Guinness Pro14 Season 2018-2019

typhoony · 20-02-2019 4:31pm

Former Former wrote: »

13 WEEKS?!!! I mean, it's gross and he absolutely deserved a ban, but the panel said:

“It is difficult to imagine how an act of foul play of this sort could be worse, save for repeated acts or where actual injury is caused.”

What are they smoking? He got 26 weeks reduced by 50% for a clean record. The day after Henderson got away with neck-rolling a guy onto his head.

That's incredible

www.pro14rugby.org/2019/02/20/decision-of-disciplinary-hearing-nico-lee-13-weeks/

it's just stupidity, a moment of madness. but apart from that I think that a 4 week ban would have been enough. I mean I've farted in the wife's face in the past and only received a 1 week ban so there you have it.

Eod100 · 20-02-2019 4:34pm

Buer wrote: »

Jesus Christ. What a dirtbag.

Although I am genuinely surprised they gave him 13 weeks.

Awful and deserves a ban but thought you might not even get that length of ban for eye gouging say. Disgusting thing to do and that's him gone for rest of season. Do bans carry into start if next season? Cheetahs season likely to be over end of April

Buer · 20-02-2019 4:38pm

Eod100 wrote: »

Awful and deserves a ban but thought you might not even get that length of ban for eye gouging say. Disgusting thing to do and that's him gone for rest of season. Do bans carry into start if next season? Cheetahs season likely to be over end of April

Cheetahs final game is on April 27th which is in 10 weeks. But I imagine they'll try to work it such that the remainder of the ban is served during the Currie Cup, if he's in the Cheetahs squad to play in that competition? The Currie Cup is being moved to an earlier point in the year in part to avoid the clash between the Pro14 and Currie Cup for the later rounds.

Squidgy Black · 20-02-2019 4:39pm

Buer wrote: »

Cheetahs final game is on April 27th which is in 10 weeks. But I imagine they'll try to work it such that the remainder of the ban is served during the Currie Cup, if he's in the Cheetahs squad to play in that competition? The Currie Cup is being moved to an earlier point in the year in part to avoid the clash between the Pro14 and Currie Cup for the later rounds.

The statement says he won't be eligible to play until the 21st of July.

Buer · 20-02-2019 4:44pm

Squidgy Black wrote: »

The statement says he won't be eligible to play until the 21st of July.

His ban must run through the Pro14 playoffs so because that's the opening weekend of the CC.

Eod100 · 20-02-2019 4:46pm

Squidgy Black wrote: »

The statement says he won't be eligible to play until the 21st of July.

Yeah just spotted that: ''The committee took into account the rugby calendar for the rest of the season and for domestic fixtures in South Africa, and as a result, the player is banned for a period of 13 games and is free to play from midnight on Sunday, July 21, 2019.'' Only 6 regular seasons left in Pro14 so guess rest takes account of Currie Cup games

AdamD · 20-02-2019 4:56pm

As disgusting as it is, dangerous tackles/hits should be copping bigger bans than incidents like this.

arsebiscuits1 · 20-02-2019 5:37pm

AdamD wrote: »

As disgusting as it is, dangerous tackles/hits should be copping bigger bans than incidents like this.

Punching and stamping should.

Dangerous tackles are often accidental or reckless.

This is someone consciously and deliberately snot rocketing in someones face.

This is not acceptable behaviour in any circumstance.

Stone Gossard · 20-02-2019 5:40pm

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Punching and stamping should.

Dangerous tackles are often accidental or reckless.

This is someone consciously and deliberately snot rocketing in someones face.

This is not acceptable behaviour in any circumstance.

Nobody is saying it's acceptable...what people are saying is that deliberate and gross acts of violence against a player get lesser bans....and that isn't acceptable either

sydthebeat · 20-02-2019 5:50pm

fcuk him, no sympathy......

Squidgy Black · 20-02-2019 5:54pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

fcuk him, no sympathy......

Don't think it's anything to do with sympathy, I think everyone can see it's an absolute knacker move and he's a disgrace, it's just the comments from the citing commission combined with the much shorter bans handed out for incidents that have physically harmed players is a bit mind boggling.

I think the sentence is appropriate for the action, but would like to see incidents like stamping or gouging be held to the same accord.

