Bus Eireann N3/M3 Corridor Route & Timetable Changes - Phase 3

Slippin Jimmy · 09-11-2017 3:13pm

What's the NX like in the morning from the square? Is it anywhere near full? I'll be getting it between 07.20-08.00 as far as Blanchardstown.

magentis · 09-11-2017 8:32pm

Slippin Jimmy wrote: »

What's the NX like in the morning from the square? Is it anywhere near full? I'll be getting it between 07.20-08.00 as far as Blanchardstown.

Nowhere near full and usually 85 seat LD's on it,25-35 normally.

tom23 · 04-04-2019 5:30pm

So a year or more using this service what's people's thoughts on it?

I think it would be quicker flying to London. A service that that uses a small part if a motorway and has effectively replaced the local bus town bus in Johnstown is not in anyway an 'express' bus service.

I wish there was a train service to Navan but am now throing in the towel and getting a car and either driving to dun Boyne to get the train or driving all the way. We are 45k from Dublin and obe does not need to spend close to two hours on a bus trying to get to work.

kccamper · 04-04-2019 7:35pm

Very frustrating indeed and MCC announced €454 million of planned expenditure yesterday and no sign of any earmarked for a rail line to Dublin.

tom23 · 05-04-2019 6:24am

kccamper wrote: »

Very frustrating indeed and MCC announced €454 million of planned expenditure yesterday and no sign of any earmarked for a rail line to Dublin.

It is and what do we do? Lobby? Not worth a damn. Meath it seems is an overflow carpark for commuters and for houses. I think a huge portion of blame should be shouldered by meath county council and definitely NTA. Meath a huge county, no bus station of any kind. The main city centre bus stop Beresford place has one bus shelter for about 8 people. I counted at least 70 yesterday trying to get on ashbourne and Navan buses. Add to that a Paddy wagon coach pulling in to let off all of its tourists and get their bags. Crazy stuff. It seems the NX service was designed for the good folk of Johnstown with no consideration for anyone else.

sofireland · 06-04-2019 2:12pm

tom23 wrote: »

So a year or more using this service what's people's thoughts on it?

I think it would be quicker flying to London. A service that that uses a small part if a motorway and has effectively replaced the local bus town bus in Johnstown is not in anyway an 'express' bus service.

I wish there was a train service to Navan but am now throing in the towel and getting a car and either driving to dun Boyne to get the train or driving all the way. We are 45k from Dublin and obe does not need to spend close to two hours on a bus trying to get to work.

tom23 wrote: »

It is and what do we do? Lobby? Not worth a damn. Meath it seems is an overflow carpark for commuters and for houses. I think a huge portion of blame should be shouldered by meath county council and definitely NTA. Meath a huge county, no bus station of any kind. The main city centre bus stop Beresford place has one bus shelter for about 8 people. I counted at least 70 yesterday trying to get on ashbourne and Navan buses. Add to that a Paddy wagon coach pulling in to let off all of its tourists and get their bags. Crazy stuff. It seems the NX service was designed for the good folk of Johnstown with no consideration for anyone else.

Echos my thoughts on this whole debacle.
I moved to the train from M3 parkway this week, i'm in the office half an hour earlier. Leaving the house five minutes earlier.

The length of time to get through the city centre in the evening is criminal.

I believe the NTA is more culpable for the lack of rail line, once it got kicked of the capital programme by government, the NTA had all the excuses they needed to totally kibosh the rail extension to Navan, and saddle us with a laughable "express" service to Dublin.

piplip87 · 06-04-2019 2:40pm

tom23 wrote: »

So a year or more using this service what's people's thoughts on it?

I think it would be quicker flying to London. A service that that uses a small part if a motorway and has effectively replaced the local bus town bus in Johnstown is not in anyway an 'express' bus service.

I wish there was a train service to Navan but am now throing in the towel and getting a car and either driving to dun Boyne to get the train or driving all the way. We are 45k from Dublin and obe does not need to spend close to two hours on a bus trying to get to work.

