Andy farrell - overseas players

leinster blue boys · 29-09-2019 7:43am #1

Did I read sonewhere in the press Farrell is going to allow players , who play in uk or elsewhere to be available for selection ? It may be a good idea with so many of our current squad looking for a big pay day for there last few years, an possibly moving to uk, just as sean O'Brien has ??

thomond2006 · 29-09-2019 7:45am

I highly doubt it.

Shefwedfan · 29-09-2019 7:47am

leinster blue boys wrote: »

Did I read sonewhere in the press Farrell is going to allow players , who play in uk or elsewhere to be available for selection ? It may be a good idea with so many of our current squad looking for a big pay day for there last few years, an possibly moving to uk, just as sean O'Brien has ??

I would doubt you did

It’s not Farrell decision either....Nucifora etc made the decision....plus all the provinces wouldn’t be happy if it happened

SOB is still on Dublin....he is still contracted to irfu....he could play if IRFU wanted but he is recovering from injury.....

leinster blue boys · 29-09-2019 7:52am

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I would doubt you did

It’s not Farrell decision either....Nucifora etc made the decision....plus all the provinces wouldn’t be happy if it happened

SOB is still on Dublin....he is still contracted to irfu....he could play if IRFU wanted but he is recovering from injury.....

So'b has signed for Lon Irish

Shefwedfan · 29-09-2019 7:53am

Berties_Horse wrote: »

If that's the case then it's a constructive move. The versatile likes of Zebo can enter the fray as Kearney and other aging backs wind down their careers.

Zebo is out of condition and would be a disaster in that heat

Also he isn’t that good.....all the provinces have better young winger available and waiting to get a chance

Burkie1203 · 29-09-2019 7:54am

leinster blue boys wrote: »

So'b has signed for Lon Irish

He was contracted to IRFU until after RWC

irishbucsfan · 29-09-2019 7:55am

This isn't happening and it'd be a woeful decision

29-09-2019 10:15am

The success of the provinces and the control the irfu have over the players is too important to allow this

sydthebeat · 29-09-2019 10:23am

Berties_Horse wrote: »

If that's the case then it's a constructive move. The versatile likes of Zebo can enter the fray as Kearney and other aging backs wind down their careers.

If you think it would be constructive for Irish players to be allowed to play international rugby while earning bigger wedges abroad, then you don't understand Irish rugby.

Shefwedfan · 29-09-2019 10:36am

leinster blue boys wrote: »

So'b has signed for Lon Irish

He signed but is not free till after WC...

Dravokivich · 29-09-2019 10:39am

S.O'B is broken. Zebo isnt really in good condition reportedly. So who else, is there a position we are lacking in right now, that can be met by an expat?

Clegg · 29-09-2019 10:58am

Zebo might be a good idea.

We're in desperate need of some extra bulk in the backrow.

DGRulz · 29-09-2019 11:00am

Clegg wrote: »

Zebo might be a good idea.

We're in.desperate need of some extra bulk in the backrow.

Last I saw of him he was on his way to looking more like a prop.

un5byh7sqpd2x0 · 29-09-2019 11:48am

DGRulz wrote: »

Last I saw of him he was on his way to looking more like a prop.

There's something wrong with your eyes so.

bilston · 29-09-2019 1:08pm

leinster blue boys wrote: »

Did I read sonewhere in the press Farrell is going to allow players , who play in uk or elsewhere to be available for selection ? It may be a good idea with so many of our current squad looking for a big pay day for there last few years, an possibly moving to uk, just as sean O'Brien has ??

Not Farrell's call to make.

It works anyway. Who has left that we desperately miss? Zebo and Madigan may well have been in the WC squad, but neither are indispensable from the squad and neither would start. Although Zebo would be a nice option at 15.

If players like Ryan, Furlong, Stockdale and Ringrose start to leave in the next couple of years then maybe a conversation would be needed, but not at the moment.

LuckyLloyd · 29-09-2019 1:13pm

It will ultimately be the players themselves that break the IRFU on this policy. If more key players leave after the World Cup for superior money then the policy will be abandoned. It’s just a numbers game. It is definitely in the player interest for this policy to be abandoned over the coming word Cup cycle, for obvious reasons.

thomond2006 · 29-09-2019 1:22pm

I get the impression the money abroad without playing test rugby isn't significantly better tbh. The An Béal Bocht image of the IRFU is long since dispelled.

