Brexit discussion thread IX (Please read OP before posting)

21-07-2019 12:58PM

Jumping ship before being pushed by the looks of it.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-49062514

Philip Hammond has told the BBC he intends to resign as chancellor if Boris Johnson becomes the UK's next PM.

He said a no-deal Brexit, something Mr Johnson has left open as an option, was "not something I could ever sign up to".

Asked if he thought he would be sacked next week, Mr Hammond said he would resign on Wednesday to Theresa May.

He said he intends to quit after Prime Minister's Questions but before Mrs May steps down.

I thought that the next PM took office on the 23rd a Tuesday.

10000maniacs · 21-07-2019 01:04PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Jumping ship before being pushed by the looks of it.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-49062514

Philip Hammond has told the BBC he intends to resign as chancellor if Boris Johnson becomes the UK's next PM.

He said a no-deal Brexit, something Mr Johnson has left open as an option, was "not something I could ever sign up to".

Asked if he thought he would be sacked next week, Mr Hammond said he would resign on Wednesday to Theresa May.

He said he intends to quit after Prime Minister's Questions but before Mrs May steps down.

I thought that the next PM took office on the 23rd a Tuesday.

David Gauke has said the same thing on Radio 4 this morning. The Tories are running out of options fast.

21-07-2019 01:09PM

10000maniacs wrote: »

David Gauke has said the same thing on Radio 4 this morning. The Tories are running out of options fast.

I'm sure they'll have a rake of Brexiteer MPs (unknown and untested) to choose from.

Sam Russell · 21-07-2019 01:16PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm sure they'll have a rake of Brexiteer MPs (unknown and untested) to choose from.

I think the LibDems might be getting a few new joiners.

Igotadose · 21-07-2019 01:22PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm sure they'll have a rake of Brexiteer MPs (unknown and untested) to choose from.

Mark Francois for Chancellor! Imagine the fun!

O.K. that's outside the charter. Indo is saying Sajid Javid as Chancellor, a neocon running the UK towards Brexit. Scary...

10000maniacs · 21-07-2019 01:22PM

Deleted User wrote: »

10000maniacs wrote: »

David Gauke has said the same thing on Radio 4 this morning. The Tories are running out of options fast.

I'm sure they'll have a rake of Brexiteer MPs (unknown and untested) to choose from.

Bridgen, Francois, Mogg, Paterson, Jenkin etc. I can just imagine the carnage.

ballsymchugh · 21-07-2019 01:26PM

10000maniacs wrote: »

Bridgen, Francois, Mogg, Paterson, Jenkin etc. I can just imagine the carnage.

Mogg is a devious charlatan who knows better than to get involved in cabinet. he'd much prefer to be commentating on the sidelines like he has done for the past few years with no real responsibility.

Strazdas · 21-07-2019 01:28PM

10000maniacs wrote: »

Bridgen, Francois, Mogg, Paterson, Jenkin etc. I can just imagine the carnage.

I'm not sure the likes of Francois and Bridgen would get near the cabinet (too mental even for Johnson), but it looks like Davis, Mogg, Patel and IDS will

Hermy · 21-07-2019 01:34PM

10000maniacs wrote: »

Everybody keeps saying Johnson is a really "smart" guy. I am at a loss and don't see it. All I see is a bumbling disorganised buffoon. Is it only me? What am I missing?

He's almost in the door of No. 10.

Surely that counts for something.

Leroy42 · 21-07-2019 01:49PM

Jebus, IDS back in cabinet. That is pretty depressing. He failed as the leader, he failed as the minister and he has offered nothing in terms of details in regards to Brexit.

10000maniacs · 21-07-2019 01:51PM

Hermy wrote: »

10000maniacs wrote: »

Everybody keeps saying Johnson is a really "smart" guy. I am at a loss and don't see it. All I see is a bumbling disorganised buffoon. Is it only me? What am I missing?

He's almost in the door of No. 10.

Surely that counts for something.

No, not really. It says more about the Oxford Buddington club mentality than anything else. The champagne-swilling, restaurant-trashing, “pleb”-taunting elitism and self entitlement that was a trademark of this alternate UK universe has somehow transformed itself into the core of the Tory party that will get Johnson into number 10. Intelligence free zone unfortunately.

