The Chinese Big Lie

silverharp · 12-04-2020 10:57AM

https://twitter.com/KenRoth/status/1249265229558681604

FVP3 · 12-04-2020 11:07AM

Roth is a propagandist of the American empire, and like most neo-cons an inveterate liar. They realise that if they lie they will convince people who are too

I googled this woman's name and finding nothing to confirm this, in this ScientificAmerican profile. China informed the W.H.O on Dec 31st. This piece, written a few months later says nothing bout suppression.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-chinas-bat-woman-hunted-down-viruses-from-sars-to-the-new-coronavirus1/

Once the WHO declared this a novel virus every country in the world had adequate time to control it.

fryup · 12-04-2020 12:29PM

so things aren't as rosy as they say....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQaNdTKQyLY

MadYaker · 12-04-2020 12:32PM

I don't care if they lied about their numbers. What would be nice though is if there is another similar outbreak in China in the future (i think this is a certainty at some point) it would be nice if they could give the international community some reassurance that they won't try and pretend it doesn't exist for 6 weeks before deciding to do anything thus allowing it to spread all over China and the world. If we see a repeat of this I think economic sanctions are a good idea.

2u2me · 12-04-2020 12:34PM

FVP3 wrote: »

I googled this woman's name and finding nothing to confirm this, in this ScientificAmerican profile. China informed the W.H.O on Dec 31st. This piece, written a few months later says nothing bout suppression.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-chinas-bat-woman-hunted-down-viruses-from-sars-to-the-new-coronavirus1/

Once the WHO declared this a novel virus every country in the world had adequate time to control it.

Indeed.
The piece links to a Dailmail article. Interestingly it refers to an online lecture that Shi did last month. In it she describes how the CCP knew about H2H transmission for 1 week before they announced on 20th December to the world.

I guess this is the week everyone is blaming China for. I would say a large amount of blame can be placed on our western goverments imbecilic inaction for the 2 months after that.

2u2me · 12-04-2020 12:35PM

MadYaker wrote: »

it would be nice if they could give the international community some reassurance that they won't try and pretend it doesn't exist for 6 weeks.

Even Shi said it was 1 week.

Yurt2 · 12-04-2020 12:36PM

FVP3 wrote: »

Roth is a propagandist of the American empire, and like most neo-cons an inveterate liar. They realise that if they lie they will convince people who are too

I googled this woman's name and finding nothing to confirm this, in this ScientificAmerican profile. China informed the W.H.O on Dec 31st. This piece, written a few months later says nothing bout suppression.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-chinas-bat-woman-hunted-down-viruses-from-sars-to-the-new-coronavirus1/

Once the WHO declared this a novel virus every country in the world had adequate time to control it.

Roth isn't making the claim. It is Gao Yu, who is one of the brave few journalists in China willing to put her safety at risk by reporting honestly. She was imprisoned a number of years back for writing factually on the workings of the communist party and attempting to inform her compatriots.

A dangerous business in China, and something we take for granted in our country.

The claim either has merit or it doesn't. But if you're shooting the messenger, aim it Gao, who is journalist of integrity and genuine bravery.

EazyD · 12-04-2020 12:39PM

FVP3 wrote: »

Roth is a propagandist of the American empire, and like most neo-cons an inveterate liar. They realise that if they lie they will convince people who are too

I googled this woman's name and finding nothing to confirm this, in this ScientificAmerican profile. China informed the W.H.O on Dec 31st. This piece, written a few months later says nothing bout suppression.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-chinas-bat-woman-hunted-down-viruses-from-sars-to-the-new-coronavirus1/

Once the WHO declared this a novel virus every country in the world had adequate time to control it.

https://youtu.be/bpQFCcSI0pU

Skip to 1.30, explains how the Wuhan Institute of Virology had posted job listings on their website asking for researchers to examine a "new Coronavirus". Also references her and her work in this area

MadYaker · 12-04-2020 12:41PM

2u2me wrote: »

Even Shi said it was 1 week.

First confirmed case in Wuhan mid december (first confirmed case was not patient zero, there were cases before this). Then we have the WHO parroting Chinese lies until the end of january when they eventually declare it a "Public Health Emergency of International Concern" on January 30th. Thats 6 weeks wasted by my count. This tweet and a few others haven't aged well.

https://twitter.com/WHO/status/1217043229427761152

Yurt2 · 12-04-2020 12:50PM

fryup wrote: »

so things aren't as rosy as they say....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQaNdTKQyLY

This sort of stuff isn't a surprise unfortunately. In my China years, every now and then you'd get Chinese guys talking smack under their breath thinking you wouldn't understand, particularly if one was in the company of an Asian female. It was under the surface, and from a minority of Chinese in the past.

