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Picard 1x05 - "Stardust City Rag" [** SPOILERS WITHIN **]

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    #32
    tromtipp
    Registered Users Posts: 262 ✭✭tromtipp


    I was very glad I'd picked up a spoiler on that. I skipped the first four minutes or so, and still found it traumatic - I always liked poor Icheb, treated so cynically by his parents. Good episode there - hope Seven comes back, as ever Ryan outshines everyone else, and yet draws the best out of them.

    Totally on board with the cyberAgnes theory - just wonder is she Data or Lore?


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    #33
    TheIrishGrover
    Registered Users Posts: 6,023 ✭✭✭TheIrishGrover


    I really enjoyed that episode. Thought it was a vast improvement over the last couple.
    The bet with Icheb was heartbreaking and brilliantly done. I remember thinking: "After all that kid has been through, Assimilation, loss of family.... spending so much time on Voyager ( :) ), working his way through Starfleet. Only for some a$$hole to treat him in such a way. You can totally empathise with Seven and her casual violence at the end.

    I'm warming to Elf-Rom very quickly. I was hoping that he wasn't going to be a one-note poor-man's G'kar/Worf and he definitely isn't. He's a kid with combat and mental training who is still leaving home for the first time.

    Jeri Ryan was simply fantastic.

    I mist admit, I thought Agnes was really our "in" to the series. For people to dump info on for those who haven't seen previous series. Didn't twig her until we were supposed to (The instant the camera flashed to her the first time towards the end).

    Yeah, her mental-state/anxiety is definitely part of her story. Deffo Agnesynth. Would explain all her "quirky" mannerisms. Her arm thumping with Rios, reaction to advert holo, general slightly hyper/annoying mannerisms. (The arm thumping and holo scenes annoyed me initially but at the end you were thinking: Oooooooohhhhhhhh. She's only about 7 or something)

    So yeah, great episode. My usual:

    the Good
    • Icheb scene at the start. Heartbreaking.
    • Jeri Ryan throughout the episode. Fantastic. Would like to see her in the show again but very sparingly. (Similar amount of time next season maybe)
    • Elf-Rom. Character coming along nicely: "How come I didn't get one"
    • Captain PimpRios
    • Agnes: "You're killing it"
    • Use of Voyager's music as Seven transports back to wreak havok.

    The Bad
    • For the love of God... I know, was cool to see Seven blazing away with two guns but c'mon, on ALL the adverts?
    • Only minor thing: The whole "Oh yeah, I forgot he was a Borg" exposition. I know, some people will be coming into this fresh but it was a bit on the nose.

    The Meh
    • Raffi still in the show. I suppose we never really expected her to leave. At leave she dialed back the whole JL to once I think and even called him Admiral Picard.


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    #34
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    ReginaldSmythV wrote: »
    A minute into that and I’m done with the series. They had to reduce it to gore like every two-bit show around that has nothing else going for it.
    It's not gratuitous and it's very much necessary, that scene (and the brutality of it) is arguably the lynchpin of most of the episode. Give it another go.

    I enjoyed that. There are some online enclaves who are hating this, and I get it. I watched a DS9 episode after, and the tone is entirely different. There's no sterile optimism, the lighting is darker, the characters are more "normal" and there's more natural dialogue.

    Arguably this series is the darker Trek that Voyager really should have been.

    Jeri Ryan as ever, stole the show. I have no doubt she'll be back another couple of times. But if they're looking at more Trek shows, then I'd watch the **** out of a show about Seven and the Rangers.

    What Seven did at the end, could be a metaphor for the entire series. Gone are the last-minute redemptions, the change of heart after some epic speech on humanity by Janeway. She did what in any previous Trek series would be considered a brutal murder, and she has shrugged it off as a necessary evil.

    Also somewhat "nice" to see that they're literally killing off old characters. Bring them in to link the past to the present, and then discard them rather than making them part of the regular cast. This in effect allows them to "reboot" Trek post-Voyager without ruining continuity.

