House Issue

airportgirl83 · 02-07-2019 07:49PM

Also, you should buy as tenants in common instead of joint tenancy.

Tenancy in common means the property is owned in defined shares by two people. For example, 50/50, 75/25, 60/40, etc. Each person can leave their share of the property to whomever they wish. (They may leave their share to their partner for example, but they must make a will stating this fact). If no will is made, the share becomes part of the estate of the deceased partner and the other partner does not have any automatic right to the share. Instead, the family (or even a separated spouse or civil partner) of the deceased person can claim this share.

airportgirl83 · 02-07-2019 07:55PM

Finally, talk to your Solicitor to get your ducks in the row. I know many unmarried couples that own their properties as tenants in common. Some even have specific conditions included e.g. what happens if relationship breaks down etc.

LegacyUser · 03-07-2019 10:00AM

Adelaide Wailing Blackjack wrote: »

Does the garage have to be next to the house? Buy the house you want and let him buy the garage he wants with his own money elsewhere. A lock up somewhere would be cheaper and do the trick. It also means it is not coming out of your pocket.

+ 1 that's a good compormise OP. I wanted a studio space in my home but ended up getting that separately 10mins away. I assume you want to avoid buying land and doing a build as that's even more work then a refurb but maybe he'd be up for getting a garage nearby or getting a small plot of land nearby and building a space for himself.

suicide_circus · 03-07-2019 10:12AM

well i dont think its unusual for one partner to contribute more to a house purchase than the other. in my experience and group of friends having bought with wives and girlfriends the men have always contribute substantially more, not only that but the wives and girlfriends have always had the major say in which house was purchased

this wasnt an issue for any of my friends. reducing what should be a secure relationship to a balance sheet and who paid more for what doesn't bode well.

i certainly wouldn't purchase with this man and i would queation whether the relationship is really what you want.

sportsfan90 · 03-07-2019 10:33AM

suicide_circus wrote: »

well i dont think its unusual for one partner to contribute more to a house purchase than the other. in my experience and group of friends having bought with wives and girlfriends the men have always contribute substantially more, not only that but the wives and girlfriends have always had the major say in which house was purchased

this wasnt an issue for any of my friends. reducing what should be a secure relationship to a balance sheet and who paid more for what doesn't bode well.

i certainly wouldn't purchase with this man and i would queation whether the relationship is really what you want.

I'm finding it difficult to understand your post.

You're saying that when it's the man paying substantially more and the woman gets a major say then it's not an issue and who contributed what is irrelevant.

You then tell the OP that her partner isn't the type of person you'd purchase with. Is it because in this case it's the woman contributing more? If it isn't a problem to you when the man contributes substantially more why would it suddenly be an issue when it's the other way around?

Apologies if I've picked you up wrong but if that is what you were saying then that's a bizarre attitude to have.

argolis · 03-07-2019 05:02PM

I'd echo a previous poster's solution of finding a garage or workspace nearby that could be bought or rented. You could do some research and find a few possibilities to suggest to him, then you could suggest he use his savings to buy or rent that space and you use your savings to buy a newer place that suits you. He might be quite happy with that solution and you'd be the only person on the deeds then.

lulu1 · 03-07-2019 10:22PM

I would buy a house on my own and as someone said let him give you something towards the mortgage

If his passion is cars and he gets a garage you know where his money will be going then

qwerty13 · 03-07-2019 11:54PM

In my opinion, he is behaving unrealistically, and immaturely.

Of course ‘a garage’ in itself isn’t a big ask. However, new mid range homes don’t generally come with one. So straight away the ‘simple’ request for a garage cuts out a load of options re buying a home. So now you’re into rather serious compromises re a house, ie older house (probably needing renovations). For someone who is only contributing less than 10% of what the OP is, I think he has some cheek to be effectively ruling out new builds, which a house with no renovation costs / effort is expressly what the OP wants.

suicide_circus · 04-07-2019 12:54PM

sportsfan90 wrote: »

I'm finding it difficult to understand your post.

You're saying that when it's the man paying substantially more and the woman gets a major say then it's not an issue and who contributed what is irrelevant.

You then tell the OP that her partner isn't the type of person you'd purchase with. Is it because in this case it's the woman contributing more? If it isn't a problem to you when the man contributes substantially more why would it suddenly be an issue when it's the other way around?

Apologies if I've picked you up wrong but if that is what you were saying then that's a bizarre attitude to have.

what i'm saying is that if she is just looking at the contributions of each and is unhappy with her paying the majority then the relationship is doomed anyway, thats the kind of resentment that will fester and be brought up in fights for years to come, she needs a partner with more cash essentially. From my own experience (which just happens to be all men contributing the lions share) this has never been an issue.

