ISPs to block Illegal Streaming of UK Premiership games [READ POST #3 BEFORE POSTING]

icdg · 16-07-2019 02:38PM

I’m confused on that one. It implies that it is the broadcasters decision not to show the other games in Ireland, and they could somehow, if they wanted to, show the games in Ireland but not the UK.

That isn’t the case.

In the UK and Ireland the Premier League, made available for purchase, separately for the the UK and for Ireland, seven packages of rights consisting of the same games in both countries. Four of the packages were acquired by Sky Sports in both the UK and Ireland, two of the packages were acquired by BT Sport in both the UK and Ireland, and one of the packages by Prime Video in the UK and Premier Sports for Ireland. The Premier League also offered one extra package for Ireland consisting of 33 Sat 3pm KOs and this package was acquired by Premier Sports.

There is no package consisting of the other 3pm KOs available for an Irish broadcaster to purchase. That is the Premier League’s decision.

It is all explained here:
http://www.premierleague.com/news/708008

I get the argument from a fan point of view that they would like to do a “follow my team” type of deal. But you have to realise that if the Premier League made that sort of package available it’s member clubs would instantly know exactly what percentage of the TV rights revenue is attributable to each club. And if that showed, for example, a disparity between the Top 6 and the rest of the league there’d be a clammer from the Top 6 for a “fairer” share of the rights money, with the likely threat of a European Super League being held over the rest of the league if they didn’t get their way.

dulpit · 16-07-2019 02:43PM

Would there ever be a scenario where the premier league sell access directly to customers? Similar to the likes of NFL Gamepass/etc... I assume as of right now, the amounts the broadcasters are paying is too high, but how sustainable is it long term?

icdg · 16-07-2019 02:44PM

I think it’s often forgotten over here that NFL GamePass is not available in the States; it’s equivilant Sunday Ticket blocks all games broadcast on TV in the viewer’s market. And is only available on one pay TV provider (DirectTV).

SteM · 16-07-2019 02:45PM

galtee boy wrote: »

So you just pay what the supplier asks for and say thanks very much ? Switching/haggling/threatening to leave a supplier etc is the way to reduce your bills, I do it every year with TV, Phone, Broadband, Electricity, Car and House Insurance etc and I always end up paying less than what the original asking price was. Everyone I know does it, that's domestic economics these days and Sky will bend over backwards more than most to hold on to you, because they know Pay tv is a luxury, not a necessary expense.

No, I just refuse to pay them and go elsewhere. No skin off my nose if they can't offer me the best price the first time around.

D14Rugby · 16-07-2019 03:03PM

icdg wrote: »

I’m confused on that one. It implies that it is the broadcasters decision not to show the other games in Ireland, and they could somehow, if they wanted to, show the games in Ireland but not the UK.

That isn’t the case.

In the UK and Ireland the Premier League, made available for purchase, separately for the the UK and for Ireland, seven packages of rights consisting of the same games in both countries. Four of the packages were acquired by Sky Sports in both the UK and Ireland, two of the packages were acquired by BT Sport in both the UK and Ireland, and one of the packages by Prime Video in the UK and Premier Sports for Ireland. The Premier League also offered one extra package for Ireland consisting of 33 Sat 3pm KOs and this package was acquired by Premier Sports.

There is no package consisting of the other 3pm KOs available for an Irish broadcaster to purchase. That is the Premier League’s decision.

It is all explained here:
http://www.premierleague.com/news/708008

I get the argument from a fan point of view that they would like to do a “follow my team” type of deal. But you have to realise that if the Premier League made that sort of package available it’s member clubs would instantly know exactly what percentage of the TV rights revenue is attributable to each club. And if that showed, for example, a disparity between the Top 6 and the rest of the league there’d be a clammer from the Top 6 for a “fairer” share of the rights money, with the likely threat of a European Super League being held over the rest of the league if they didn’t get their way.

Ah my bad, as you can tell don't follow premier league goings on too closely.

messinkiapina · 16-07-2019 03:09PM

Anyone know how successful were they in blocking these streams being accessed from the UK last season? Have they effectively killed it for most people or just shut down the ones every Joe Soap was accessing, like Mobdro?

