Vegan Death Cult

14-01-2020 11:57PM

gozunda wrote: »

his vegan cows

Grass eating pricks..

ILoveYourVibes · 14-01-2020 11:58PM

gozunda wrote: »

True. My neighbour is so enthusiastic - he gets up at 6 each morning to milk his vegan cows ...

Everyone gets up at 6 in the morning these days.

pheasant tail · 15-01-2020 12:59AM

Lyan wrote: »

I tend to agree that many vegans are idiotic whackjobs, but I cannot see a way around the ethicial arguments for veganism. I probably ought to become one myself, but for the life of me I could never stop eating meat.

I would have thanked this post if it wasn’t for your first line but yes you are right in relation to the ethics. There is a lot of debate and throwing around if facts and figures in relation to health and environment but ethics and animal rights are at the core and foundation of veganism and why most people are vegan today. Not people taking up a plant based diet, but actually vegan. Veganism is not a diet contrary to popular belief.

Im amazed how people get so outraged and offended with the choice someone makes to say no, I respect animals and I don’t want to cause unnecessary suffering just because I like the taste and it’s easy.

MMXX · 15-01-2020 01:23AM

Is the lion bad, for eating the antelope? Is he a bad lion, or just a lion? Should the spider be chastised, for spinning a web to catch a fly? Bad spider? Unnatural spider? Ignorant spider? Or just spider? Does the snake have second thoughts when eating the mouse? Is he a bad snake, or just a hungry snake? Does he not have a right to thrive, to be nourished? Is indeed that very mouse, God rest his little soul, a bad mouse - for eating the centipede? Was it unethical of him? Did he think of the centipede? Bad mouse? Unethical mouse? Or just mouse?

Is evolution not real? Did cooking the meat we once ate raw, for millions of years - not increase our brainpower, our strength, our ability to communicate, to build societies? Did we eat meat, because we were cruel - or because we wanted to sustain our bodies? To live? Is the desire to live wrong? If we didn't begin to cook the meat that we already ate for millions of years - would we even be able to ask these questions today? Would we even be here today?

Is life cruel? Or is life just life? Cruel - and kind, warm - and cold, happy - and sad, full of darkness - full of light. You can't have one of these - without the other, it's not possible.

Beeping Kitchen Appliances · 15-01-2020 02:21AM

MMXX wrote: »

Is the lion bad, for eating the antelope? Is he a bad lion, or just a lion? Should the spider be chastised, for spinning a web to catch a fly? Bad spider? Unnatural spider? Ignorant spider? Or just spider? Does the snake have second thoughts when eating the mouse? Is he a bad snake, or just a hungry snake? Does he not have a right to thrive, to be nourished? Is indeed that very mouse, God rest his little soul, a bad mouse - for eating the centipede? Was it unethical of him? Did he think of the centipede? Bad mouse? Unethical mouse? Or just mouse?

Is evolution not real? Did cooking the meat we once ate raw, for millions of years - not increase our brainpower, our strength, our ability to communicate, to build societies? Did we eat meat, because we were cruel - or because we wanted to sustain our bodies? To live? Is the desire to live wrong? If we didn't begin to cook the meat that we already ate for millions of years - would we even be able to ask these questions today? Would we even be here today?

Is life cruel? Or is life just life? Cruel - and kind, warm - and cold, happy - and sad, full of darkness - full of light. You can't have one of these - without the other, it's not possible.

Did you just ask twenty three questions?
Are you a bad poster for asking twenty three questions?

jaxxx · 15-01-2020 02:27AM

Want to become a vegan to help the environment but don't want to stop eating meat? HERE'S HOW!! !! !!

Don't eat cows, eat RATS!!

Disclaimer - the above statement is a suggestion only. No responsibility will be taken as a result of any health defects caused by eating rats.

Unearthly · 15-01-2020 05:21AM

RobertKK wrote: »

Veganism is not natural as vegans needs to get Vitamin B12 supplements to replace how most people get their B12 which is from animal products.

A lot of people (whether vegan or not) will end up malnourished on a diet if they don't understand what their body needs.
But it is easier to get malnourished when one chooses to avoid what is nutrient dense food like meat, eggs, fish and dairy.

Ah yes the famous b12 argument combined with the natural fallacy

B12 has now been discovered in plants as a source that's there 'naturally'

It's also now fortified in a lot of food. It's not natural to do a lot of things. Sv3rige who has inspired this topic and has a fanbase on boards.ie, also uses the natural argument that there should be no law, and rape and murder of humans should be ok. Do you support this ideology to?

And let's be honest here, the real reason you mention b12 is not because you care about vegan health, you just think it's a stick to beat them with to help justify your own position.