Unlike the despicable acts of racism directed towards Asians in Europe you get on occasion, the ugliness you see in the video has been cultivated from above. The party has most decidedly taken a fascistic turn under Xi.

The party thinks its moment has come, has the bull whip in-hand and wants to settle scores, real or imagined.

2u2me · 12-04-2020 01:00PM

MadYaker wrote: »

First confirmed case in Wuhan mid december (first confirmed case was not patient zero, there were cases before this). Then we have the WHO parroting Chinese lies until the end of january when they eventually declare it a "Public Health Emergency of International Concern" on January 30th. Thats 6 weeks wasted by my count. This tweet and a few others haven't aged well.

I wouldn't dispute the WHO are an imcompetant lot, in fact I've been slating them on another thread.

The fact remains H2H transmission was revealed to the world on the 20th. It's like if someone told you a tsunami was coming and you chose not to act, would you then blame the weather?

Even Shi admits the chinese didn't know about this until 1 week before. Would you expect China to shut down its economy on hearsay? Would you expect our government to do so? Because they didn't shut it down on hearsay, or even when the news was out.

threeball · 12-04-2020 01:05PM

There is now verifiable proof that the CCP are repressing information and studies into Covid19 particularly those related to the origin of the virus. A letter from their health ministry was published on many university websites but was then taken down after CNN contacted them to verify the legitimacy of the letter. It was acknowledged the letter was correct but wasn't for public consumption.

MadYaker · 12-04-2020 01:06PM

2u2me wrote: »

I wouldn't dispute the WHO are an imcompetant lot, in fact I've been slating them on another thread.

The fact remains H2H transmission was revealed to the world on the 20th. It's like if someone told you a tsunami was coming and you chose not to act, would you then blame the weather?

Even Shi admits the chinese didn't know about this until 1 week before. Would you expect China to shut down its economy on hearsay? Would you expect our government to do so? Because they didn't shut it down on hearsay, or even when the news was out.

Id expect them not gag doctors who issue public warnings when they realise what the CCP is trying to do. How can you say they didn't know about it? They were putting doctors under house arrest in december ffs! The fact remains that the Chinese lied to the world about this for weeks to try and save face and as a result we are all now in this situation. Whether the initial cover up was done at the behest of local officials or directed by Beijing the fact remains that there was a coverup which allowed the virus to get a head start and spread all over the world. This can't be allowed to happen again and if it does there needs to be crippling economic sanctions brought to bear on the chinese.

2u2me · 12-04-2020 01:16PM

MadYaker wrote: »

They were putting doctors under house arrest in december ffs! [...]The fact remains that the Chinese lied to the world about this for weeks to try and save face and as a result we are all now in this situation.

I still disagree, you are implying some sort of sinister motive. I would prefer to attribute imcompetence.

Whether the initial cover up was done at the behest of local officials or directed by Beijing the fact remains that there was a coverup which allowed the virus to get a head start and spread all over the world.

I'd agree and only add that we were also compliant in it spreading around the world. We didn't act for 2 months after the news was out.

This can't be allowed to happen again and if it does there needs to be crippling economic sanctions brought to bear on the chinese.

This probably will happen again, the scientific literature has been warning about it for ages. We need to be ready, not ready to blame.

bob mcbob · 12-04-2020 01:18PM

FVP3 wrote: »

Roth is a propagandist of the American empire, and like most neo-cons an inveterate liar. They realise that if they lie they will convince people who are too

I googled this woman's name and finding nothing to confirm this, in this ScientificAmerican profile. China informed the W.H.O on Dec 31st. This piece, written a few months later says nothing bout suppression.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-chinas-bat-woman-hunted-down-viruses-from-sars-to-the-new-coronavirus1/

Once the WHO declared this a novel virus every country in the world had adequate time to control it.

Perhaps what we all need is some "gratitude education" to Xi - just like the residents of Wuhan.