SureYWouldntYa · 16-07-2019 03:11PM

So long as the proper way has easy access and is a fair price people will use the service

Look at the success of Netflix, it's so easy to pirate yet so many will still sign up to Netflix because it's the path of least resistance and a fair price especially when compared to Sky and the likes

There's no good reason other than greed that we can't have access to all 380 PL games a year by a monthly / yearly sub, and cut out the massive Sky costs who are doubling dipping with ad revenue as well as sub revenue

If PL football was €100 a year or €15 a month or something along them lines you'd have people in their droves, if I could have a castable app on my phone for it then it would be an absolute no brainer

c.p.w.g.w · 16-07-2019 03:22PM

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

So long as the proper way has easy access and is a fair price people will use the service

Look at the success of Netflix, it's so easy to pirate yet so many will still sign up to Netflix because it's the path of least resistance and a fair price especially when compared to Sky and the likes

There's no good reason other than greed that we can't have access to all 380 PL games a year by a monthly / yearly sub, and cut out the massive Sky costs who are doubling dipping with ad revenue as well as sub revenue

If PL football was €100 a year or €15 a month or something along them lines you'd have people in their droves, if I could have a castable app on my phone for it then it would be an absolute no brainer

They would probably make more money. Most people I know watch all sport illegally. They can't justify the money, especially since they really just want to watch there own team.

garra · 16-07-2019 03:26PM

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

So long as the proper way has easy access and is a fair price people will use the service

Look at the success of Netflix, it's so easy to pirate yet so many will still sign up to Netflix because it's the path of least resistance and a fair price especially when compared to Sky and the likes

There's no good reason other than greed that we can't have access to all 380 PL games a year by a monthly / yearly sub, and cut out the massive Sky costs who are doubling dipping with ad revenue as well as sub revenue

If PL football was €100 a year or €15 a month or something along them lines you'd have people in their droves, if I could have a castable app on my phone for it then it would be an absolute no brainer

Unfortunately there are enough eejits out there paying full whack for the Sky HD package etc, to make it commercially worthwhile for Sky / BT to protect this lucrative income through technical / legal means rather than do as you suggest.

If Netflix could get away with charging 40 quid a month and and risk losing 50% of customers to illegal streaming, they would do it too.

SureYWouldntYa · 16-07-2019 03:30PM

garra wrote: »

Unfortunately there are enough eejits out there paying full whack for the Sky HD package etc, to make it commercially worthwhile for Sky / BT to protect this lucrative income through technical / legal means rather than do as you suggest.

If Netflix could get away with charging 40 quid a month and and risk losing 50% of customers to illegal streaming, they would do it too.

You just reminded me of Sky's biggest scam, paying for HD

I believe it's tied in with box sets now at €16 a month or something like that, utterly ridiculous

It's short term gain for long term failure I hope, the whole bloody lot of it

mackersdublin · 16-07-2019 03:35PM

sugarman wrote: »

Not until they offer 1080p streams.

Testing has commenced https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/2335971/nowtv-full-hd-testing/p1

ED E · 16-07-2019 03:37PM

messinkiapina wrote: »

Anyone know how successful were they in blocking these streams being accessed from the UK last season? Have they effectively killed it for most people or just shut down the ones every Joe Soap was accessing, like Mobdro?

Luddites. Stymied.

Anyone using a VPN will route passed the block. Wholly ineffectual.

gibgodsman · 16-07-2019 03:49PM

Phileas Frog wrote: »

This was in place in the UK last season. How effective was it?

It was actually fairly effective due to the need for a VPN if you were in the UK last season. While a VPN is easy enough to use on a PC, using them on Boxes, TV's etc can be more of a challenge due to needing to get specific routers etc. that most just couldn't do.

I honestly just do not understand why Sky or someone doesn't just offer specific packages to watch your teams matches. €20 a month to watch Liverpool games only, yes please, would do it instantly.

_Kaiser_ · 16-07-2019 03:49PM

galtee boy wrote: »

So you just pay what the supplier asks for and say thanks very much ? Switching/haggling/threatening to leave a supplier etc is the way to reduce your bills, I do it every year with TV, Phone, Broadband, Electricity, Car and House Insurance etc and I always end up paying less than what the original asking price was. Everyone I know does it, that's domestic economics these days and Sky will bend over backwards more than most to hold on to you, because they know Pay tv is a luxury, not a necessary expense.

Slightly side-tracked, but it's gotten ridiculous at this point. Every service/utility expects you to spend hours comparing, haggling and dealing with the frustration and outages if anything goes wrong every year... just so you can get the same price as others!

That's leaving aside the fact that many are just reselling other products anyway. My car renewal quote was ridiculous this year (for no reason I might add)... going online to their site instantly knocked €400 off.

Calling another broker who offered pricing with the same underwriter was cheaper again. Calling that company directly gave ANOTHER price.

It's ridiculous and it takes far too much time and stress.

settopbox · 16-07-2019 03:52PM

Time for a foreign sub I think.
Canal Plus Poland or Spain I think.

Bigmac1euro · 16-07-2019 03:54PM

I laughed out loud when I heard this today, it’s not even possible. The guys who are selling these illegal streams have each stream running through a VPN as well. All their servers have VPN’s.

galtee boy · 16-07-2019 04:08PM

settopbox wrote: »

Time for a foreign sub I think.
Canal Plus Poland or Spain I think.

