Gardai hunting for expired motor tax in car parks

Isambard · 07-03-2019 02:00PM

Rennaws wrote: »

Here's one here..

I'm not sure if it's the same one.

I do remember a case being discussed here a few years ago.

€200 fine :P

If I wasn't paying I would say it's worth the risk.

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/sligochampion/news/sold-car-to-father-95-to-avoid-back-tax-36274483.html

no it's not the same one, but interesting to see him charged after just one transfer!

The one I referred to the guy was transferring it back and forward to , i think, his brother

Eggs For Dinner · 07-03-2019 02:15PM

coolshannagh28 wrote: »

The poor who struggle to tax a vehicle quarterly pay a premium of 10%

The not so poor pay that levy as well, if they want to pay quarterly

Dravokivich · 07-03-2019 02:18PM

coolshannagh28 wrote: »

Its essentially compulsory to tax a vehicle now with no loopholes , its a petty fundraising exercise particularly when its enforced by traffic wardens , where a reminder would be effective and then enforcement as per the TV license.

But... we get a reminder posted to us a month before the tax expires along with a form to pay for it.

Odyssey 2005 · 07-03-2019 06:36PM

Isambard wrote: »

you pay more for quarterly discs because the costs of sending them out is quadrupled.

Costs the same if you go to the tax office and pay in person,in cash. !

brightspark · 07-03-2019 06:51PM

Odyssey 2005 wrote: »

Costs the same if you go to the tax office and pay in person,in cash. !

So the person who processes the tax only gets paid one of the times?
The other three discs are printed free?

It's four times as much work, four times as much paper etc.

Odyssey 2005 · 07-03-2019 06:55PM

brightspark wrote: »

So the person who processes the tax only gets paid one of the times?
The other three discs are printed free?

It's four times as much work, four times as much paper etc.

12 months €570
6 months €316
3 months €161

That's an expensive printer.!

brightspark · 07-03-2019 07:20PM

Odyssey 2005 wrote: »

12 months €570
6 months €316
3 months €161

That's an expensive printer.!

True, the six monthly one works out as €632 and the quarterly €644 and extra €62 or €74 so the quarterly isn't that bad considering the extra work involved (two more discs, two more reminders etc)

What isn't included is the cost of finance, the government not having the €570 at the beginning of the tax year.

But if there was no difference in cost between the annual payment and the quarterly or six monthly payment there would be no incentive for anyone to pay the annual amount and the government would need to have almost four times the current number of staff, printers etc.

Dravokivich · 07-03-2019 07:34PM

brightspark wrote: »

True, the six monthly one works out as €632 and the quarterly €644 and extra €62 or €74 so the quarterly isn't that bad considering the extra work involved (two more discs, two more reminders etc)

What isn't included is the cost of finance, the government not having the €570 at the beginning of the tax year.

But if there was no difference in cost between the annual payment and the quarterly or six monthly payment there would be no incentive for anyone to pay the annual amount and the government would need to have almost four times the current number of staff, printers etc.

Most of it should be automated. There is no reason for someone to be reviewing upcoming renewals, printing notices and processing the payments. The form is setup so a scanner can get the details. I'd expect a high amount of people to do it online. Labour intensive stuff would be the tax office.

Also... next time I tax my car is August. Regardless of how long I tax it for, they aren't going to have any of that payment at the start of the tax year. Sure I could even have to declare it off the road. Who knows.

Guy:Incognito · 07-03-2019 07:40PM

coolshannagh28 wrote: »

Its essentially compulsory to tax a vehicle now with no loopholes , its a petty fundraising exercise particularly when its enforced by traffic wardens , where a reminder would be effective and then enforcement as per the TV license.

Of course its compulsory to tax a vehicle that's in use.

If its not in use you declare it off the road. It's a simple enough system.

brightspark · 07-03-2019 07:45PM

Dravokivich wrote: »

Most of it should be automated. There is no reason for someone to be reviewing upcoming renewals, printing notices and processing the payments. The form is setup so a scanner can get the details. I'd expect a high amount of people to do it online. Labour intensive stuff would be the tax office.

Also... next time I tax my car is August. Regardless of how long I tax it for, they aren't going to have any of that payment at the start of the tax year. Sure I could even have to declare it off the road. Who knows.

While automation undoubtedly reduces costs it doesn't eliminate them, the software has to be paid for and maintained, bank charges will also be per transaction.