BanditLuke · 12-04-2020 01:19PM

MadYaker wrote: »

I don't care if they lied about their numbers. What would be nice though is if there is another similar outbreak in China in the future (i think this is a certainty at some point) it would be nice if they could give the international community some reassurance that they won't try and pretend it doesn't exist for 6 weeks before deciding to do anything thus allowing it to spread all over China and the world. If we see a repeat of this I think economic sanctions are a good idea.

This is a repeat, we've been here before with China. Sanctions are needed now it's all they understand.

Yurt2 · 12-04-2020 01:21PM

2u2me wrote: »

I still disagree, you are implying some sort of sinister motive. I would prefer to attribute imcompetence.

Even in the most generous reading of events, Detaining doctors who are raising a public health alarm can't possibly be written off as mere incompetence.

It's the first thing in the armoury the party use to silence, isolate and intimidate individuals or groups they view as a threat, real or imagined.

Doctors are held in very high esteem in China, the CCP can't afford to have them disseminating information that makes them look bad.

Again, you are being far too kind to a party that would fire you in a gulag for even thinking that they shouldn't dominate political, cultural and society in China until the end of time.

2u2me · 12-04-2020 01:22PM

BanditLuke wrote: »

This is a repeat, we've been here before with China. Sanctions are needed now it's all they understand.

Best start with demand. A good start might be boycotting hollywood movies and not using 5g, tech devices, smart phones etc.. or anything that uses rare earth metals.

wakka12 · 12-04-2020 01:24PM

MadYaker wrote: »

I don't care if they lied about their numbers. What would be nice though is if there is another similar outbreak in China in the future (i think this is a certainty at some point) it would be nice if they could give the international community some reassurance that they won't try and pretend it doesn't exist for 6 weeks before deciding to do anything thus allowing it to spread all over China and the world. If we see a repeat of this I think economic sanctions are a good idea.

It matters that they lied, maybe if the true scale of the disaster was made public knowledge then others countries would have sat up and paid attention. 80k cases and 3k deaths is not a lot over the course of two months in a country the size of China, and probably made other countries think it was a much more manageable disese than it was in reality

fryup · 12-04-2020 01:33PM

MadYaker wrote: »

it would be nice if they could give the international community some reassurance that they won't try and pretend it doesn't exist for 6 weeks before deciding to do anything thus allowing it to spread all over China and the world.

they knew about it a year ago according to this source

_Brian · 12-04-2020 01:37PM

fryup wrote: »

they knew about it a year ago according to this source

Borris Johnson was briefed in December and held his first emergency meeting in March. Donald trump was briefed early on too but up to recently was saying it was a hoax.
It was all over the news from Christmas. Italy was all over the news and little was done, heck Italy waited until they had 1000 confirmed deaths before they initiated a lockdown.

Much of the Irish cases and deaths are linked to Cheltenham and rugger tourists from Italy.

But hey, let’s not accept any responsibility and blame someone else.

MadYaker · 12-04-2020 02:07PM

_Brian wrote: »

Borris Johnson was briefed in December and held his first emergency meeting in March. Donald trump was briefed early on too but up to recently was saying it was a hoax.
It was all over the news from Christmas. Italy was all over the news and little was done, heck Italy waited until they had 1000 confirmed deaths before they initiated a lockdown.

Much of the Irish cases and deaths are linked to Cheltenham and rugger tourists from Italy.

But hey, let’s not accept any responsibility and blame someone else.

I've not seen anyone saying we shouldn't bear some responsibility. We absolutely should. But the point thats being made is that if China had acted quicker instead of covering up it would've been exclusively a chinese problem and not a global one.

mzhou · 12-04-2020 04:43PM

mikiezzz wrote: »

It is true. Chinese Communist governors do not care about people dying. They care about economy going down. The actual death toll in China must be huge. This is a photo of mobile phones taken out from death people in a cremation service venue in Wuhan:

You know, phone batteries cannot be burned, so have to be taken out.

----
If this is true, why wouldn't people wear masks and gloves and full protection in the photo? As far as I know, Chinese people are extremely alert and vigilant with virus and wear gloves and masks everywhere. So I doubt this is a true picture.
I find it interesting how pictures and videos were fabricated to tell a fake story.

declanflynn · 12-04-2020 05:34PM

mzhou wrote: »

----
If this is true, why wouldn't people wear masks and gloves and full protection in the photo? As far as I know, Chinese people are extremely alert and vigilant with virus and wear gloves and masks everywhere. So I doubt this is a true picture.
I find it interesting how pictures and videos were fabricated to tell a fake story.