I'm using the 109x service. It's a shambles. The NX route should take all people to Navan. The 109x should not go near Navan especially when there is plenty of busses between Navan and Kells to provide connections.

Thankfully the increased frequency of the 30/30x is a blessing never really takes more than 80 minutes.

There 5:15 service operated by Tully's direct to Kells via the port tunnel could do with a rethink though. The 109x that leaves at the same time could stop in Kells and the Tully's bus serve Virginia and Cavan.

All 109x/109/NX should stop at the M3 Parkway it would knock serious time off commuters at peak times if it was set up correctly. Especially in the evening where it's an hour to Blanchardstown.

thomasj · 06-04-2019 2:41pm

I think your best chance is to lobby the NTA to provide a bus service between Navan and M3 parkway and then you can use the usage numbers from that bus service to push your case for a railway service .

Irish Steve · 06-04-2019 6:09pm

The whole M3/N3/N2 corridor is a mess, and not getting better, between absurd routing, appalling on time performance, and a structure that defies imagination, the only reason for using it for most people is the unfortunate reality that there is no real alternative.

Given the proximity of the M3 parkway station to the motorway, I cannot understand why it is not being used much more positively as a staging and interchange point for the services in the area, and for other feeder services to areas on the south side of Dublin. There is no valid reason for not having feeder services into M3 from places like Blanchardstown Hospital, Blanchardstown Shopping centre, the industrial estates around that area, and maybe even places like Intel at Leixlip, as well as Dublln Bus/Go Ahead routes serving locations inside the M50 ring.

I suspect if it was done properly, regular feeders round the M50 to places like Tallaght, Sandyford, Citywest and Parkwest would also attract additional customers, and reduce the number of vehicles commuting. Given the time delays that are incurred, there can be no valid reason for forcing people to go into central Dublin if they actually want to get to other parts of the city, there are many areas of the city that have a massive work population, but there are nowhere near the centre of the city.

All of the services from M3 should then run from there non stop to the city via Port Tunnel, and realistically, there is a case to be made that a significant number of buses that currently serve Central Dublin should turn round at M3, with a high frequency service to central Dublin being provided as a separate option from M3, as that will also help with time keeping.

tom23 · 09-04-2019 10:21am

Great replies folks. I am actually thinking off starting up a brand new thread for the North East routes especially for Navan, Kells and Cavan with the view of collating commuters opinions and ideas to sending to the NTA.

This revamp service has been in existence for 18 months and there is not a week that goes by where I wish we had the old bone shaker express that left Market Square at 07:05 and 07:20. That was in all sense and purposes an express.

But for me the fact there is no bus shuttle service to the M3 parkway is damming.

What do other posters think?

tara83 · 09-04-2019 10:47am

tom23 wrote: »

Great replies folks. I am actually thinking off starting up a brand new thread for the North East routes especially for Navan, Kells and Cavan with the view of collating commuters opinions and ideas to sending to the NTA.

This revamp service has been in existence for 18 months and there is not a week that goes by where I wish we had the old bone shaker express that left Market Square at 07:05 and 07:20. That was in all sense and purposes an express.

But for me the fact there is no bus shuttle service to the M3 parkway is damming.

What do other posters think?

Agree although the M3 to Docklands is already beyond capacity at peak times. Something major needs to be done to improve commuting from Meath. It's so frustrating and I can only see it going 1 way for the foreseeable. It needs to be on everyone's agenda when speaking with local CC campaigning over the next few weeks

tom23 · 09-04-2019 11:36am

tara83 wrote: »

Agree although the M3 to Docklands is already beyond capacity at peak times. Something major needs to be done to improve commuting from Meath. It's so frustrating and I can only see it going 1 way for the foreseeable. It needs to be on everyone's agenda when speaking with local CC campaigning over the next few weeks

Absolutely agree. I'll be speaking with all councillors that call on my door. I want a proper service in place for my children when they do go to college. Only way change is going to happen is we make it.

horseburger · 10-04-2019 2:29am

piplip87 wrote: »

I'm using the 109x service. It's a shambles. The NX route should take all people to Navan. The 109x should not go near Navan especially when there is plenty of busses between Navan and Kells to provide connections.