    I still find it a bit overwritten in some points, but it's definitely finding its feet. We've moved from being all set up, to starting to move the storyline on.

    Dunno what the story is with Agnes. Either she has been replaced, or she was lying to Picard when they first met. I suspect Agnes is in fact a synth herself (and she knows it) and was hoping that Picard would just go away.


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    #35
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,486 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    I really don't get all the love for this episode. I thought it was by far the worst so far. It's a convoluted mess of nothing really happening that makes any reasonable sense.


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    #36
    ilovesmybrick
    Registered Users Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭ilovesmybrick


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    I really don't get all the love for this episode. I thought it was by far the worst so far. It's a convoluted mess of nothing really happening that makes any reasonable sense.

    I'm not sure what episode you were watching, but an awful lot happened in that episode to drive the story in the second half of the season.

    They found Maddox (& lost Maddox), learned where Soji is and are now moving to the cube linking the two stories together, we find out there is still Romulan Space, the Federation completely abandoned the Neutral Zone area, the Dr. outed herself (to the audience) as having ulterior motives, a bit of movement on what happened to Raffi after she left Starfleet, we see that there's a black market for freed Borg parts, are reintroduced to Seven and get some backstory on her over the past twenty years, and Icheb is reintroduced and then offed and we see that over the years Seven developed a deep familial bond with him.

    And not levelling this at you directly, but I'll be stunned if someone also doesn't have next weeks as worst so far, or the following week etc. etc!


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    #37
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,486 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    ilovesmybrick wrote: »
    I'm not sure what episode you were watching, but an awful lot happened in that episode to drive the story in the second half of the season.

    They found Maddox (& lost Maddox), learned where Soji is and are now moving to the cube linking the two stories together, we find out there is still Romulan Space, the Federation completely abandoned the Neutral Zone area, the Dr. outed herself (to the audience) as having ulterior motives, a bit of movement on what happened to Raffi after she left Starfleet, we see that there's a black market for freed Borg parts, are reintroduced to Seven and get some backstory on her over the past twenty years, and Icheb is reintroduced and then offed and we see that over the years Seven developed a deep familial bond with him.

    And not levelling this at you directly, but I'll be stunned if someone also doesn't have next weeks as worst so far, or the following week etc. etc!

    Let's find and kill 2, probably 3*, characters without any real reason other than heartstrings. Let's ruin girati as just some romulan stooge or whatever, lets give rafi some stupid nonsense go nowhere extra bit, let have Picard play the ridiculous French stereotype.

    *I reckon it's heavily implied seven would be killed.

    Also it went so generic future with stupid ads everwhere etc that is so detracting from what star trek should be. And yes i get it portraying a star fleet perfect world etc when they are "normal" people, but still its just horrifically cliche. This is the first episode where it's felt like any other generic crap future sci-fi show and it's so disappointing. I have really enjoyed it so far but this episode was just too far 😕

    Edit: also the cube is common knowledge and everyone is cool with that????


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    #38
    ilovesmybrick
    Registered Users Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭ilovesmybrick


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    Let's find and kill 2, probably 3*, characters without any real reason other than heartstrings. Let's ruin girati as just some romulan stooge or whatever, lets give rafi some stupid nonsense go nowhere extra bit, let have Picard play the ridiculous French stereotype.

    *I reckon it's heavily implied seven would be killed.

    Also it went so generic future with stupid ads everwhere etc that is so detracting from what star trek should be. And yes i get it portraying a star fleet perfect world etc when they are "normal" people, but still its just horrifically cliche. This is the first episode where it's felt like any other generic crap future sci-fi show and it's so disappointing. I have really enjoyed it so far but this episode was just too far ��

    Edit: also the cube is common knowledge and everyone is cool with that????

    I'd disagree that their deaths were just to tug heartstrings (and in fairness, who actually liked Maddox?)