HamSarris · 04-07-2019 08:43PM

The general consensus seems to be of an unequal relationship where the OP is of higher value than her partner. Hence all the suggestions that the OP needs to legally protect her assets from her partner and descriptions of the partner as unreasonable, selfish and some sort of feckless rogue who pissed all his money away at the weekend.

Another perspective to take is that if the relationship broke up, the OP could potentially have more to lose than the partner. The OP seems far more motivated to settle down and the break-up of a relationship could delay buying a house for years, or be forced to buy a less desirable house on a single income.

In comparison, the partner is under no rush and as a 30-something professional could probably find another women who’s more accommodating of his interests. People are focusing on the deposit and forgetting the massive future commitment of buying a house, this could be somewhere he spends the rest of his life and contributes up to 200k. I’d want some say in the house I’m potentially living in for the rest of my life; if I had a partner that completely dismissed my preferences I’ll tell them to search for another man to pay the mortgage.

All things being equal the OP is in a stronger position but things are rarely equal in a relationship. High earning men regularly marry women who are ‘financial losers’ because the women’s physical attractiveness compensates for their financial drain. Imagine if the OP was a man on here dismissing his wife’s preference to live in the countryside because he wanted a house closer to work. You wouldn’t have half as many comments on here about how the wife is a loser and had too many nights out.

ted1 · 04-07-2019 08:54PM

amcalester wrote: »

Sounds like your boyfriend actually has 2 passions.

Cars and spending €105K of your money.

If they were married would it be an issue. My wife contributed financially.

LegacyUser · 04-07-2019 10:57PM

HamSarris wrote: »

The general consensus seems to be of an unequal relationship where the OP is of higher value than her partner. Hence all the suggestions that the OP needs to legally protect her assets from her partner and descriptions of the partner as unreasonable, selfish and some sort of feckless rogue who pissed all his money away at the weekend.

Another perspective to take is that if the relationship broke up, the OP could potentially have more to lose than the partner. The OP seems far more motivated to settle down and the break-up of a relationship could delay buying a house for years, or be forced to buy a less desirable house on a single income.

In comparison, the partner is under no rush and as a 30-something professional could probably find another women who’s more accommodating of his interests. People are focusing on the deposit and forgetting the massive future commitment of buying a house, this could be somewhere he spends the rest of his life and contributes up to 200k. I’d want some say in the house I’m potentially living in for the rest of my life; if I had a partner that completely dismissed my preferences I’ll tell them to search for another man to pay the mortgage.

All things being equal the OP is in a stronger position but things are rarely equal in a relationship. High earning men regularly marry women who are ‘financial losers’ because the women’s physical attractiveness compensates for their financial drain. Imagine if the OP was a man on here dismissing his wife’s preference to live in the countryside because he wanted a house closer to work. You wouldn’t have half as many comments on here about how the wife is a loser and had too many nights out.

I have to agree with your post, most girls that I know are 'financial losers'. Some are on very high salaries but blow it all on poor quality dresses, shoes, drinking etc. every week. I do buy nice things for myself as well but I always carefully consider all my purchases.

Some people suggested that I did not enjoy my 20s. I never went traveling around the world but I've visited many many places in Europe and had fun. Travel is definitely something I like spending my money on.

People often jump into conclusions - just because I said that my BF started saving properly only 2 years ago - they assume he's been living some sort of a crazy, expensive lifestyle.

Guess what, we both do not drink, do not go out clubbing (dinner out occasionally), do not buy designer items and he does not spend much on car stuff every month. He has started saving regularly because now he has a goal - goal of getting a house. It was difficult for him (and his siblings actually) to understand that saving is a way of living for many (me for example). You save even if you do not have a clear goal. I don't think it's something they were taught when they were growing up, they are definitely lacking some sort of 'financial education' let's put it that way but now he is getting his head around money.

I would like him to have a shed, but I do not think it's wise investing into a 2nd hand house with a garage - those often require require loads of money and time invested. Also, by focusing so much on a garage we are missing out on some really nice properties and continue paying rent. I want to spend next 5-10 years traveling as much as possible, not renovating another property. Also, realistically when is he going to be able to enjoy that shed while working full time? He's renting a shed at the moment and he's rarely there!

Realistically, in terms of money, he will never be able to match my savings so what is it that you propose?

suicide_circus · 05-07-2019 06:39AM

Peonie83 wrote: »

I have to agree with your post, most girls that I know are 'financial losers'. Some are on very high salaries but blow it all on poor quality dresses, shoes, drinking etc. every week. I do buy nice things for myself as well but I always carefully consider all my purchases.