Thankfully the increased frequency of the 30/30x is a blessing never really takes more than 80 minutes.

There 5:15 service operated by Tully's direct to Kells via the port tunnel could do with a rethink though. The 109x that leaves at the same time could stop in Kells and the Tully's bus serve Virginia and Cavan.

All 109x/109/NX should stop at the M3 Parkway it would knock serious time off commuters at peak times if it was set up correctly. Especially in the evening where it's an hour to Blanchardstown.

If the 109X from Cavan, did not serve Navan at all, there would be no services from Cavan to Navan, that would not involve having to change buses.

I think the problem, for anyone in Cavan going to Navan, might be the wait time in Kells, because the 109, 109A and 109X are hourly services, as opposed to the NX between Navan and Dublin, which is far more frequent.

It might be ok, if there were never any traffic delays, because in theory, the 109X leaving Cavan at 45 minutes past the hour, should be in Kells Town Hall at exactly the same time that the 109A is due to leave Kells Town Hall, each hour at 15 minutes to the hour. The 109X is due in Kells Town Hall at 45 minutes past the hour - 30 minutes before the 109 is due to leave Kells Town Hall, at 15 minutes past the hour.

If people in Cavan wanted to go to Navan by bus, if they had to take the 109X from Cavan to Kells Town Hall, and then wait in Kells to connect with the hourly 109 or 109A services, they might be inclined to drive instead, due to the possibility of traffic delays and missing the 109A connection, and the possibility of having to wait up to a half an hour and longer, in Kells Town Hall for the next hourly 109 or 109A services from Kells Town Hall to Navan.

If the Cavan bus that is due in Kells Town Hall at 45 minutes past the hour, was late, and the 109A that leaves Kells Town Hall at 15 minutes to the hour had already left, then anyone from Cavan for Navan, would have to wait in Kells for the 109 at 15 minutes past the hour.

Irish Steve · 10-04-2019 8:34am

Don't rely on the 109A, there are very few days when it's on time, and in recent weeks, at Ashbourne, at certain times it is up to 50 yes 50 minutes late on the Kells to Airport run, and also late in the opposite direction, if it even shows up, and that's not just at peak periods, the same issues can and do happen at 0430 in the morning.

What's even more annoying and frustrating is that there seems to be absolutely no interest or concern from any of the BE management in resolving the problems, they seem to see nothing wrong with no shows or massive late running.

I suspect that the only thing that will get their attention is when the contract is up for renewal, hopefully a more responsive company will get it next time round, and will deliver a service that's more reliable. Unfortunately, it's a waste of time complaining to TFI or NTA, they are just another semi state that is toothless when it comes to actually making things work the way they are supposed to.

tom23 · 24-04-2019 7:07am

Irish Steve wrote: »

Don't rely on the 109A, there are very few days when it's on time, and in recent weeks, at Ashbourne, at certain times it is up to 50 yes 50 minutes late on the Kells to Airport run, and also late in the opposite direction, if it even shows up, and that's not just at peak periods, the same issues can and do happen at 0430 in the morning.

What's even more annoying and frustrating is that there seems to be absolutely no interest or concern from any of the BE management in resolving the problems, they seem to see nothing wrong with no shows or massive late running.

I suspect that the only thing that will get their attention is when the contract is up for renewal, hopefully a more responsive company will get it next time round, and will deliver a service that's more reliable. Unfortunately, it's a waste of time complaining to TFI or NTA, they are just another semi state that is toothless when it comes to actually making things work the way they are supposed to.

