The UK response to Covid-19 [MOD WARNING 1ST POST]

theological · 15-04-2020 12:21PM

RobMc59 wrote: »

Whether its covid,brexit,importing British cars or any number of subjects there are an astonishing array of mainly anti British threads here on boards,which is fine except when the main contributors take offense when a British person has the audacity to challenge them- This isn't an attempt to stifle discussion by the way,reading different points of view is good although the thought that there are some here with an agenda lingers.
I enjoy boards because I'm interested in Ireland and it's people-I don't come here to slag it off.

I agree on this by the by. There's a pretty ugly undertone of Anglophobia on this thread. Before anyone claims this is paddy bashing I'm Irish myself.

My hope and prayer is that we all get this virus under control as soon as possible. It looks like the UK is heading in the right direction and will get through this. I'm thankful for those who are leading the strategy and those who are working on the frontline.

A Dub in Glasgo · 15-04-2020 12:23PM

The National Records Scotland has released the 2nd data set for deaths in Scotland which are confirmed COVID-19 and those which are suspected. The data cut off is Sunday, 12th April and the deaths show 962 versus the 566 announced on Sunday from deaths in hospital

https://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/covid19stats

The dash line below is the daily cumulative from hospitals

Breakdown of the 962 shows

62% - hospital
25% - care homes
13% - home or other

Christy42 · 15-04-2020 12:28PM

Deleted User wrote: »

If they aren't aware of Sweden's response to the current coronavirus pandemic and they debates around it, then they obviously have zero interest in the actual topic at hand and should do the rest of us a favour and stop posting.

If they just want to pull their pud thinking about dead brits I would prefer if they did it in private.

Do you know how many relatives I have in Sweden? Do you know how many friends I have in Sweden? 0. Combined. Maybe 1 if a colleague went home during this but I don't believe so.

I have friends in the UK. I care about them. I know people on the front line in the UK. I know vulnerable people in the UK. I am willing to bet that there is a similar scenario the world over.

Yes Sweden should be doing better but I also don't have that attachment. And well. Checking how every single country is dealing with this is quite frankly more than anyone has time for so I focus in on ones where I actually know people. So Ireland, UK, US and half an eye on a few places dotted around where I might know one person or some such.

As can be seen Covid reporting can get tied up in a lot of biases. I know who the tories are. I know who Labour are. I couldn't name the main parties in Sweden so it is much harder to grasp the local situation.

This is just more of the same. The UK is fine because you aren't allowed talk about it.

A Dub in Glasgo · 15-04-2020 12:37PM

Scotland:
In hospital: 1,748 (-53)
In ICU: 195 (-1)
Total confirmed cases: 6,748 (+390)
Total deaths with confirmed COVID-19: 699 (+84)

Therefore as it stands, there are a minimum of 1,093 (699+394) deaths in scotland (confirmed and suspected)

mugsymugsy · 15-04-2020 12:48PM

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Scotland:
In hospital: 1,748 (-53)
In ICU: 195 (-1)
Total confirmed cases: 6,748 (+390)
Total deaths with confirmed COVID-19: 699 (+84)

Therefore as it stands, there are a minimum of 1,093 (699+394) deaths in scotland (confirmed and suspected)

Scotland has approx same population as Ireland so the question and explanation is required why are the deaths at least double.

A Dub in Glasgo · 15-04-2020 12:58PM

mugsymugsy wrote: »

Scotland has approx same population as Ireland so the question and explanation is required why are the deaths at least double.

Scotland is in the UK therefore is following the UK Govt strategy (more or less) which we all realise was slow to react and probably went for herd immunity at the start. Scotland benefits because when it did act, the virus was not as widespread in Scotland as it was elsewhere in the UK (coupled with the population density)

Joe_ Public · 15-04-2020 12:59PM

You have to acknowledge good news when it comes and health minister Helen Whatelys statement on Sky this morning that they are set to."ramp up" testing for care homes is very welcome.

