ordinary person could find in a few seconds. Do you think this is because they are a poor investigator, or that it is because they decided to leave this proven fact out (deception by omission) because it did not suit the agenda that they were ploughing?


    Yesterday you claimed that it was government propaganda.

    Then you implied that it could have been someone working for the government here.

    I'm directing it at you because I'm asking you to back up your claims.


This discussion has been closed.
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