I didn't think you could legally do this, didn't some pub landlady lose the case in England when she tried to use a Greek sports subscription?

rabbidpeach · 16-07-2019 04:09PM

galtee boy wrote: »

I didn't think you could legally do this, didn't some pub landlady lose the case in England when she tried to use a Greek sports subscription?

She won the case.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-17150054

galtee boy · 16-07-2019 04:19PM

rabbidpeach wrote: »

She won the case.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-17150054

She did and she didn't, read the last paragraph, the Premier League still say she's liable to prosecution, my understanding is that if the picture on the screen shows the Premier League logo, the Lions head, it is a breach of copyright. However , that's for a pub, I'm guessing that a private legal foreign subscription for domestic use is legal under EU ruling. But would Canal Plus ,or Bein Sports or whoever sell a subscription outside the country they have a licence for ?

Clareman · 16-07-2019 04:26PM

People will always get around any securities that are put in place, Sky helped get around OnDigital back in the day, they replaced their boxes to get rid of card sharing now the owner of the content is getting involved it makes it even more complicated. The Premier League are making a couple of billion a year from TV rights, they are going to do everything they can to protect that and the first thing they'll do is stop illegal streams as this will stop Sky complaining that feeds from Iraq (for example) are killing their subscription base.

Personally, I'm not a big soccer fan but I love the excuse to go down the pub to watch a match but there are so many matches on now I couldn't tell you the last time I went out of my way to watch a match.

Sir Oxman · 16-07-2019 04:30PM

Yes, this will be circumvented in the time it takes to blink.

Price it right and decently and people will flock to open subs.

settopbox · 16-07-2019 04:33PM

galtee boy wrote: »

I didn't think you could legally do this, didn't some pub landlady lose the case in England when she tried to use a Greek sports subscription?

Even for a private home ?

PhilOssophy · 16-07-2019 04:35PM

Have been on a half-price Sky Sports offer for about 5 years now, ring up and cancel and they'll extend. They do it like this to make sure you feel you are getting a good deal.
If they can find mugs to pay full price, they are delihra. Win win.

Clareman · 16-07-2019 04:35PM

Sir Oxman wrote: »

Yes, this will be circumvented in the time it takes to blink.

Price it right and decently and people will flock to open subs.

The price will always be too high for some people, even free can be too expensive some times, ffs people complain about rugby matches being on TG4 cause they want English commentry.

The copyright holders are going to keep trying to block as many illegal sources as possible, people will always stay ahead of the game. For this issue they easiest way around it is to get a VPN but that's fine for techie people, for people who just install some kind of steaming app to their phone that'll probably be beyond them.

Suckit · 16-07-2019 04:37PM

It's all expected to drop in price anyway, as it collapses in on itself. FA cup going back to ITV in 2021.
Figures on paid to watch sports channels have dropped massively compared to hen they were on terrestrial TV.

Clareman · 16-07-2019 04:38PM

PhilOssophy wrote: »

Have been on a half-price Sky Sports offer for about 5 years now, ring up and cancel and they'll extend. They do it like this to make sure you feel you are getting a good deal.
If they can find mugs to pay full price, they are delihra. Win win.

Whatever about people paying full price for a sub, pubs subs (that's funnier than it should be) are extremely expensive, I think my own local pub is paying ~€700 a month for all the sports channels, busier pubs are paying a lot more.

neacy69 · 16-07-2019 04:44PM

If Sky were to offer reasonably priced packages then people wouldn't need an alternative...Spotify is a perfect example....Music piracy declined massively once there was a reasonably priced, easily accessible alternative available.

Clareman · 16-07-2019 04:47PM

I think there is a huge difference between tv/movies/music and sport, most people will want to enjoy tv/movies/music at their own convenience whereas for sport it will almost always have to be enjoyed, to paraphrase Rurpert Murdoch when he sold Fox "the only things people watch live anymore is sports and news"

clevtrev · 16-07-2019 05:11PM

neacy69 wrote: »

If Sky were to offer reasonably priced packages then people wouldn't need an alternative...Spotify is a perfect example....Music piracy declined massively once there was a reasonably priced, easily accessible alternative available.

the problem with Spotify though is they are losing money hand over fist and the artists are getting paid very little for their art. Spotify may eventually get to a point where they are making money but not anytime soon and Im sure sky and the premiership would not be interested in replicating that model!

galtee boy · 16-07-2019 05:18PM

settopbox wrote: »

Even for a private home ?

I don't know, someone with knowledge of EU laws regarding selling tv subscriptions outside the country where the broadcaster has a licence for, might answer? If it was easy, legal and cheaper, why haven't we all been subscribed to Canal + or Bein Sports before now ?

ISPs to block Illegal Streaming of UK Premiership games [READ POST #3 BEFORE POSTING]

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