Now, maybe this is being done because "it is the right thing to do", as we often hear, or maybe it has come because of the severe scrutiny of the government's care home policies over the past few days and the pressure for another change of direction that has been applied.

This is why that scrutiny is essential. Why questions need to be asked, and not just accepting blindly what they tell you because they are experts or something.

https://twitter.com/KayBurley/status/1250316388704456710?s=20

15-04-2020 01:06PM

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Scotland is in the UK therefore is following the UK Govt strategy (more or less) which we all realise was slow to react and probably went for herd immunity at the start. Scotland benefits because when it did act, the virus was not as widespread in Scotland as it was elsewhere in the UK (coupled with the population density)

So surely Sturgeon and the Scottish CMO is deserving of criticism for that?

A Dub in Glasgo · 15-04-2020 01:06PM

Aegir wrote: »

So surely Sturgeon and the Scottish CMO is deserving of criticism for that?

For being in the UK and following UK Govt strategy.... absolutely

threeball · 15-04-2020 01:11PM

Aegir wrote: »

So surely Sturgeon and the Scottish CMO is deserving of criticism for that?

Yes, I was shocked when I heard Sturgeon announce they were to follow the same strategy as Boris had announced. If ever there was a chance to grasp the nettle and show some leadership that would demonstrate why Scotland should be independent this was it. And she sh1t the bed royally.

Dave0301 · 15-04-2020 01:17PM

Deleted User wrote: »

And there you have it.

Anyone who thinks this thread is an actual calm and reasoned discussion of "the UK response to Covid-19" is kidding themselves.

It's actually deeply toxic, xenophobic ****show and everyone involved should be taking a long hard look at themselves.

I'll leave you all to enjoy it anyway, numbers are out later - hope they go up!

As has been said many times, the majority of posters here on both sides of the discussion have family in the UK or live there themselves. Therefore, it is perfectly natural to have a vested interest as well as take a critical view of the decisions made.

To be fair, it has been a reasonable enough debate at times.

Or at least until you stuck your oar in and then decided to drop out whilst stating you want more British people to die :rolleyes:

15-04-2020 01:21PM

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

For being in the UK and following UK Govt strategy.... absolutely

Heaven forbid the SNP are criticized.

There is not one single thing the UK government has done that the ScottishWelsh or Northern Irish government could not have done differently.

A Dub in Glasgo · 15-04-2020 01:24PM

threeball wrote: »

Yes, I was shocked when I heard Sturgeon announce they were to follow the same strategy as Boris had announced. If ever there was a chance to grasp the nettle and show some leadership that would demonstrate why Scotland should be independent this was it. And she sh1t the bed royally.

The problem with that approach is that 95% of the media and about 50% of the population in Scotland would have crucified her for it as they never questioned the UK approach and would just see it as doing something that is different to Westminster. Westminster would probably have shut down the devolution settlement in that scenario

You have also got to ask how much clout and influence the Scottish, the Welsh and NI had at the likes of the COBR meetings

The fact is Scotland is not independent and I am not even sure the current laws allowed the SG to do anything that is widely different from that set up at UK Govt level

Hopefully, it will all come out in any inquiry

BonnieSituation · 15-04-2020 01:25PM

Aegir wrote: »

Heaven forbid the SNP are criticized.

There is not one single thing the UK government has done that the ScottishWelsh or Northern Irish government could not have done differently.

The Assembly did differently eventually and is being criticised as a SF U-turn. No winning sometimes eh.

Joe_ Public · 15-04-2020 01:25PM

Orinoco flowed in and then Orinoco flowed out again. Though left his mark in a "calm and reasoned" manner, it has to be said.

Anyway, I notice Matt Hancock is getting quite a lot of heat on the care home issue. The replies to this announcement are fairly damning. Interesting to recall it was Theresa Mays social care policy that effectively cost her the tories majority in 2017. You have to wonder do they ever learn?

https://twitter.com/MattHancock/status/1250326413460140033?s=20

threeball · 15-04-2020 01:28PM

Aegir wrote: »

Heaven forbid the SNP are criticized.

