Vauxhall Ampera

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »

Hi guys .I'm just about to purchase ampera .
You guys have had the ampera.
Any pros and cons to watch out for.
Cheers

all good, love the car, but getting parts is a nightmare so dont break anything lik i did

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »

Cheers
I heard that specially after end of October with Brexit will make parts more expensive .
It's real pity opel Ireland didnt support ampera. Ok it wasn't sold here but come on.its opel Vauxhall ampera.
Think its poor on opel Ireland part.

How would Brexit affect this? You'd be ordering parts from Opel for a car built in the US...

Pay someone a grand to collect for u,pay their flights n ferry,you will still save 2k

Oh, really? I was assuming you could at least order parts from a local Opel dealer. That totally puts me off buying an Ampera so!

A stark contrast from the Japanese dealers who'll get you parts for cars they never sold in Europe (though you may have to wait a while for them).

hi guys
i have an ampera issue im hoping ye may have experienced and can help with a quick fix.

on two occasions now i have returned to the AMP to find all my windows down and the car soaked, because of course it rained.
i know its because i squeezed the key fob within range of the car. why the hell would they put this feature in as i can only think it helps a car thief but i cant think of a use for it. can this stupid feature be disabled ???

We are well into our second year of ownership now, almost 13,000km tracked for just over €500 worth of petrol at an overall fuel economy of 2.6l/100km or over 100mpg in old money.

http://www.fuelly.com/car/vauxhall/ampera/2012/alkers/877577

Over 95% of fuel used has been on long-distance trips where it returns about 5.5l/100km on the motorway when the battery is empty. This is definitely worth it to us considering what BEV's we could have afforded on our budget at the time.

Best from one tank (which is small - circa €40 to fill) is over 2,000km.

Interestingly, we have never undertaken a journey which was long enough to require stopping for fuel more than once. Typical GOM range from a full fuel tank is 500km + whatever battery range at the time.

Never heard of the Ampera until yesterday when I saw one on Autotrader UK.

I wasn't looking for a hybrid car or anything, but, I stopped on the Ampera because it looked so good. Started reading some reviews and the reviews were mostly good. So then I found the thread here and, again, mostly positive feedback about the car.

In fact I am thinking about buying one. Most of the ones that are within my price range are high mileage though, 90K+ (Miles) The other thing I am wondering about is would it be worth it for my use case?

These are my current driving distances. (all round trips)

A. One trip most weeks of 210km (mostly motorway)
B. two trips of 84Km most weeks
C. two trips of 84Km every second week.
D. Most of the rest of my driving is less than 50km round trip.

I would be charging the car most nights at home. Also for trip C: above, I will be able to charge the car while I am at work for a few hours as there are charging stations close to both places. I was thinking that if I could get 50 km out of the electric motor per trip, I would get roughly half the B trips and all the C trips for just the electricity cost. The lack of power because the battery would be empty wouldn't be a problem because those are journeys on bad roads.

Trip A is mainly motorway and would be driving at speed. Does the car use the battery then switch over no matter what? or can you set it up so that it conserves the battery and you use the petrol engine mostly except for those times when you need the extra power?

Currently driving a 2011 BMW 120D with 95K miles that does 53 MPG.

Alkers wrote: »

Things to note - the car doesn't fast charge or even quick charge - I think 3.5kW is the most it can draw. This means that you get very little mileage for every hour of charging - not an issue for overnight charging or if there are plenty of chargers in work but if they're busy you will be be hogging a charger to save a few euro.

The car has a massive battery buffer which isn't used when driving on EV mode so you don't have to worry about the car being down on power at all unless you're really hammering it for an extended period of time. There is a 'mountain mode' which further increases the buffer but you won't need it in Ireland.

You can set the car to 'hold' mode where it will not deplete the battery but instead use the ice to power the elec motor, it's recommended to use this once above 50mph/80kmh if you know you'll be depleting the battery. Fine to do over 130kmh on battery but it depletes quickly at that speed.

53mpg is very good, I would say that for the long motorway spins your diesel may be more economical, especially with petrol more expensive than diesel. Otherwise the ampera should be more economical.

