Covid19 Part XV - 15,251 in ROI (610 deaths) 2,645 in NI (194 deaths) (19/04) Read OP

declanflynn · 11-04-2020 06:17AM

s1ippy wrote: »

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/gabrielleigh/2020/04/10/sweden-continues-with-controversial-coronavirus-strategy-is-it-a-big-mistake/amp/

It appears from this article that Ireland are taking a somewhat similar approach to Sweden when it comes to enforcing the guidelines. I don't know how a "caretaker" "government" can be entitled to be making these life and death decisions (for example, not to penalise people who are flouting restrictions) but at least I'm optimistic that if enough of a society is left at the end to have an enquiry, the Covid tribunal will show this dictatorship up for what it is.

Basically Leo hates the poor. He's said it in every other way that you can besides actually coming out and saying it. Before he is kicked off his unelected pedestal (not forgetting that he was Taoiseach and his own constituents didn't even want him there, was it five counts? And he just replaced Enda to be party leader or "president" as he referred to himself today), he seems hell-bent on using this crisis as an opportunity to take out as many people who hate his government as possible.

I'm talking about all the people who are working at the moment, by the way.

Hear me out. If all the upper middle class who think they're too good for the lockdown travel this weekend (and his flimsy warnings against it and totally inadequate deterrents indicated that he didn't really give a sh!t what they do), there will be a huge surge on hospitals in two weeks. Like we are NOT doing well. Was it 65 or 70% of cases are community transmission? So we don't know how they got it.

The next Cheltenham is Easter and isn't it ironic they'll all be dying for Leo's sins like he's some kind of
edgy biracial sexually enlightened
Jesus. I hid that because it's probably offensive if you're religious, but it's actually probably the only compliment I can pay the man, his race and sexuality are progressive and his politics are completely medieval.

I just can't wait for him to paraphrase Marie Antoinette later this year when the flour supply chains from Italy inevitably cack it.

fcuk I never thought of the flour

Hamsterchops · 11-04-2020 06:33AM

Can somebody please explain as to why some people shrug off this virus as nothing more than a common cold or a mild flu, (Brazil's President comes to mind), yet other healthy people end up on a ventilator and may die!

Do we know why?

munsterlegend · 11-04-2020 06:43AM

US2 wrote: »

People starting to lose confidence in Tony, flat out refuses to say how many are waiting on results, says he doesn't know, but he was quick to know it's not 51000 as was mentioned.

Once people lose confidence they will start to disobey.

Just be transparent that's all anyone wants.

The fact he said on the 7th of March that he was only expecting a few cases in Ireland also doesn’t inspire much faith for any future predictions.

branie2 · 11-04-2020 06:44AM

Thank you for this latest thread

Gynoid · 11-04-2020 06:46AM

https://www.latimes.com/science/story/2020-04-10/coronavirus-infection-can-do-lasting-damage-to-the-heart-liver?_amp=true&__twitter_impression=true

An article from yesterday in LA times that summarises links to various early studies on longer term effects in body for survivors. Both those with severe symptoms and those with mild. Covers possible impaired liver function, effects on heart, kidneys, blood system, possibility of dormancy or latency, clots, fibrosis of lungs, autoimmune responses, etc. There are no long term survivors yet as it is too new a disease. These are all early speculations/ research.

igCorcaigh · 11-04-2020 06:47AM

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Can somebody please explain as to why some people shrug off this virus as nothing more than a common cold or a mild flu, (Brazil's President comes to mind), yet other healthy people end up on a ventilator and may die!

Do we know why?

You're not the only one asking that

I don't think anyone knows the answer yet, but I suspect viral load plays a factor, possibly genetics too? Idk.

ek motor · 11-04-2020 06:54AM

Blanco100 wrote: »

Is it an absolute certainty that if some gets rid of it they dont pick it up quickly again?

Also does the virus cause any long term lung damage for people who even recover?

https://m-en.yna.co.kr/view/AEN20200410006500320

There seems to be evidence of virus reactivation according to the South Korean CDC

Away With The Fairies · 11-04-2020 06:58AM

Gynoid wrote: »

https://www.latimes.com/science/story/2020-04-10/coronavirus-infection-can-do-lasting-damage-to-the-heart-liver?_amp=true&__twitter_impression=true

An article from yesterday in LA times that summarises links to various early studies on longer term effects in body for survivors. Both those with severe symptoms and those with mild. Covers possible impaired liver function, effects on heart, kidneys, blood system, possibility of dormancy or latency, clots, fibrosis of lungs, autoimmune responses, etc. There are no long term survivors yet as it is too new a disease. These are all early speculations/ research.

