Waterford GAA thread - mod warning post #1 and #51

DiscoStew · 05-09-2019 07:51PM

celt262 wrote: »

It's not up to a referee to decide on the eligibility of a player anyway, it's up to the clubs to know the ruling. The secretary of the club should be getting suspension here also.

Correct. If a player is suspended for having a red card in a previous game, for example, it’s not up to the referee to identify this player and remove him from the pitch if he is togged out while suspended. The onus is on the club to know the rule and not put themselves at risk of further action.
I fully accept this is a slightly different situation but the club officials not knowing or ignoring the rules is as much an issue as the referees lack of knowledge and poor advice from board members.

thesaturdayman · 05-09-2019 08:05PM

DiscoStew wrote: »

Correct. If a player is suspended for having a red card in a previous game, for example, it’s not up to the referee to identify this player and remove him from the pitch if he is togged out while suspended. The onus is on the club to know the rule and not put themselves at risk of further action.
I fully accept this is a slightly different situation but the club officials not knowing or ignoring the rules is as much an issue as the referees lack of knowledge and poor advice from board members.

Look fair enough, I hear the arguments, as someone who’s a player & a former Secretary I’m totally in opposite camp. Understand and respect the points but definitely don’t agree.

Why the secretary? Why not the chairman? Seriously?

I know of club secretaries who don’t even go to games. A team secretary yea fair enough.

Referees and officials are there to know and police the rules, they are the custodians of the game, both elected and well reimbursed to do so.

Accept your point & % wise man id out about 3% at club secretaries door. 40% referee 57% county board Only as referee had the wherewithal to stop and vet the decision prior to it!

DiscoStew · 05-09-2019 08:46PM

thesaturdayman wrote: »

Look fair enough, I hear the arguments, as someone who’s a player & a former Secretary I’m totally in opposite camp. Understand and respect the points but definitely don’t agree.

Why the secretary? Why not the chairman? Seriously?

I know of club secretaries who don’t even go to games. A team secretary yea fair enough.

Referees and officials are there to know and police the rules, they are the custodians of the game, both elected and well reimbursed to do so.

Accept your point & % wise man id out about 3% at club secretaries door. 40% referee 57% county board Only as referee had the wherewithal to stop and vet the decision prior to it!

I referenced club officials, didn’t mention a secretary whatsoever in my post.
As for board officials being on hand to implement rules, do you expect to have a board official at every single game played? I’m far from an apologist for the board but I don’t see how this could be any way feasible.
The club have to look out for the best interest of their players, that includes knowing such rules and potential consequences of breaking them.

Again I respect this is slightly different given that the ref, supposedly, consulted board members. I would expect board members to at the very least be able to consult the rule book on the matter to advise the ref but I certainly believe the club can not pass the blame totally on to the ref / board. They need to protect themselves in these instances.

celt262 · 05-09-2019 09:17PM

thesaturdayman wrote: »

Look fair enough, I hear the arguments, as someone who’s a player & a former Secretary I’m totally in opposite camp. Understand and respect the points but definitely don’t agree.

Why the secretary? Why not the chairman? Seriously?

I know of club secretaries who don’t even go to games. A team secretary yea fair enough.

Referees and officials are there to know and police the rules, they are the custodians of the game, both elected and well reimbursed to do so.

Accept your point & % wise man id out about 3% at club secretaries door. 40% referee 57% county board Only as referee had the wherewithal to stop and vet the decision prior to it!

It this situation it seems like there were a bunch of uneducated personnel who though they knew it all and others who took advantage of it.

FYI Under official GAA rules, the chairman and secretary of a club are held responsible if their club fields an illegal player.

Mastermcgrath · 06-09-2019 02:21AM

thesaturdayman wrote: »

Ah come on. Since when are the clubs responsible for implementing the rules!

It’s like a cop stopping you for being on the phone when driving and saying it’s a 90 euro fine & you telling actually it’s a 90 fine and 3 penalty points.

The ref is paid to do the game, should know the rules - In This instance , he didn’t know, so rightly he sought advice and was misinformed.

The county secretary is well paid & should know the rules

The treasurer is also well looked after and is a former county secretary also should know the rules.

Clubs don’t run fixtures / competitions administrators do.