Zzippy · 20-02-2019 5:55pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

Glasgow Vs Connacht and Ospreys Vs Munster on Friday. Two big Conference A games.

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Robertson McCoy stamped on VdF's head intentionally, and got 12 weeks, which was then reduced to 6.

Yet somehow they say someone blowing their nose onto a player is twice as bad and they couldn't imagine a worse act of foul play.

It's completely disgusting, but compared to physically harming someone.

Mind blowing.

I've been kicked, punched, elbowed, headbutted, stamped on, had my fingers broken with a hurley deliberately, and plenty more. Took it and gave it plenty too. But the one time I absolutely lost the rag on a pitch was when a guy spat in my face. It's the one time where I deliberately and absolutely tried to beat the living sh1t out of someone. Failed miserably, of course, I did land one or two slaps, but I was reliably informed afterwards that he never played for that team again.
Not saying it's right, but there is an acceptance in physical sports that a bit of physical harm will come your way, but spitting or what he did are beyond the pale.

Buer · 20-02-2019 5:56pm

Zzippy wrote: »

I've been kicked, punched, elbowed, headbutted, stamped on, had my fingers broken with a hurley deliberately, and plenty more. Took it and gave it plenty too.

Nobody made you get married, Zzippy.

Squidgy Black · 20-02-2019 5:59pm

Zzippy wrote: »

I've been kicked, punched, elbowed, headbutted, stamped on, had my fingers broken with a hurley deliberately, and plenty more. Took it and gave it plenty too. But the one time I absolutely lost the rag on a pitch was when a guy spat in my face. It's the one time where I deliberately and absolutely tried to beat the living sh1t out of someone. Failed miserably, of course, I did land one or two slaps, but I was reliably informed afterwards that he never played for that team again.
Not saying it's right, but there is an acceptance in physical sports that a bit of physical harm will come your way, but spitting or what he did are beyond the pale.

I agree on the odd slap or getting into a scrap and being on the end of a dig or a headbutt, but a deliberate stamp on the head when you're lying defenceless at the bottom of a ruck is a different level.

AdamD · 20-02-2019 6:05pm

Zzippy wrote: »

I've been kicked, punched, elbowed, headbutted, stamped on, had my fingers broken with a hurley deliberately, and plenty more. Took it and gave it plenty too. But the one time I absolutely lost the rag on a pitch was when a guy spat in my face. It's the one time where I deliberately and absolutely tried to beat the living sh1t out of someone. Failed miserably, of course, I did land one or two slaps, but I was reliably informed afterwards that he never played for that team again.
Not saying it's right, but there is an acceptance in physical sports that a bit of physical harm will come your way, but spitting or what he did are beyond the pale.

I completely understand where people are coming from on this but, however a few days after the incident when everything has calmed down I'm sure most (everyone?) would take being spat on over a concussion or other serious injury caused by a reckless challenge.

CMcsporty · 20-02-2019 6:42pm

AdamD wrote: »

I completely understand where people are coming from on this but, however a few days after the incident when everything has calmed down I'm sure most (everyone?) would take being spat on over a concussion or other serious injury caused by a reckless challenge.

We'll of course. It hurts less!
It's a good message to punish this with a severe penalty.

The Eye gouge is the one that really gets me. Ban 'em for life.

Zzippy · 20-02-2019 8:53pm

Buer wrote: »

Nobody made you get married, Zzippy.

Exceeded yourself there, Buer. Well played!

tobdom · 21-02-2019 4:43pm

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Robertson McCoy stamped on VdF's head intentionally, and got 12 weeks, which was then reduced to 6.

Yet somehow they say someone blowing their nose onto a player is twice as bad and they couldn't imagine a worse act of foul play.

It's completely disgusting, but compared to physically harming someone.

Mind blowing.

I read the citing commisions comments as them saying what they said in the context of the law under which he was cited. So under that law, which is pretty ambiguous & broad as it is (Law 9.27 – A player must not do anything that is against the spirit of good sportsmanship), they're saying they don't know what could be considered a worse act......

But they're not saying this in totality in relation to all laws which cover other offenses. So they don't necessarily think that that snot-megging on someone's face is worse than eye gouging.