That is so scary for a disease that's spreading so fast.

Away With The Fairies · 11-04-2020 07:02AM

munsterlegend wrote: »

The fact he said on the 7th of March that he was only expecting a few cases in Ireland also doesn’t inspire much faith for any future predictions.

It was beyond me how anyone thought we were low risk in those early days. And that coming from a doctor.

NegativeCreep · 11-04-2020 07:03AM

Please let the barbers open up soon. The head on me ðŸ˜©ðŸ˜©

c.p.w.g.w · 11-04-2020 07:05AM

NegativeCreep wrote: »

Please let the barbers open up soon. The head on me &#55357;&#56873;&#55357;&#56873;

Genuinely in a state of disbelief at how many folks are worried about their hair...In work it's literally all 40% of the lads are talking about, not the football or the virus but thier fcuking hair

Away With The Fairies · 11-04-2020 07:08AM

NegativeCreep wrote: »

Please let the barbers open up soon. The head on me ðŸ˜©ðŸ˜©

We'd be doing well if we came out of this with just bad hair.

Ninthlife · 11-04-2020 07:08AM

NegativeCreep wrote: »

Please let the barbers open up soon. The head on me ðŸ˜©ðŸ˜©

My missus cut mine....i may look like an extra out of Mad Max but at least my hair is short

Juwwi · 11-04-2020 07:11AM

munsterlegend wrote: »

The fact he said on the 7th of March that he was only expecting a few cases in Ireland also doesn’t inspire much faith for any future predictions.

I remember him saying that ,also he said we were very low risk of getting the virus ,, the stupidity of telling the Northern Italy ski trip people to carry on about daily business unless they show any symptoms was just madness tho ,, the band camp lad who was waiting for his result going to the class ,, none of this is hindsight talk either loads were screaming blue murder at the time over this ,,it was well documented that this virus is contagious and you might not show symptoms for a while ,,

What skin off his nose was it just to tell people returning home from northern Italy to self isolate for 2 weeks back then .

Funsterdelux · 11-04-2020 07:15AM

NegativeCreep wrote: »

Please let the barbers open up soon. The head on me ��

Ive had my hair cut about 3 times in my life by a barber/hairdresser. Mind I just give myself a 0 all round beard and all. I only need to do it every 6 weeks- 2 months. A significant other could do a more complex cut/trim.

NegativeCreep · 11-04-2020 07:33AM

Funsterdelux wrote: »

Ive had my hair cut about 3 times in my life by a barber/hairdresser. Mind I just give myself a 0 all round beard and all. I only need to do it every 6 weeks- 2 months. A significant other could do a more complex cut/trim.

I’ve a lumpy head. They won’t do.

Sean 18 · 11-04-2020 07:38AM

How come it affects some healthy young people so bad even fatal in some cases and some people have it and they might not even have a temperature? Is there different strains of it

tigger123 · 11-04-2020 07:39AM

Sean 18 wrote: »

How come it affects some healthy young people so bad even fatal in some cases and some people have it and they might not even have a temperature? Is there different strains of it

Not different strains, but they don't know why it affects different people in different ways. Think I heard on the radio yesterday that the WHO are doing studies on that particular aspect of it.

Achasanai · 11-04-2020 07:41AM

If you don't want to shave your head, there's always a sheep shears

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1248325832243916802

Achasanai · 11-04-2020 07:44AM

tigger123 wrote: »

Not different strains, but they don't know why it affects different people in different ways. Think I heard on the radio yesterday that the WHO are doing studies on that particular aspect of it.

Some were saying on the last thread that it may have something to do with viral load.

Wibbs · 11-04-2020 07:45AM

Gynoid wrote: »

https://www.latimes.com/science/story/2020-04-10/coronavirus-infection-can-do-lasting-damage-to-the-heart-liver?_amp=true&__twitter_impression=true

An article from yesterday in LA times that summarises links to various early studies on longer term effects in body for survivors. Both those with severe symptoms and those with mild. Covers possible impaired liver function, effects on heart, kidneys, blood system, possibility of dormancy or latency, clots, fibrosis of lungs, autoimmune responses, etc. There are no long term survivors yet as it is too new a disease. These are all early speculations/ research.

