DCM 2019 - Mentored Novices Thread

akenno · 10-09-2019 10:43AM

Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
Yeah only had 2 runs last week. 12km on Thursday and 31km on Saturday

Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
12km was a bit faster than I had hoped but I had a course in work so couldn't dilly dally too much.
I didn't have ideal prep for LSR, had to drop my sister to the airport at 2am on Friday night. Then just as I was heading out for the run I got a call from work so that delayed my 2 hours. I didn't know whether to eat and delay my run further or just head out, so I did the latter. I got tired towards the end, stopped once to take on a gel and water then got going again.

Are you happy with your progress to this point?
Yes I am. the thoughts of the LSR aren't as daunting as I had expected them to be.

TurboTerror · 10-09-2019 10:56AM

passinginterest wrote: »

Anyone use the gel belt that was part of the goody bag for South Dublin 10k? I tried to use it for long run on Saturday but the High5 Aqua gels just started falling out within half a mile. Is there some trick to securing the gels? The elastic doesn’t seem tight enough.

Another vote for the flip belt. Worth the money, but all the better if you can get it cheaper as mentioned above. I triedmy friends before buying my own and it held 4 SIS gels easily.

Mr. Guappa · 10-09-2019 11:51AM

Clareview wrote: »

Just getting around to post up after the weeks training.. 3 good running days plus 2 cross training (1 was weights) sessions this week.

LSR went really well yesterday which was a tad surprising considering I found the last 2K or so fairly tough/slightly sore on the previous weekend. So got 29km (18miles) in at 6m31s avg pace with a very welcome dip in the sea after to aid recovery! the run has given me a welcome boost into believing I will get the DCM completed! Next weekends LSR on the plan I'm following is the 20miler so will see if I still have the confidence after that!

Like a few other posts recently Im still wondering how the hell will I be able to pick up the pace come race day though!!

You would be better served at this stage by dropping one of the cross-training sessions and adding an easy run. I'd slow down the LSR and easy pace to 6:45-7:00/km too.

Mr. Guappa · 10-09-2019 12:00PM

akenno wrote: »

Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
Yeah only had 2 runs last week. 12km on Thursday and 31km on Saturday

Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
12km was a bit faster than I had hoped but I had a course in work so couldn't dilly dally too much.
I didn't have ideal prep for LSR, had to drop my sister to the airport at 2am on Friday night. Then just as I was heading out for the run I got a call from work so that delayed my 2 hours. I didn't know whether to eat and delay my run further or just head out, so I did the latter. I got tired towards the end, stopped once to take on a gel and water then got going again.

Are you happy with your progress to this point?
Yes I am. the thoughts of the LSR aren't as daunting as I had expected them to be.

I'm not sure why a marathon plan would only require two runs at this stage - seems completely wrong! Looking back I see you have generally been running 4 times a week, which would be more in line with what I'd expect. If your stuck for time you would be better served cutting back the distance rather than speeding up.

akenno · 10-09-2019 12:21PM

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

I'm not sure why a marathon plan would only require two runs at this stage - seems completely wrong! Looking back I see you have generally been running 4 times a week, which would be more in line with what I'd expect. If your stuck for time you would be better served cutting back the distance rather than speeding up.

The reason the plan reduced was because of the Tullamore HM.

I was in the gym Monday and Tuesday. It is back up to 4 runs a week from here on out.

Treviso · 10-09-2019 12:34PM

akenno wrote: »

The reason the plan reduced was because of the Tullamore HM.

I was in the gym Monday and Tuesday. It is back up to 4 runs a week from here on out.

It's a good idea to do a recovery run a day or 2 after a race. Once run at a really really easy pace, your legs actually feel better after the run than before.

Mr. Guappa · 10-09-2019 12:41PM

akenno wrote: »

The reason the plan reduced was because of the Tullamore HM.

I was in the gym Monday and Tuesday. It is back up to 4 runs a week from here on out.

I'm confused, you didn't run Tullamore? Either way, good to know that the plan is for 4 days a week going forward! Just keep those paces nice and easy.

Clareview · 10-09-2019 12:59PM

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

You would be better served at this stage by dropping one of the cross-training sessions and adding an easy run. I'd slow down the LSR and easy pace to 6:45-7:00/km too.