Aside from that it's a fantastic car - let me know any questions you have

Wow, thank you for the informative post.

I understand that it isn't fast charging, the places where I will be charging are empty all day. But, going by the rest of your post, it looks like I wouldn't really need to charge during the day because there is no real savings.

I am not a fast driver. I pretty much obey the speed limits. So I would rarely be driving at 130kph. Just a little confused about the buffer zone. For examples, let's say I am driving 100 miles and I have it in normal mode, does the car drive for 30 miles using electric power and the rest of the journey using petrol power, and the buffer makes sure that I have power when I need it?

Would you have any worries about buying an ampera with 95K miles on the clock? I understand that the batteries supply enough power for between 25 and 50 miles depending on various factors. But, those figures are from launch, will 8 year old batteries still have the same range? If I go to test drive one, how accurate is the range estimate on the dashboard?

Charging: Can I charge from home using an outdoor wall socket, if I get that socket checked by an electrician? Is there any real need to install a home charging point? It will be at home most nights for more than 8 hours, so the slower charging time from the granny plug is not an issue.

The car I am considering is the MY12, Electron model.

(I am sure I will have more questions)

reaper12 wrote: »

I understand that it isn't fast charging, the places where I will be charging are empty all day. But, going by the rest of your post, it looks like I wouldn't really need to charge during the day because there is no real savings.

You save ballpark €5 vs fuel costs each time you fully charge the battery. It's absolutely worth doing if it's convenient and you're not inconveniencing anyone else - e.g. your driveway! In your other post it sounded like you were planning on using public chargers. FYI the car doesn't come with a public charge cable so you might have to buy one if you planning on using a work charger - circa €200 so this needs 40 full charges to pay for itself.

reaper12 wrote: »

I am not a fast driver. I pretty much obey the speed limits. So I would rarely be driving at 130kph. Just a little confused about the buffer zone. For examples, let's say I am driving 100 miles and I have it in normal mode, does the car drive for 30 miles using electric power and the rest of the journey using petrol power, and the buffer makes sure that I have power when I need it?

Yeah, that's pretty much it. Basically the capacity of the battery is 16kWh but only about 10.5kWh is usable. Once this 10.5kWh is used the car will display 0% battery and 0km range remaining and the ICE will kick in to generate electricity as the car drives. The remaining 5.5kWh is the battery buffer. This is used any time the car needs more power than the ICE can generate so you don't experience any loss in power. Even when driving with the range showing 0km, the electric motor & battery are driving the car, with the engine at the same time recharging the battery. It's a little strange at first as the engine revs are not related to what you do with the accelerator. e.g. you could be cruising at 120km/hr and bury your foot, car will accelerate with no increase in engine revs for maybe 10 seconds. Then if you stop accelerating, the engine will still rev until the battery buffer is topped up to the normal amount. Using "mountain mode" further increases the size of the buffer, to I think around 10kWh. If you engage this mode when the battery shows less than 50% remaining, the engine will kick in to recharge the battery until it reaches 50%. This is not needed in Ireland unless you were on a track, it's basically for driving over mountain ranges as if you actually deplete the buffer, the car will display "reduced propulsion" and you can only use as much power as the ICE can provide - possibly resulting in some slow uphill speeds.

reaper12 wrote: »

Would you have any worries about buying an ampera with 95K miles on the clock? I understand that the batteries supply enough power for between 25 and 50 miles depending on various factors. But, those figures are from launch, will 8 year old batteries still have the same range? If I go to test drive one, how accurate is the range estimate on the dashboard?

