Schadenfreude

Donnielighto · 19-10-2019 1:34pm #1

Why is there such enjoyment seeing Ireland lose amongst some parts of the public. The amount of people posting just to have a go is ridiculous. The soccer and GAA forum will argue with themselves, I post in both, but you have people coming in here having a crack. I genuinely don't see the motivation in it.

Tv, print media and companies will jump on any team seen to be doing well, you can see that with current Dublin team and the Irish soccer team when they are doing well, the rugby one isn't anything different. Boxing seems to be the only one we can do well in and not get full bandwagon. It just seems hypocritical that rugby gets dumped on regularly for that behaviour.

Salary Negotiator · 19-10-2019 1:35pm

Some people are pricks.

Dog Murphy · 19-10-2019 1:46pm

Because the coverage of the rugby team is incredibly nauseating both because of the ridiculous hype that is generated and the sycophantic nature of the coverage.

It doesn't just apply to the rugby team I think people in Ireland by and large find excessive hype of anything quite tedious, it's just most other sports stars in Ireland don't tend to get the fawning type of coverage that rugby has gotten.

I like seeing the team do well but I find the coverage of the sport in Ireland nauseating.

The Dubs is a bad example of what you are trying to prove, people absolutely hate them.

CatFromHue · 20-10-2019 2:41am

Dog Murphy wrote: »

it's just most other sports stars in Ireland don't tend to get the fawning type of coverage that rugby has gotten.

That's what all island success gets you.

Even the provinces represent far more than any county or football club does.

In 2005 it looked like no Irish team would ever win the HEC again but we've won 6 since then, Connacht even qualify by themselves for it now.

GAA players tend to just be popular in their own county and the Soccer players live and play in England or further afield.

I also don't think they're fawned over. The very top levels might be but POC, BOD, ROG, and Sexton are very much world class.

tuxy · 20-10-2019 2:56am

Dog Murphy wrote: »

Because the coverage

Yeah that's a part of it. If you have no interest in it and don't care who wins or loses it's all too easy to get some fun out of winding up the die hard fans. If they got no reaction from doing this they would stop.

Ardillaun · 20-10-2019 4:47am

Dog Murphy wrote: »

Because the coverage of the rugby team is incredibly nauseating both because of the ridiculous hype that is generated and the sycophantic nature of the coverage.

It doesn't just apply to the rugby team I think people in Ireland by and large find excessive hype of anything quite tedious, it's just most other sports stars in Ireland don't tend to get the fawning type of coverage that rugby has gotten.

I like seeing the team do well but I find the coverage of the sport in Ireland nauseating.

I don’t think that’s an issue confined to rugby. What about golf? I like the game but could do without Chairman Rory’s ’thoughts’ (many not golf-related) ad nauseam in the Indo.

Sam Quentin · 20-10-2019 4:58am

Because most Rugby fans call soccer fans scum-bags. So they deserve to be wund up to the hilt. And it's great craíc looking at them over compensating and hiding how annoyed and upset they are 'not'.

joeguevara · 20-10-2019 5:22am

Sam Quentin wrote: »

Because most Rugby fans call soccer fans scum-bags. So they deserve to be wund up to the hilt. And it's great craíc looking at them over compensating and hiding how annoyed and upset they are 'not'.

I'd say it is a small minority who think football fans are scum. I have never come across it and most people I know who play rugby support a football team. I reckon in the past it was probably true but rugby is way more inclusive

One thing I find is that some rugby supporters think football is boring because of low scores but that is not the same.

It is a bit of reverse snobbery that people think that rugby supporters are purely bandwagon and don't really support it but pretend because of the relative success.

For transparency I live and die football and like rugby. But football comes first.

Faugheen · 20-10-2019 8:38am

Donnielighto wrote: »

Why is there such enjoyment seeing Ireland lose amongst some parts of the public. The amount of people posting just to have a go is ridiculous. The soccer and GAA forum will argue with themselves, I post in both, but you have people coming in here having a crack. I genuinely don't see the motivation in it.