I completely agree that bans for other offenses should be much longer than they have been, and there is a general inconsistency in bans doled out, but I think it's good to see a ban of this length for something which is just totally inconceiveable and scumbaggery of the highest order!

stephen_n · 21-02-2019 6:06pm

Former Former wrote: »

13 WEEKS?!!! I mean, it's gross and he absolutely deserved a ban, but the panel said:

“It is difficult to imagine how an act of foul play of this sort could be worse, save for repeated acts or where actual injury is caused.”

What are they smoking? He got 26 weeks reduced by 50% for a clean record. The day after Henderson got away with neck-rolling a guy onto his head.

That's incredible

www.pro14rugby.org/2019/02/20/decision-of-disciplinary-hearing-nico-lee-13-weeks/

You are not seriously drawing a correlation between those two events? Henderson’s while reckless was not comparable to a deliberate act of scumbaggery. There is no place in the game for that kind of thing, none. The ban reflects that. I’m genuinely surprised it’s that long but also delighted.

Former Former · 21-02-2019 6:54pm

stephen_n wrote: »

You are not seriously drawing a correlation between those two events? Henderson’s while reckless was not comparable to a deliberate act of scumbaggery. There is no place in the game for that kind of thing, none. The ban reflects that. I’m genuinely surprised it’s that long but also delighted.

Not a correlation, a contrast. My problem is that there is absolutely no correlation.

Henderson did something that was reckless and dangerous. He got away with it on a technicality that (as I predicted) this citing officer seems to love, but he could have really injured the guy and he got no punishment. Fair enough. I don't have any real problem with that.

Now, there's a Cheetahs guy who did something disgusting but in no way dangerous. Yeah it's totally against the spirit of the game but come on, the committee said "it's hard to imagine a worse offence" or something. That's bollocks. If he'd punched an opponent in the face and spread his nose across his face, he'd have got off more lightly. Where's the justice in that?

The Pro14 are now on record that deliberately stamping on a prone opponent's neck is significantly more acceptable than spraying a bit of mucus on his face. They're a joke.

I'm glad the Cheetahs guy got banned. Don't get me wrong at all but 26 weeks?? The absolute frauds running this process are more concerned with the gentlemanly Corinthian values of the game than player safety. I hope Cheetahs appeal this and call this out for what it is.

stephen_n · 21-02-2019 9:09pm

Former Former wrote: »

Now, there's a Cheetahs guy who did something disgusting but in no way dangerous. Yeah it's totally against the spirit of the game but come on, the committee said "it's hard to imagine a worse offence" or something. That's bollocks. If he'd punched an opponent in the face and spread his nose across his face, he'd have got off more lightly. Where's the justice in that?

In reaching that conclusion the Panel found that: “It is difficult to imagine how an act of foul play of this sort could be worse, save for repeated acts or where actual injury is caused.”
99

It’s the or something that’s important in your paraphrasing though.

Burkie1203 · 23-02-2019 2:25pm

Benetton 12-0 Dragons after 21

2 tries

vienne86 · 23-02-2019 2:38pm

That's the TBP for Treviso after only 30 minutes.

Eod100 · 23-02-2019 2:38pm

Burkie1203 wrote: »

Benetton 12-0 Dragons after 21

2 tries

Probably for the best that Welsh teams are in a league which doesn't have relegation..

Burkie1203 · 23-02-2019 2:44pm

Dragons seem to think this is tag rugby

31-0 after 36

vienne86 · 23-02-2019 2:55pm

Decent try for Dragons there but Treviso are running riot.

thomond2006 · 23-02-2019 3:15pm

Wow, Benetton are slaughtering them. Very impressive considering the number of players they're missing. Then again they are playing the Welsh equivalent of the Kings.

Burkie1203 · 23-02-2019 3:22pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

Wow, Benetton are slaughtering them. Very impressive considering the number of players they're missing. Then again they are playing the Welsh equivalent of the Kings.

43-7 latest

Dubinusa · 23-02-2019 3:25pm

Bring back Jackman!

Burkie1203 · 23-02-2019 3:36pm

50-7 now

Burkie1203 · 23-02-2019 3:51pm

57-7 ft

ScrubsfanChris · 23-02-2019 3:58pm

That's surely one of the most embarrassing results in tournament history?

Eod100 · 23-02-2019 4:16pm

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

That's surely one of the most embarrassing results in tournament history?