In this instance & subsequent events that followed administrators made a total balls of it, again.

Missing my point, of course its responsibility on the referee to implement the rules. I'm not talking about the clubs implementing the rules, I'm talking about the spirit of the game.

It just seems now that Clashmore are taking the moral highground and playing the victim with their public statement etc, they were happy to sit back and say nothing and allow rules to be broken when it worked to their advantage (the player in question one of the best young footballers in the county) but when its now turned around on them and the individual player punished they're crying outrage. I'm just saying the clubs are not coming out of this with the huge halo's on their heads like they're portraying. the only unjustified victims in all this is the players themselves.

Lingoweet913 · 06-09-2019 09:09AM

Mastermcgrath wrote: »

Missing my point, of course its responsibility on the referee to implement the rules. I'm not talking about the clubs implementing the rules, I'm talking about the spirit of the game.

It just seems now that Clashmore are taking the moral highground and playing the victim with their public statement etc, they were happy to sit back and say nothing and allow rules to be broken when it worked to their advantage (the player in question one of the best young footballers in the county) but when its now turned around on them and the individual player punished they're crying outrage. I'm just saying the clubs are not coming out of this with the huge halo's on their heads like they're portraying. the only unjustified victims in all this is the players themselves.

Maybe it would have been better for the board to charge Clashmore and kilmac rather than the player? I think both statements by both clubs were mostly along the lines of just stating how things are done in the county - which is not very well

Alpha Centauri · 06-09-2019 10:44AM

mountgomery burns wrote: »

It took me 5 seconds to Google "GAA extra time red card" and returned the below:

"(a) Any fifteen players may start Extra Time (In Inter County the players must be from the Official Team List) except that a player ordered off in Normal Time (Black or Red) is not permitted to play in Extra Time. ... (e) A Caution (Yellow Card) issued during Normal Time shall not carry over into Extra Time."

Are these old rules? The 2019 guide says:

(d) A player ordered off in any circumstance in
Normal Time, may not play in Extra Time but
may be replaced.

upthedeise16 · 06-09-2019 12:16PM

Alpha Centauri wrote: »

Are these old rules? The 2019 guide says:

(d) A player ordered off in any circumstance in
Normal Time, may not play in Extra Time but
may be replaced.

It’s basically the same thing, if you are sent off in normal time, you can’t play extra time but a sub can come on for you.

mountgomery burns · 06-09-2019 12:26PM

Alpha Centauri wrote: »

Are these old rules? The 2019 guide says:

(d) A player ordered off in any circumstance in
Normal Time, may not play in Extra Time but
may be replaced.

Exact same thing just worded differently.

whiteandblue · 06-09-2019 02:04PM

Hearing Tadgh de Burca has done his cruciate, hopefully he will make a full recovery but would be likely to miss all of 2020

JesusRef · 06-09-2019 02:06PM

The clubs knew the rules.

One.club chanced their arm and the other followed suit, unfortunate for the ref, there were players from both team having recieved two yellows, so he was then put under pressure from both sides to get them back on in extra time.

If only one team had a player sent off on two yellows this never would have happened, as the club with the full compliment, knowing well the rules, would have objected.

In this instance, punish both clubs and not the players.... they knew well what they were at

PTH2009 · 06-09-2019 04:20PM

whiteandblue wrote: »

Hearing Tadgh de Burca has done his cruciate, hopefully he will make a full recovery but would be likely to miss all of 2020

yeah will be a massive loss for club and county

hopefully he recovers fully and see him in action sometime in 2020

A bit of a headache for the new manager trying too find a sutiable replacement

hurler on de ditch · 06-09-2019 06:24PM

PTH2009 wrote: »

yeah will be a massive loss for club and county

hopefully he recovers fully and see him in action sometime in 2020

A bit of a headache for the new manager trying too find a sutiable replacement

Seriously ...loads of replacements .he had a glorious few years as sweeper and for the best part of the time as a man marker he was inadequate ,

Relhcstirt · 06-09-2019 08:12PM

DJ Carey for the senior post!!

spideyman92 · 06-09-2019 09:31PM

Relhcstirt wrote: »

DJ Carey for the senior post!!