    Icheb died to indicate why Seven has developed into the character we see, as well as to indicate the lawlessness of the region. Maddox died to indicate how much whatever truth the Dr. was told affected her, and how important it seems to her now that all knowledge of synthetic life is destroyed. Anyway, it was heavlily implied from the second episode that there was something off about her. And there's no way Seven died. Not only did we see her slip away the pattern enhancer, she also literally gave Picard a calling card, which is a Chekov's gun if ever there was one.

    I'm not sure what the issue is with the cube being common knowledge? We have seen that researchers from the Federation go there, and that the Romulans are using harvested technology to support themselves. While the Federation might think that even a dead cube is dangerous, what do you think they'll do, swoop in and blow it up in Romulan space?

    Also it's nice to see something that isn't a perfect Federation, because times have moved on and they're literally not in the Federation, they're in a lawless part of space. And speaking about stupid ads...



    So far I think the series has been great. I've a few quibbles with it, and it's not the Trek I expected or thought I wanted, which is fantastic. When DS9 came out I was dead set against Trek on a station, and based on the initial episodes I proved myself right. Turns out it was the best of all Trek series so far. Despite this utter garbage



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    #39
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,486 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    ilovesmybrick wrote: »
    I'm not sure what the issue is with the cube being common knowledge? We have seen that researchers from the Federation go there, and that the Romulans are using harvested technology to support themselves. While the Federation might think that even a dead cube is dangerous, what do you think they'll do, swoop in and blow it up in Romulan space?

    Seriously?
    I thought in the first few episodes it was supposed to be super secret. Now its clear its common knowledge.You honestly think that if it is common knowledge that the Romulans have a cube every other power would be ok with it? They are a broken former superpower that any other (Fed, Klingon, Gorn, Tholians etc) would walk over, yet we're supposed to believe everyone is cool to just let them at it?
    Not a chance, there is no way a broken civ could sustain that especially if it is common knowledge. As much as the Fed may be decent about it the Klingons would just annihilate them without any hesitation.


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    #40
    ilovesmybrick
    Registered Users Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭ilovesmybrick


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    Seriously?
    I thought in the first few episodes it was supposed to be super secret. Now its clear its common knowledge.You honestly think that if it is common knowledge that the Romulans have a cube every other power would be ok with it? They are a broken former superpower that any other (Fed, Klingon, Gorn, Tholians etc) would walk over, yet we're supposed to believe everyone is cool to just let them at it?
    Not a chance, there is no way a broken civ could sustain that especially if it is common knowledge. As much as the Fed may be decent about it the Klingons would just annihilate them without any hesitation.

    In the second episode we see multiple non-Romulans on the artifact, and are introduced to researchers being brought in as guests of the institute. So from the outset we knew it wasn't super secret. Maybe not broadly common knowledge, but at least common enough that humans and trills don't appear to be considered particularly unusual to see there.

    As to why other powers don't intervene, we have no idea what the strength is of the remains of the Romulan empire, or even what the relative strength of the other powers is. The Klingons would not necessarily swoop in and attack if it was something that cold jeopardise their alliance with the Federation. Or maybe they have but the artifact is out of reach or too heavily protected. I'm not saying that other powers are ok with it, but not being ok with it does not need to mean launching an assault on the Romulan Free State (whatever that may be, and however big it may be). And we don't know what relative benefit they gain fro the Romulan work there. The Romulans did provide the Klingons with their initial cloaking devices, who knows what they may be getting now.


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    #41
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users Posts: 28,791 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Watching now so my immediate random thoughts.. .

    - MORE flashbacks
    - This is graphic. Not exactly family friendly
    - Icheb! Ah FFS
    - Freecloud is a ridiculous name for a planet
    - More lens flare
    - Dark gritty Discovery tones... Check! *sigh*

    ... And this is just the pre-title scenes. Will post more afterwards


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    #42
    Goodshape
    Registered Users Posts: 8,488 ✭✭✭Goodshape


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »

    ... And this is just the pre-title scenes. Will post more afterwards

    Or maybe put the notebook away, relax a little, and actually watch the TV show?

    Who knows, you might accidentally enjoy yourself.