Unearthly · 15-01-2020 05:30AM

MMXX wrote: »

Is the lion bad, for eating the antelope? Is he a bad lion, or just a lion? Should the spider be chastised, for spinning a web to catch a fly? Bad spider? Unnatural spider? Ignorant spider? Or just spider? Does the snake have second thoughts when eating the mouse? Is he a bad snake, or just a hungry snake? Does he not have a right to thrive, to be nourished? Is indeed that very mouse, God rest his little soul, a bad mouse - for eating the centipede? Was it unethical of him? Did he think of the centipede? Bad mouse? Unethical mouse? Or just mouse?

Is evolution not real? Did cooking the meat we once ate raw, for millions of years - not increase our brainpower, our strength, our ability to communicate, to build societies? Did we eat meat, because we were cruel - or because we wanted to sustain our bodies? To live? Is the desire to live wrong? If we didn't begin to cook the meat that we already ate for millions of years - would we even be able to ask these questions today? Would we even be here today?

Is life cruel? Or is life just life? Cruel - and kind, warm - and cold, happy - and sad, full of darkness - full of light. You can't have one of these - without the other, it's not possible.

This is not a reply to you as it is After Hours, new account etc but there are some long term posters on here who actually use this argument to.

You can't use a comparison between different animals for our behaviour. We have moral agency

Animals sniff each others arses to greet each other. Will you now go down the street and sniff a random persons arse? Good luck with that.

Carnivore animals dont have the luxury of:

1. Have the bodies to live off plant food
2. The choice and luxury to shop for plant food
3. The ability of humans to know the difference between right or wrong

Gynoid · 15-01-2020 06:12AM

Haven't read the thread so I don't know where the inevitable argument has gone, but I watched the first few minutes of the video. Horrible stuff. That is anorexia, I think.
I know veganism has become an extreme ideology for some, and they eat very restricted diets which is terrible. Other vegans are quite healthy. This is from personal observation of both types. I can understand the urge not to eat meat as I have not done so in several decades, but there are people eating very silly whimsical diets.
But that video makes me think (again!) how bad for many humans has been the ubiquity of the camera's eye and the ease of access to publishing platforms. It is tragic to see these people amplify their suffering for an audience. Not that either tool should be restricted. But they can glorify very destructive impulses and should be known and taught for what they are, brilliant wonderful tools that can be very dangerous for some.

gozunda · 15-01-2020 07:59AM

pheasant tail wrote: »

I would have thanked this post if it wasn’t for your first line but yes you are right in relation to the ethics. There is a lot of debate and throwing around if facts and figures in relation to health and environment but ethics and animal rights are at the core and foundation of veganism and why most people are vegan today. Not people taking up a plant based diet, but actually vegan. Veganism is not a diet contrary to popular belief.

I'm amazed how people get so outraged and offended with the choice someone makes to say no, I respect animals and I don’t want to cause unnecessary suffering just because I like the taste and it’s easy.

Not regarding you but imo a lot of people are simply reacting to the aggression directed at anyone who is not vegan and something which is which is frequently very evident in these discussions.

I'm also amazed at this bizarre idea that others are outraged. The most vocal outrage I see on this thread seems to come from a few who keep going on about his dare anyone comment on anything. That and the rubbish about others being mean but the same are quite happy to engage in throwing ****e and worse.

As to ethics - it's nothing to do with agreeing with your or anyone else's personal 'ethics'. Not everyone will agree with yours and vice versa. People not believing in your personal ethics is not something to beat others up with.

I reckon a lot of people would have a lot more respect for such views and opinions where the high ground wasn't been automatically seized and occupied.

gozunda · 15-01-2020 08:13AM

Unearthly wrote: »

Ah yes the famous b12 argument combined with the natural fallacy B12 has now been discovered in plants as a source that's there 'naturally'
It's also now fortified in a lot of food. It's not natural to do a lot of things. Sv3rige who has inspired this topic and has a fanbase on boards.ie, also uses the natural argument that there should be no law, and rape and murder of humans should be ok. Do you support this ideology to?

And let's be honest here, the real reason you mention b12 is not because you care about vegan health, you just think it's a stick to beat them with to help justify your own position.

Ok there is a lot of rubbish claims being made in this thread. And I'm going to call that one out.

There are a total of 7 references to Sv3rige on boards which I can find. Four of them in the vegetarian forum, three where you mention the guy yourself and I think the rest mostly from this tread discussing the video.

So I would ask where is this 'fanbase'? Again it would seem that little better than using crazy claims to beat others with. And just because some eejit on YouTube does not believe in the law or makes lots of money doing so - it does not follow that anyone else supports his 'ideology' simply because they do not espose a particular set of opinions or views. That makes no sense whatsoever.