There is not one single thing the UK government has done that the ScottishWelsh or Northern Irish government could not have done differently.

NI was always going to follow Downing St. The DUP would countenance nothing less.

threeball · 15-04-2020 01:30PM

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

The problem with that approach is that 95% of the media and about 50% of the population in Scotland would have crucified her for it as they never questioned the UK approach and would just see it as doing something that is different to Westminster. Westminster would probably have shut down the devolution settlement in that scenario

You have also got to ask how much clout and influence the Scottish, the Welsh and NI had at the likes of the COBR meetings

The fact is Scotland is not independent and I am not even sure the current laws allowed the SG to do anything that is widely different from that set up at UK Govt level

Hopefully, it will all come out in any inquiry

She could have refernced other countries and said she was not comfortable with the pace of reaction in westminister. It was obvious to all bar themselves how inept it was.

Memnoch · 15-04-2020 01:36PM

Bit of a bombshell mentioned in quite a nondescript manner in a sky news article today.

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-why-the-daily-death-figures-dont-reveal-the-full-picture-11973146

The ONS figures count any death certificate which mentions COVID-19.

But this number is likely to be under-reported too as it does not include deaths from those not tested for coronavirus and there is a lag between when the death occurs and when it is registered.

So even if the GPs are reporting suspected coronavirus on death certificates it would seem they are now being excluded in the official ONS count of Covid 19 deaths whereas before they were being included.

Is this change of direction a directive from the government. This would explain why there are so many thousands of “excess deaths” that are unexplained. And we already know that the government have not been testing outside of hospitals.

Matt Hancock is saying they will start testing now but how many thousands have already lost their lives and will not even be counted? And according to his tweet linked above, he is talking about testing people going from hospital into care homes. But what about residents in care homes that are symptomatic?

This government continues to lie and obfuscate.

Enzokk · 15-04-2020 01:40PM

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

The National Records Scotland has released the 2nd data set for deaths in Scotland which are confirmed COVID-19 and those which are suspected. The data cut off is Sunday, 12th April and the deaths show 962 versus the 566 announced on Sunday from deaths in hospital

https://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/covid19stats

The dash line below is the daily cumulative from hospitals

Breakdown of the 962 shows

62% - hospital
25% - care homes
13% - home or other

So that is 38% of the deaths not recorded in hospital. So the numbers from other countries seems to be quite accurate of 40%-50% of the deaths from coronavirus not being in hospital. So the argument about making sue you get the numbers right is fine, but then don't show a chart to try and compare deaths between countries but use different criteria which distorts the picture.

Who would have though Piers Morgan would be someone to look to as leading the charge in holding the government to account,

https://twitter.com/TheMendozaWoman/status/1250363783534575617?s=20

A Dub in Glasgo · 15-04-2020 01:42PM

threeball wrote: »

She could have refernced other countries and said she was not comfortable with the pace of reaction in westminister. It was obvious to all bar themselves how inept it was.

She announced school closures and closure of gatherings over 500 people ahead of the UK Govt but she did not close them ahead. She should have been a lot more assertive in that. But hey, the UK Govt have been dismissing the devolved nations for years so it is no great surprise that the UK Govt view held sway. I even heard rumours that the Barnett conequentials for the UK Govt bailout would not apply to Scotland if Scotland changed course

Professor Moriarty · 15-04-2020 01:45PM

Enzokk wrote: »

So that is 38% of the deaths not recorded in hospital. So the numbers from other countries seems to be quite accurate of 40%-50% of the deaths from coronavirus not being in hospital. So the argument about making sue you get the numbers right is fine, but then don't show a chart to try and compare deaths between countries but use different criteria which distorts the picture.

Who would have though Piers Morgan would be someone to look to as leading the charge in holding the government to account,

https://twitter.com/TheMendozaWoman/status/1250363783534575617?s=20

Car crash.