Not at all, we bought ours with 100k miles, which is when the manufacture warranty expires. In order to keep the warranty valid, you need to get the car serviced by an authorised dealer, the only one of which is in Belfast. We didn't want this hassle anyway, so didn't mind buying out of warranty. There are a few niggles that can happen - stuck charge port, steering lock etc but they are all workable and I wouldn't want to have to get to Belfast to get them looked at in any case. Because of the large battery buffer and the slow charging speeds, the battery in the ampera has a very easy life compared to other EVs. I don't have a link right now but there was a study of all EVs done and the ampera came out tops for the lack of battery degradation. We have over 220,000km on ours and can still get 60km summer range. We don't try and drive economically at all, (defeats the purpose IMO) and will happily use heating, accelerate hard etc.
If you test-drive one, the range on the dashboard is not a representation of battery health at all - it's an estimate of the remaining range depending on recent driving conditions / habits / outside temperature etc. If you drive like Ms. Daisy, the display will increase, turn on the heating and go onto the motorway and it will drop quickly. The remaining milage on petrol will also change similarly.

reaper12 wrote: »

Charging: Can I charge from home using an outdoor wall socket, if I get that socket checked by an electrician? Is there any real need to install a home charging point? It will be at home most nights for more than 8 hours, so the slower charging time from the granny plug is not an issue.

This is what we do, the car was never sold in Ireland so does not qualify for the home charger grant. Even if you got a home charger installed, the car can only charge at 3.5kW on it vs about 2.4kW on the granny charger so you're talking about a 3-4 hour charge time instead of a 4-5 hour charge time - not worth paying for IMO. We had an electrician put in a new outdoor socket on it's own circuit with oversized wiring to accommodate a charger in the future. The car draws 10a continuous so is likely to overload an existing socket so definitely get this checked before doing it.

reaper12 wrote: »

The car I am considering is the MY12, Electron model.

That is what we have. There are some changes in the 2013 model including a slightly larger battery but it's still a great car. You are aware it's a strictly 4-seater, because of the location of the battery?

Alkers wrote: »

You save ballpark €5 vs fuel costs each time you fully charge the battery. It's absolutely worth doing if it's convenient and you're not inconveniencing anyone else - e.g. your driveway! In your other post it sounded like you were planning on using public chargers. FYI the car doesn't come with a public charge cable so you might have to buy one if you planning on using a work charger - circa €200 so this needs 40 full charges to pay for itself.

Yeah, sorry should have been clearer, I will be charging it at home every night. I just mentioned the public chargers as they are close to places that I work.

Alkers wrote: »

Yeah, that's pretty much it. Basically the capacity of the battery is 16kWh but only about 10.5kWh is usable. Once this 10.5kWh is used the car will display 0% battery and 0km range remaining and the ICE will kick in to generate electricity as the car drives. The remaining 5.5kWh is the battery buffer. This is used any time the car needs more power than the ICE can generate so you don't experience any loss in power. Even when driving with the range showing 0km, the electric motor & battery are driving the car, with the engine at the same time recharging the battery. It's a little strange at first as the engine revs are not related to what you do with the accelerator. e.g. you could be cruising at 120km/hr and bury your foot, car will accelerate with no increase in engine revs for maybe 10 seconds. Then if you stop accelerating, the engine will still rev until the battery buffer is topped up to the normal amount. Using "mountain mode" further increases the size of the buffer, to I think around 10kWh. If you engage this mode when the battery shows less than 50% remaining, the engine will kick in to recharge the battery until it reaches 50%. This is not needed in Ireland unless you were on a track, it's basically for driving over mountain ranges as if you actually deplete the buffer, the car will display "reduced propulsion" and you can only use as much power as the ICE can provide - possibly resulting in some slow uphill speeds.

That's a great explanation.

Alkers wrote: »

Not at all, we bought ours with 100k miles, which is when the manufacture warranty expires. In order to keep the warranty valid, you need to get the car serviced by an authorised dealer, the only one of which is in Belfast. We didn't want this hassle anyway, so didn't mind buying out of warranty. There are a few niggles that can happen - stuck charge port, steering lock etc but they are all workable and I wouldn't want to have to get to Belfast to get them looked at in any case. Because of the large battery buffer and the slow charging speeds, the battery in the ampera has a very easy life compared to other EVs. I don't have a link right now but there was a study of all EVs done and the ampera came out tops for the lack of battery degradation. We have over 220,000km on ours and can still get 60km summer range. We don't try and drive economically at all, (defeats the purpose IMO) and will happily use heating, accelerate hard etc.
If you test-drive one, the range on the dashboard is not a representation of battery health at all - it's an estimate of the remaining range depending on recent driving conditions / habits / outside temperature etc. If you drive like Ms. Daisy, the display will increase, turn on the heating and go onto the motorway and it will drop quickly. The remaining milage on petrol will also change similarly.

