Formula 1 2019 - General Discussion Thread

AMKC · 30-08-2019 12:35PM

Is it time for Kimi to consider retiring at the end of this season? He said it himself he is getting old and injured a muscle. Maybe Alfa might have two new drivers in there line up next year.

Top Dog · 30-08-2019 12:40PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

And does anyone remember Button? Long past producing good performances and people wee still reluctant to let him drop off the grid.

I really don't see how you can compare the two. Button was a World Champion, multiple podium finishes, master in the rain, seriously smooth and easy on machinery, beat Hamilton when they were in the same cars. Even in his final years he was still putting in great performances and bringing home strong points.

2 totally different levels of drivers. Hulk is just, grand. Seems like a nice bloke, but I'm not sure many would notice if he wasn't there.

El_Duderino 09 · 30-08-2019 01:34PM

pjohnson wrote: »

Do you happen to like any driver over 30?

They are giving FP1 in Japan to Naoki Yamamoto (31 year old) anyway this year so thats a photo opportunity rather than young driver.

I like most of them. I admire all of them. I just don’t give in to the nostalgia when looking at what’s most likely to happen.

Listening to the bbc spa preview podcast and one of them predicted a podium for hulk this weekend. I know it was a bit of a joke but it shows that they’re playing to the fans nostalgia. Classic Heart over head.

Nostalgia is what causes f1 fans to say Kubica is living up to their expectations of him this year.

Do you honest think Honda wants a young Japanese driver who could be WC one day, or any old driver with name recognition?

El_Duderino 09 · 30-08-2019 01:37PM

Top Dog wrote: »

I really don't see how you can compare the two. Button was a World Champion, multiple podium finishes, master in the rain, seriously smooth and easy on machinery, beat Hamilton when they were in the same cars. Even in his final years he was still putting in great performances and bringing home strong points.

2 totally different levels of drivers. Hulk is just, grand. Seems like a nice bloke, but I'm not sure many would notice if he wasn't there.

Nostalgia alert. Button’s last year was a massive disappointment. It was clear his edge was gone. The comeback in Monaco was a bit embarrassing.

El_Duderino 09 · 30-08-2019 02:01PM

You’re making an arbitrary distinction between drivers over and under 30.

Hulk is a prime example of a driver who has had all the opportunity to show his peaks and troughs and a fairly consistent mean. He’s a grand driver but he isn’t very good. With a quick injection of nostalgia and likability you could make out he’s a top driver. But reality is, he isn’t.

vectra · 30-08-2019 02:05PM

AMKC wrote: »

Is it time for Kimi to consider retiring at the end of this season? He said it himself he is getting old and injured a muscle. Maybe Alfa might have two new drivers in there line up next year.

Why would he?
He has a 2 year contract with an option to extend.
He is enjoying himself more than he has for a long time.

Jordan 199 · 30-08-2019 02:17PM

vectra wrote: »

Why would he?
He has a 2 year contract with an option to extend.
He is enjoying himself more than he has for a long time.

He's doing very well this year.

donspeekinglesh · 30-08-2019 04:30PM

AMKC wrote: »

Toro rosso looking to get a Japanese driver in, just no talent in sight

Sure they could get Kamui Kobayashi until there is another Japanese driver ready to race. Be nice to see him back in F1 again.

Would he give up his well paid factory Toyota drive (with a shot at a world title) for a midfield seat and be treated the way his new team-mate was?

pjohnson · 30-08-2019 05:25PM

Perez signs a 3 year deal at Racing Point.

El_Duderino 09 · 30-08-2019 05:32PM

pjohnson wrote: »

Perez signs a 3 year deal at Racing Point.

You don’t see many 3 year deals these days. There must be a clause to release him if one of the big teams come knocking. Racing point is investing in the future with a new factory. So it will improve but probably not within 3 years. We’ll have to see how it works out.

Good security for Perez but it’s worth keeping in mind that hulk was signed to Renault for next year.

Frank Bullitt · 30-08-2019 05:43PM

pjohnson wrote: »

Perez signs a 3 year deal at Racing Point.