Enzokk · 21-07-2019 02:14PM

10000maniacs wrote: »

Boris was one word away from a diplomatic incident with Ireland when he was foreign secretary. If he used "Mick" or "Paddy" in the comment instead of "Murphy", he would be in serious trouble now.
Everybody keeps saying Johnson is a really "smart" guy. I am at a loss and don't see it. All I see is a bumbling disorganised buffoon. Is it only me? What am I missing?

I think he his smart, but just enough to get himself in trouble as he knows enough to get by but not enough to make the best decisions. Then you have the fact that he is an entitled racist to add to it and that is what we see. He says offensive things but in a way that you cannot really shout racist at him, but he is doing it on purpose. A bit like Jeremy Clarkson and the "slope" joke when they were in Asia and a local was using a bridge.

McGiver · 21-07-2019 02:18PM

Strazdas wrote:

There may well be large elements of truth in the article such as Cox and Brokenshire meeting Irish officials and EU ambassadors meeting Tories but he's putting two and two together and coming up with six if he thinks the WA will be renegotiated.

The only possibility is renegotiation to the original NI only backstop version of the WA.
I think this is more likely to happen with BoJo than with TM or Hunt. Johnson could spin it as a victory, the English Brexiteers are totally ignorant of NI and I think they would buy it.

Stop moaning ffs · 21-07-2019 02:23PM

McGiver wrote: »

The only possibility is renegotiation to the original NI only backstop version of the WA.
I think this is more likely to happen with BoJo than with TM or Hunt. Johnson could spin it as a victory, the English Brexiteers are totally ignorant of NI and I think they would buy it.

Only this week Vatadkar said if it applied to NI only, that is still on the table and would move things forward.

Leroy42 · 21-07-2019 02:23PM

Possibly a time limit or unilateral ability to withdraw from the UK wide backstop, but with NI essentially staying as is.

Can dress it up as alternatives will sort it out so NI have nothing to fear.

But would that require a reopening of the WA?

Water John · 21-07-2019 02:26PM

How long would the Brexiteers then guard the DUP's back?

Stop moaning ffs · 21-07-2019 02:30PM

Water John wrote: »

How long would the Brexiteers then guard the DUP's back?

If Johnson can sell the rewording of the PD to HOC he might not need DUP support any longer.
Arlene this morning saying the confidence and supply arrangement will continue.
I wouldn’t bank on Johnson remaining as faithful to the DUP as they seem to be to him and the current status.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo · 21-07-2019 02:37PM

Tikki Wang Wang wrote: »

Coveney on Marr now. Doing a good job as usual.

Full interview is up on YouTube. Can't post a link because of phone.

Coveney did an excellent job to be fair to him. Similar to how Mairead McGuinness has explained Ireland's thoughts on British TV. He was really concise in how he answered all the questions put to him.
I'm thankful he and his team have such a realistic approach to Brexit. Talking about the all Ireland economy and peace on the island is a very reasonable standpoint to have. 800,00 journeys and 30% of all exports between north and south. He had the facts to back up his points

Have never given Fine Gael a first preference. But am almost considering it based on his performance with regard to Brexit, as I'm registered in his constituency of Cork south central.

I'm still annoyed he hasn't delivered the Event Centre for Cork but that's for the Cork City forum.

Water John · 21-07-2019 02:47PM

I haven't seen any Irish politician perform poorly on this issue. The briefing from the civil service has been top notch from day 1.
Even politicians who are mediocre on other things have come good when on foreign media on this issue. I think they all are on their A game on this matter.

Igotadose · 21-07-2019 03:00PM

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo wrote: »

Full interview is up on YouTube. Can't post a link because of phone.

Coveney did an excellent job to be fair to him. Similar to how Mairead McGuinness has explained Ireland's thoughts on British TV. He was really concise in how he answered all the questions put to him.
I'm thankful he and his team have such a realistic approach to Brexit. Talking about the all Ireland economy and peace on the island is a very reasonable standpoint to have. 800,00 journeys and 30% of all exports between north and south. He had the facts to back up his points

Have never given Fine Gael a first preference. But am almost considering it based on his performance with regard to Brexit, as I'm registered in his constituency of Cork south central.

I'm still annoyed he hasn't delivered the Event Centre for Cork but that's for the Cork City forum.