Some people suggested that I did not enjoy my 20s. I never went traveling around the world but I've visited many many places in Europe and had fun. Travel is definitely something I like spending my money on.

People often jump into conclusions - just because I said that my BF started saving properly only 2 years ago - they assume he's been living some sort of a crazy, expensive lifestyle.

Guess what, we both do not drink, do not go out clubbing (dinner out occasionally), do not buy designer items and he does not spend much on car stuff every month. He has started saving regularly because now he has a goal - goal of getting a house. It was difficult for him (and his siblings actually) to understand that saving is a way of living for many (me for example). You save even if you do not have a clear goal. I don't think it's something they were taught when they were growing up, they are definitely lacking some sort of 'financial education' let's put it that way but now he is getting his head around money.

I would like him to have a shed, but I do not think it's wise investing into a 2nd hand house with a garage - those often require require loads of money and time invested. Also, by focusing so much on a garage we are missing out on some really nice properties and continue paying rent. I want to spend next 5-10 years traveling as much as possible, not renovating another property. Also, realistically when is he going to be able to enjoy that shed while working full time? He's renting a shed at the moment and he's rarely there!

Realistically, in terms of money, he will never be able to match my savings so what is it that you propose?

Firstly, dont be too hard on yourself. It is said that in general as a woman's socio-economic status increases , so her pool of suitable men decreases where as for men its the opposite. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypergamy
This might be evolutionary or it might be influenced by social factors, either way its a fairly recognisable trend through time and cultures.

On the other hand as you say yourself, its not like your boyfriend is a total lush throwing his money away on trinkets and the horses. He has some degree of financial prudence. But the likelihood s you will always be in charge of the finances if you stay with him. Are you happy with that? If so, i would advise you to win the type of house argument on practical and well thought out logical grounds rather than the "I'm paying more so what i say goes" argument. Make a list (men respond to lists) of reasons a new build is so much better.

LegacyUser · 05-07-2019 10:18AM

Peonie83 wrote: »

He has started saving regularly because now he has a goal - goal of getting a house. It was difficult for him (and his siblings actually) to understand that saving is a way of living for many (me for example). You save even if you do not have a clear goal. I don't think it's something they were taught when they were growing up, they are definitely lacking some sort of 'financial education' let's put it that way but now he is getting his head around money.

There's your answer why he wants the shed and why he keeps looking at properties at the top end of your budget - he's not got a financial education and now that it is something he is focusing on he's gone a bit OTT. This isn't a gender thing like many are trying to make out but simply an experience thing. I've seen this happen with family and friends of all ages and genders - they get a bigger salary or save a chunk of money and spend it on the top end of the market without thinking. If they've saved money for something but theres a cheaper option they still tend to buy the more expensive option as thats what the saved the money for.

Peonie83 wrote: »

Realistically, in terms of money, he will never be able to match my savings so what is it that you propose?

You sit down as adults and partners and discuss what you really want from a property. What is the end goal? You've not mentioned kids in any posting so I assume those are not on the cards for you so what is? Are you living together now? When is your lease up? If you want to have money to travel then why are you putting it into the pot for the house? Just because you have X saved doesn't mean you have to put all of it in. Yes you'll prob still put more in than your partner but if you say O we've got X amount of money then they're going to look at what they can get for X amount. Whats the minimum you need to put in to get a house that ticks most of the boxes for both of you?

What are the must haves vs nice to haves. If he already rents a shed but doesn't go then discuss this. Does he not go due to work or distance? how far is it from where you live now? would looking at properties near it make it easier to go to it more often or renting a similar shed near new property be acceptable to having a shed directly on the property.

We aren't in your relationship OP, we can offer advice etc but you need to sit down and just be frank about this, unless you stumble upon a property that ticks every box you're both going to have to compromise.

Ursus Horribilis · 05-07-2019 11:21AM

It's interesting that you mention him renting a shed at the moment and that he barely uses it. Perhaps he's like someone who buys a guitar, meaning to learn how to play but never does. Yet they think that if they went and splashed out on a top of the range model, they'l be playing like a virtuoso in no time. Has he explained why he rarely visits it? Past behaviour is often a predictor of future actions.

Have you sat down with him and gone through the financial implications of what would happen if you overstretch yourselves or buy a do-er upper? (Personally, I would rule out buying in less good areas from the get to). Have you discussed how you'd pay for it if one of you lost your job? Or if we have another recession and you suffer pay cuts. What if you have a baby (planned or unplanned) and you have to pay for childcare? You've also got the advantage of already having owned a house and know about all those extra costs that sneak up on you. You also have gained the insight of knowing what it is you want in your next house. Most people end up having to compromise when they buy a house and this is no different.