Cool.. will look to add another easy run in!
Will try get that LSR pace down slower at weekend too.. Thanks

Wombled · 10-09-2019 01:02PM

Wombled wrote: »

All runs completed,
4 miles 12/mile
7.82 miles 11.55/ mile( had to cut the run short as fell trying to make up the last bit. A few cuts, nothing Major, thankfully.
4 miles 11.28/ mile
16 miles 12.01/ mile

Happy enough with how the plan is going, will continue with the stretching and foam rolling daily. Back to normal after Saturday run.

This week I have to bring runs forward. Working nights at the weekend so I have to do my LSR on Thursday.

Can't believe how real its all becoming

Be careful with how you structure the rest of your week - if you must move the LSR then push the 8 mile midweek run to the Sunday. I'd still like to see those paces a touch slower too.

I will do that so Mr Guapa, I am not sure I will be able to squeeze 8 miles in on Sunday, but I will try to do as much as I can. This work thing plays havoc with my training, it's a bloody nuisance really. ðŸ˜‰

Naked Lepper · 10-09-2019 01:43PM

Huzzah! wrote: »

What had you been doing before you got injured? I don't think DCM is out of the question but perhaps a time goal might be.

yeah, I might just start training again and just take it handy on the day and enjoy it!

I had been doing around 30-40km a week, but have been quite active throughout the year playing football a few times a week and cycling to work every day. also did DCM last year so have the experience.
hard to know if I have enough time to get back into it now though, would love to ramp up training quickly and go for it

will run the HM in two weeks and see how it goes I guess?

ReeReeG · 10-09-2019 02:46PM

Naked Lepper wrote: »

yeah, I might just start training again and just take it handy on the day and enjoy it!

I had been doing around 30-40km a week, but have been quite active throughout the year playing football a few times a week and cycling to work every day. also did DCM last year so have the experience.
hard to know if I have enough time to get back into it now though, would love to ramp up training quickly and go for it

will run the HM in two weeks and see how it goes I guess?

I think this approach could lead to more injuries though so be careful. Where was your long run at before the injury?

Huzzah! · 10-09-2019 03:35PM

Folks, there's a few on the injured bench and few coming back from injury and I'd just like to note that it's important to manage your comeback well. I have a saying/belief that you can't force fitness - it is what it is, so if you've missed a few weeks, it's probably not a great idea to jump straight back on plan or try and "catch-up" on what you've missed.

If you would like our assistance in modifying the plan you're on to where you're at post-injury, just ask. We're here to help.

Fraggle07 · 10-09-2019 04:08PM

Huzzah! wrote: »

Folks, there's a few on the injured bench and few coming back from injury and I'd just like to note that it's important to manage your comeback well. I have a saying/belief that you can't force fitness - it is what it is, so if you've missed a few weeks, it's probably not a great idea to jump straight back on plan or try and "catch-up" on what you've missed.

If you would like our assistance in modifying the plan you're on to where you're at post-injury, just ask. We're here to help.

I'm planning on following for this week:
Mon 6m - Tue 7.5m - Wed 3m - Thu Rest - Fri 10m - Sat 3m - Sun Rest (All at easy pace).
And then jumping back on Boards plan next week. I'll see how I am, but I suspect I'll probably do HM at easier pace and not race it.

I'm also thinking of swapping LSR for week 14 and 15. So doing 18m on week 14 and 20m week 15 as my longest run to date was 16mile pre injury. I'm afraid jumping to 20m might be too much.

Any feedback appreciated...

Mr. Guappa · 10-09-2019 07:05PM

Fraggle07 wrote: »

I'm planning on following for this week:
Mon 6m - Tue 7.5m - Wed 3m - Thu Rest - Fri 10m - Sat 3m - Sun Rest (All at easy pace).
And then jumping back on Boards plan next week. I'll see how I am, but I suspect I'll probably do HM at easier pace and not race it.

I'm also thinking of swapping LSR for week 14 and 15. So doing 18m on week 14 and 20m week 15 as my longest run to date was 16mile pre injury. I'm afraid jumping to 20m might be too much.

Any feedback appreciated...

I'd advise being a touch more circumspect than what you propose there. For the rest of this week I'd go Rest - 3mi - Rest - 9mi - Rest. Then next week I'd do easy runs of 3, 5 and 3 miles, with the half marathon as an LSR - don't even consider racing it! From there I'd follow the HHN1 plan through to DCM.