Wow 25 minutes to get through Navan and the suburb of Johnstown on to the m3. A new record for the jonstown nx express. It's effectively a local service in the am for Jonstown. It seems if you live in any other part of Navan you are at a serious disadvantage trim road, proudstown or Boyne road)

tom23 · 26-04-2019 4:44pm

So the other aspect that is killing this NX service is the trip into the Blanchardstown center. Stuck on the slip road into it because of traffic. I understand why they forced a relocation of a stop but was this really the best solution? Already excess time on to a journey that is taking for to long.

thomasj · 26-04-2019 5:00pm

The sliproads into and out the centre should be 100% bus lane, get private traffic to come in from the snugborough end

piplip87 · 27-04-2019 5:54am

horseburger wrote: »

If the 109X from Cavan, did not serve Navan at all, there would be no services from Cavan to Navan, that would not involve having to change buses.

I think the problem, for anyone in Cavan going to Navan, might be the wait time in Kells, because the 109, 109A and 109X are hourly services, as opposed to the NX between Navan and Dublin, which is far more frequent.

It might be ok, if there were never any traffic delays, because in theory, the 109X leaving Cavan at 45 minutes past the hour, should be in Kells Town Hall at exactly the same time that the 109A is due to leave Kells Town Hall, each hour at 15 minutes to the hour. The 109X is due in Kells Town Hall at 45 minutes past the hour - 30 minutes before the 109 is due to leave Kells Town Hall, at 15 minutes past the hour.

If people in Cavan wanted to go to Navan by bus, if they had to take the 109X from Cavan to Kells Town Hall,

Who in the name of jaysus wants to go from Cavan to Navan at 4:45 in the morning ? That is my biggest issue with going through Navan. This is after sitting in Carnoross for maybe 10 minutes, sitting in Kells for maybe 10 minutes because whatever genius came up with the timetable doesn't get the bus or realise that depending on time of day you can do Virginia to Kells in 15 minutes.

The 30/30X Expressway bus has started accepting the Taxsaver ticket, it's an absolute game changer at this time of the morning but saying that if BE showed on the timetable that it takes 20 minutes to Kells from Virginia on weekends and early mornings it would possibly beat the 30.

5:05 30x will get me in for 6:25 - 6:30

5:15 109x will get me in at 6:45-7:00, On a Saturday morning this will be 6:35 -6:45.

Without the pissing about waiting at stops on the way to Kells it could be 6:20.

tom23 · 02-05-2019 5:30pm

Does anybody use the 109 that goes along the old route? Think one leaves bus Eireann at 4:15. Would be interested to see what time it takes to get from Dublin to Navan. Am I right in saying it avoids Johnstown? To me that is one of the biggest reasons the NX is crap.

Lord Glentoran · 05-05-2019 7:44pm

tom23 wrote: »

Does anybody use the 109 that goes along the old route? Think one leaves bus Eireann at 4:15. Would be interested to see what time it takes to get from Dublin to Navan. Am I right in saying it avoids Johnstown? To me that is one of the biggest reasons the NX is crap.

And to think we get a raft of posts whenever the subject is raised that extending the railway from M3 Parkway to Navan is utterly unnecessary, because the bus service is now so exemplary.

There aren't enough rolleyes emojis in the world to note this.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Geog1234 · 06-05-2019 8:27pm

First-thing and late-evening 109X services in the last week have been going via Ballyjamesduff due to roadworks on the N3 (leaving/rejoining the N3 at New Inns).

Friday evening Dublin-Cavan left Busáras a few minutes behind schedule and reached Cavan a few minutes early - even with the Ballyjamesduff diversion there is slack in the schedule.

horseburger · 07-05-2019 12:50am

piplip87 wrote: »

Who in the name of jaysus wants to go from Cavan to Navan at 4:45 in the morning ? That is my biggest issue with going through Navan. This is after sitting in Carnoross for maybe 10 minutes, sitting in Kells for maybe 10 minutes because whatever genius came up with the timetable doesn't get the bus or realise that depending on time of day you can do Virginia to Kells in 15 minutes.

The 30/30X Expressway bus has started accepting the Taxsaver ticket, it's an absolute game changer at this time of the morning but saying that if BE showed on the timetable that it takes 20 minutes to Kells from Virginia on weekends and early mornings it would possibly beat the 30.