Excellent performance by Coveney. Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rKoJfVEZNQ

Marr kept trying to bait him into traps, but he avoided them adroitly, and kept hammering on 'Brexit is a UK decision. No-Deal Brexit hurts everyone.' Coveney reiterated that it will be a UK decision to leave without a deal. Basically shredding the whinefest that comes out of the UK media.

I suppose Marr is well regarded, but he definitely couldn't get Coveney to say or do anything wrong.

Tell me how · 21-07-2019 03:17PM

Water John wrote: »

I haven't seen any Irish politician perform poorly on this issue. The briefing from the civil service has been top notch from day 1.
Even politicians who are mediocre on other things have come good when on foreign media on this issue. I think they all are on their A game on this matter.

Agree.
Coveney, McEntee, Richmond and McGuinness all top notch. And all with very similar manner and arguments whenever they are on show.
No sense that they are shooting from the hip.

Whoever coordinated their guidance/coaching/training deserves a clap on the back.

I'm not a fan of local FG representatives, but Coveney is someone I think of as very very capable.

Water John · 21-07-2019 03:26PM

I presume there is a strategic briefing team in the Dept of Foreign Affairs, possibly drawing expertise across Depts.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo · 21-07-2019 03:40PM

Water John wrote: »

I presume there is a strategic briefing team in the Dept of Foreign Affairs, possibly drawing expertise across Depts.

There must be.

Brexit is a minefield for Irish politics and society so you need people with a bit of cop on to be there talking with public representatives.

The whole thing is too important to half ass it.

J Mysterio · 21-07-2019 03:45PM

Igotadose wrote: »

Excellent performance by Coveney. Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rKoJfVEZNQ

Thanks for the link. Agree Coveney very good as always. Accepting no nonsense and quite forceful in his points.

I do wish the conversation could be switched back to the sea border. This works for everyone bar the DUP.

Stop moaning ffs · 21-07-2019 03:47PM

J Mysterio wrote: »

Thanks for the link. Agree Coveney very good as always. Accepting no nonsense and quite forceful in his points.

I do wish the conversation could be switched back to the sea border. This works for everyone bar the DUP.

It’s just bizarre it’s not front and Center as the way forward.

Igotadose · 21-07-2019 04:25PM

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo wrote: »

There must be.

Brexit is a minefield for Irish politics and society so you need people with a bit of cop on to be there talking with public representatives.

The whole thing is too important to half ass it.

Wish the UK would realize that. Amusing the cadre of Brexit supporters here have gone away, at this point it's just watch-the-trainwreck. Whatever did happen to SoloDel...

Spanish Eyes · 21-07-2019 04:39PM

Very inpressive interview Coveney on Marr.

Pity few will care in UK. Such is the cult of Brexit.

Stop moaning ffs · 21-07-2019 04:52PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Very inpressive interview Coveney on Marr.

Pity few will care in UK. Such is the cult of Brexit.

I know twitter isn’t a reliable gauge but a great many Brits seem really impressed with him with many wishing they had anyone like as capable and articulate as him in all this mess.
On the other hand he’s annoying a great many of them simply because he’s bursting their fantasy and some of the stuff being said really exposes that good old colonial imperial delusion and some outright anti Irish sentiment.
And some of them trying to present ‘facts’ about us and what we ‘owe’ Britain really make for a poor display of not only our history with Britain but their lack of education on their own history. Even recent events.

Looking st the interview and the reaction you can see the blame game is in ramping up.

ThePanjandrum · 21-07-2019 05:18PM

J Mysterio wrote: »

Thanks for the link. Agree Coveney very good as always. Accepting no nonsense and quite forceful in his points.

I do wish the conversation could be switched back to the sea border. This works for everyone bar the DUP.

Is this the sea border between Ireland and the rest of the EU? Why would it upset the DUP?

Sam Russell · 21-07-2019 05:22PM

ThePanjandrum wrote: »

Is this the sea border between Ireland and the rest of the EU? Why would it upset the DUP?

That is not happening under any Irish Gov. The first pressure point in a 'No-Deal' scenario is the British border at Dover port. When that is sorted then the attention will turn to the British border in Ireland.

If the British Gov decides to inspect at Larne for agriculture and hygiene as they do now (but 100% inspection) then the problem reduces.

Brexit discussion thread IX (Please read OP before posting)

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