That will be him and Stroll together for a while so.

skipper_G · 30-08-2019 05:59PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

You don’t see many 3 year deals these days. There must be a clause to release him if one of the big teams come knocking. Racing point is investing in the future with a new factory. So it will improve but probably not within 3 years. We’ll have to see how it works out.

Good security for Perez but it’s worth keeping in mind that hulk was signed to Renault for next year.

Genuine question, I've seen two people now say Hulk was signed to Renault for next season, where did that come from? Everything I read says he was out of contract at the end of this season

Top Dog · 30-08-2019 06:06PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Nostalgia alert. Button’s last year was a massive disappointment. It was clear his edge was gone. The comeback in Monaco was a bit embarrassing.

You know what, yup, likely guilty as charged. They same could be said for Schumachers return, but he's still regarded as one of the best ever.

Still doesn't change the fact that in his prime Jenson was on another level when compared to Hulk.

It's like apples and oranges - 10 years without a podium vs a World Champion with multiple podiums.

El_Duderino 09 · 30-08-2019 07:31PM

skipper_G wrote: »

Genuine question, I've seen two people now say Hulk was signed to Renault for next season, where did that come from? Everything I read says he was out of contract at the end of this season

That was the story at the time. He was the main driver when he signed. He was the experienced driver who would tear the team during its development phase to glory over the next 3 years. That was the narrative at the time Anyway.

Plus this year the story was that Renault couldn’t finalise the Ocon deal until Renault found a seat for hulk because he’s under contract for next year.

I don’t claim to have seen the contract or anything.

El_Duderino 09 · 30-08-2019 07:33PM

Top Dog wrote: »

You know what, yup, likely guilty as charged. They same could be said for Schumachers return, but he's still regarded as one of the best ever.

Still doesn't change the fact that in his prime Jenson was on another level when compared to Hulk.

It's like apples and oranges - 10 years without a podium vs a World Champion with multiple podiums.

Ah yeah but the nostalgia is only a problem when it causes someone to pretend Schumacher was driving well during his comeback when he clearly wasn’t. It doesn’t mean he wasn’t excellent in the past but you have to be honest about the facts at the time.

Same with pretending Button was driving well in his last season. He wasn’t. It doesn’t mean he wasn’t very good on his day.

chicorytip · 30-08-2019 11:33PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I like most of them. I admire all of them. I just don’t give in to the nostalgia when looking at what’s most likely to happen.

Listening to the bbc spa preview podcast and one of them predicted a podium for hulk this weekend. I know it was a bit of a joke but it shows that they’re playing to the fans nostalgia. Classic Heart over head.

Nostalgia is what causes f1 fans to say Kubica is living up to their expectations of him this year.

Do you honest think Honda wants a young Japanese driver who could be WC one day, or any old driver with name recognition?

Nobody was expecting Kimi to get a two year deal at Alfa. It was his retirement gift from Ferrari, in effect, a consolation prize for being dropped. He is also an investor in Sauber. In fairness, I think he is exceeding many peoples expectations with his performances and is not just going through the motions. Reaching the grand old age of forty seems to bring about infirmity in racing drivers however. Mansell and Schumacher, for example.

GarIT · 31-08-2019 01:16AM

chicorytip wrote: »

Nobody was expecting Kimi to get a two year deal at Alfa. It was his retirement gift from Ferrari, in effect, a consolation prize for being dropped. He is also an investor in Sauber. In fairness, I think he is exceeding many peoples expectations with his performances and is not just going through the motions. Reaching the grand old age of forty seems to bring about infirmity in racing drivers however. Mansell and Schumacher, for example.

Both Ferrari and Kimi say Ferrari had no involvement in him getting that drive. He arranged it independently. Ferrari didn't know until it was announced.

skipper_G · 31-08-2019 07:01AM

GarIT wrote: »

Both Ferrari and Kimi say Ferrari had no involvement in him getting that drive. He arranged it independently. Ferrari didn't know until it was announced.

And he's not an investor either, that's more unfounded Internet speculation

El_Duderino 09 · 31-08-2019 07:04AM

GarIT wrote: »

Both Ferrari and Kimi say Ferrari had no involvement in him getting that drive. He arranged it independently. Ferrari didn't know until it was announced.