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    #43
    Stark
    Registered Users Posts: 20,954 ✭✭✭✭Stark


    This episode reminded me very much of that "bootleg" version of Power Rangers some guy did in the lead up to the 2016 movie. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power/Rangers . (Maybe the "Rangers" they refer to are Power Rangers :eek:).

    I've a feeling they're going for a "darkest before the dawn" take on things with the exceptionally gritty tone. We know at some point between now and the 26th century, the Federation and Starfleet return to former glory so there is hope.


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    #44
    Thargor
    Registered Users Posts: 17,907 ✭✭✭✭Thargor


    Who the feck thought those pathetic hologram adverts for Freecloud were a good idea? They would have been embarrassing on a nineties childrens tv show.


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    #45
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 7,712 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    Watching now so my immediate random thoughts.. .

    - MORE flashbacks
    - This is graphic. Not exactly family friendly
    - Icheb! Ah FFS
    - Freecloud is a ridiculous name for a planet
    - More lens flare
    - Dark gritty Discovery tones... Check! *sigh*

    ... And this is just the pre-title scenes. Will post more afterwards

    That was one I was thinking last week as a real low point - “Freecloud” seems very Star Wars. I didn’t see it in this one but I was guessing Mos Eisley straight away.
    It all seems very early days rather than onward in time from TNG etc.


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    #46
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users Posts: 28,791 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Goodshape wrote: »
    Or maybe put the notebook away, relax a little, and actually watch the TV show?

    Who knows, you might accidentally enjoy yourself.

    Nope, unfortunately I didn't.

    Seven was great. I was worried that she'd be "rebooted" in the same way as Picard, but she seemed to be where you'd expect after 20 years of exposure to humanity again, and the loss of Icheb would obviously have hardened her as they were very close on Voyager. The exchange between her and Picard before she beamed back down about that humanity was the most "classic Trek" sequence I've seen in this show.

    But the graphic mutilation of Icheb, the stupid holo ads that look like they came from a Disney kids movie (ironic as there was nothing family friendly about this episode), Picard hamming it up as a badly-accented French space pirate, the Star wars feeling Casino.... all negatives.

    The other problem here is that they have turned probably one of the top 2 iconic characters of the entire franchise into a weak, reactive, ineffective charicature of himself. We already saw the reactions to New Spock in Discovery/JJ's films, but this is PICARD they're messing with!

    What they've unfortunately done here is create another Discovery - reliant on shock value, action sequences, bad lighting and a gritty feel to everything, and dark "complicated" characters to sell it. This has more in common with something like The Expanse than TNG/DS9/VOY

    And that's fine... but then BE that show. Don't rely on nostalgia and familiarity of a massive franchise to hook an audience, and give them occasional glimpses of that past.. only to then "subvert expectations" by rebooting concepts, visuals and characters beyond recognition.

    I really WAS hopeful for this show as earlier posts on this forum will show, and was very positive about the first episode, but there's very little recognisable here and many of the same issues with Discovery have been carried over :(


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    #47
    Sparko
    Registered Users Posts: 2,100 ✭✭✭Sparko


    I read an interesting comment about the Icheb scene that I didn't notice at the time - the doctor/butcher removing his Borg parts made a comment about not being able to find his cortical node, but he didn't have one because he donated it to Seven in an episode of Voyager in which her one was malfunctioning and she couldn't survive without one, whereas he could.


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    #48
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,068 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Not bothered to go back but did I hear a Quark namedrop during captain Rios' initial attempts at infiltration?

    I liked the episode, definitely a bit more forward momentum to it, and the daft con act a nice reminder they hadn't completely forgotten how to have fun. Elnor came off well, after rough first impressions, and I even liked Raffi, if her own subplot was a little rushed.

    Obviously 7of9 was the standout, her little chat with Picard about their shared Borg experience showed more characterisation on that front than the entirety of TNG ever bothered / managed. Methinks that won't be the first time Lacutus comes up either.