220 thousand km and still getting 60km range, that sounds brilliant. Certainly puts my mind at rest about the battery!! The thing is, I don't like a car that's too warm, and I will rarely, if ever, use the heated seats. So I imagine I should get pretty decent range.

Just a quick question on servicing. The 8 year warranty is out, I understand that. But, will a good local garage be able to service the car? Or is there anything with the electric side of things that will have to be handled by specialist?

Alkers wrote: »

This is what we do, the car was never sold in Ireland so does not qualify for the home charger grant. Even if you got a home charger installed, the car can only charge at 3.5kW on it vs about 2.4kW on the granny charger so you're talking about a 3-4 hour charge time instead of a 4-5 hour charge time - not worth paying for IMO. We had an electrician put in a new outdoor socket on it's own circuit with oversized wiring to accommodate a charger in the future. The car draws 10a continuous so is likely to overload an existing socket so definitely get this checked before doing it.


That is what we have. There are some changes in the 2013 model including a slightly larger battery but it's still a great car. You are aware it's a strictly 4-seater, because of the location of the battery?

Great, I can get a electrician to make sure it's safe. Not having to install a charger might just swing it for me

The MY13 is out of my price range at the moment so I don't have much of a choice MY12 or bust!! And I am aware it's a 4 seater. My current car is only a 4 seater coupe. But, I wouldn't put any adults in the back seats!!

How do you rate the car for comfort? And how is road noise and wind noise?

Just one more question. Been reading a little on that Speakev website you recommended. Lots of good info about the car.

My question is about the lights, are they as bad as that site suggests they are?

Alkers wrote: »

I haven't noticed them being poor at all but we do very little driving with full beams.

Thanks Alkers. Just been doing up some calculations, trying to figure out what my savings would be versus the car I have now.

Can I go ask about something you said earlier in the thread. You said with a full battery I would save €5 vs fuel costs. Did you mean that it's better to drive the car in petrol mode with a full battery than an empty one?

Like, when I am driving a journey that's out of range of the electric motor, I should drive using petrol mode for the start of the trip and switch to electric more when I am nearing end of my journey?

Also, is 45mpg an reasonable estimate for mpg when using Petrol only?

Alkers wrote: »

Hi, no I didn't mean that. I meant for every full charge of battery you use, the equivalent mileage would cost you around €5 in fuel. So every time you use a public charger, you could block it for 4+ hours to save 5e!

It doesn't make much difference whether you use much battery at the start or end of a trip, just it's easier to use it all if you use it at the start rather than having some left when you get home. Also, if you use the engine at a start of a trip, you get "free" heating from the engine without using the electric heaters (presuming you haven't pre-heated). You should use the engine when over 80km/hr when you're on longer trips.

45mpg would be a pessimistic estimate I think but would depend on how much motorway mileage you do.

Yeah, I took it that way, but just wanted to make sure

For working out my savings, I estimated the range of the electric motor as 30 miles on average and the petrol engine as 45mpg. With those estimates I save about €600 a year on fuel. Of course that doesn't include the cost of the electricity!!

Those estimates are probably on the low side based on what you told me, so I might be looking at savings of around €750+ when I include all the short trips.

Not too shabby I guess. I would need to keep the car for at least two years to make up for the cost of switching.

Alkers wrote: »

Have you factored in low tax and partial toll refunds?

Well, I am only paying €190 at the moment, so I am not going to be saving much on road tax and I rarely use toll roads. But, I will be saving a little on servicing as the BMW really needs to be serviced every 10,000km.

The way I worked out the cost savings is a little off though. The reason I am thinking of changing is because the BMW will need some extra bits and pieces done on the next service, new tyres etc. So was going to cost over €1000 to get it all done.

Been reading more of that site you linked to, it seems 50 miles range on the electric motor is the norm. It's only on really cold days where the temp is less than 3 or 4 degrees that the range drops down to 25/30 miles. IF that's the case than fuel savings for me would be pushing €1000!!!

It really does sound too good to be true.