Faugheen · 29-09-2019 1:23pm

This thread was started with a thinly-veiled attempt to get the Zebo talk going again. The ‘oh I read Andy Farrell is thinking of doing this’ is complete and utter nonsense, because it’s not Farrell’s call.

He’s bang average and he’s always been bang average for Ireland. He’s had multiple chances and he took the opportunity to move abroad for more money (and all power to him).

People really need to get over it. You bring in average player like Zebo and you can say goodbye to all the good players in the provinces.

Some people here are so short-sighted it’s actually baffling.

beggars_bush · 29-09-2019 1:26pm

We should be letting more players aged 22/23 go abroad for a few years to develop and then if they are good enough bring them home.

Too many good players in Ireland not able to get a contract and they are lost to the top level game

And many of them could have a very good career abroad

leinster blue boys · 29-09-2019 1:27pm

Faugheen wrote: »

This thread was started with a thinly-veiled attempt to get the Zebo talk going again. The ‘oh I read Andy Farrell is thinking of doing this’ is complete and utter nonsense, because it’s not Farrell’s call.

He’s bang average and he’s always been bang average for Ireland. He’s had multiple chances and he took the opportunity to move abroad for more money (and all power to him).

People really need to get over it. You bring in average player like Zebo and you can say goodbye to all the good players in the provinces.

Some people here are so short-sighted it’s actually baffling.

The thread wasnt started at all bout getting people talking bout Zebo, hes now past his sell by date, I was thinking of other Irish qualified players plsying abroad

Squidgy Black · 29-09-2019 1:28pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

I get the impression the money abroad without playing test rugby is significantly better tbh. The An Béal Bocht image of the IRFU is long since dispelled.

I think the IRFU are competitive with players who get central contracts, but I'd say for players on provincial ones or on the cusp of a central one but losing out due to limited spots would be making a hell of a lot more abroad.

When you take the Zebo argument out of it, I don't think there's been a single player who's left Ireland worth changing the policy for other than Sexton who was under different circumstances.

If anything, changing policy could make it more favourable for players to leave Ireland.

Buer · 29-09-2019 1:30pm

leinster blue boys wrote: »

The thread wasnt started at all bout getting people talking bout Zebo, hes now past his sell by date, I was thinking of other Irish qualified players plsying abroad

Who is there playing abroad that is going to be realistically in an Irish 23? Not Zebo (hasn't been playing well since start of year) , Ryan (too old) , SOB (old/past his best) or Madigan (well past his best).

I'm not sure there's anyone else abroad that was ever going to be in consideration.

leinster blue boys · 29-09-2019 1:32pm

Buer wrote: »

Who is there playing abroad that is going to be realistically in an Irish 23? Not Zebo (hasn't been playing well since start of year) , Ryan (too old) , SOB (old/past his best) or Madigan (well past his best).

I'm not sure there's anyone else abroad that was ever going to be in consideration.

Just a thought ??

Former Former · 29-09-2019 1:33pm

Noel Reid was MOTM on his Leicester debut this week.

Just saying.

Faugheen · 29-09-2019 1:35pm

leinster blue boys wrote: »

Faugheen wrote: »

This thread was started with a thinly-veiled attempt to get the Zebo talk going again. The ‘oh I read Andy Farrell is thinking of doing this’ is complete and utter nonsense, because it’s not Farrell’s call.

He’s bang average and he’s always been bang average for Ireland. He’s had multiple chances and he took the opportunity to move abroad for more money (and all power to him).

People really need to get over it. You bring in average player like Zebo and you can say goodbye to all the good players in the provinces.

Some people here are so short-sighted it’s actually baffling.

The thread wasnt started at all bout getting people talking bout Zebo, hes now past his sell by date, I was thinking of other Irish qualified players plsying abroad

Sure Jan.

Squidgy Black · 29-09-2019 1:49pm

Former Former wrote: »

Noel Reid was MOTM on his Leicester debut this week.

Just saying.

Brett Herron also started and slotted the match winning penalty for Quins this week.

AbusesToilets · 29-09-2019 4:09pm

I think any selection of overseas players would be predicated on them being available for training camps, which is something that English and French clubs are unlikely to acquiesce to. Sexton had to specifically negotiate that in his contract with Racing iirc.

At a certain point, I think it's inevitable that more players are going to look abroad for opportunities, and more power to them imo.