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    #49
    AMKC
    Registered Users Posts: 15,768 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    ilovesmybrick wrote: »
    I'd disagree that their deaths were just to tug heartstrings (and in fairness, who actually liked Maddox?) And there's no way Seven died. Not only did we see her slip away the pattern enhancer, she also literally gave Picard a calling card, which is a Chekov's gun if ever there was one.

    Also it's nice to see something that isn't a perfect Federation, because times have moved on and they're literally not in the Federation.

    So far I think the series has been great. I've a few quibbles with it, and it's not the Trek I expected or thought I wanted, which is fantastic. When DS9 came out I was dead set against Trek on a station, and based on the initial episodes I proved myself right. Turns out it was the best of all Trek series so far. Despite this.


    I have to disagree with you. It might not be the best episode but it is a fun episode with a bit of humour in it.
    Stark wrote: »
    This episode reminded me very much of that "bootleg" version of Power Rangers some guy did in the lead up to the 2016 movie. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power/Rangers . (Maybe the "Rangers" they refer to are Power Rangers :eek:).

    I've a feeling they're going for a "darkest before the dawn" take on things with the exceptionally gritty tone. We know at some point between now and the 26th century, the Federation and Starfleet return to former glory so there is hope.

    Actually the bit about Seven in charge of some rangers reminded me more of Babylon 5.
    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    Nope, unfortunately I didn't.

    Seven was great. I was worried that she'd be "rebooted" in the same way as Picard, but she seemed to be where you'd expect after 20 years of exposure to humanity again, and the loss of Icheb would obviously have hardened her as they were very close on Voyager. The exchange between her and Picard before she beamed back down about that humanity was the most "classic Trek" sequence I've seen in this show.

    But the graphic mutilation of Icheb, the stupid holo ads that look like they came from a Disney kids movie (ironic as there was nothing family friendly about this episode), Picard hamming it up as a badly-accented French space pirate, the Star wars feeling Casino.... all negatives.

    The other problem here is that they have turned probably one of the top 2 iconic characters of the entire franchise into a weak, reactive, ineffective charicature of himself. We already saw the reactions to New Spock in Discovery/JJ's films, but this is PICARD they're messing with!

    What they've unfortunately done here is create another Discovery - reliant on shock value, action sequences, bad lighting and a gritty feel to everything, and dark "complicated" characters to sell it. This has more in common with something like The Expanse than TNG/DS9/VOY

    And that's fine... but then BE that show. Don't rely on nostalgia and familiarity of a massive franchise to hook an audience, and give them occasional glimpses of that past.. only to then "subvert expectations" by rebooting concepts, visuals and characters beyond recognition.

    I really WAS hopeful for this show as earlier posts on this forum will show, and was very positive about the first episode, but there's very little recognisable here and many of the same issues with Discovery have been carried over :(

    To be fair this is far better than Discovery even if it is a lot darker. I agree some of the scenes look more like scenes from Lord of The Rings or Star Wars or even Babylon 5 but I am enjoying most of it. Last weeks episode was to me the worst so far and this one was the best.


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    #50
    SimonTemplar
    Registered Users Posts: 2,815 ✭✭✭SimonTemplar


    Captain Rios badly needs to get AdBlock for his ship.


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    #51
    Stark
    Registered Users Posts: 20,954 ✭✭✭✭Stark


    I wonder is the EMH going to rat Jurati out in the next episode. Though I'm sure she's smart enough to edit its memory.


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    #52
    velo.2010
    Registered Users Posts: 3,010 ✭✭✭velo.2010


    AllForIt wrote: »
    ...Patrick Stewart... looks like he has his lines held in front of him by a best-boy and is just reading them off as if it's the first time he's seen them. As if noting was asked of him to do the show, only turn up.

    I got that vibe too. We must remember, though, that Stewart is rapidly approaching his 80th birthday and is visibly and audibly frail. That will have an impact on what he can and can't do on the show... and, in fairness, it has been intimated as much for his character during the episode run so far.

    A word on the original actors not returning to their roles. Brian Brophy (Bruce Maddox TNG) hasn't been active as of late according to IMDB. My suspicion is that he was never asked back and they chose an actor with an unremarkable presence to portray Maddox - it's easier to bump him off without offending too many fans.