Tv, print media and companies will jump on any team seen to be doing well, you can see that with current Dublin team and the Irish soccer team when they are doing well, the rugby one isn't anything different. Boxing seems to be the only one we can do well in and not get full bandwagon. It just seems hypocritical that rugby gets dumped on regularly for that behaviour.

Because as Jerry Flannery put it, these people are losers themselves.

whiskeyman · 20-10-2019 8:56am

It's down to bandwagoners in my opinion.

These people love 'supporting' the team when they're doing well, and love the enjoying of slagging them off during a bad result / form.

I doubt real rugby fans take enjoyment of their team losing.. just like any sport.

FYI, I'm not a rugby fan but just enjoy watching Ireland's games. I'm not going to revel in their loss though because I know what it means because I'm a sports fan firstly.

Your Face · 20-10-2019 9:14am

They find any success confronting.

Dog Murphy · 20-10-2019 10:18am

Ardillaun wrote: »

I don’t think that’s an issue confined to rugby. What about golf? I like the game but could do without Chairman Rory’s ’thoughts’ (many not golf-related) ad nauseam in the Indo.

I turned off McIlroy seriously during his excellent period of a few years ago because of all the hype and talk about his personal life, I've found him much more bearable in recent years since the hype has died down a bit with him not winning as many majors.I expect the buildup to the Masters next year to be intolerable though.

completedit · 20-10-2019 12:14pm

It’s because we all know the private schools and the rugby mentality and the type of status rugby players have in Ireland(Dublin) That’s it for me, I know so many good looking girls that have been with some of the rugby lads(some of them are so far punching it’s insane) and that taps into the jealousy. Because they’re more local than football players for instance it just compounds it.

It’s stupid but I think you’ll get that type of person appearing on message boards.

Also how aligned it seems with corporate Ireland and the status quo doesn’t help it’s case. Think of ROC Kelly’s old man, that sort, seeing their status knocked back and having to eat humble pie as their beloved Ireland get beaten by a new rugby country such as Japan or absolutely tonked by a country where rugby is more rough and less elitist, feels good.

joseywhales · 20-10-2019 12:37pm

It's mad in this apparently enlightened time, with more information than ever at our finger tips, that people can allow themselves to indulge in shadenfreude, when they know it only really hurts themselves and feeds their own self loathing, the athletes most of the time couldn't give a toss, they are too busy trying to be successful.

Ironic that by taking pleasure in the failure of others they have doomed themselves to failure but they just can't delay gratification.

piplip87 · 20-10-2019 12:41pm

I think it's down to the traditional class of the average rugby fan compared to the rest.

Rugby has been seen as a sport for the upper class and membership fees for young lads who wanted to play rugby reflected this. Plenty of rugby fans out there like myself who would have loved to play as young fella but the membership fees at the time where designed to keep the game in the upper class.

So when Ireland don't do well some people see the opportunity to have a dig against the upper class.

joseywhales · 20-10-2019 12:50pm

Jesus there is barely such a class in Ireland , Dublin is a dinky parochial town at best relative to the world.luckily it retains a rare identity still and people are somewhat connected, unlike large international cities with actual division. This exclusivity and entitlement is just embarrassing, it's a tiny place with generally good people, the last thing they need are "notions" about their class. I went to a small country school and we started the first underage rugby teams t that was pretty successful, rugby is there for anyone, it is just a ball, post and a bunch of mates, no need to complicate it

PhlegmyMoses · 20-10-2019 12:52pm

I think that there is a weird chip on some people's shoulder about attention not given to "their" sport. Lucky for me, I enjoy most sports like a normal person so I never need to feel that way. :pac:

I saw some post on Twitter comparing media reaction to a rugby loss compared to soccer. Instead of asking for similar coverage of their own sport, they went on the attack calling the rugby reaction nauseating. Weird mentality.

Harry Palmr · 20-10-2019 12:52pm

I think what used to be called the DART accent types and Ross O'Carroll-Kelly's parody has stuck, it doesn't matter that say Kerry is a rugby county or that Limerick is a traditional hot bed the game is associated with South Dublin.