I heard recently from someone in the camp that Anthony Daly was approached but the fee he wanted was too high.

cul beag · 06-09-2019 10:05PM

spideyman92 wrote: »

I heard recently from someone in the camp that Anthony Daly was approached but the fee he wanted was too high.

All a smokescreen. They have to be seen to go through the motions of asking all the big names out there but when you’re penniless the job will be given to Queally and we’ll be told he was the best candidate for the position.

tommylad1212 · 06-09-2019 10:26PM

Anyone get the football draw 1/4 finals and relegation playoffs?

PTH2009 · 06-09-2019 11:05PM

Relhcstirt wrote: »

DJ Carey for the senior post!!

Would be a decent appointment but he stated he would never manage outside of Kilkenny

upthedeise16 · 06-09-2019 11:55PM

tommylad1212 wrote: »

Anyone get the football draw 1/4 finals and relegation playoffs?

Ballinacourty-Kilrossanty, Nire-An Rinn, Rathgormack-Gaultier, Stradbally-Clashmore

Deisefacts · 07-09-2019 02:33PM

After attending last nights football match, I can now confirm that Dessie o Leary is the worst referee we have or there’s ever been in the county. And that’s a fact

JesusRef · 07-09-2019 02:36PM

Deisefacts wrote: »

After attending last nights football match, I can now confirm that Dessie o Leary is the worst referee we have or there’s ever been in the county. And that’s a fact

Jesus ref.....for f*cks sake Dessie

windy shepard henderson · 08-09-2019 12:15AM

upthedeise16 wrote: »

Ballinacourty-Kilrossanty, Nire-An Rinn, Rathgormack-Gaultier, Stradbally-Clashmore

who are the favorites out of the 8 , the nire . stradbally Courtey ?

mountgomery burns · 08-09-2019 08:29AM

windy shepard henderson wrote: »

who are the favorites out of the 8 , the nire . stradbally Courtey ?

Not sure about actually winning it but Rathgormack could be dark horses there. Only a matter of time before they're in a final, a lot of good young players.

ProudDUB · 08-09-2019 10:05AM

PTH2009 wrote: »

Would be a decent appointment but he stated he would never manage outside of Kilkenny

So what's he doing managing IT Carlow?

hardybuck · 08-09-2019 02:45PM

Deisefacts wrote: »

After attending last nights football match, I can now confirm that Dessie o Leary is the worst referee we have or there’s ever been in the county. And that’s a fact

How is he still reffing at all?

Jerry Atrick · 09-09-2019 02:14PM

hardybuck wrote: »

How is he still reffing at all?

He's shocking bad and a danger to players on the field with his attitude and grasp of the rules. Not many referees out there though so keeps getting games and is one of the more senior referees around the county.

thesaturdayman · 09-09-2019 02:42PM

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

He's shocking bad and a danger to players on the field with his attitude and grasp of the rules. Not many referees out there though so keeps getting games and is one of the more senior referees around the county.

An Abomination.

Regularly turns up to senior championship games with no umpires, no grasp of the changing rules - mark, square ball, black card, kick outs.

Players get frustrated then with him and with each other at which point he starts giving abuse back to players.

Deisefacts · 09-09-2019 02:53PM

thesaturdayman wrote: »

An Abomination.

Regularly turns up to senior championship games with no umpires, no grasp of the changing rules - mark, square ball, black card, kick outs.

Players get frustrated then with him and with each other at which point he starts giving abuse back to players.

His 2 umpires on Friday night were John Jackson and pat flynn.

PTH2009 · 09-09-2019 11:21PM

69776584_2432808320136531_4193555541819129856_n.jpg?_nc_cat=109&_nc_oc=AQm-Sf0pjW36VaL77VqrLMry1wbddWyzWk_3m6G7KmMpON_TqyfDEx0H76ItRu_ZGKg&_nc_ht=scontent-dub4-1.xx&oh=c0f6803908ba85756595fae8ad96d3fc&oe=5E1021AD

Gardner · 10-09-2019 08:41AM

thesaturdayman wrote: »

An Abomination.

Regularly turns up to senior championship games with no umpires, no grasp of the changing rules - mark, square ball, black card, kick outs.

Players get frustrated then with him and with each other at which point he starts giving abuse back to players.

could you understand him?

Waterford GAA thread - mod warning post #1 and #51

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