5:05 30x will get me in for 6:25 - 6:30

5:15 109x will get me in at 6:45-7:00, On a Saturday morning this will be 6:35 -6:45.

Without the pissing about waiting at stops on the way to Kells it could be 6:20.

Apparently not you, but that doesn't mean that no one else does.

Is it just the 4.45am bus from Cavan, that you want to avoid Navan? Are you ok with the other 109X services, that are scheduled to serve Navan?

I'm sure passengers at Cavan Town, going to Dublin, would be happy if they could take the 109X and avoid Virginia, Carnaross and Kells, as well as Navan, if it was possible.

But perhaps they realise, that people live in the towns and villages that are located in between Cavan and Navan, and they understand, that for that reason, the Cavan bus serves the locations in between, to accommodate passengers going to and from these locations and Dublin, as well as to and from Cavan and Virginia, Cavan and Kells, Cavan and Carnaross, Cavan and Navan, Virginia and Carnaross, Virginia and Kells, Virginia and Navan, Carnaross and Navan, and Carnaross and Kells.

What service are you proposing that Bus Éireann operate, between Cavan and Navan and the locations in between Virginia and Navan, if you are unhappy with the 109X covering the locations in between Virginia and Navan?

tom23 · 09-05-2019 12:23pm

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

And to think we get a raft of posts whenever the subject is raised that extending the railway from M3 Parkway to Navan is utterly unnecessary, because the bus service is now so exemplary.

There aren't enough rolleyes emojis in the world to note this.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Well I can tell you it is necessary and the bus service is not exemplary (unless you are referring to another user here who I have on an ignore list).

Anyway I am so desperate now to avoid going through Johnstown to reach its suburb of Navan Town that I would try anything to avoid it. I was thinking that the old 109 might work, any time that was gained on the M50 is lost going through Johnstown. I'll gladly suffer the old Cabra road, Dunshaughlin and the N3.

horseburger · 12-05-2019 2:12pm

tom23 wrote: »

Well I can tell you it is necessary and the bus service is not exemplary (unless you are referring to another user here who I have on an ignore list).

Anyway I am so desperate now to avoid going through Johnstown to reach its suburb of Navan Town that I would try anything to avoid it. I was thinking that the old 109 might work, any time that was gained on the M50 is lost going through Johnstown. I'll gladly suffer the old Cabra road, Dunshaughlin and the N3.

People in Kells who take the 109 to and from Dublin daily, would be delighted if the 109 avoided Navan.

109 users from Kells, going to and from Dublin, consider having to stop in Navan, every bit as much a pain in the ass, as you consider Johnstown on the NX.

If you lived in Kells and used the 109 for Dublin every day, I'm sure you'd be more than happy if the 109 never served Navan.

But because you are only going as far as Navan, you don't mind Kells passengers on the 109 from Dublin, having to "suffer" Navan, as well as the other places on the 109 route, that you mentioned, that you'd ideally avoid.

piplip87 · 20-05-2019 1:58pm

horseburger wrote: »

Apparently not you, but that doesn't mean that no one else does.

Is it just the 4.45am bus from Cavan, that you want to avoid Navan? Are you ok with the other 109X services, that are scheduled to serve Navan?

I'm sure passengers at Cavan Town, going to Dublin, would be happy if they could take the 109X and avoid Virginia, Carnaross and Kells, as well as Navan, if it was possible.

But perhaps they realise, that people live in the towns and villages that are located in between Cavan and Navan, and they understand, that for that reason, the Cavan bus serves the locations in between, to accommodate passengers going to and from these locations and Dublin, as well as to and from Cavan and Virginia, Cavan and Kells, Cavan and Carnaross, Cavan and Navan, Virginia and Carnaross, Virginia and Kells, Virginia and Navan, Carnaross and Navan, and Carnaross and Kells.

What service are you proposing that Bus Éireann operate, between Cavan and Navan and the locations in between Virginia and Navan, if you are unhappy with the 109X covering the locations in between Virginia and Navan?

