Pete Doherty: Greatest Songwriter of His Generation?

pleas advice · 16-01-2019 4:50am

Jay-Z though, he can pen a lyric

KungPao · 16-01-2019 5:07am

Isn’t he known as Peter Doherty/Dockerty now?

Circuital · 16-01-2019 12:34pm

"The stale chips are up and the hope stakes are down"...

A brilliant lyricist, but in my opinion not many people of late can touch Alex Turner for lyrics.

CrankyHaus · 16-01-2019 2:18pm

pleas advice wrote: »

Amy Winehouse was a great lyricist as well, around the same age, same problems as Pete...

Well sometimes I go out by myself
And I look across the water

Wasn't that written by The Zutons?

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5 · 16-01-2019 2:25pm

I'd say pretty much any track off The Libertines will hold up lyrically. In retrospect their whole media image was pretty cringe and they um, didn't try to hide their influences, to put it politely but I lapped all that up at the time. Every time I go back to that album especially I expect to have outgrown it or find it hasn't aged well or whatever but nope, still class.

I so vividly remember listening to it for the first time.

The Tetrarch · 16-01-2019 2:31pm

I think he falls into the George Best, Alex Higgins group, the wasted talent that could have been great, but let's call them the greatest anyway ahead of the grafters with great talent who also worked hard.

Birneybau · 16-01-2019 2:34pm

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Elton John was pretty great up to around 78, passable to around 82, best avoided after that. Bernie Taupin did write most of the lyrics.

Didn't think he was THAT old

humberklog · 16-01-2019 2:39pm

AllForIt wrote: »

Elton John is one of the greatest lyricists ever. Even if you don't like his music which I think was great especially in the early 80's, he is one artist who when he sings I pay attention to the lyrics where otherwise I'd ordinarily pay more attention to the melody, which is the most important part of course.

Elton John would provide the music but Bernie Taupin wrote the lyrics for the majority of their songs.

**Edited to say I see this point has already been made.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 16-01-2019 2:47pm

As a person, he’s kind of repulsive to me. Just to look at. I’m not sure why. He just gives me the heebie jeebies.

But I do enjoy some of his music and think he is quite talented.

oneilla · 16-01-2019 3:44pm

mzungu wrote: »

Jaysus, a bit harsh, no? The guy has never done anything to warrant being called that. He is most likely a pleasant chap and a lot of people seem to think he is also.

Back on topic, his music was never my thing so I would not call him the greatest of his generation.

Have a read into the death of Mark Blanco:

Less than six months after his death, Doherty audaciously returned to where Mark Blanco died, to record a promotional video for the Babyshambles song "The Lost Art of Murder", a reference to the 1827 essay On Murder Considered as One of the Fine Arts, by Thomas De Quincey – one of Blanco's favourite writers.

https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/3ky4yb/a-death-at-a-pete-doherty-party-is-still-unexplained

16-01-2019 3:48pm

Wasn't too pushed on the libertines or babyshambles.. thought he was a bit of a tit with the media etc..

But 'Grace/Wastelands' is an absolutely amazing album.. Like, absolutely unbelievably good..

So.. maybe..

sweetie · 16-01-2019 3:53pm

Apparently he has substituted his love of hard drugs for one of hash browns and pork products:
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-kent-45264871

AllGunsBlazing · 16-01-2019 4:08pm

Poor man's Shane MacGowan.

mzungu · 16-01-2019 4:21pm

Captain Red Beard wrote: »

I wouldn't think it's a bit harsh. He's been known to take impressionable young girls home with him, read them poetry and then shoot them full of heroin. He's been investigated for doing this in the past, with a handful of overdoses being blamed on him.

oneilla wrote: »

Have a read into the death of Mark Blanco:

https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/3ky4yb/a-death-at-a-pete-doherty-party-is-still-unexplained

Ok. I didn't know anything about either of the above (or indeed any of what he gets up to outside of being a regular drug user).

Laois_Man · 16-01-2019 4:48pm

Every time anyone mentions Pete Doherty, I can't help but think of his very uncomfortable appearance on The Late Late Show in the Pat Kenny days when he got pissed off coz the only thing Pat knew about him was the drugs stories.

He begins to get ratty after 6 minutes and starts shuffling in is seat

Starts to get really ratty on about 8 minutes and is completely tuning out

By about 10 minutes he's complaining that plastic Pat can't name any of his songs

By the end, he's literally running off stage to get away from Pat Kenny

And just to add to it all - there was the annoying super-fan heckling from the audience from the very start

I think it was the same night Pat infamously tore up the Late Late Toys Show tickets and Chris de Burgh made a show of him making a speech about Pat's Critics and how hard the bob is!

facehugger99 · 16-01-2019 4:52pm

AllForIt wrote: »

Elton John is one of the greatest lyricists ever. Even if you don't like his music which I think was great especially in the early 80's, he is one artist who when he sings I pay attention to the lyrics where otherwise I'd ordinarily pay more attention to the melody, which is the most important part of course.

pleas advice wrote: »

Amy Winehouse was a great lyricist as well, around the same age, same problems as Pete...