B0jangles · 05-07-2019 01:00PM

^^^ That's a very common thing alright - buying in the expectation that having a nicer whatever will somehow make you better at particular thing. I used to keep buying nice pens and fancy notebooks in the hope that that would make me better at keeping a diary. (Yeah, that didn't work.)

I know someone who keeps building sheds/garages/workspaces with the intention of doing all sorts of crafts in them - they are up to... 2 garages, 2 workshops and a shed but they've mostly stood idle once built/converted.

Renting a separate garage space in the area makes so much more sense than demanding that every house you view already have one attached.

05-07-2019 01:07PM

Peonie83 wrote: »

Also, realistically when is he going to be able to enjoy that shed while working full time? He's renting a shed at the moment and he's rarely there!

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

It's interesting that you mention him renting a shed at the moment and that he barely uses it. Perhaps he's like someone who buys a guitar, meaning to learn how to play but never does. Yet they think that if they went and splashed out on a top of the range model, they'l be playing like a virtuoso in no time. Has he explained why he rarely visits it? Past behaviour is often a predictor of future actions.

Yup, this shed is starting to sound more like an aspirational purchase than a necessity.

Also, I can understand why he'd prefer a garage if cars are his thing, but in the meantime could he not just settle for a shed in the back garden to tinker away at things and keep the rented garage to store the car he's working on.

Leave aside the legalities of ownership/possible break-up. These are, of course, important to be clear on but moot if you can't even find a house you both like.

Tell him why you don't want to buy an old(er) house, explain exactly what YOU want to buy and let him go find it.

ILoveYourVibes · 06-07-2019 01:40AM

Build the garage?

Ursus Horribilis · 06-07-2019 04:04PM

Where exactly do you propose they build this garage? Most new builds don't have the space around them to build such a thing.

ILoveYourVibes · 06-07-2019 10:15PM

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

Where exactly do you propose they build this garage? Most new builds don't have the space around them to build such a thing.

It depends on where you buy.

But they would have to make sure they have land etc obviously.

06-07-2019 10:45PM

Isn't it time he grew out of the fascination with cars if he is talking about buying a house with a partner?

ILoveYourVibes · 07-07-2019 08:14AM

salonfire wrote: »

Isn't it time he grew out of the fascination with cars if he is talking about buying a house with a partner?

Well if he can't afford them or that type of house etc yes I see your point.

seannash · 07-07-2019 09:45AM

I think you've probably had the talk of what and why you want a new build so I imagine revisiting it isn't going to help.

Your compromise could be to give him areas where you are happy to live and tell him that if it's a fixer upper the budget gets reduced by 25% to allow a contractor to make it pristine.
He's not wrong to be looking at fixer uppers, in fact it's quite a common bit of house buying advice (worst house in the nicest street)

Ultimately I think the rented garage will be the runner for your situation as not only would it solve your issue it would also give your new neighbours some peace (in laws live beside a hobby mechanic and he has cars and parts lying all over the place and is constantly revving and making noise at the weekend which gets really old when they are trying to enjoy a bit of sun in their garden)

In terms of the financial split I'm in a similar boat. I own a house outright and currently doing it up. Mortgage to renovate it is in my name but I'm well aware that if a split was to happen I would be giving up half. That's just the risk you take but I choose to look on the positives and not think about splitting with my partner. Very hard to enter a relationship on equal terms.

Ursus Horribilis · 07-07-2019 10:15AM

salonfire wrote: »

Isn't it time he grew out of the fascination with cars if he is talking about buying a house with a partner?

Eh, what? The man is entitled to be interested in whatever he wants. It's the unwillingness to compromise that is the problem. Would you be saying the same thing if he liked doing woodwork or pottery and wanted a workshop?

The point seannash above me makes about the neighbours is something else to consider. If you find yourself living near people who do more than grumble to themselves when the noise starts, you're in for a lot of hardship. And in a built-up area, you'll be p*ssing people off if he starts work on cars too early in the morning or goes on late into the night. Really, I think renting a garage near your house is the best solution.

The_Honeybadger · 07-07-2019 10:38AM

There was a thread on fixer uppers in the accommodation & property forum not long ago and the consensus was that they almost never make financial sense because the vendors don’t reduce the price enough to cover the renovations needed, and especially not in Dublin in 2019. That is before you even get in to the cost of alternative accommodation while it’s being done up and the hassle of arranging contractors who are all crazy busy etc, and the fact that they never ever stay on budget.