You've missed the bulk of 4 weeks training, so jumping back into the boards plan at it's peak wouldn't be a wise move. As Huzzah! put it, you can't force fitness. It might not be what you want to hear, but building back up too quickly would be asking for trouble - the priority now is to get you to the start line in one piece.

Naked Lepper · 10-09-2019 07:17PM

ReeReeG wrote: »

I think this approach could lead to more injuries though so be careful. Where was your long run at before the injury?

long runs were only 20k or so

Mr. Guappa · 10-09-2019 07:23PM

DeepBlue wrote: »

- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
Yes, all done.

- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
Yes. If anything some were run slower than normal. Tried running the LSR keeping an eye on HR rather than pace. Ran the last recovery run keeping the HR in the 110s or 120s leading to slower average pace. Will come back to looking at running to HR properly after DCM.

- Are you happy with your progress to this point?
I think so. Still have some things to finalise prior to DCM including planned pace and strategy.

Having car trouble at the moment so the Charleville Half is in doubt next weekend.

I did wonder what inspired the easier paces alright

Fingers crossed you make it to Charleville! DCM plans will come into focus more after Charleville, but don't worry if you can't make it - you've enough times posted to guide us towards a DCM target.

passinginterest wrote: »

Did you complete all the runs on your plan?
Yes. Another steady week. Only disappointment was falling a shade short of 40 miles for the week, because I didn’t fancy playing tummy roulette for an extra ¼ mile on the recovery run!
Did you complete all the runs an appropriate pace?
Yes, slightly quicker with the long mid week run because there was no PMP session this week. Overall happy with the pacing. For the 20 mile ran the second half about 5 minutes quicker than the first half and finished with my fastest mile again, which is really helping the confidence (even if it’s a bit of an unnecessary indulgence).
Are you happy with your progress to this point?
Yes. Earlier in the plan I was getting a bit worried about losing pace and not hitting target times over shorter distances, but the way the 19 and 20 mile runs have gone has really helped with confidence and belief in the system. Would love to nail the half marathon target, just to solidify the marathon pace goals, but I won’t be overly worried if I don’t, and I’ll adjust the marathon target if it’s sensible to do so. Weight finally going in the right direction too, down about 5 pounds over the last two weeks, now if I could stop gorging myself over the weekends that could be improved a bit too.

Fear not - there will be another chance to cross that 40 mile mark in a couple of weeks! Sounds like you've a very sensible outlook toward DCM goals - I'll be reminding you of this when taper madness kicks in :pac:

Soulsun · 10-09-2019 07:48PM

Huzzah! wrote: »

Folks, there's a few on the injured bench and few coming back from injury and I'd just like to note that it's important to manage your comeback well. I have a saying/belief that you can't force fitness - it is what it is, so if you've missed a few weeks, it's probably not a great idea to jump straight back on plan or try and "catch-up" on what you've missed.

If you would like our assistance in modifying the plan you're on to where you're at post-injury, just ask. We're here to help.

Much appreciated!

3boyz · 10-09-2019 07:56PM

Hi, I wonder would it be ok to join in at this late stage?

Huzzah! · 10-09-2019 07:59PM

3boyz wrote: »

Hi, I wonder would it be ok to join in at this late stage?

Of course - answer the questions in the OP to give us an idea where you're at.

3boyz · 10-09-2019 08:13PM

Thanks a mill,

I took up running 4 years ago, never progressed much past 10k, last year a friend talked me into doing the ratoath half, which I really enjoyed. However busy family, work and college kept me off the roads pretty much until May, went on holidays in June and ran every second day, managed to get one of the covetted extra numbers that were released and have been training ever since. Have been enjoying the running so far, but am finding as am sure many are, tiredness and the longer runs particular midweek, with the darker evenings are becoming more difficult .

Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!)
I have a couple of 10k’s, 1 half marathon, Ratoath, 2018, pb: 2.07,
Kilcock 10mile, 2019, pb: 1.29:30

Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training? (No problem if you do)
No

How much training do you currently do ? Distances, how many days a week, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level.

I have been following the HHN1 plan since the middle of July, longest run was last Saturday, 16 miles. Planning to run Ratoath half marathon this Saturday.

What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?
I would love to finish around 4.45, but realistically sub 5 hours would be fantastic

What is your biggest worry/fear/doubt (if you have any!) in signing up?
Biggest fear is injury, calves and lower legs really hampered my 16 mile run last Saturday and have me worried that I will end up injured and unable to complete the marathon.

