New Dail / New Taoiseach

WomanSkirtFan8 · 19-02-2020 05:44PM

realdanbreen wrote: »

All Pears has to do is propose Mary Lou for Taoiseach get a seconder and if she gets enough votes she's in so simple.

Except that it doesn't work like that. Have to have 80 seats or more to form a government. The election of Taoiseach is down to a Dail vote so she's in no way guaranteed to be taoiseach now or at any time in the immediate future.

jimmycrackcorm · 19-02-2020 05:47PM

Scoondal wrote: »

And Sinn Fein will try to convince a democratic and intelligent electorate that Sinn Fein won the General Election.

If they were brutally honest they'd stop whining that people voted for "change" and admit that people voted for them in protest.

If people voted for change then there would be enough numbers for SF to lead a government.

corkie · 19-02-2020 06:23PM

^^^ What? There is no one going to President till another 'Taoiseach' is elected or 'Leo Varadkar' needs to call another election?

Already a 'Leo Varadkar' lead caretaker goverment in place since 32 dail was dissolved.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Members_of_the_32nd_D%C3%A1il

The 32nd Dáil convened for the first time at 10.30 am on 10 March 2016.[1] Its first act was to elect a Ceann Comhairle. It was dissolved by President Michael D. Higgins on the request of Taoiseach Leo Varadkar on 14 January 2020.[2]

Scoondal · 19-02-2020 06:26PM

People voted for FG in 2011 "for change". Some people just vote for change ... it's not a considered vote. They say"ah I just want a change".
Now we will have a caretaker government. Nothing will be changed.

Scoondal · 19-02-2020 06:28PM

corkie wrote: »

^^^ What? There is no one going to President till another 'Taoiseach' is elected or 'Leo Varadkar' needs to call another election?

Already a 'Leo Varadkar' lead caretaker goverment in place since 32 dail was dissolved.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Members_of_the_32nd_D%C3%A1il

So will the caretaker government not have a Minister for Transport ?

corkie · 19-02-2020 06:33PM

https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/libraryResearch/2016/2016-06-28_caretaker-governments-and-caretaker-conventions_en.pdf

1.Caretaker governments in Ireland
In Ireland, under Article 28.11.1 of the Constitution, the incumbent Taoiseach and Ministers remain in office as a caretaker government until a successor is appointed.This is the case even where the Taoiseach or Ministers are not re-elected as members of the incoming Dáil. Ministers of State also remain in office, even if not re-elected.

James Brown · 19-02-2020 06:33PM

corkie wrote: »

^^^ What? There is no one going to President till another 'Taoiseach' is elected or 'Leo Varadkar' needs to call another election?

Already a 'Leo Varadkar' lead caretaker goverment in place since 32 dail was dissolved.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Members_of_the_32nd_D%C3%A1il

Since Enda 'good for a laugh' Kenny stepped down.

James Brown · 19-02-2020 06:36PM

Every election so far has been swayed by putting manners of FF or FG. Hopefully we are seeing signs of an end to that.
Any 'change' depends on the policies enacted.

Scoondal · 19-02-2020 06:36PM

corkie wrote: »

https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/libraryResearch/2016/2016-06-28_caretaker-governments-and-caretaker-conventions_en.pdf

Thanks, that is the information that I wanted.
Someone who is not even a T.D. remains as a minister in a caretaker government.

Riskymove · 19-02-2020 06:41PM

WomanSkirtFan8 wrote: »

Except that it doesn't work like that. .

yes it does

you get enough votes then you are Taoiseach as you set out yourself

HalloweenJack · 19-02-2020 07:02PM

Scoondal wrote: »

Thanks, that is the information that I wanted.
Someone who is not even a T.D. remains as a minister in a caretaker government.

If having an unelected minister is a problem for you, get on to your local TD's that represent the big three parties from this election and stress the importance of putting aside differences and forming a Government that consists of elected representatives for ministers.

If party politices cannot step aside for the national interest then this will be one of the consequences until they come to their senses or there's another election.

Scoondal · 19-02-2020 07:08PM

HalloweenJack wrote: »

If having an unelected minister is a problem for you, get on to your local TD's that represent the big three parties from this election and stress the importance of putting aside differences and forming a Government that consists of elected representatives for ministers.

If party politices cannot step aside for the national interest then this will be one of the consequences until they come to their senses or there's another election.

My T.D.s are Independant, FF and Social Democtat. How can they form a government ? SF won't put the "establishment" back into government.

FrancieBrady · 19-02-2020 07:08PM

Scoondal wrote: »

And Sinn Fein will try to convince a democratic and intelligent electorate that Sinn Fein won the General Election.

Somebody is trying to convince the same electorate that they were 'defeated'. If somebody is defeated does that not mean that somebody won?

Leo Varadkar wrote:

"It may have been a tight finish, but we were defeated so that means that people are saying to us that Fine Gael should go into opposition and we are absolutely willing to do that."

Nevin Parsnipp · 19-02-2020 07:14PM

Shinners deserve a chance to be in government....let's see what they can do.....some of their recently elected gorillas are fcucking up already.

Let's have them....

James Brown · 19-02-2020 07:15PM

Scoondal wrote: »

My T.D.s are Independant, FF and Social Democtat. How can they form a government ? SF won't put the "establishment" back into government.

Neither will the SD's. And FG are already resigned to opposition and FF won't work with SF. So looks like an election.