JJJackal · 29-09-2019 8:12pm

Buer wrote: »

Who is there playing abroad that is going to be realistically in an Irish 23? Not Zebo (hasn't been playing well since start of year) , Ryan (too old) , SOB (old/past his best) or Madigan (well past his best).

I'm not sure there's anyone else abroad that was ever going to be in consideration.

SOB would have been picked for World Cup squad if not injured.

SOB most likely would not be in contention come next 6N and certainly not come the next WC cycle

Dev Toner is left at home. There are other locks such as Dillane who are still available too. Not sure Ryan would definitely have made it

Is Madigan better than Sexton, Carberry, Carty or Ross Byrne?

Zebo is the only player who could have made the 23. Schmidt always preferred Kearney.

Shefwedfan · 29-09-2019 10:52pm

In regards to overseas, it was mentioned a number of times on podcast that Irish player will get offered more wages overseas because they will not play for ireland ....so Zebo is getting extra because Racing know he won’t be missing during 6 nations/WC etc....

So even if Ireland did turn around and ask Zebo to come would he? It would mean a huge hit in his wages....the money was the reason he left.....

arsebiscuits1 · 30-09-2019 12:00pm

beggars_bush wrote: »

We should be letting more players aged 22/23 go abroad for a few years to develop and then if they are good enough bring them home.

Too many good players in Ireland not able to get a contract and they are lost to the top level game

And many of them could have a very good career abroad

If they're good enough they get a provincial contract.

If they're slightly less good than that they may get signed by a high standard foreign club.

If they're not that good then they won't...

The IRFU/ provinces don't hold them against their will like

razorblunt · 30-09-2019 12:04pm

If Zebo is brought in, was shown to be miles off the pace, would people shut up about it then?

Kilcoyne is in better condition than him.

thomond2006 · 30-09-2019 12:15pm

beggars_bush wrote: »

We should be letting more players aged 22/23 go abroad for a few years to develop and then if they are good enough bring them home.

Too many good players in Ireland not able to get a contract and they are lost to the top level game

And many of them could have a very good career abroad

If they are good enough then they'll have a good career abroad if they want to. It's not a case of letting players go, nobody is forcing them to sign contracts with a province! For the players at academy level it would difficult to loan them out for a year as most are engaged in academic studies at the same time.

The Tadhg Beirnes and Chris Farrells of the Irish rugby world are very rare and in those cases their lack of opportunities in Ireland were mostly due to injury.

thomond2006 · 30-09-2019 12:19pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

In regards to overseas, it was mentioned a number of times on podcast that Irish player will get offered more wages overseas because they will not play for ireland ....so Zebo is getting extra because Racing know he won’t be missing during 6 nations/WC etc....

So even if Ireland did turn around and ask Zebo to come would he? It would mean a huge hit in his wages....the money was the reason he left.....

I don't think we can discount the marketing opportunities here for the top players.

Jonny Sexton is a household name in Ireland. While at Paris he's virtually a nobody. The same applies to Zebo.

Squidgy Black · 30-09-2019 12:48pm

razorblunt wrote: »

If Zebo is brought in, was shown to be miles off the pace, would people shut up about it then?

Kilcoyne is in better condition than him.

Not a chance, the argument would shift to it being Joe's game plan not suiting him or something.

Former Former · 30-09-2019 12:56pm

Zebo had another horror show in defence at the weekend. I don't know if it's his conditioning, if he's unhappy in Paris, or what, but he's become an absolute liability.

Shefwedfan · 30-09-2019 1:05pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

I don't think we can discount the marketing opportunities here for the top players.

Jonny Sexton is a household name in Ireland. While at Paris he's virtually a nobody. The same applies to Zebo.

You not see the Paddy Power video?

diusmr8a504cvk · 04-10-2019 2:14pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

SOB is still on Dublin....he is still contracted to irfu....he could play if IRFU wanted but he is recovering from injury.....

Can't think of any other reason why SOB mightn't be involved with the Irish team.
Nope, nothing at all, nope.

04-10-2019 3:55pm

Coraline Ancient U-turn wrote: »

Can't think of any other reason why SOB mightn't be involved with the Irish team.
Nope, nothing at all, nope.

It's because of injury.

diusmr8a504cvk · 04-10-2019 4:50pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It's because of injury.