Why are you running this marathon?
Hubbie and my best friend have run it twice and are doing it again this year, the atmosphere in town on race day is electric and have always envied those running, hoping this year I’ll be on the other side of the spectators fence!

ReeReeG · 10-09-2019 08:23PM

Naked Lepper wrote:

long runs were only 20k or so

Yeah dunno if you've much to gain from racing the HM and maybe just focus on building distance?

Unknownability · 10-09-2019 08:26PM

Really noticed the short evenings tonight, had a bit of scare out on an unlit country road so turned on my heels and got back to street lights as quickly as possible.

Going to have to make a better plan for midweek runs going forward.

No chance, I'd be able to do a run at PMP in those light conditions tomorrow. So think I'll take a half day and do the PMP on the Phoenix Park tomorrow afternoon, my first time running there &#55357;&#56876;.

Think I'll just run the length of chesterfield Avenue so I'm familiar with it the day of the marathon.

Huzzah! · 10-09-2019 08:31PM

3boyz wrote: »

Thanks a mill,

I took up running 4 years ago, never progressed much past 10k, last year a friend talked me into doing the ratoath half, which I really enjoyed. However busy family, work and college kept me off the roads pretty much until May, went on holidays in June and ran every second day, managed to get one of the covetted extra numbers that were released and have been training ever since. Have been enjoying the running so far, but am finding as am sure many are, tiredness and the longer runs particular midweek, with the darker evenings are becoming more difficult .

Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!)
I have a couple of 10k’s, 1 half marathon, Ratoath, 2018, pb: 2.07,
Kilcock 10mile, 2019, pb: 1.29:30

Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training? (No problem if you do)
No

How much training do you currently do ? Distances, how many days a week, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level.

I have been following the HHN1 plan since the middle of July, longest run was last Saturday, 16 miles. Planning to run Ratoath half marathon this Saturday.

What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?
I would love to finish around 4.45, but realistically sub 5 hours would be fantastic

What is your biggest worry/fear/doubt (if you have any!) in signing up?
Biggest fear is injury, calves and lower legs really hampered my 16 mile run last Saturday and have me worried that I will end up injured and unable to complete the marathon.

Why are you running this marathon?
Hubbie and my best friend have run it twice and are doing it again this year, the atmosphere in town on race day is electric and have always envied those running, hoping this year I’ll be on the other side of the spectators fence!

If you're following Hal Higdon, you'll fit in well here

Can you give us an idea of the paces your run your training runs at?

If you're on Strava, join us in the Strava group: https://www.strava.com/clubs/523351 PM me your name and I can approve you.

Huzzah! · 10-09-2019 08:32PM

Unknownability wrote: »

Really noticed the short evenings tonight, had a bit of scare out on an unlit country road so turned on my heels and got back to street lights as quickly as possible.

Going to have to make a better plan for midweek runs going forward.

No chance, I'd be able to do a run at PMP in those light conditions tomorrow. So think I'll take a half day and do the PMP on the Phoenix Park tomorrow afternoon, my first time running there ��.

Think I'll just run the length of chesterfield Avenue so I'm familiar with it the day of the marathon.

Things are getting serious! Enjoy the Park; it's a pleasure to run in, despite what Doc says

3boyz · 10-09-2019 08:45PM

Huzzah! wrote: »

If you're following Hal Higdon, you'll fit in well here Can you give us an idea of the paces your run your training runs at?

If you're on Strava, join us in the Strava group: PM me your name and I can approve you.

my last few runs have been as follows:
16.26 miles - avg pace 10.23
7.24 miles - avg pace 9.23
4 miles - avg pace 9.19

I'm not on strava, but I'll look at joining it.

Mr. Guappa · 10-09-2019 09:04PM

3boyz wrote: »

my last few runs have been as follows:
16.26 miles - avg pace 10.23
7.24 miles - avg pace 9.23
4 miles - avg pace 9.19

I'm not on strava, but I'll look at joining it.

It will be interesting to see how Ratoath goes for you, but that 10 mile time indicates that you are being a touch pessimistic with that 4:45 target. However, those training paces are far too fast - something like 11-11:30/mile would be far more beneficial. All those runs above are at your marathon pace, or much faster - if you flog yourself in training you'll have emptied the tank before the marathon. You'll read plenty here about the benefits of easy running - the main takeaway should be that lots and lots of easy miles will build the aerobic endurance you need to complete the marathon.