I wouldn’t touch a fixer upper right now personally unless I had exhausted all other options.

seannash · 07-07-2019 11:17AM

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

There was a thread on fixer uppers in the accommodation & property forum not long ago and the consensus was that they almost never make financial sense because the vendors don’t reduce the price enough to cover the renovations needed, and especially not in Dublin in 2019. That is before you even get in to the cost of alternative accommodation while it’s being done up and the hassle of arranging contractors who are all crazy busy etc, and the fact that they never ever stay on budget.

I wouldn’t touch a fixer upper right now personally unless I had exhausted all other options.

It's definitely tough right now but I always wonder who moves into a house and says this is exactly how I want it to be. A lot of people want to put their own stamp on properties and that can involved as little as painting a few walls to redoing the kitchen and bathrooms.
I'm in the middle of a renovation and whilst it's not in Dublin it's in one of the commuter towns. It is doable although a little slower than I'd like.
What it does mean is that I can customise it exactly how I want (obviously)

Of this is a house you're going to keep for 10 plus years recouping your money by making it how you want it might not be of huge concern. (I know nobody wants to pose money but prices are sky high now so it's hard to predict if you'll ever get what you paid for anything in the future)
I guess it depends on what approach you want to take. I can see huge value in both but personally a fixer upper appeals to me.

OP besides the fixer uppers having the garage is there anything else that appeals to your partner about them? Bigger, more features, room to expand etc etc. Or is it simply the garage?
I'd never consider a new build but that's just me.

The_Honeybadger · 07-07-2019 11:31AM

seannash wrote: »

It's definitely tough right now but I always wonder who moves into a house and says this is exactly how I want it to be. A lot of people want to put their own stamp on properties and that can involved as little as painting a few walls to redoing the kitchen and bathrooms.
I'm in the middle of a renovation and whilst it's not in Dublin it's in one of the commuter towns. It is doable although a little slower than I'd like.
What it does mean is that I can customise it exactly how I want (obviously)

Of this is a house you're going to keep for 10 plus years recouping your money by making it how you want it might not be of huge concern. (I know nobody wants to pose money but prices are sky high now so it's hard to predict if you'll ever get what you paid for anything in the future)
I guess it depends on what approach you want to take. I can see huge value in both but personally a fixer upper appeals to me.

OP besides the fixer uppers having the garage is there anything else that appeals to your partner about them? Bigger, more features, room to expand etc etc. Or is it simply the garage?
I'd never consider a new build but that's just me.

Sorry I wasn’t referring to a property that just needs some decorating.

I’m talking about properties that need heavy maintenance works / renovations like re-wiring, plumbing, dry lining or insulation etc. Things you need to move out for. Those houses rarely make sense financially over a new house.

We bought a ten year old house few years ago and have put down new floors and carpets everywhere, painted all the rooms etc. This is par for the course with any second hand house.

seannash · 07-07-2019 11:46AM

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

Sorry I wasn’t referring to a property that just needs some decorating.

I’m talking about properties that need heavy maintenance works / renovations like re-wiring, plumbing, dry lining or insulation etc. Things you need to move out for. Those houses rarely make sense financially over a new house.

We bought a ten year old house few years ago and have put down new floors and carpets everywhere, painted all the rooms etc. This is par for the course with any second hand house.

Yeah it probably does make financial sense to go for a new build although I've read an article recently that is saying they do not allow any room for growth of a family as you can't extend as all available space is used up. Perhaps that's one advantage of older homes, they allow that possibility as well as having larger footprints in general.
My earlier suggestion was to have a reduced budget for any fixer upper property and do the work before you move in but I get the sense the OP is eager to get moved.

I won't list some other advantages of old houses because that's not what the OP is asking about.

Renting a garage is the best compromise I think

ILoveYourVibes · 07-07-2019 12:50PM

seannash wrote: »

Yeah it probably does make financial sense to go for a new build although I've read an article recently that is saying they do not allow any room for growth of a family as you can't extend as all available space is used up. Perhaps that's one advantage of older homes, they allow that possibility as well as having larger footprints in general.
My earlier suggestion was to have a reduced budget for any fixer upper property and do the work before you move in but I get the sense the OP is eager to get moved.

I won't list some other advantages of old houses because that's not what the OP is asking about.

Renting a garage is the best compromise I think

It depends on how much land you buy and the size of the site.

Renting a garage will more expensive long term.

But i don't know your life or needs exactly etc only you do.

woodchuck · 07-07-2019 12:53PM

Mod note:

This is a reminder to keep things on topic please. Debating the merits of new builds vs old houses is of no use to the OP, as she already seems to be well informed and knows what she wants in that regard. Please let's keep it to the issues at hand and only post if you have advice for the OPs specific situation.

House Issue

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