I haven't bought a newspaper in years but often the coverage would feature this sort of shot

Which is more or less designed to annoy the rest of the population!

PhlegmyMoses · 20-10-2019 12:54pm

Harry Palmr wrote: »

I think what used to be called the DART accent types and Ross O'Carroll-Kelly's parody has stuck, it doesn't matter that say Kerry is a rugby county or that Limerick is a traditional hot bed the game is associated with South Dublin.

I haven't bought a newspaper in years but often the coverage would feature this sort of shot

Which is more or less designed to annoy the rest of the population!

Why would this annoy anybody? I genuinely don't get it. "People enjoy themselves at sporting event" more news at 6

SJW Lover · 20-10-2019 12:56pm

Donnielighto wrote: »

Why is there such enjoyment seeing Ireland lose amongst some parts of the public. The amount of people posting just to have a go is ridiculous. The soccer and GAA forum will argue with themselves, I post in both, but you have people coming in here having a crack. I genuinely don't see the motivation in it.

Tv, print media and companies will jump on any team seen to be doing well, you can see that with current Dublin team and the Irish soccer team when they are doing well, the rugby one isn't anything different. Boxing seems to be the only one we can do well in and not get full bandwagon. It just seems hypocritical that rugby gets dumped on regularly for that behaviour.

Because its a minority sport in World terms but presented to us like its a world cup in soccer. There are 10 countries seriously competing (if that) and we have never go beyond the quarter finals. Yet it is presented like it is something profound. Documentaries made when we win friendly matches and then we get tonked when it matters.

Harry Palmr · 20-10-2019 12:56pm

re PhlegmyMoses

Basically it says they are better than you - it's the old media version of an instagram "story"! Perfect people being perfect.

joseywhales · 20-10-2019 12:58pm

Harry Palmr wrote: »

re PhlegmyMoses

Basically it says they are better than you - it's the old media version of an instagram "story"! Perfect people being perfect.

Yeah the vanity aspect is annoying but in fairness who cares really, you don't get pissed off when your toddler shows off, this is nondifferent

MadYaker · 20-10-2019 1:07pm

The soccer team literally can’t win a game against anyone and they don’t get half as much abuse, at least not on boards anyway

Hurrache · 20-10-2019 1:09pm

Harry Palmr wrote: »

re PhlegmyMoses

Basically it says they are better than you - it's the old media version of an instagram "story"! Perfect people being perfect.

How? It's 2 photos, how can anyone read an undercurrent to them?

completedit · 20-10-2019 1:11pm

SJW Lover wrote: »

Because its a minority sport in World terms but presented to us like its a world cup in soccer. There are 10 countries seriously competing (if that) and we have never go beyond the quarter finals. Yet it is presented like it is something profound. Documentaries made when we win friendly matches and then we get tonked when it matters.

This is pretty much it. I don’t know if the media should show more awareness about this, like it’s not rugbys fault that it’s not a popular sport and if the media brought this up might undermine the sport and take away the buzz.
People are too aware and too worldly these days to not realize that rugby is a minority sport. The best country is a country of 4 million people and is a nothing country in terms of history. Part of the thing about football is that powerhouses like Germany are the among the best countries. Brazil with a huge population is one of the best countries. USA, the global power aren’t that good but they have improved over the years and slowly producing better standard of players. In rugby, population means nothing, it’s just whether or not the sport happens to have a fringe following.,

BTW, I think even if other countries took rugby more seriously, New Zealand would still be one of the best countries, just because of how in their blood it is.

joseywhales · 20-10-2019 1:12pm

MadYaker wrote: »

The soccer team literally can’t win a game against anyone and they don’t get half as much abuse, at least not on boards anyway

The "soccer" fans are so abused that we don't even call their sport football here, I think due to the superiority of gaelic football.