The problem with that kinda thing G is because as you say it's a "new" disease so supposition is rife, with an understandable hint of fear, even panic attached. Add in the natural human competitive rush to be the first with results and..

The main problem I see with that research is they're only looking at people who were sick enough to end up needing medical attention, including those who ended up in ICU's even sedated, intubated and ventilated often for weeks at a time. Never mind that the majority of those very serious cases are older and with at least one underlying condition, often more than one.

What I would be doing is looking at people who ended up in ICU's in the past, before Covid 19. People who were sedated, intubated and ventilated for other reasons. I'm no doctor, but I'll bet the farm that those people are going to show various long lasting issues too. From both what landed them in ICU and the medical process to save them. Sedation for that length of time is tricky and hard on the body, mechanical ventilation is bloody hard on the body too and takes a long recovery time. Never mind that you're not eating, hydration is through a drip, catheter up the how's yer father for waste disposal.

If you look into the experiments on long term issues with space flight where they get volunteers to lay in bed for weeks to stimulate low gravity, they get all sorts of bodily function changes and they're perfectly healthy younger people who are not immobile and unconscious with tubes everywhere. I mean medical health advice for office workers at desks is to get up and walk around once an hour, because it's not good for the body to keep sitting for too long.

TL;DR? I'd be waiting a goodly while until all the results, or at least better results, are in before jumping to any conclusions about such long term damage in the vast majority of people who contract this dose.

11-04-2020 07:47AM

I see Mexico has closed down a plant making ventilators as it can only export them to America and has said that since it doesn't benefit Mexicans, it isn't an essential business.

Widdensushi · 11-04-2020 07:50AM

Deleted User wrote: »

I see Mexico has closed down a plant making ventilators as it can only export them to America and has said that since it doesn't benefit Mexicans, it isn't an essential business.

will they not treat Mexican Americans in the American hospitals

caveat emptor · 11-04-2020 07:52AM

Initially I was terrified what would happen if we didn't bring in restrictions. We managed to bring them in but it was always slightly after the fact.
I've been impressed with how society are rallying around vulnerable but if I look at the situation coldly I'm not so happy. At every step there has been people on here doing their best to raise awareness fighting pitched battles with the wilfully ignorant. It's great to see so many like minded people on here but I've spent most of my time pointing out utter horsesho!t written by people who are clearly working for some vested interest in a volunteer or professional capacity.

cancel the match / parade => leave pubs open so people travelled anyway
open glamour testing centres => no possibility of processing them => massive testing backlog to this way
transparency through obfuscation => It should not take that long to explain a number
Proper PPE for front-line staff => highest rate of HCW infected AFIK (as a percentage of total cases) All you need to do is compare how our staff look compared to other countries to know we were given run around.
Talking AROUND numbers has turned into a national sport
Nursing home situation needs investigation. God knows how many people who could have pulled through were signed away by well wishing family who stood to gain financially. Horrible to think but I've seen this first hand with family and houses.

I wasn't surprised in the least that extensions were extended. I'm still not happy about not having a clear exit strategy. Strategy has been weak throughout. We were more concerned with cowing EU, vintners , Bord failte than getting ahead of this curve.

Getting to the stage of just getting on with the new reality. This will be hear for a very long time if the whole international community doesn't work together. Best just get used to new normal and keep yourself and loved ones happy and safe.

Happy Saturday.

Kivaro · 11-04-2020 07:52AM

I posted this on the mask thread earlier:

Was listening to a virologist from Lancaster University this morning on how the virus can be transmitted by just talking to another person. This is now accepted in the wider medical community and it really should come as no surprise to anyone. This is why some of us have been saying for many weeks that masks are so important.

Yesterday, there was a poster talking about the 15-minute rule required to get the virus, and how it was not possible to contract the virus by a heavy breathing jogger passing close by you. Neither of these statements are true, and they actually sound illogical knowing how contagious Covid-19 is. The same illogical guidance is what we are receiving from the HSE and government about not wearing masks. I expect though that there will be a slow u-turn by them on this.

Wonder if anyone saw the BBC Hoziron's program during the week about the virus. It was truly an eye opener. The exponential nature of where we are with the virus was shocking. We are past the point of no return according to the presented graphs .... mathematically speaking. There was a moment when we could have leveled the curve to stop the exponential increase, but that time has passed.