Yup https://twitter.com/Stu_Farmer/status/1099326474828611584?s=19

thomond2006 · 23-02-2019 4:25pm

Benetton at home to Edinburgh next week. That's a huge game and might be determined by the outer squad internationals available.

Former Former · 23-02-2019 4:34pm

That Newport were one of the greatest clubs in the history of rugby, only to become the Dragons, is an absolute disgrace.

They can't continue like this. Maybe they just can't continue at all.

thomond2006 · 23-02-2019 4:38pm

Former Former wrote: »

That Newport were one of the greatest clubs in the history of rugby, only to become the Dragons, is an absolute disgrace.

They can't continue like this. Maybe they just can't continue at all.

It's not as if they didn't recruit heavily either.

sydthebeat · 23-02-2019 4:49pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

It's not as if they didn't recruit heavily either.

Ross Moriarty must be wondering how he was sold a pup

troyzer · 23-02-2019 9:56pm

The moves from SARU today surely are a really strong indication that they're committing to the Pro14 going forward? It doesn't make sense otherwise.

thomond2006 · 23-02-2019 9:58pm

troyzer wrote: »

The moves from SARU today surely are a really strong indication that they're committing to the Pro14 going forward? It doesn't make sense otherwise.

How do you figure this?

It looks to me like they are cutting SR and Pro 14 squad numbers in order to retain as many Springboks as they can, as well as acknowledging how much ZAR vs EUR/GBP hamstrings their buying power.

troyzer · 23-02-2019 10:01pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

troyzer wrote: »

The moves from SARU today surely are a really strong indication that they're committing to the Pro14 going forward? It doesn't make sense otherwise.

How do you figure this?

It looks to me like they are cutting SR and Pro 14 squad numbers in order to retain as many Springboks as they can, as well as acknowledging how much ZAR vs EUR/GBP hamstrings their buying power.

By saying they're now going to be selecting players regardless of where they play their club rugby, it means most of the top players are just going to leave.

I understand what they're trying to do but it'll mean the death of their club game. Something I imagine the other SANZAAR members aren't happy with as it dramatically reduces the value of the tournament.

It does make sense though if the plan is to shift everyone into the Pro14 with the extra revenue that brings, especially if they get access to European rugby.

troyzer · 23-02-2019 10:03pm

I confused the 30 cap thing by the way, ignore that.

thomond2006 · 23-02-2019 10:05pm

troyzer wrote: »

By saying they're now going to be selecting players regardless of where they play their club rugby, it means most of the top players are just going to leave.

I understand what they're trying to do but it'll mean the death of their club game. Something I imagine the other SANZAAR members aren't happy with as it dramatically reduces the value of the tournament.

It does make sense though if the plan is to shift everyone into the Pro14 with the extra revenue that brings, especially if they get access to European rugby.

I imagine SANZAAR with have to lump it. SA Rugby can't do anything about a currency and I'm sure a strong Springbok team is more valuable than strong SR franchises.

Access to European Rugby could be key but it would require a rejig of how pool stages work. There's no way three blocks of one home and one away fixture could work with South African teams involved.

troyzer · 23-02-2019 10:10pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

troyzer wrote: »

By saying they're now going to be selecting players regardless of where they play their club rugby, it means most of the top players are just going to leave.

I understand what they're trying to do but it'll mean the death of their club game. Something I imagine the other SANZAAR members aren't happy with as it dramatically reduces the value of the tournament.

It does make sense though if the plan is to shift everyone into the Pro14 with the extra revenue that brings, especially if they get access to European rugby.

I imagine SANZAAR with have to lump it. SA Rugby can't do anything about a currency and I'm sure a strong Springbok team is more valuable than strong SR franchises.

Access to European Rugby could be key but it would require a rejig of how pool stages work. There's no way three blocks of one home and one away fixture could work with South African teams involved.

I don't think SANZAAR will have the option to lump it. Super Rugby is only a few seasons away from total collapse.

Japan = big, rich market but nobody cares.
New Zealand = rich, interested market but too small.
Australia = very rich, small sized market but nobody cares.
Argentina = big, poor market and nobody cares.
South Africa = big, poor market but a lot of people care.