Yer Da sells Avon · 20-10-2019 1:13pm

I don't think it helps when you get people on RTE referring to it as 'The People's Game'. I think that kind of unfounded, self-aggrandising rubbish can contribute towards resentment.

joseywhales · 20-10-2019 1:15pm

Yer Da sells Avon wrote: »

I don't think it helps when you get people on RTE referring to it as 'The People's Game'. I think that kind of unfounded, self-aggrandising rubbish can contribute towards resentment.

Gaa is the undisputed champion in this country and would be considered the people's game if there is such a thing, I don't think anyone denies that.

SJW Lover · 20-10-2019 1:16pm

MadYaker wrote: »

The soccer team literally can’t win a game against anyone and they don’t get half as much abuse, at least not on boards anyway

You need to check your understanding of "literally". It doesnt mean what you think it does, clearly. The soccer team play in a World Cup where circa 200 countries compete. They are probably abused less on this site because people realise that they are involved in a truly competitive arena rather than a sport most common to countries formerly or currently ruled by Britain.

RugbyLover123 · 20-10-2019 1:16pm

SJW Lover wrote: »

Because its a minority sport in World terms but presented to us like its a world cup in soccer. There are 10 countries seriously competing (if that) and we have never go beyond the quarter finals. Yet it is presented like it is something profound. Documentaries made when we win friendly matches and then we get tonked when it matters.

24 teams in Italia 90. We drew 3 games and beat Romania on penalties. We got to the 1/4 finals when there was so many poor teams yet we still celebrate it to this day like it was a huge achievement? It happens.

I understand there’s a slight overhype from the media about the rugby team. But people taking enjoyment out of their country losing because of the media and the stereotype that it’s associated with D4 and upper class is just embarrassing and they have a serious chip on their shoulders.

completedit · 20-10-2019 1:19pm

RugbyLover123 wrote: »

24 teams in Italia 90. We drew 3 games and beat Romania on penalties. We got to the 1/4 finals when there was so many poor teams yet we still celebrate it to this day like it was a huge achievement? It happens.

I understand there’s a slight overhype from the media about the rugby team. But people taking enjoyment out of their country losing because of the media and the stereotype that it’s associated with D4 and upper class is just embarrassing and they have a serious chip on their shoulders.

Not contradicting you, but I never really got the significance of Italia 90 until I realized that that Romania team was incredible.

But you’re right actually, it’s a stupid mentality. I think people who are really aware of class and status and see themselves not part of that class and would like to be are the most likely to be bitter. I like rugby too, i’m Just not that invested in Ireland’s fortunes.

PhlegmyMoses · 20-10-2019 1:33pm

Harry Palmr wrote: »

re PhlegmyMoses

Basically it says they are better than you - it's the old media version of an instagram "story"! Perfect people being perfect.

That is the problem of the person viewing it that way. It is a bizarrely sad outlook that I cannot even fathom.

The indo also do photos of Irish fans at soccer World Cups, people at music festivals, kids enjoying themselves at Young Scientist events. It's those Young Scientists that really piss me off. Nerds should not be allowed to have fun, they are supposed to be serious and wear glasses and look like weaklings in order for me to feel superior ffs.

RugbyLover123 · 20-10-2019 1:52pm

completedit wrote: »

Not contradicting you, but I never really got the significance of Italia 90 until I realized that that Romania team was incredible.

But you’re right actually, it’s a stupid mentality. I think people who are really aware of class and status and see themselves not part of that class and would like to be are the most likely to be bitter. I like rugby too, i’m Just not that invested in Ireland’s fortunes.

Incredible? Really? They finished 2nd in their group and then got knocked out by Ireland. If that’s the barometer then I guess we can call this Irish rugby team incredible? Good players but didn’t do much on the world stage?

I’ve never taken too much of an interest in the Irish soccer team. I don’t feel like I’ve an affiliation with any of them. Most of them get shipped off to England at 15/16 and live there. The only time they’d come back is when they’ve an Irish game. I don’t know any of them, where as I could run into one of the Irish rugby players in the street or there’s a good chance you know someone who knows them etc. They are much more accessible. Not the case with the Irish soccer team. Still doesn’t make me not want to see them do well, and win. They are representing me because I am irish. I want to see anyone representing Ireland do us proud. And as I said anyone that doesn’t because maybe they are from a different social class, well then, that’s just a sad way to live.