    Icheb is different. Manu Intiraymi is very much active and quite likely was approached about the role. After looking at the script, I can imagine the actor politely turned down the part because of the nature of the scene and it being so short. Why return after 19 years to be bumped off like that?

    This weeks episode was better again. No Borg Cube scenes, maybe that's the key!:D Frakes did well with what he was giving, story wise. The middle bit with the high jinx was not Star Trek or any good sci-fi for that matter - it just felt off. What did feel like Star Trek was the final interaction between Picard and Seven. For the briefest moment, I felt like we were back to prime TNG, First Contact - that soul searching in the midst of an epic journey or battle. It was well written and well directed. This must be Jeri Ryan's finest performance. It must also be the most complex a role and longest duration on screen for any part she has previously played, so double kudos for her to be able to nail it, this far along in her career.

    It's disappointing to read some reviews elsewhere that focus so much on the gender/patriarchal aspect of the show - that Kurtzman and co are trying to redress the balance like Discovery. Well, this show isn't Discovery... its better. And, TBH, I don't find the show as particularly allegorical for what is going on in the world today. All Star Trek has, to some degree, been a reflection on society - ST Picard does no different. Its OK to have strong female characters and just fine to see them in duplicitous roles. It's refreshing and different to have women playing roles more associated with those familiar stock authority type actors.

    I don't see the Jurati-is-a-synth scenario. I could be wrong but she just comes across as an detached scientist who's been easily turned after being presented with something of a 'all synths must perish' last resort scenario.

    The Borg cube next week. That's come quicker than expected. I hope they get it right because it will set the tone for the last few episodes. Still waiting for an actual starship to appear!


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    #53
    AllForIt
    Registered Users Posts: 8,336 ✭✭✭AllForIt


    velo.2010 wrote: »
    I got that vibe too. We must remember, though, that Stewart is rapidly approaching his 80th birthday and is visibly and audibly frail. That will have an impact on what he can and can't do on the show... and, in fairness, it has been intimated as much for his character during the episode run so far.

    Yes, fair play to him for agreeing to engage. It's shows some respect for sci-fi as a genre from someone who was more originally Shakespearean/theater focused.

    The middle bit with the high jinx was not Star Trek or any good sci-fi for that matter - it just felt off.

    That kind of thing worked in the holo-decks. I felt the scene was a homage to that.
    It's disappointing to read some reviews elsewhere that focus so much on the gender/patriarchal aspect of the show - that Kurtzman and co are trying to redress the balance like Discovery.

    I'ts not bugging me too much...yet. That type of thing can be a bit too obvious that it detracts your attention. I never felt it with Voyager, having a strong willed female captain. Or Borg 'Queen'.
    I don't see the Jurati-is-a-synth scenario. I could be wrong but she just comes across as an detached scientist who's been easily turned after being presented with something of a 'all synths must perish' last resort scenario.

    No I don't see that either. She seems to be involved in making androids so she could hardly have made herself. She wept in a earlier seen unless that's a red herring.


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    #54
    TheValeyard
    Registered Users Posts: 12,325 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    I really enjoyed it. Thought it had humour and good content. First episode I didn't want Raffi to be airlocked.

    Seven really added to it and we got a more full picture of an alpha quadrant in chaos.

    It's great to see non fed worlds and open up the Trek universe more.

    Dont like the ending, we've been down the bad crew member already with Discovery..no need to do it again.

    All Eyes On Rafah



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    #55
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,068 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    That villain Bejazzle looked so like Marina Sirtis, I genuinely wondered for a moment if it were her, de-ageing perhaps or what was going on. The spell never quite left either, she really was the spitting image IMO.


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    #56
    AllForIt
    Registered Users Posts: 8,336 ✭✭✭AllForIt


    pixelburp wrote: »
    That villain Bejazzle looked so like Marina Sirtis, I genuinely wondered for a moment if it were her, de-ageing perhaps or what was going on. The spell never quite left either, she really was the spitting image IMO.