YFlyer · 15-01-2020 08:16AM

Assetbacked wrote: »

Look at the first page of this thread. It is full of comments complaining about vegans. The stereotype about meat eaters being more obsessed with vegans is far more likely to be accurate consequently.

The Bord Bia bint is obsessed with vegans.

Unearthly · 15-01-2020 08:17AM

gozunda wrote: »

Ok there is a lot of rubbish claims being made in this thread. And I'm going to call that one out.

There are a total of 7 references to Sv3rige on boards which I can find. Four of them in the vegetarian forum, three where you mention the guy yourself and I think the rest mostly from this tread discussing the video.

So I would ask where is this 'fanbase'? Again it would seem that little better than using crazy claims to beat others with. And just because some eejit on YouTube does not believe in the law or makes lots of money doing so - it does not follow that anyone else supports his 'ideology' simply because they do not espose a particular set of opinions or views. That makes no sense whatsoever.

He was posted about on the farmers forum when they supported him going to a vegan festival eating raw animals in front of everyone.

I felt boards.ie farmers let themselves down that day

gozunda · 15-01-2020 08:18AM

YFlyer wrote: »

The Bord Bia bint is obsessed with vegans.

Charming. Who is this person? And how is she 'obsessed?

gozunda · 15-01-2020 08:24AM

Unearthly wrote: »

He was posted about on the farmers forum when they supported him going to a vegan festival eating raw animals in front of everyone.I felt boards.ie farmers let themselves down that day

Nope. My own comment was in reply to yours that he was an eejit or wtte. I can see no evidence of any 'fan base' whatsoever or anyone commenting on this guy and 'supporting' him are not the same. If it was - you'd be one of his biggest fans here (joke).

Edit: You also seem to be lumping all farmers in that comment btw - there is plenty of content in the veg forum which in the same vein others could point out where veg*ns are certainly letting themselves down.

batman_oh · 15-01-2020 08:25AM

Unearthly wrote: »

This is not a reply to you as it is After Hours, new account etc but there are some long term posters on here who actually use this argument to.

You can't use a comparison between different animals for our behaviour. We have moral agency

Animals sniff each others arses to greet each other. Will you now go down the street and sniff a random persons arse? Good luck with that.

Carnivore animals dont have the luxury of:

1. Have the bodies to live off plant food
2. The choice and luxury to shop for plant food
3. The ability of humans to know the difference between right or wrong

If people hadn't decided to start farming cows etc we would never have reached the enlightened state we are supposedly at now that allows you to make these lifestyle choices. The alternative result would probably have been that we turned our attention to other animals and basically wiped out everything that wasn't us.

I've no problems with vegans at all. But I dislike the way many seem to think they are some form of superior human as a result.

Unearthly · 15-01-2020 08:40AM

gozunda wrote: »

My own comment was in reply to yours that he was an eejit or wtte. I can see no evidence of any 'fan base' whatsoever or anyone Commenting on this guy and 'supporting' him are not the same. If it was - you'd be one of his biggest fans here (joke)

I have my sv3rige t shirt coming in the post. I've been outed

Unearthly · 15-01-2020 08:43AM

batman_oh wrote: »

If people hadn't decided to start farming cows etc we would never have reached the enlightened state we are supposedly at now that allows you to make these lifestyle choices. The alternative result would probably have been that we turned our attention to other animals and basically wiped out everything that wasn't us.

I've no problems with vegans at all. But I dislike the way many seem to think they are some form of superior human as a result.

True and there was a necessity to eat meat or whatever people got their hands on back in the day.

Advances in technology, science and knowledge allows people to live a life without animal products these days. If you don't want to then fine by me but I don't like seeing weak criticism

sbsquarepants · 15-01-2020 08:52AM

jaxxx wrote: »

Want to become a vegan to help the environment but don't want to stop eating meat? HERE'S HOW!! !! !!

Don't eat cows, eat RATS!!

Disclaimer - the above statement is a suggestion only. No responsibility will be taken as a result of any health defects caused by eating rats.

I sometimes get mixed up with things like tomatoes and berries but i'm fairly sure rats are neither fruit nor vegetables;)

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Climate change is killing bees.

Bees are dying for other reason mostly climate change its nothing to do with almond milk. Climate change is killing bees. So are pesticides.

If almond crops use pesticides then they would pose a threat to bees ..BUT EVERY CROP USES PESTICIDES and they all pose a threat to bees.

Not all crops.