The service I would propose is:

109x Cavan, Virginia, Kells, Dublin. - Hourly as it is. With an adjusted timetable that will stop busses having to stay at a stop for 15 minutes because there early.

Example : Cavan 4:45 Virginia 5;10 Kells 5:25. If it's a few minutes late then so be it.

There is no need for an express bus from Virginia because we already have one in the 30/30x.

For Navan, there would have to be a survey carried out regarding this. From what I have seen (regularly use the 5:10 and 11:10 from Virginia and the 9:15 am bus from Dublin) Very few people actually get on in or go to Navan

horseburger · 22-05-2019 4:50pm

piplip87 wrote: »

The service I would propose is:

109x Cavan, Virginia, Kells, Dublin. - Hourly as it is. With an adjusted timetable that will stop busses having to stay at a stop for 15 minutes because there early.

Example : Cavan 4:45 Virginia 5;10 Kells 5:25. If it's a few minutes late then so be it.

There is no need for an express bus from Virginia because we already have one in the 30/30x.

For Navan, there would have to be a survey carried out regarding this. From what I have seen (regularly use the 5:10 and 11:10 from Virginia and the 9:15 am bus from Dublin) Very few people actually get on in or go to Navan

At the moment, Navan is served every two hours on the Cavan Dublin 109X service.

If Navan is served less often on the 109X to and from Cavan, a follow on from that - unless a separate local service is ever proposed by Bus Éireann or any other bus company - would be less services to and from Navan and Virginia, Navan and Carnaross, and less services to and from Navan and Whitegate.

Consideration would need to be made, regarding how that would affect bus users in these locations, who are going to and from Navan.

As far as I am aware, there is no other daily bus service that connects Navan to Virginia, Carnaross or Whitegate.

But in contrast, if the 109 service was ever changed, to avoid Navan, or if it was ever proposed that certain 109 services to and from Dublin and Kells, avoided Navan, passengers in Navan, who go to and from Dublin on the 109, could still use the more frequent NX service.

If it was ever proposed that less 109 services covered Navan, passengers going to and from Navan and Kells, could still use the hourly 109A service.

But, as far as I am aware, there is no daily bus service - other than the 109X - that connects Navan, Carnaross, Whitegate and Virginia.

Irish Steve · 24-05-2019 8:25pm

Came back up the Ballybin road earlier, and a 109A passed me at the Ratoath end, heading for Kells. This was 18:50, so I find myself wondering was it the 1800 Ashbourne departure, running over 40 minutes later, or the 1900 Departure from Ashbourne, running nearly 20 minutes early. Either way, there's an issue there, but contacting BE will be a waste of time, based on previous responses, the customer service unit basically don't seem to care, but either way, this is the sort of scenario that should (hopefully) lead to this route being either rescheduled to solve the inability to run to time, or given to a different service provider who will hopefully be able to run the service in accordance with the timetable.

piplip87 · 02-06-2019 11:48pm

Serious slack on the 23:15 109x service. I get this regularly. Usually gets into Virginia at about 00:45. After leaving late, stopping in Blanch for 5 minutes and maybe Kells for 10.

Donahue's have been operating the service a fair bit over the past few weeks on behalf of BE. Leaves on time doesn't stick to the schedule at all. Blanch at 23'35 Virginia at 00:25.

Doesn't seem like too much but jaysus it was great to make closing time last night Surely the timetables could be looked at again.

tom23 · 04-06-2019 4:35pm

Abysmal service again this evening on NX. 04:20 now departs at 04:35. Soul destroying. Can somebody in NTA please take note that beresford stop is not fit for purpose. It’s too congested with to many people using at peak times especially in wet weather.

sofireland · 14-06-2019 8:21pm

So, the 510 service didn't show at Wilton Terrace, the 530 arrived at 545, the same time as 550 service.

It is an absolute shambles. The NX service

Bus Eireann N3/M3 Corridor Route & Timetable Changes - Phase 3

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