Broadcasters are not going to pay the same amount when basically a third of the competition is fielding weak teams getting battered while their best players are up north.

European rugby could be rejigged and I imagine South Africa would be such a coup that even the English and French would be happy to sit down and make it work.

thomond2006 · 23-02-2019 10:12pm

17-19 to Cardiff with ten to go

Tigerandahalf · 23-02-2019 10:14pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

How do you figure this?

It looks to me like they are cutting SR and Pro 14 squad numbers in order to retain as many Springboks as they can, as well as acknowledging how much ZAR vs EUR/GBP hamstrings their buying power.

Didn't realise this was discussed here as had commented on the Super Rugby thread.

There has been a lot of talk of SR going back to 12 teams in a round robin format - 5 NZ, 3 OZ, 3 SA plus the Jaguares is a possibility. That could mean a money saving, pooled for the SA national team players (better contracts to keep them in SA).

However the SA union would be foolish to turn down prime time tv money from the north. They may have 3 teams also then in the pro14. That would explain the expansion of contracted players.

That would be 6 pro teams all set up to compete in a revived Currie Cup.

I don't know if that is all feasible but it is a possibility.

Remember SA are now on the board of Pro14 and thus will want their teams in the Champions Cup (if they qualify), thus another possible revenue stream.

troyzer · 23-02-2019 10:16pm

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

thomond2006 wrote: »

How do you figure this?

It looks to me like they are cutting SR and Pro 14 squad numbers in order to retain as many Springboks as they can, as well as acknowledging how much ZAR vs EUR/GBP hamstrings their buying power.

Didn't realise this was discussed here as had commented on the Super Rugby thread.

There has been a lot of talk of SR going back to 12 teams in a round robin format - 5 NZ, 3 OZ, 3 SA plus the Jaguares is a possibility. That could mean a money saving, pooled for the SA national team players (better contracts to keep them in SA).

However the SA union would be foolish to turn down prime time tv money from the north. They may have 3 teams also then in the pro14. That would explain the expansion of contracted players.

That would be 6 pro teams all set up to compete in a revived Currie Cup.

I don't know if that is all feasible but it is a possibility.

Remember SA are now on the board of Pro14 and thus will want their teams in the Champions Cup (if they qualify), thus another possible revenue stream.

Cup rugby is crucial. If they can get in on that it would literally change world rugby.

Former Former · 23-02-2019 10:18pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

17-19 to Cardiff with ten to go

Great result for Ulster.

Not for Connacht.

thomond2006 · 23-02-2019 10:26pm

Going into tomorrow and Scarlets vs Cheetahs...

Munster (57): Scarlets (A), Zebre (H), HCC QF, Cardiff (H), Benetton (A), Possible HCC SF, Connacht (H)

Glasgow (56): Zebre (A), Cheetahs (H), HCC QF, Ulster (H), Leinster (A), Possible HCC SF, Edinburgh (H)

Cardiff (42): Kings (H), Scarlets (H), Munster (A), Connacht (A), Ospreys (H)

Connacht (42): Ospreys (H), Benetton (H), ECC QF, Zebre (A), Possible ECC SF, Cardiff (H), Munster (A)

Ospreys (39):, Connacht (A), Dragons (H), Cheetahs (A), Kings (A), Cardiff (A)

Cheetahs (36): Scarlets (A), Leinster (A), Glasgow (A), Ospreys (H), Dragons (H), Kings (H)

thomond2006 · 23-02-2019 10:28pm

Benetton (46): Edinburgh (H), Connacht (A), Leinster (A), Munster (H), Zebre (A)

Ulster (44): Dragons (A), Kings (H), HCC QF, Glasgow (A), Edinburgh (A), Possible HCC SF, Leinster (H)

Edinburgh (42): Benetton (A), Leinster (H), HCC QF, Scarlets (A), Ulster (H), Possible HCC SF, Glasgow (A)

Scarlets (36): Cheetahs (H), Munster (H), Cardiff (A), Edinburgh (H), Zebre (H), Dragons (A)

troyzer · 23-02-2019 10:30pm

Scarlets, Cheetahs and Ospreys are out for me. They all have really tough fixtures.

I think it'll be Munster, Glasgow, Connacht and Leinster, Ulster, Treviso.

Guinness Pro14 Season 2018-2019

Comments