Listened to very interesting thing on the radio the other day about vertical farming. Absolutely pesticide free, the guy reckons that the same amount of crops that you can grow conventionally in a soccer pitch sized field, can actually be grown in an area the size of the goal vertically without the need for any pesticides whatsoever.

Environmentally crops aren't really the problem though, meat is. Although the bees might argue different!

gozunda · 15-01-2020 08:52AM

Unearthly wrote: »

I have my sv3rige t shirt coming in the post. I've been outed

Does that come with it's own bucket of paint? :pac:

sbsquarepants · 15-01-2020 08:56AM

Unearthly wrote: »

I have my sv3rige t shirt coming in the post. I've been outed

Slightly off topic, I've never heard of this guy, but his name is really bugging me - how the hell is it pronounced? Or is it one of those prince symbol bolloxology deals?

purplesnack · 15-01-2020 09:10AM

gozunda wrote: »

But more importantly that soy grown in the Amazon is directly the result of the demand for soy OIL.

What's your source for this?

gozunda · 15-01-2020 09:25AM

purplesnack wrote: »

What's your source for this?

Ok this has already been extensively gone over in this thread already. Please read it.

mathie · 15-01-2020 09:29AM

Soy cultivation is a major driver of deforestation in the Amazon basin. Seeds from the soybean plant provide high protein animal feed for livestock, and 80% of Amazon soy is destined for animal feed; smaller percentages are used for oil or eaten directly. Today Brazil has 24-25 million hectares devoted to the growth of this crop, and is currently the second largest producer of soybeans in the world.

https://globalforestatlas.yale.edu/amazon/land-use/soy

purplesnack · 15-01-2020 09:33AM

gozunda wrote: »

Ok this has already been extensively gone over in this thread already. Please read it.

I've gone through the entire thread and I have not seen any source indicating that the demand for soy oil is the driving factor for the growth of soy beans in the Amazon, so again, I'll ask what your source is. Thanks

mathie · 15-01-2020 09:34AM

purplesnack wrote: »

I've gone through the entire thread and I haven't not seen any source indicating that the demand for soy oil is the driving factor for the growth of soy beans in the Amazon, so again, I'll ask what your source is. Thanks

I would like to see that too.

Unearthly · 15-01-2020 09:38AM

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Slightly off topic, I've never heard of this guy, but his name is really bugging me - how the hell is it pronounced? Or is it one of those prince symbol bolloxology deals?

I think you pronounce the 3 as an E. Makes about as much sense as finding a dead rodent on the road and eating it raw

Deebles McBeebles · 15-01-2020 09:45AM

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Slightly off topic, I've never heard of this guy, but his name is really bugging me - how the hell is it pronounced? Or is it one of those prince symbol bolloxology deals?

Lets not compare the 2 please. Prince was a vegetarian and not a prick

mathie · 15-01-2020 09:48AM

Deleted User wrote: »

What are you citing there? What is one sausage???

I'd highlighted the "in pretty above average amounts"

World Health Organisation wrote:

The consumption of processed meat was associated with small increases in the risk of cancer in the studies reviewed. In those studies, the risk generally increased with the amount of meat consumed. An analysis of data from 10 studies estimated that every 50 gram portion of processed meat eaten daily increases the risk of colorectal cancer by about 18%.

50 grams = one sausage.

You said that 50 grams (one sausage) was "above average amounts".

gozunda · 15-01-2020 09:59AM

mathie wrote: »

Soy cultivation is a major driver of deforestation in the Amazon basin. Seeds from the soybean plant provide high protein animal feed for livestock, and 80% of Amazon soy is destined for animal feed; smaller percentages are used for oil or eaten directly. Today Brazil has 24-25 million hectares devoted to the growth of this crop, and is currently the second largest producer of soybeans in the world.
https://globalforestatlas.yale.edu/amazon/land-use/soy

That article that already been discussed - so is clear you didn read the discussion. Indeed soy cultivation is a major driver of deforestation as per above. However what that link fails to detail is that soy is grown primarily for its oil which is the most valuable part of the bean gram per gram. That oil gets extracted and what is left over (the soy meal) gets fed to animals.

So no "80%" of the whole soy bean crop is not fed to animals. That is the percentage of 'soy meal' left over after oil extraction. (The figures of extracted meal also vary depending on soy bean variety). In total 85% of all soybeans grown globally are crushed for their oil. For example this from the US.

https://mobile.twitter.com/donlayman/status/1188124117230333952?s=19

Industry figures
https://www.oilseedandgrain.com/soy-facts

This guy is Professor of Nutrition (emeritus) University of Illinois. That is the same process as for soy grown in SA and elsewhere

It's a subject which I have studied btw but no I do not support the growing of soy for oil or any other use in the Amazon.

Vegan Death Cult

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