Downlinz · 20-10-2019 1:53pm

While there's always been an small element of resentment there from some quarters (usually regarding private schools) it's definitely been much more pronounced this RWC.

Personally I think Daire O'Brien calling rugby "the people's game", the Vodafone ad campaign #teamofus and other such comments or marketing attempts to convince the public of Rugby being our top priority, national game has really rubbed fans of other sport the wrong way as the main reason but there's plenty to choose from.

Some other factors:

The behaviour of the Belfast boys along with a couple of former Leinster players in a bar has sullied the previously held clean image of rugby players in Ireland.
Current prominent players like Sexton, POM, James Ryan etc are far less personable or interesting to a wider audience than BOD, ROG and POC.
Ireland's gameplan is overly structured and dull. Neutrals hate to watch us so I can only imagine how the casual rugby audience feels about it as a spectacle.
Soft ride by a rugby media filled with ex-players, especially considering Irish sports media are generally noted for being ruthlessly critical.

20-10-2019 2:16pm

Downlinz wrote: »

Some other factors:
The behaviour of the Belfast boys along with a couple of former Leinster players in a bar has sullied the previously held clean image of rugby players in Ireland.

critical.

This point is quite under rated.

20-10-2019 2:21pm

RugbyLover123 wrote: »

24 teams in Italia 90. We drew 3 games and beat Romania on penalties. We got to the 1/4 finals when there was so many poor teams yet we still celebrate it to this day like it was a huge achievement? It happens.

I understand there’s a slight overhype from the media about the rugby team. But people taking enjoyment out of their country losing because of the media and the stereotype that it’s associated with D4 and upper class is just embarrassing and they have a serious chip on their shoulders.

The whole country was behind the team in 1990 because a) it was a different time and b) it’s the game of the people and always will be. A team associated with the upper classes and ulster loyalism will never get the same almost blanket support and good will. Some people don’t even see this team as a representation of them or the country (fake anthems, flags, etc), that’s just how it is.

Kerry_2008 · 20-10-2019 2:21pm

I am by no means a dyed in the wool rugby fan, but like most I would follow the provinces and national team. I found the whole PR hype and spin around the national team for the past year to be somewhat off-putting. We were force fed all this 'team of us' and rugby country style stuff. Winning the grand slam, the tour to Australia along with a win against the All Blacks were great achievements. However, the coverage that went with it especially the All Blacks match went way over the top. We essentially beat a team at the end of their long season in a friendly, but you would think we won the world cup.

I think it was partly over hyped as our soccer team were so poor, that people latched on to any national success. The problem I have with the coverage was when things started to go wrong in the six nations things were glossed over. Journalists and sports writers effectively became cheer leaders and all manner of excuses were trotted out for our poor performance. Our shambles of a performance against Japan was put down to humidity. People still spoke of Joe having plays 'up his sleeve'. Our soccer team are rightly pillared week in week out for being poor but, rugby has seemed immune to that criticism. I think people are seeing the rugby team and media writers along with the marketing gurus as being representative of the 'posh boy', private school self entitled clique that and are happy to see them with egg on their face.

I have no problem with the rugby team wanting to be the best and believing they could win the world cup. There is no point playing unless you want to strife to be the best in your sport no matter what the level. My issue is with the spin around them. And lets not forget, the Irish people love to see someone succeed so they can also watch their fall. There is very few universally loved teams / sporting individuals across all of Ireland.

Hoboo · 20-10-2019 2:24pm

I can't take anyone who calls a test a friendly seriously.

El_Duderino 09 · 20-10-2019 2:29pm

Sam Quentin wrote: »

Because most Rugby fans call soccer fans scum-bags.So they deserve to be wund up to the hilt. And it's great craíc looking at them over compensating and hiding how annoyed and upset they are 'not'.