Well sometimes I go out by myself
And I look across the water

I can't tell if people are taking the piss or not on this thread.

Anyway, the correct answer is obviously Bob Dylan followed closely by David Bowie.

refusetolose · 16-01-2019 4:54pm

Laois_Man wrote: »

Every time anyone mentions Pete Doherty, I can't help but think of his very uncomfortable appearance on The Late Late Show in the Pat Kenny days when he got pissed off coz the only thing Pat knew about him was the drugs stories.

He begins to get ratty after 6 minutes and starts shuffling in is seat

Starts to get really ratty on about 8 minutes and is completely tuning out

By about 10 minutes he's complaining that plastic Pat can't name any of his songs

By the end, he's literally running off stage to get away from Pat Kenny

And just to add to it all - there was the annoying super-fan heckling from the audience from the very start

I think it was the same night Pat infamously tore up the Late Late Toys Show tickets and Chris de Burgh made a show of him making a speech about Pat's Critics and how hard the bob is!

yeah he was in dublin that day giving a lecture in trinity college
think pat would mention it? not a chance

refusetolose · 16-01-2019 4:54pm

facehugger99 wrote: »

I can't tell if people are taking the piss or not on this thread.

Anyway, the correct answer is obviously Bob Dylan followed closely by David Bowie.

different generation

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5 · 16-01-2019 4:57pm

facehugger99 wrote: »

I can't tell if people are taking the piss or not on this thread.

Anyway, the correct answer is obviously Bob Dylan followed closely by David Bowie.

Nobel prize, alright, maybe. But I draw the line at placing Dylan in Doherty's generation :pac:

Bit since we're doing this I nominate Leonard Cohen!

One eyed Jack · 16-01-2019 5:11pm

Some good songs certainly, but “Greatest Songwriter of his Generation” is a stretch. He did inspire one of my favourite songwriter/artists though of his generation -

"Poison Prince" is the first single from Scottish singer-songwriter Amy MacDonald's debut album, This Is the Life, and charted at number 136 on the UK Singles Chart in 2007. Its initial limited release was on 7 May 2007, and it was later re-released 19 May 2008. The lyrics were based on the life of Babyshambles and Libertines singer Pete Doherty, and were written as an ode to the troubled musician.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhDTVq8C-Yc

16-01-2019 6:47pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAcmdARQ-7Q

Atoms for Peace · 16-01-2019 7:05pm

oneilla wrote: »

Have a read into the death of Mark Blanco:

https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/3ky4yb/a-death-at-a-pete-doherty-party-is-still-unexplained

Shooting a man in Reno inspired Johnny Cash to pen a classic, therefore why can't Pete push lad off a balcony as inspiration for a murder ballad?

Pa8301 · 16-01-2019 7:23pm

mzungu wrote: »

Ok. I didn't know anything about either of the above (or indeed any of what he gets up to outside of being a regular drug user).

Google Paul Cunniffe. He was an Irish musician who died in similar circumstances to the Blanco fella.

Billy86 · 16-01-2019 7:34pm

I would take Kendrick Lamar and maybe a few others ahead of him as a lyricist, but he's come out with some great ones all the same.

Random timing for the thread though, I've had What Katie Did stuck in my head for the last few days.

ceadaoin. · 16-01-2019 8:14pm

Pa8301 wrote: »

Google Paul Cunniffe. He was an Irish musician who died in similar circumstances to the Blanco fella.

I didnt know about that. Seems a bit of a coincidence it would happen twice at the same persons home.

irishguitarlad · 16-01-2019 8:14pm

Lyricist maybe but as a songwriter not a hope. Songwriting involves the structure, the dynamics, harmonies, melodies, the time signature and the lyrics.

andekwarhola · 16-01-2019 8:36pm

Never really a fan of the music but was thinking of that famous clip of him queuing for an Oasis album when he was a teenager, pre fame.

Always made me laugh. Something so gauche and innocent about it before all the later shenanigans.

16-01-2019 9:09pm

irishguitarlad wrote: »

Lyricist maybe but as a songwriter not a hope. Songwriting involves the structure, the dynamics, harmonies, melodies, the time signature and the lyrics.

Listen to 'grace/wasteland'..

Captain Red Beard · 17-01-2019 1:25pm

In a sea of dross he's average.

The Golden Miller · 19-01-2019 10:09pm

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAcmdARQ-7Q

That off the solo album? Haven't actually listened to it yet. Is it all acoustic?

Pete Doherty: Greatest Songwriter of His Generation?

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