3boyz · 10-09-2019 09:14PM

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

It will be interesting to see how Ratoath goes for you, but that 10 mile time indicates that you are being a touch pessimistic with that 4:45 target. However, those training paces are far too fast - something like 11-11:30/mile would be far more beneficial. All those runs above are at your marathon pace, or much faster - if you flog yourself in training you'll have emptied the tank before the marathon. You'll read plenty here about the benefits of easy running - the main takeaway should be that lots and lots of easy miles will build the aerobic endurance you need to complete the marathon.

Thanks, yes I agree my pace is too fast, will concentrate on slowing down from here on in. I think the 10 mile was just a good day. I'm not sure I can repeat that form on Saturday, my legs were really sore from mile 9 on my last long run and am very nervous now of injury.

I did 4 miles this evening, what other distance would you recommend this week ahead of the half on saturday? This will be my only half marathon race in advance of dcm.

Many thanks for the advice,

Mr. Guappa · 10-09-2019 09:35PM

3boyz wrote: »

Thanks, yes I agree my pace is too fast, will concentrate on slowing down from here on in. I think the 10 mile was just a good day. I'm not sure I can repeat that form on Saturday, my legs were really sore from mile 9 on my last long run and am very nervous now of injury.

I did 4 miles this evening, what other distance would you recommend this week ahead of the half on saturday? This will be my only half marathon race in advance of dcm.

Many thanks for the advice,

Keeping the paces slower has the added benefit of reducing the injury risk. The easy paces may take some getting used to, but stick with it. I'd go with 6 miles on Wednesday, then rest Thursday and rest Friday. You might surprise yourself on Saturday

Mr. Guappa · 11-09-2019 06:49AM

Karlos80 wrote: »

Week 11
- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
Yes, all done, in what was a modified week for me.

- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
Was happy with paces.
Mon - 4 miles 10:15/m
Tues - 5 miles 10:20/m
Thurs - 4 miles 10:10/m
Sat - 15 miles 10:40/m (couple of them at PMP near the end)
Sun - 3 miles 11:00/m

- Are you happy with your progress to this point?
Yes and no. Feel I missed out on 10mile race, 19 & 20mile LSR's, even though I know I'm really not far off where I would have been. Heel is holding up so that's good. My last marathon I struggled badly in last 7 miles, and got home in 4h20m. I would like to beat that, without the struggle this time. I think I'm on track for that, even taking into account the injury. Looking forward to this week. (Pushed my Sub4 aim out to DCM2020, *winking emoji here*)

As we touched on yesterday, there is nothing to be gained by chasing lost miles, so don't overdo it these next few weeks. Definitely a wise move to adjust goals given the missed time - there will be plenty more marathons :eek:

Ais_Byrne7 wrote: »

- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
No, I missed a 4 mile on Thursday.....eeeek sorry sorry sorry! I wasn't feeling the best during the week and felt more beneficial to skip, sleep and prepare for the weekend's LSR.

- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
Think i'm finally slowing down to the pace I should be at (I hope)...but this week I must say has been the toughest one for me yet. I think it was just one of "those".

4m @ 10.43
8m @11.20
16m @ 11.41

- Are you happy with your progress to this point
I'm extremely proud of the distances I'm now overcoming - I never would have thought this was within my grasp, but turns out with hard work and dedication it sure is!!

Wishing everyone a good one

That was a good decision to skip the 4 miler - sometimes no run is the best run if it prevents a niggle or cold from developing into something more. You're getting better on the pacing - still a bit of room for improvement though

DolG · 11-09-2019 04:28PM

Thank you.
Started running 2012, no sporting history at all. Not a natural athlete. Worked very hard.
Best 10K 2013: 49.50.
2014, first 10 mile Ballycotton : 1:23. Best 5K : 23.03, 3K : 13.16.
Had slipped disc L3/4. Got back gently.
2015 one year later bad fall swollen knees x 1-2 years.
Trying to get back since.
Putting down a base since Nov 2018. Not able to push for times. Best 10mikes 97mins
Run mostly 4 times /week. Mid week very haphazard. Yoga class x1. Salsa dancing x1.
Have done 16 miles x 2. General stiffness afterwards. Can’t imagine doing 10.2 more. Biggest problem is tummy......
Marathon is a bucket list thing. Not aiming for a time, aiming to get to the starting line uninjured and then on finishing.

DCM 2019 - Mentored Novices Thread

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