Now that’s almost compete and total boll1x. That’s much more indicative of an inferiority complex on your part than anything to do with rugby or what rugby fans think. Goes without saying that it’s untrue but I’ve seen loads of guff about the rugby clique. One poster said his north side friends couldn’t go to a Leinster or Ireland game because of the rugby clique. Nonsense

What do people want to happen when they go to a match? A parade and a marching band to welcome every newcomer to their first rugby match?

Anyone is welcome at the rugby and this inferiority complex is silly and unnecessary.

Benedict XVI · 20-10-2019 2:48pm

Kerry_2008 wrote: »

I am by no means a dyed in the wool rugby fan, but like most I would follow the provinces and national team. I found the whole PR hype and spin around the national team for the past year to be somewhat off-putting. We were force fed all this 'team of us' and rugby country style stuff. Winning the grand slam, the tour to Australia along with a win against the All Blacks were great achievements. However, the coverage that went with it especially the All Blacks match went way over the top. We essentially beat a team at the end of their long season in a friendly, but you would think we won the world cup.

I think it was partly over hyped as our soccer team were so poor, that people latched on to any national success. The problem I have with the coverage was when things started to go wrong in the six nations things were glossed over. Journalists and sports writers effectively became cheer leaders and all manner of excuses were trotted out for our poor performance. Our shambles of a performance against Japan was put down to humidity. People still spoke of Joe having plays 'up his sleeve'. Our soccer team are rightly pillared week in week out for being poor but, rugby has seemed immune to that criticism. I think people are seeing the rugby team and media writers along with the marketing gurus as being representative of the 'posh boy', private school self entitled clique that and are happy to see them with egg on their face.

I have no problem with the rugby team wanting to be the best and believing they could win the world cup. There is no point playing unless you want to strife to be the best in your sport no matter what the level. My issue is with the spin around them. And lets not forget, the Irish people love to see someone succeed so they can also watch their fall. There is very few universally loved teams / sporting individuals across all of Ireland.

This is totally it
It's the media hype, the lack of accountability for bad results etc that turn people away

Any time Irish athletics has a disastrous Olympics (i.e completely under performing ) they is usually some sort of structural review etc to see what went wrong

No so with rugby, it's all hard luck guys, beaten by a brilliant NZ team (lets not mention Japan), on to the next years Six Nations and it's more "Team of US", "This is rugby country etc"
Smart people see through it and get tired of it

RugbyLover123 · 20-10-2019 2:55pm

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

The whole country was behind the team in 1990 because a) it was a different time and b) it’s the game of the people and always will be. A team associated with the upper classes and ulster loyalism will never get the same almost blanket support and good will. Some people don’t even see this team as a representation of them or the country (fake anthems, flags, etc), that’s just how it is.

I apologise for getting behind the Irish women’s hockey team there 2 summers ago because it wasn’t the game of the people.

washman3 · 20-10-2019 2:55pm

Hoboo wrote: »

I can't take anyone who calls a test a friendly seriously.

The game yesterday was a Test Match, ie a do or die contest that both teams wanted to win. Unfortunately one team were literally streets ahead of the other and won comfortably.
The game last November had little or nothing at stake but a game that the home team took seriousley while their opponents were on a virtual holiday at the end of a tough championship. It's also their fundraising ploy and appeases their sponsors. That is what we call a Friendly.
Do you get it now..??

washman3 · 20-10-2019 2:58pm

RugbyLover123 wrote: »

I apologise for getting behind the Irish women’s hockey team there 2 summers ago because it wasn’t the game of the people.

Who said that it was.? i did'nt see any billboards proclaiming this.
FYI i was fully behind them too as the represented Ireland.

washman3 · 20-10-2019 2:59pm

Faugheen wrote: »

Because as Jerry Flannery put it, these people are losers themselves.

Could have picked a better role model than the 'bould Jerry' there bud..;);)

20-10-2019 3:09pm

RugbyLover123 wrote: »

I apologise for getting behind the Irish women’s hockey team there 2 summers ago because it wasn’t the game of the people.