We should remember with all of this not-too-positive news though is that thousands of very clever people around the globe are using their expertise to come up with solutions. One report this morning talked about a September vaccine. Whether or not it is a realistic expectation for a safe vaccine so soon, there are positive reports of vaccine progress and other treatments to reduce the symptoms.

Rvsmmnps · 11-04-2020 07:54AM

Another day where this has been blown out of proportion.

US2 · 11-04-2020 07:55AM

Not politically motivated atall , I think the government has handled this well in regards to unemployment and businesses under pressure but I have completely lost what little faith I had in Tony hoolahan and co.
Fudging numbers since the start which I proved here on boards on day 3 when my friend got a positive result on a friday but it wasnt announced until the following Wednesday.
Every day he tells us how much testing capabilities we have, last night he said NO ONE was waiting to be tested?
He has flat out refused to answer how many are awaiting on test results or how long the wait is yet he is very quick and knows it's not 51000 waiting results as reported by Michael Martin.
This is from a guy who expected us not to have any community spread AFTER someone who hadn't traveled or been in contact with a confirmed case?

Treat us with respect, give us transparency and we will respect you and your guidance.

I was thinking at the start, we might actually handle this well but no typical Ireland everything's a secret.

We dont need an excuse or to hide anything, some of the best healthcare systems in the world are struggling, we expect our health system to struggle.

Tell us the truth or we lose confidence and ignore you because your full of fibs!!

Away With The Fairies · 11-04-2020 07:57AM

Rvsmmnps wrote: »

Another day where this has been blown out of proportion.

Will you say the same thing if you were grasping for breath in hospital?

Wibbs · 11-04-2020 07:58AM

Sean 18 wrote: »

How come it affects some healthy young people so bad even fatal in some cases and some people have it and they might not even have a temperature? Is there different strains of it

From what I've read on the Wuhan research into kids who caught it and almost always have mild symptoms, it appears to not get into the lungs to any great degree with children. It stays in the upper respiratory system, the throat, sinuses, for some reason. This appears to be the case with the really mild symptoms in adults too. So those who only have the lose of taste and smell as a symptom it's in the head and appears to stay there. In some it goes into the lungs and causes stronger symptoms and in a minority that goes onto serious symptoms in the lungs. As for healthy young people getting it bad even fatally, they appear to be a small minority. In Italy's case every single person under 40 that died from it had very serious underlying health conditions.

What I've noticed in a completely unscientific way I grant you is when you see reports in the media of younger people in their 20's and 30's, even 40's who've tragically died from this, the majority are overweight and usually obese. That appears to be a pretty big factor. Even in the images of the Italian wards a goodly proportion are pretty stocky men, not so many whippet thin people.

Gynoid · 11-04-2020 07:58AM

Wibbs wrote: »

The problem with that kinda thing G is because as you say it's a "new" disease so supposition is rife, with an understandable hint of fear, even panic attached. Add in the natural human competitive rush to be the first with results and..

The main problem I see with that research is they're only looking at people who were sick enough to end up needing medical attention, including those who ended up in ICU's even sedated, intubated and ventilated often for weeks at a time. Never mind that the majority of those very serious cases are older and with at least one underlying condition, often more than one.

What I would be doing is looking at people who ended up in ICU's in the past, before Covid 19. People who were sedated, intubated and ventilated for other reasons. I'm no doctor, but I'll bet the farm that those people are going to show various long lasting issues too. From both what landed them in ICU and the medical process to save them. Sedation for that length of time is tricky and hard on the body, mechanical ventilation is bloody hard on the body too and takes a long recovery time. Never mind that you're not eating, hydration is through a drip, catheter up the how's yer father for waste disposal.

If you look into the experiments on long term issues with space flight where they get volunteers to lay in bed for weeks to stimulate low gravity, they get all sorts of bodily function changes and they're perfectly healthy younger people who are not immobile and unconscious with tubes everywhere. I mean medical health advice for office workers at desks is to get up and walk around once an hour, because it's not good for the body to keep sitting for too long.

TL;DR? I'd be waiting a goodly while until all the results, or at least better results, are in before jumping to any conclusions about such long term damage in the vast majority of people who contract this dose.

I agree. We will have to meet back here in 3 to 6 months and longer to report anything approaching more certain indices. I still think it is an important consideration in policy planning, as people with mild (who knows what that means right now!) symptoms were included in some of the studies.

Covid19 Part XV - 15,251 in ROI (610 deaths) 2,645 in NI (194 deaths) (19/04) Read OP

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