And if he wasn't injured he'd be on the plane because he hasn't done anything absolutely inexcusable that would've seen him be the subject of a witch-hunt in any other sport.

sydthebeat · 04-10-2019 5:00pm

Coraline Ancient U-turn wrote: »

And if he wasn't injured he'd be on the plane because he hasn't done anything absolutely inexcusable that would've seen him be the subject of a witch-hunt in any other sport.

but he IS injured.... so ...... everything else is hypothetical

JJJackal · 04-10-2019 5:05pm

SOB would 100% be in Japan if not injured

Shefwedfan · 04-10-2019 6:07pm

JJJackal wrote: »

SOB would 100% be in Japan if not injured

Of course he would......

JJJackal · 05-10-2019 10:52am

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Of course he would......

You think if SOB was injury free he wouldnt be playing for Ireland at this WC?

If he wasnt so injury prone he would still be at Leinster

Shefwedfan · 05-10-2019 12:05pm

JJJackal wrote: »

You think if SOB was injury free he wouldnt be playing for Ireland at this WC?

If he wasnt so injury prone he would still be at Leinster

I knw he would be and one of the first names on the plane.....

And yes he would still be at Leinster but unfortunealty for him and rugby he has had a bad run

joseywhales · 05-10-2019 1:10pm

He would have certainly solved the backrow conundrum we now have and provided some extra leadership in high pressure situations but sure injuries are cruel like that

Snickers Man · 06-10-2019 6:21pm

joseywhales wrote: »

He would have certainly solved the backrow conundrum we now have and provided some extra leadership in high pressure situations but sure injuries are cruel like that

Back row is certainly our biggest problem in this world cup. No specialist No 8. Only five flankers in the squad and one of them (Murphy) is crocked at the time of writing. So we only have Van der Flier, O'Mahony, CJ and Ruddock as our real back row options with Beirne and Henderson on standby to fill in.

So yeah, even a fit if still "shadow of his former self" Sean O/Brien would be in the squad but he's crocked. As is Leavey, which is by far the bigger loss at this stage.

Who's next for call up if Murphy is out? Tommy O'Donnell? Max Deegan?

connachta · 09-10-2019 2:42pm

In Premiership

For the Bristol/L.Irish game we had this week

1) Sheedy on the bench
2) Macken starting
3) Piers O'conor starting
4) Gilsenan starting
5) Joyce starting

In the 5 other games I've spotted

1) Charlie Mulchrone on the bench for Quins
2) Michael Heaney starting for Worcester
3) Jordan Coghlan starting for Leicester (plays 7 or 8)

(I didn't forget Whitten/Steenson/Muldowney, but they are too old to come now)

Niallof9 · 09-10-2019 2:46pm

Former Former wrote: »

Zebo had another horror show in defence at the weekend. I don't know if it's his conditioning, if he's unhappy in Paris, or what, but he's become an absolute liability.

he scored 16 tries last season. How many horror shows has Kearney had at this stage in his career? Quite a few despite his tactical nous.

People just have it in for Zebo for no reason

we're crying out for that back 3 type player who could give us something different.

Joe superfans are just refusing to see it at this stage they are that blinkered.

Larmour badly in need of a coach that backs his talent. I think its being slowly coached out of him.

Can only hope Farrell ditches the gameplan.

DelBoy Trotter · 09-10-2019 4:24pm

Niallof9 wrote: »

People just have it in for Zebo for no reason

People have it in for Zebo as he's sh!t! He's had some great moments over the last few years, but his defense is very poor, and he's not reliable. I haven't seen him play yet this season, but last season he had also gained a good few pounds and looked unfit

Niallof9 · 09-10-2019 5:56pm

DelBoy Trotter wrote: »

People have it in for Zebo as he's sh!t! He's had some great moments over the last few years, but his defense is very poor, and he's not reliable. I haven't seen him play yet this season, but last season he had also gained a good few pounds and looked unfit

Joe doesn't like him and vice versa. he's gone. And yeah his body shape isn't great. But people applying standards to certain players and not others is a bloody joke at this stage. Kearney, POM springs to mind.

09-10-2019 6:35pm

Niallof9 wrote: »

People just have it in for Zebo for no reason

I don’t like Zebo because he clearly has a planet sized ego and very much over rates himself. Not to mention his constant whingeing in the media about not getting picked when he knew well what the rules were upon his departure - obviously can’t stand not being the centre of attention and he just comes off bitter.

Finally I really didn’t like seeing him going on about how he felt shackled by Schmidt and the he couldn’t play freely, when Schmidt is literally the only coach he’s ever won anything under. The cheek of him, average player.

Andy farrell - overseas players

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