None of which hopefully adds up to the extra cost of the the quarterly or six monthly tax discs, but why shouldn't those of us who pay the annual amount in one transaction get it cheaper?

When I mentioned tax year, I meant the annual car tax, not necessarily linked to any calendar month.
e.g. They have your payment since last August (if you paid for the year), if you paid quarterly they would have just got the third payment last month and have to wait until May for the next payment

brightspark · 07-03-2019 08:06PM

If lack of money is the reason not to pay the full years tax, then it would be cheaper to get a loan from a Credit Union and then you can pay back weekly (€570 would work out at about €11.65 per week or ~€605 for the year, some credit unions give an interest reduction so it's likely to be even less)

Dravokivich · 07-03-2019 09:17PM

brightspark wrote: »

While automation undoubtedly reduces costs it doesn't eliminate them, the software has to be paid for and maintained, bank charges will also be per transaction.

None of which hopefully adds up to the extra cost of the the quarterly or six monthly tax discs, but why shouldn't those of us who pay the annual amount in one transaction get it cheaper?

When I mentioned tax year, I meant the annual car tax, not necessarily linked to any calendar month.
e.g. They have your payment since last August (if you paid for the year), if you paid quarterly they would have just got the third payment last month and have to wait until May for the next payment

I didn't challenge the cost. Just your expectation of additional work from it. Cost of any such software is there whether I tax for the year or for 3 months.

Since having a car totalled in an accident caused by someone else, I've never taxed a car for more than 6 months. With that car getting written off, just after I taxed it for the year, I had no means to recoup that cost.

decky1 · 07-03-2019 09:34PM

yea the ould traffic wardens are known for that,they'll be checking the tryes next'

brightspark · 07-03-2019 09:35PM

Dravokivich wrote: »

I didn't challenge the cost. Just your expectation of additional work from it. Cost of any such software is there whether I tax for the year or for 3 months.

Since having a car totalled in an accident caused by someone else, I've never taxed a car for more than 6 months. With that car getting written off, just after I taxed it for the year, I had no means to recoup that cost.

The cost of issuing 4 discs per year is not the same as issuing 1 no matter how automated the system my be, admittedly it won't cost an extra €74 but no one is forcing anyone to pay quarterly.

Yes there is a way to claim it back if the car is written off.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/motor_tax_and_insurance/motor_tax_rates.html

Refunds of motor tax
It is possible in certain circumstances to claim a refund of motor tax. Your application for a refund should be made directly to your local motor tax office on Form RF120 (pdf). Circumstances where you may claim a refund of motor tax include:

The vehicle has been scrapped/destroyed or sent permanently out of the State
The vehicle has been stolen and has not been recovered by the owner
The vehicle has not been taken out or used in a public place at any time since the issue of the current disc
The owner of the vehicle has ceased, because of illness, injury or other physical disability, to use the vehicle
The owner of the vehicle has ceased, because of absence from the state for business or educational purposes, to use the vehicle
The owner of the vehicle has ceased, because of service overseas with the Defence Forces, to use the vehicle

Even if you couldn't reclaim it from the government, you could have probably claimed the loss from whoever caused the accident.

Paying the tax six monthly means that it is costing you approx 10% extra, that means that after 10 years of paying the extra you will have lost a full years tax, do you really expect to write off a car every ten years? I've had one car written off in over 25 years, and I think the tax was just due when that happened.

Dravokivich · 07-03-2019 09:46PM

brightspark wrote: »

Yes there is a way to claim it back if the car is written off.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/motor_tax_and_insurance/motor_tax_rates.html

Even if you couldn't reclaim it from the government, you could have probably claimed the loss from whoever caused the accident.

Paying the tax six monthly means that it is costing you approx 10% extra, that means that after 10 years of paying the extra you will have lost a full years tax, do you really expect to write off a car every ten years? I've had one car written off in over 25 years, and I think the tax was just due when that happened.

I had 2 choices scrap it myself and recover the tax, or get a pay out for the car from insurance and they'll tender it out to another company to take it and do whatever with it. There was no chance of repairing it. There was no means for me to recoup that money without also being down the cost of the car. I never saw it up for sale, so I reckon they scrapped it themselves and made a tidy profit with the tax back.

I don't have a high paying job. I'd rather take a hit on the tax short term, than lose out long term like what happened then. I don't expect to be in accidents at all. But there's way too many people out there driving about without any consideration for other road users. Id be surprised if it never happens again.

Gardai hunting for expired motor tax in car parks

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