    Absolutely. I thought there was going to be some twist that it turned out to be Deanna Troi but it soon became apparent it was just a remarkable lookalike. The eyes especially.


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    #57
    McDermotX
    Registered Users Posts: 14,894 ✭✭✭✭McDermotX


    Another awful outing.

    Some decent bits with Seven (don't have any issue with opening), but even that couldn't save another shambolic episode of forced exposition, clunky writing and some downright terrible acting.

    I've no idea why I'd stick this out TBH, only because it's 'Picard' or even, and I say this loosely given what being demonstrated, 'Star Trek'. Any other material and it wouldn't be getting the time of day if I'm honest.


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    #58
    btkm8unsl0w5r4
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,538 ✭✭✭btkm8unsl0w5r4


    I gave this show a shot but after 5 episodes I cannot watch anymore. The dark, gritty tone is not Star trek for me. I can get dystopian futures full of despair, done better elsewhere. I am off to re-watch the Orville, STP is a load of bollox and is just ruining all that was great about trek. Patrick Stewart has gone down in my estimations, and all I can do not is watch no more to preserve my nostalgia.


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    #59
    bilbot79
    Registered Users Posts: 1,989 ✭✭✭bilbot79


    IvySlayer wrote: »
    Never would I have imagined Picard with an eyepatch doing a french pirate accent

    Reminded me of the old days of TNG when an entire episode was devoted to a holodeck programme about 17th century England or something. It was clearly to give the actors something different to do.


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    #60
    Rawr
    Registered Users Posts: 3,815 ✭✭✭Rawr


    Alas this episode, although with some solid moments, did feel kind of weak.

    Seven developed a bit since Voyager and I liked that, but I feel that there were too many missed opportunities here and I can't help but feel cheated by this episode.

    Some stuff that stuck out.

    Icheb: I never really liked Icheb...and now I'm feeling guilty about that! Damn that was a harrowing end of a character.

    Quark's Bar: Good to know that Quark is still kicking and following the 45th Rule of Acquisition :) Could have really done with a Holo-ad of his place...

    Stuff I didn't really like:

    Picard & Seven: Why didn't they explore this more? I had always wondered what kind of interaction they would have between old Locutus and 7 of 9. They bare touched on that. Were ex-Borg *that* common in the Alpha Quadrant back then?

    Imperial Entanglements: So going to the Romulan Free State will "cost more". Can we please get an explination of how payment now works in the Federation? What kind of cash does the Federation have or does Picard have some Latinum earnings from his vinyard? We're in the same problem area as DS9 were the Starfleet crew appeared to have cash to spend at Quarks.

    Bizzare standoff and Seven's revenge: Seven getting revenge made perfect sense. Seven killing the evil Freecloud lady made sense. But setting herself up to die in the casino (off screen, so not for certain) didn't make sense. She had plenty of a chance to kill her before their escape. Also, I was never a fan of that shot where she brandishing two phaser rifles as if the were smaller hand weapons. They were going for bad-ass action hero moment, but it just looked silly. Could they at least pretend that those props had some weight to them?

    Le Picard Diabolique: No doubt Steward had loads of fun with this, but come on. One of the most famous faces in the Galaxy, he had just been on the news telling people that Starfleet suck, and his disguise was just an eye-patch and silly accent? It was fun, but come on. Were the evil Freecloud people really that thick?

    Next week look interesting. Are we getting a flashback of Locutus, or are they actually going to assimilate Picard again?


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    #61
    The Megaphone
    Registered Users Posts: 474 ✭✭The Megaphone


    So eye-patch Picard, a french man, goes undercover as a bad impersonation of a french man when so far all the show has shown us is that pretty much nobody knows who is he in the first place. Why?

    Also anyone remember in TNG when going undercover involved use of cosmetics? How about Picard the space Bajoran pirate or Picard the space Trill pirate?

    I liked space pimp Rios but Picard just reminded me of a cheap Halloween costume!

    Besides this - thought it was a good episode!


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