HalloweenJack · 19-02-2020 07:18PM

Scoondal wrote: »

My T.D.s are Independant, FF and Social Democtat. How can they form a government ? SF won't put the "establishment" back into government.

FF have the most seats and they love being in power. Get in touch with the FFer and let them know that FF should be doing all they can to form a coalition. Stress your preference for an "Anyone but SF" coalition while also pointing out your problem with having unelected representatives as ministers. The only reason FF can't/won't form a Government is their own egos (and that of other political parties).

Also contact the Indie and the SD member and stress that they should support any coalition to make sure that the Minister for Transport is actually an elected TD as soon as possible.

Or just accept that this is a consequence of an election with no clear winner and you will have to suck up a few months of an unelected minister.

hotmail.com · 19-02-2020 07:19PM

Scoondal wrote: »

On Thursday 20th February, will we have new ministers in a "care taker" government going to The President for their positions to get the Presidential approval ?

This happened 4 years ago.

The outgoing ministers who lost their seats stayed on as ministers but only received the equivalent of a TD salary.

The caretaker government has no mandate to introduce change. So I'm not really sure what they do in this period.

James Brown · 19-02-2020 07:19PM

Kelly is merely the loudest. They should pick someone who didn't back the IW quango. It should be someone who supported the public's right to protest. Y'know Labour stuff.

Scoondal · 19-02-2020 07:21PM

Bowie wrote: »

Neither will the SD's. And FG are already resigned to opposition and FF won't work with SF. So looks like an election.

The electorate have already voted. So, we voted wrong and they want us to vote the right way now ?
No way, I will start a campaign against another election this year.
We voted ... we did our job ... TDs, deal with it.

STB. · 19-02-2020 07:35PM

PatrickSmithUS wrote: »

Howlin not running for Ceann Comhairle is costing them an easy additional seat in the next election.

George Lawlor would romp home in Wexford without Howling in the race.

He is not held in as much high regard as he possibly holds himself.

Kelly for all his soundbites about going back to basics wouldn't be someone I would trust. He lost the run of himself when he was Minister for Environment. Yet a complete gem at the Oireachtas Committee meetings when in opposition.

And the basics that the labour party need to get back to is trust. Don't promise stuff you cannot deliver. Do not list them. Do not shaft your electorate. There was a time when they were the safe pair of hands when the other centre rights parties got out of line/people had enough of them. They will have to regain that trust and it will be tough. SF are now filling that void and they have no track record and have largely been voted in on the basis of one word.

Change.

hotmail.com · 19-02-2020 07:39PM

With the greatest respect to Aodhan who seems like a very nice man, he isn't really a man of the people full of charisma.

He probably wants to talk about Trump and other matters that don't interest or affect people in Ireland.

Riskymove · 19-02-2020 07:39PM

Sure we had a Taoiseach in 2011 who was no longer a TD

Poor_old_gill · 19-02-2020 07:45PM

It’s between Kelly & o Riordan.

The former seems to have copped on a bit and has the backing of big Willie penrose- which is a plus in my eyes.

O riordan is so used to flip flopping on his position that hes probably simultaneously running for the position and backing Kelly for the leadership

19-02-2020 07:49PM

Scoondal wrote: »

The electorate have already voted. So, we voted wrong and they want us to vote the right way now ?
No way, I will start a campaign against another election this year.
We voted ... we did our job ... TDs, deal with it.

What would you suggest?

Scoondal · 19-02-2020 08:13PM

hotmail.com wrote: »

This happened 4 years ago.

The outgoing ministers who lost their seats stayed on as ministers but only received the equivalent of a TD salary.

The caretaker government has no mandate to introduce change. So I'm not really sure what they do in this period.

Thanks. I should have just googled it.

Scoondal · 19-02-2020 08:15PM

bubblypop wrote: »

What would you suggest?

What I suggest is ... I did my duty and voted. T.D.s should do their duty and form a government.
I am a voter ... they run the country. I say to them ... "Go".
We can't keep voting until they get the result that they want, right ?

19-02-2020 08:24PM

Scoondal wrote: »

What I suggest is ... I did my duty and voted. T.D.s should do their duty and form a government.
I am a voter ... they run the country. I say to them ... "Go".
We can't keep voting until they get the result that they want, right ?

If they can't form a government, given the numbers available, what else to do

Scoondal · 19-02-2020 08:48PM

bubblypop wrote: »

If they can't form a government, given the numbers available, what else to do

If those T.D.s can't form a government they should not be allowed to go for re-election.

corkie · 19-02-2020 09:19PM

Scoondal wrote: »

....

We can't keep voting until they get the result that they want, right ?

It maybe not the case of getting a result they want. It has more to do with numbers of TD's elected to each Party and if they get along with other parties.

Not the case of a single issue vote, where we vote in the past for the same thing twice or more.
i.e.: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-eighth_Amendment_of_the_Constitution_of_Ireland

Scoondal wrote: »

If those T.D.s can't form a government they should not be allowed to go for re-election.

160 TD's: - Where are you going to get replacements to run and spend the money to do so. Also candidates that didn't get elected in #GE2020 can also run again in #GE20202 if they so wish. And can afford to do so.

Martin Lanigan · 19-02-2020 09:21PM

OP, can we take it you are not a SF voter or supporter?

New Dail / New Taoiseach

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