Well, maybe. He is an investor in the team so in a sense, he’s a pay driver. It’s a like a scaled down version of Stroll at Racing point. Is anyone seriously suggesting RP picked Stroll purely based on his speed?

But Kimi is doing well at Alpha this season. He’s way ahead of goo in points but he’s actually barely ahead in quali head to head. Only 0.069 seconds according to Andrew Benson’s analysis after Hungary. That’s one of he smaller gaps between teammates. So either Kimi is slow in quali, Gio is fast in quali and slow in races, or Kimi is roughly as fast as Gio but is using his experience to great effect to bring home points.

https://mobile.twitter.com/andrewbensonf1/status/1151414383140069377

Gaoth Laidir · 31-08-2019 10:21PM

Antoine Hubert killed in the F2 race today. RIP

murphyebass · 31-08-2019 11:14PM

Saw this earlier. Absolutely horrific crash. Wish I hadn’t watched the footage to be honest. Poor family.

AMKC · 31-08-2019 11:18PM

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Antoine Hubert killed in the F2 race today. RIP

Very sad. RIP Antoine Hubert.

Darkglasses · 31-08-2019 11:26PM

Absolutely awful, he was only 22 and all.

Will make tomorrow a bit of a hard watch for me.

H3llR4iser · 31-08-2019 11:46PM

Car split down the middle... in 30 years following motor racing, I had never seen anything like it. Calls the structural integrity of the F2 Chaos into question.

PopePalpatine · 01-09-2019 12:04AM

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Car split down the middle... in 30 years following motor racing, I had never seen anything like it. Calls the structural integrity of the F2 Chaos into question.

I doubt Dallara ever thought their cars would get hit twice in two successive 250km/h+ crashes. RIP Antoine.

murphyebass · 01-09-2019 12:26AM

PopePalpatine wrote: »

I doubt Dallara ever thought their cars would get hit twice in two successive 250km/h+ crashes. RIP Antoine.

+1.

Was a completely freak accident.

Halo and all couldn’t do anything about it.

Rightly or more likely wrongly though the risk is one if not most of the reason that made a lot of us watch Motorsport, F1 in this instance/in particular, in the first place.

Kind puts the backlash to the halo just because of its aesthetics into perspective.

Again, tragic accident.

Inviere · 01-09-2019 07:17AM

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Car split down the middle... in 30 years following motor racing, I had never seen anything like it. Calls the structural integrity of the F2 Chaos into question.

Does it really though? I don't think any racing car is designed to be driven into a barrier at 250+ kmph, bounced back out onto the track, come to a stop, and then be driven into by another car doing 250+ kmph.

Like everyone, I'm down for learning what we can from things like this to ensure they never happen again, but this isn't something you can engineer a car to be able to withstand. Personally I don't think the cars design was the problem here, and more the angle of the barrier/how the barriers absorb impacts. They need to look at this particular barrier, and design it so a car can't bounce off it and back onto the track.

Even at that though, things like speed, entry vector, steering angle, and many other factors will throw calculations out the window. Inherently, motorsports is dangerous - they've gotten seriously good at protecting life - but there will always be risk there. All we can do is learn, and try to prevent same happening again.

RIP Antoine

Burkie1203 · 01-09-2019 07:26AM

Inviere wrote: »

Does it really though? I don't think any racing car is designed to be driven into a barrier at 250+ kmph, bounced back out onto the track, come to a stop, and then be driven into by another car doing 250+ kmph.

Did his car make it back out onto the track or was another car off the track when they collided?

uchimata83 · 01-09-2019 07:33AM

Burkie1203 wrote: »

Did his car make it back out onto the track or was another car off the track when they collided?

The other car was off track too. Looked very similar to magnussens huge one there a few years back

It's more so that run off area than anything to do with the cars, that place has been way to tight for many years.

Inviere · 01-09-2019 07:43AM

Burkie1203 wrote: »

Did his car make it back out onto the track or was another car off the track when they collided?

It didn't bounce back out onto the racing line as such, but the barrier bounced him back out where another car was wide. Those barriers need attention, and the trees behind them probably cleared to make the area bigger/wider.

Formula 1 2019 - General Discussion Thread

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