Hockey is another game that could have the exact same things said about it as could be said for rugby.

El_Duderino 09 · 20-10-2019 3:14pm

Benedict XVI wrote: »

This is totally it
It's the media hype, the lack of accountability for bad results etc that turn people away

Any time Irish athletics has a disastrous Olympics (i.e completely under performing ) they is usually some sort of structural review etc to see what went wrong

No so with rugby, it's all hard luck guys, beaten by a brilliant NZ team (lets not mention Japan), on to the next years Six Nations and it's more "Team of US", "This is rugby country etc"
Smart people see through it and get tired of it

Of course there will be a review of the systems and administration. What on earth makes you think there wouldn't be?

One reason here isn't a desire to go for the team's jugular is because of the honesty of effort by everyone involved. I believe they all did their utmost for the last few years and they came up short in the end. That doesn't mean they made the best decisions in every case but it does mean they gave it their best and it just didn't work out.

I trust that they did their best and nobody is more disappointed than the lads themselves.

smurgen · 20-10-2019 3:15pm

Probably cause some of the rugby players in Ireland are seen as upper class dickheadsby the layman.We know their types in college who in general come from well to do families but carry themselves like utter dickheads after a few pints yet have a thin veneer of respectability simply because of their social standing. Then the sanitisation of them in the likes of the Indo and their wags also rammed down our throats is nauseating also. The Churchill quote of rugby being a hooligans sport played by gentlemen certainly doesn’t apply is Ireland. Delighted they were trounced to be honest. Have visited NZ in February it seemed a much more salt of the earth sport where people from all background played it. Hopefully this will catch on in Ireland and the team will truely become a team of us.

Mysterypunter · 20-10-2019 3:24pm

Its possibly because rugby is shoved down our throats, endlessly hyped, and people can see that they are a middle of the road team, but the media think they are gods. The Guinness ad, not men but giants, what a pile of rubbish.

Kerry_2008 · 20-10-2019 3:32pm

Hoboo wrote: »

I can't take anyone who calls a test a friendly seriously.

But is that not what it is in reality? There is nothing at stake. They take on more importance as there are so few top teams in rugby and its one of the few times the southern hemisphere teams take on those from the northern hemisphere. As the rugby world cup only happens every four years and there is no qualification for the big teams it takes on an added significance. I think Ireland place more emphasis on them than the other 6 nation countries as until recently it was so rare for us to beat the top teams from south of the equator.

I'm not degenerating the achievement for Ireland, but, it needs to be put into perspective. We won a game with nothing at stake. When it came to it yesterday with our place in the world cup at stake we flopped completely. We did similar in 2015 but, we had the mitigating factor of injuries. In 2011 we flopped to Wales; in 2007 we were a shambles as well when we had notions of winning the world cup.

Obviously the media have a job to do to sell papers and market products etc. However, the fawning of the team became unbearable. We were being force fed a narrative of ruby being the peoples game etc. In reality rugby still is based around the private school system.

riddles · 20-10-2019 3:33pm

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Of course there will be a review of the systems and administration. What on earth makes you think there wouldn't be?

One reason here isn't a desire to go for the team's jugular is because of the honesty of effort by everyone involved. I believe they all did their utmost for the last few years and they came up short in the end. That doesn't mean they made the best decisions in every case but it does mean they gave it their best and it just didn't work out.

I trust that they did their best and nobody is more disappointed than the lads themselves.

My granny was a hard worker but I wouldn’t have picked her for Ireland. I would question the existence of leadership in the group as a whole. The dogs in the street knew the game plan was unpicked to a large extent. Millions spent prepping a team and it arrives at a tournament more in hope that things will be alright on the night.

Needs to be squad assembled who are fit and team selection based on form.

joeysoap · 20-10-2019 3:37pm

I think ‘. Number 1’ in the world might have something to do with it.

I don’t know anybody who is glad Ireland lost. Just not sorry we didn’t win.

Schadenfreude

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