I dont like the CCP, but there a lot of reasons why this photo is not as you claim it to be

mzhou · 12-04-2020 05:51PM

declanflynn wrote: »

I dont like the CCP, but there a lot of reasons why this photo is not as you claim it to be

I don't judge you like CCP or not, if CCP works for their people with their way of organizing things and running the country, and make most of people's lives a lot better for them, then we should have Kudos for them for saving majority of people from starving and living a very poor life. This applied to every country, all governments, if they can work to make people's life better, that is a plus. Look at the world, so many countries collapsed because of political turmoil and people's life hugely impacted. See what happens in a lot of countries in Middle East and South America.

Coin always have two sides.

mikiezzz · 12-04-2020 06:12PM

FVP3 wrote: »

I googled this woman's name and finding nothing to confirm this, in this ScientificAmerican profile. China informed the W.H.O on Dec 31st. This piece, written a few months later says nothing bout suppression.

This woman Zhengli Shi, a researcher in Wuhan Institute of Virology, is not the hero who told the truth. Actually, very likely the opposite. According to one of her thesis, she created a virus that can infect humans.

A thesis she co-authored and published on Nature Medicine in 2015, says,
"

Using the SARS-CoV reverse genetics system2, we generated and characterized a chimeric virus expressing the spike of bat coronavirus SHC014 in a mouse-adapted SARS-CoV backbone. The results indicate that group 2b viruses encoding the SHC014 spike in a wild-type backbone can efficiently use multiple orthologs of the SARS receptor human angiotensin converting enzyme II (ACE2), replicate efficiently in primary human airway cells and achieve in vitro titers equivalent to epidemic strains of SARS-CoV.

"

That is to say they created a virus that are more infectious and even can infect humans.

A number of virologists have done genome analysis of the Wuhan virus after the outbreak of the pandemic, and are drawing the same conclusion that the coronavirus is impossible a natural emerging virus. In another word, it is created in laboratory.

mikiezzz · 12-04-2020 06:27PM

mzhou wrote: »

----
If this is true, why wouldn't people wear masks and gloves and full protection in the photo? As far as I know, Chinese people are extremely alert and vigilant with virus and wear gloves and masks everywhere. So I doubt this is a true picture.
I find it interesting how pictures and videos were fabricated to tell a fake story.

It is reasonable doubt. The source of the picture cannot be verified. However. Whether the picture is true or not does not void the fact a lot of people in Wuhan have died and the crematoriums are running 24 hours.

The Sun has reported on the long queue of Wuhan people waiting to collect family member's urns at crematorium. It is simple math. 3,500 urns stacked, while official death toll is 2,535.
Stacks of coronavirus urns and queues for ashes at crematorium cast more doubt on China’s official death toll of 2,500

mzhou · 12-04-2020 06:35PM

mikiezzz wrote: »

It is reasonable doubt. The source of the picture cannot be verified, also it is a close-up picture with no surroundings visible. However, it is widely reported that cremation services in Wuhan are running 24 hours.

For a city of 10 million people, it would naturally have 3-400 people die each day based on the worldometers data. This is a special period, where people with heart attack, cancer and cardiovascular diseases cant really go to hospitals as freely as they use to, may die sadly at home, that would increase the death toll, not directly death from the virus, but need cremation services. These people may have been saved if it is not this unprecedented time. Plus is the extra deaths caused by the virus. I wouldn't be surprised that the death toll is higher and cremation services are busier. But I am surprised how the world does not do enough research, but just play the blame game.

Think about poor Irish lady Mary Mallon who used to spread virus in America without knowing herself being the super spreader. From scientific point of view, maybe we can see a different story than just being fooled by political propoganda.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Mallon

As they all say: rumors stop at the wise

silverharp · 12-04-2020 06:40PM

McDonald's in Southern China are banning Blacks from their Restaurants. Not a good corporate look

https://twitter.com/BlackLivityCN/status/1249011762638266374

mzhou · 12-04-2020 06:44PM

silverharp wrote: »

McDonald's in Southern China are banning Blacks from their Restaurants. Not a good corporate look

https://twitter.com/BlackLivityCN/status/1249011762638266374

Another obvious fake news. McDonald's is American, do you really think the American brand allows this to happen when they could be sued for million dollars?

That piece of paper is obviously made by someone not working in McDonald's and brought it there to make a video out of it to make it big in twitter and attract attention and cause tension.

The Chinese Big Lie

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