Joe_ Public · 15-04-2020 01:47PM

Enzokk wrote: »

So that is 38% of the deaths not recorded in hospital. So the numbers from other countries seems to be quite accurate of 40%-50% of the deaths from coronavirus not being in hospital. So the argument about making sue you get the numbers right is fine, but then don't show a chart to try and compare deaths between countries but use different criteria which distorts the picture.

Who would have though Piers Morgan would be someone to look to as leading the charge in holding the government to account,

https://twitter.com/TheMendozaWoman/status/1250363783534575617?s=20

Piers Morgan is an ass and Whately is pathetically out of her depth. Remember how Johnson dealt with social care in the election campaign - fobbed it off as some kind of cross party initiative. They dont know how to handle social care, dumped it on an incompetent junior minister and nobody can be the least bit surprised it has descended to level of catastrophe once a crisis like this fell.

Leroy42 · 15-04-2020 01:48PM

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Car crash.

Included in all the other car stuff worthy stuff in there was the line that she said she doesn't think she should be speculating about the numbers.

Totally agree. She should know them. Why don't they know them?

If the numbers aren't available, then someone in the government should be demanding that whatever, and whomever, is needed to get them is brought in. Serious questions need to be asked. They know that the elderly, particularly with underlying health issues are the most at risk part of the population. Yet they never though before now to actually try to see hw it was actually effecting them?

Professor Moriarty · 15-04-2020 01:52PM

Leroy42 wrote: »

Included in all the other car stuff worthy stuff in there was the line that she said she doesn't think she should be speculating about the numbers.

Totally agree. She should know them. Why don't they know them?

If the numbers aren't available, then someone in the government should be demanding that whatever, and whomever, is needed to get them is brought in. Serious questions need to be asked. They know that the elderly, particularly with underlying health issues are the most at risk part of the population. Yet they never though before now to actually try to see hw it was actually effecting them?

I am 100% certain that she does know the numbers. She's lying.

Joe_ Public · 15-04-2020 01:57PM

If they're not testing and GPs are swamped and overworked, then i wouldnt be surprised that anyone wouldnt know the numbers. She could probably give a ballpark figure but its just as easy to dodge it tbh.

15-04-2020 02:23PM

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

She announced school closures and closure of gatherings over 500 people ahead of the UK Govt but she did not close them ahead. She should have been a lot more assertive in that. But hey, the UK Govt have been dismissing the devolved nations for years so it is no great surprise that the UK Govt view held sway. I even heard rumours that the Barnett conequentials for the UK Govt bailout would not apply to Scotland if Scotland changed course

The SNP and Brexiteer arguments are scarily similar.

Always someone else to blame.

A Dub in Glasgo · 15-04-2020 02:25PM

Aegir wrote: »

The SNP and Brexiteer arguments are scarily similar.

Always someone else to blame.

What part do you disagree with?

Leroy42 · 15-04-2020 02:28PM

Aegir wrote: »

The SNP and Brexiteer arguments are scarily similar.

Always someone else to blame.

Seriously, stop being so Anti-Scottish. It clear that every post is based on your hatred of them rather than dealing with facts!

That how this works isn't it?

15-04-2020 02:45PM

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

What part do you disagree with?

All if it.

You are basically saying that Sturgeon put popularity over people’s lives.

But then blamed “them” because you heard a rumor that “they” would penalize Scotland for going it alone.

It would very easy for EU and UK to be interchanged there.

Donald Trump · 15-04-2020 02:48PM

Aegir wrote: »

All if it.

You are basically saying that Sturgeon put popularity over people’s lives.

But then blamed “them” because you heard a rumor that “they” would penalize Scotland for going it alone.

It would very easy for EU and UK to be interchanged there.

Given that the UK were in the EU for decades, you surely should have loads of examples where the EU made the UK do something stupid or prevented it from doing something sensible

Bendy bananas maybe?????

In relation to Corona, EU leaders were calling for UK to get their act together and they weren't listened to either.

The UK response to Covid-19 [MOD WARNING 1ST POST]

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